Dispelling 6 myths about Liberty League International
There’s a lot of information to be digested when thinking about joining a home business model like Liberty League International.
You’ll have the sales pitches from the associates, the mass of information on the internet and a whole host of facts and figures thrown at you.
In the following post I’ve taken what I believe to be the six most common claims you’ll encounter whilst considering joining Liberty League International. I’ve decided to label these claims as myths and expose them as there was not one that could stand up to the hype upon deeper inspection.
See for yourself.
Foreword: The quotes used in this article are from Liberty League associates themselves. They are taken from Tony Rush’s Ning social network, Liberty League Life.
Note that the Ning social network is not affiliated with Liberty League International but you will need a login to access the network. You can either create your own login or use one of the generated ones over at BugMeNot. /end foreword
1. Liberty League is not a MLM company
One of the repeated claims I’ve seen in my research on Liberty League International (LLI) is that they are not a MLM company.
Wikipedia’s description of a Multi Level Marketing company is as follows;
Independent, unsalaried salespeople of multi-level marketing, referred to as distributors (or associates , independent business owners, dealers, franchise owners, sales consultants, consultants, independent agents, etc.), represent the company that produces the products or provides the services they sell.
They are awarded a commission based upon the volume of product sold through their own sales efforts as well as that of their downline organization.
Independent distributors develop their organizations by either building an active customer base, who buy direct from the company, or by recruiting a downline of independent distributors who also build a customer base, thereby expanding the overall organization.
Additionally, distributors can also earn a profit by retailing products they purchased from the company at wholesale price.
As I’ve written previously in my article on SixFigureChicks, LLI’s business model revolves around associates purchasing conference tickets and a home study course from the company and then reselling them to either potential associates or general members of the public.
Potential associates who go on to join the company then become part of the referring associate’s downline network.
No matter what spin you put on it LLI fits the MLM template and there’s no way around it. You can change the terms, call the associates whatever you want and deny there’s an upline structure in LLI (you only keep roughly 60% of the total sale, where do you think the other 40% goes?), but LLI is clearly a MLM model.
2. No cold calling or selling
When running a home business there are two unavoidable obstacles to overcome.
The first is that without advertising or selling your business, nobody knows who you are. The second is that unless you have a vast affiliate network already set up, you’re going to have to get your business out there somehow.
The big players in LLI (ie. the ones that introduced it first in their country) are right in that they don’t have to cold call or sell the company to people. They after all have schmucks under them doing this for them. Keep in mind this is the lifestyle they are trying to sell you on and encourage you to attain despite their established monopoly in the area.
For everyone else the hard reality is that to get your business out there you’re going to have to advertise and bring in those leads. Bandit signs (homemade signs stuck into the ground), car door magnets, business cards and fliers seem to be the most common choice.
Does anyone have a good contact for Bandit signs here in Melbourne? Have seen some around that look fantastic!
Liberty League Life is full of posts enquiring about the costs and legality of bandit signs, the cheapest place to get fliers made up etc.
There’s even an amusing blog section where everyone seems to be oblivious to the fact that they will all be competing in the same niche using the same keywords and similar content in promoting their LLI business.
As a new associate you’re going to have to carve out your own exposure. Here’s something to think about, there’s already thousands of LLI associate websites out there that will outrank you, people are already dropping fliers in your area and they most likely have all the good bandit sign spots too.
I spent 3 hours each day on Friday and Saturday down at Jeff’s Shed handing out fliers at the Boat Show.
Best of luck establishing yourself without resorting to cold calling or hard face to face selling.
3. No products to sell, no inventory to keep
While the inventory bit is true, it is impossible to make a profit without selling something. A profit doesn’t have to be a physical product and in the case of LLI it’s very hard to get past the fact that you will be selling their products.
Beyond Freedom, the Liberty and Summit conferences are all products in their own right. They each have a use, a purpose and can be traded just like any other product on the market.
Don’t kid yourself, unless you somehow manage to make it to the upper tiers of the company despite the already established dominating competition, you’re going to find yourself selling these products to make a living.
If you down have a large number of associates under you then there’s no other way to make money in LLI.
4. Personal development is a 16-20 billion dollar booming growth industry
The personal development industry is mostly made up of similar home based franchise systems like LLI. Let’s face it, there’s no way to measure how big of an industry is as most of these programs are tight lipped about how much funds are flying around.
