Rippln Review: Mobile app + recruitment
The Rippln website contains no information about who owns or runs the business and only provides visitors with the following message:
Stay tuned for more updates about the release.
The Rippln website domain (“rippln.com”) was registered on the 23rd of September 2012, however the domain registration information is set to private.
On the Rippln Facebook page, a “Brian Underwood” is named as company CEO:
Underwood (photo right) describes himself as a “serial entrepreneur” and “global innovator” on his personal blog and claims to have been “building companies over 20 years”.
Underwood’s previous endeavours in the MLM industry include the creation of iZigg, which he served as CEO of.
iZigg was an opportunity that launched in 2010 and revolved around SMS and advertising. Here’s what fellow MLM blogger Ty Tribble over at MLM Blog had to say about iZigg shortly after launch:
iZigg Scam: Will The FTC Step In And File A Lawsuit To Shut This Down?
iZigg is a new MLM company that promises wealth based on text message advertising. This is a classic “lots of hype” money game that will not last.
Tribble names Underwood as having previously been involved in BurnLounge as a master-distributor and the National Sales Director of LocalAdLink.
BurnLounge was launched in April 2007 and by June the same year the FTC had filed a lawsuit alleging the company to be a pyramid scheme. The case concluded in January 2012 with a judge declaring BurnLounge to indeed be an illegal pyramid scheme.
Tribble claims Local Ad Link was also a “scam” and that it ‘had people paying a bunch of money to get listed on Google‘.
Read on for a full review of the Rippln MLM business opportunity.
The Rippln Product Line
Rippln market what they call the “Rippln App”. It’s an application for mobile devices with which users can communicate with eachother, interact with advertising and buy third-party affiliate offers and other apps through.
The Rippln Compensation Plan
Referred to as the “core strategy” of the Rippln compensation plan, Rippln affiliates recruit free affiliates (referred to as “fans”) and then get them to do the same.
For every 5 fans a Rippln affiliate recruits, they are paid $20. For each one of their directly recruited affiliates who also recruits 5 new affiliates, they are again paid $20.
Coaching Bonuses
Rippln affiliates can earn domestic and global bonuses (referred to as a “coaching bonus”) every time one of their directly recruited affiliates upgrade or qualify (Rippln do not clarify which) to either Domestic or Global affiliate status.
The Coaching Bonus is paid out using a perpetual 1-up compensation plan structure up to 10 recruited affiliates, and one in every 5 after that.
Rippln affiliates keep the Coaching Bonus earnt on the odd-numbered affiliates they recruit (within their first 10 recruited affiliates).
Every second recruited affiliate (again, within their first 10 recruited affiliates) is paid to their upline).
After the first ten recruited affiliates every 5th recruited affiliate that generates Coaching Bonus by upgrading or qualifying for Domestic or Global affiliate status is then passed up.
The Domestic Affiliate Coaching Bonus is $80 and the Global Affiliate Coaching Bonus is $240.
Matching Coaching Bonus
For every odd recruited affiliate who upgrades or qualifies as a Domestic or Global affiliate, Rippln pay out a 25% matching bonus on their Coaching Bonus earnings.
For every even recruited affiliate, the Matching Coaching Bonus is a 50% match.
Rippln App Commissions
Rippln App commissions are paid out using a unilevel compensation structure. A unilevel compensation structure places an affiliate at the top of the structure with every personally recruited affiliate placed directly under them (level 1).
If any of these level 1 affiliates recruit new affiliates of their own, they are placed on level 2, if any level 2 affiliates recruit new affiliates they are placed on level 3 and so on and so forth.
Using the above unilevel compensation structure, Rippln pay out a commission on the revenue generate by an affiliate’s downline via use of the Rippln App, paid down a maximum of 10 levels:
- recruit 2 Domestic or Global qualified or upgraded affiliates and have 10 free affiliates in your downline = 10% on the app revenue generated by 2 levels
- recruit 4 Domestic or Global qualified or upgraded affiliates and have 50 free affiliates in your downline = 10% on the app revenue generated by 4 levels
- recruit 6 Domestic or Global qualified or upgraded affiliates and have 150 free affiliates in your downline = 10% on the app revenue generated by 6 levels
- recruit 10 Domestic or Global qualified or upgraded affiliates and have 1000 free affiliates in your downline = 10% on the app revenue generated by 8 levels
- recruit 15 Domestic or Global qualified or upgraded affiliates and have 2500 free affiliates in your downline = 10% on the app revenue generated by 10 levels
All-Star Bonuses
In their compensation plan material Rippln mention “AllStar Bonuses” where affiliates can collect commissions generated by their downlines that they don’t yet qualify for.
No qualification criteria for All-Star Bonuses are provided.
Joining Rippln
Affiliate membership to Rippln is free. Free affiliates must recruit 5 new free affiliates in order to qualify as a “Player Affiliate”.
Player Affiliate’s can then opt in to become either Domestic Affiliates (earn on downline who are in the same country as the Domestic Affiliate) or Global Affiliates (earn on a global downline).
Rippln do not currently provide information on what it costs or how affiliates qualify as either as Domestic or Global Affiliate.
Conclusion
I’ve seen Rippln being marketed as a mobile app social network, which I’m assuming is based on Rippln affiliates being able to communicate with eachother via the app.
Social networks and MLM are nothing new and as usual Rippln marketing material focuses heavily on Facebook, Twitter, Angry Birds and other succesful internet properties, asking the question “why aren’t users paid to promote them?”
The key ingredient with each internet property mentioned however is the idea behind it. A key ingredient Rippln is missing.
Facebook, Twitter et al. were all heavily promoted and shared by users because of the idea and service they provided. Rippln ditch the ideas that made all of those companies succesful and simply seek to pay people to promote Rippln itself.
Let’s face it, in the year 2013 a social app that displays advertising and affiliate deals is hardly something to write home about.
Without an idea or service however, all that’s left is affiliates promoting the opportunity itself. And naturally, the Rippln compensation plan leads into that.
Recruit free affiliates and earn commissions and become a “Player”. Then, somehow become either a Global or Domestic affiliate.
Recruit enough free affiliates who then also opt to upgrade or qualify as Global or Domestic affiliates and this “core strategy”, Rippln tell you in their marketing videos, is all that’s required to be a succesful with the company.
The key piece of information left out of the puzzle is exactly what it costs or what is required to become a Domestic or Global affiliate.
Looking at the $80 and $240 commissions paid out, along with matching bonuses I’m going to guess there’s a monthly or one-time fee involved.
The fact that Rippln do not disclose this key information is a serious red flag that should not be ignored.
Most likely the reason this key information isn’