What I can tell you about LLI’s income spread though is what’s posted on their website in the ‘income disclosure’ section.
They state that 85% of their associates make between $0-$35,000 with an average income of just $13,123. This 85% bracket make up 19% of the total revenue of the company.
Meanwhile 3% of members make above $150,000 and represent 45% of the total earnings revenue.
It doesn’t take a genius to see the power of the affiliate associate system at work here. Those that got in early and got people working under them and then people working under them and so forth are the ones raking in the cash at the expense of the 85% in the lower bracket.
I couldn’t find any information on Liberty League’s total membership numbers (probably a closely guarded secret, they don’t want you knowing how much competition you have as an associate), but have a look at those percentages again and ask yourself do they add up?
I also was not able to find a reputable source for the commonly quoted 16-20 billion dollar industry figure either.
5. The upfront costs involved are small, besides you’ll make all the money back
From what I gather a lot of pressure is put on new associates to purchase all three products, that is the home study course and then attendance at the two seminars. All up this comes in at around US$30,000 per annum.
The smaller seminars are held twice a year and the major one annually, seminar ticket prices do not include airfares or accommodation so you are out of pocket for them as well. On top of all this is the marketing of your business.
Word has to get out there somehow and a cookie cutter website that looks the same as everyone elses isn’t going to be enough. The bad news is it’s all going to come out of your hip pocket.
Now if you do make some sales then sure you’ll make your money back but again have a look at those income statistics I quoted previously. 85% of associates make between $0-$35,000.
Those are some crushing odds you’re working against.
Hi guys I am looking for a way to purchase my summit ticket, I have exhausted the bank avenue and I don’t own my house so equity is out. My question is does anyone know of a finance broker or an avenue for borrowing money that are willing to over look the obligations I already have?
The costs of LLI are real and guaranteed, your earnings however are not. Are you ready to go into potential financial ruin for a 15% shot at staying in the green?
6. Business sustainability
If you do make it to a LLI conference have a look around, everyone in that room with you is your competition and are working tirelessly to steal leads away from you.
Sure everyone is smiling, holding hands and patting each other on the back but at the end of the day you’re all out to undercut each other. That’s how business works.
The big $$$ in LLI is in getting people under you as associates, in other words introducing them not only to the products but getting them to join the company. Unfortunately for each person you successfully convince to join the company you directly increase your local competition.
Then there’s the mass of LLI marketing websites set up by LLI’s inhouse company Unified Wealth Solutions which all have international contact numbers also directly competing against you in your area.
If we put aside the flashy promises and ‘positive attitudes’ for a second, does this sound like a long-term sustainable business model to you?
I’ve enjoyed your blogs on LLI and SFC. Have you looked in to a MLM company called ACN? I have been approached several times by their “representatives”.
It does look like its somewhat more reputable than LLI, as their products are atleast decent.
Glad you enjoyed reading it, I’m kind of sick of seeing their ads everywhere. The more people that get the word out on them the better.
I’ll look it up when i get home but I haven’t heard of ACN. I had to look them up, American Communications Network in case anyone’s wondering. Having said that I’m not too familiar with the MLM schemes going around at the moment.
I’m at work at the moment but a quick google glance looks like they actively encourage people to first sell to their friends and relatives which is usually an ‘oh-oh’.
I was an associate with Liberty League International here in Australia for 12 months losing $50k+. We just got back from the Summit conference at the Hilton on the big Island, Hawaii. I am no longer active in the business, but the holiday was planned and paid for before I “escaped” and I promised my 5yr old we would go to Hawaii (I operate with integrity unlike LLI). My wife attended the conference to hear the 3 speakers and get some inside info. I spent time with my daughter observing the business from another angle. Most associates there were first or second timers. They were in the same frame of mind that I was in at my first conference in Mexico in March, super positive, expecting their business to explode when they return. we were invited to the usual poolside “masterminding” sessions but told by my advisor not to discuss marketing as it is a conversation killer! I cannot believe how brainwashed I was. The first speaker asked how many people saw him at the Liberty conference at Cancun, Mexico in Oct 2007 and only a few hands out of the 900+ audience put their hands up, shows the massive turn over rate in the company. The only people who continue to attend are the few that started early on in the business as Oz mentioned.
Also on the plane back home, six figure chick was sitting in front of us in ECONOMY (cattle) class!!!
When they say you don’t have to ‘sell’ they are at least in part trying to convince you that the amazing 3-step system does it for you. The associate ‘just’ places an ad, then places people on a business overview call, and then places them on a follow up 3-way call with their Summit advisor, who will do the sales part.
Big problem for me was, after making my first $1000 profit sale, my advisor (who had made $US8000 profit from me) told the associates I’d introduced (who she was also Summit Advisor too) that she wouldn’t do their 3-way calls as I was capable of doing them. And what a story I had to tell… been in the business 4 months, spent $10,000, and made $1,000.
So yes there was selling, but no not a lot of ongoing support.
The your advisor cut you off is because you weren’t directly making her any more money at that point.
From what I understand any associates you introduce after you’ve passed on your direct upsales are not added to your advisors sales list.
Instead they then feed off the associates that are introduced from the associates you left behind on their list during your qualifiying period. I’ll go into this in a bit more depth in a future article as it’s a real eye opener into the pyramid structure of Liberty League operates.
Hey The Truth, that’s a funny story. Did you make any money from LLI or did you spend all that money with no income? Soul destroying stuff. I am new to LLI and so far I have enjoyed my time. I have not made money yet nor have I qualified. It would appear that you have attended a few conferences – were they valuable? What have you got out of LLI? Did you have to work hard for nothing. I am interested in hearing your experience.
No I did not make any money, one qualifying sale. Plenty of prospects on the fence/getting started but none proceeding.
After all three product purchased USD$22,485
Online/offline marketing over 12 months ~$20,000 plus travel expenses ~$10,000, we are in debt over AUS$50,000. Average I say. Three associates I know are in a similar situation to us except they are still going!!!
We attended both the Liberty Conference in Acapulco and Summit Conference in Hawaii. The striking thing for me at the summit (I had already made my decision to leave at this point and did not listen to the speakers, my wife attended) was that the majority of the people there were fresh faces. This was reinforced when one of the speakers who was at Cancun, Mexico asked for a hands up to see who saw him there, only a few hands went up!!!
We love travel so what we got out of it was two great destinations. It would of been far better to travel independently and see Tony Robbins or the like at home for a fraction of the cost.
Hey Rod.
What do you make of the Michael Hamburger bailout??
This is really going to hurt Liberty League as from what I can tell, Hamburger was the ‘clean up’ king. He would be well aware of how to ‘hang’ LLI.
Wow… another Liberty League Leader has bailed out.
Is the ship sinking or do they know something we don’t?
Rhonda Swan of Swanlifestyle and one of the companys all time top earners has defected to the oposition so thats two massive profiles leaving LLI in the last few days.
http://swanlifestyle.blogspot.com/
Oz… maybe, just maybe, it all started here!!
That’d be something special hey.
I’d like to think information being spread contributed somewhat to leaders leaving the company but realistically the business is cannibalistic.
The more people that join the harder it is to turn a profit as they’re all trying to create their own pyramids.
Still great news though!
This is all good news.
Not too surprising though. Michael Hamburger has not been on the leader board for a long time, so his income has been dwindling. Also he has a lot of bad press posted about his past.
Rhonda Swan was more more of a surprise, but she too has not been seen on the leader board recently either.
I can see more leaving, Tony Rush himself has not featured on the leader board for ages and he is flogging affiliate stuff on twitter, I fell for a couple. If Tony rush recommends it, it must be ok. HA HA. I held him in high regard, meeting him in person, quite a nice guy…… until I woke up. If he leaves, LLI will suffer badly, he is like a god to most Associates, particularily new ones.
Maybe the main players here in Australia will keep LLI afloat, only time will tell…….
The fact that 8 out of 10 on the leaderboard are Aussies last week (and most weeks lately) indicates to me that LLI is almost done in the US.
My partner is 21 and interested in these quick money making schemes. HELP!!!
Is anyone able to please contact me to try and talk some sense into him!!!!!
He has just returned from a conference in QLD and is all fired up and excited about paying in more money to supposedly make his fortune. Is this a scam? What should we do? Who can I speak to??
Hi Rachel Yes it is a Scam Fair trading have now confirmed this pls see link for further info https://behindmlm.com/companies/polaris-media-group/liberty-league-a-scam-in-oz-polaris-media-group-next/
If he’s receptive and hasn’t totally been brainwashed yet get him to read the Liberty League section of this website and the Whirlpool thread on Six Figure Chicks. If he’s beyond reasoning I’d start preparing for a hard few months ahead. He might make it but the odds are heavily stacked against him.
Good luck Rachel.
(From someone who has some exposure to ACN the MLM company)
Started in the USA in ’96 and launched in Australia in 2004 (www.acnpacific.com.au) , dealing primarily with telecommunications products.
In its early days, they were brought before the Australian law courts by the ACCC but were finally cleared of any allegations of being a pyramid.
(Opinion) This made sense as it would otherwise have meant that long established MLM’s such as Amway, Herbalife, Nutrimetics, Mary Kay etc. would be illegal pyramids also.
I believe the confusion arose because their compensation plan not only paid commissions on phone usage, but on how many new recruits you have who also signed up a certain number of customers. One thing ACN makes clear is that money is only paid on the acquisition of customers, not on the recruiting of new reps.
Selling to friends and relatives is not an “oh-oh” – it’s the oldest strategy in home – based businesses and encouraged for most MLMs when getting started.
And however anyone defines MLM (multilevel marketing) or Network Marketing or even pyramid schemes, the only reason pyramid schemes are outlawed is because they are not sustainable businesses, relying purely on the transfer of money from new participants, resulting in a “chain-money scheme”, sometimes under the pretense of selling a product.
A legitimate MLM company on the other hand does have a product or service of value to distribute, with distributors or agents actually being able to profit from the distribution of the product or service, whether from personal sales or through their “downline” organisation. Their growth in new distributors does not exceed the population growth due to attrition and competition, whereas an illegal pyramid scheme tends to collapse at a certain point.
It’s also interesting to note that MLM schemes are still illegal in countries like Singapore, and heavily modified in the China market (eg. Amway distributors in China have to set up a shop and do not participate in the compensation plan exactly the same way as in other countries).
(This opinion is from someone who does believe MLM is a good viable form of business and distribution for products/services)
Thanks for the clarification Sam.
I do disagree with you on the selling to friends and family though. 99.9% of the time that’s a sure fire way to lose all your friends and family, infact trying to sell something to them usually sets off alarm bells.
Loving your blogs about Six Figure Chicks and similar, but … ah … your Google ads are a bit inappropriate (scams, scams and more scams).
Hey Tam, glad your enjoying the read.
Adsense is used on every article on BehindMLM and as such Google matches the content to it’s ad database. Part of the reason I use Adsense is so I don’t have to worry about building my own advertiser network.
As a publisher I it’s not my place to comment on the integrity of the Adsense advertiser pool. In fact as a publisher I’m actually prohibited from clicking on them.
If you see an ad you don’t feel is credible then by all means report the particular ad to the Adsense team.
Thanks for your response Oz. My beef is with adsense/Google ads. I HATE IT WITH A PASSION. Sooooooo many scams get advertised, sorry shouldn’t have directed my anger at you.
Been reading your site for hours and what you’ve done is incredible. I’ve been looking for job that I might be able to do at home, and have found scam after scam after scam and it worries me that people without the same strong instincts as I get sucked into this crap.
What’s the latest with PMG? They still around? And what does EMC stand for?
Tam 🙂
Hey Tam no worries.
Unless you’re after specific information, the articles on Polaris are probably best read in chronological order. Click the ‘Libery League’ section in the Topic side navigation menu to the right (you’ll have to scroll up a bit).
Then click the older entries button at the bottom of the list until you get to the start of the article list. From this page I’d right click the articles you want to read and open them up in new windows.
Happy reading!
Re ACN. Someone I know has signed up with them and keeps posting of facebook about how wonderful it is. She gave me some paperwork to look over and man it is SO obviously dodgy.
Their selling point is ‘residuals’ and based on collecting a percentage of eacy telephone bill you manage to sign up. My calcs show you can’t make anywhere near the amount of money they suggest.
Matt Rasmussen is into ACN nowdays as well.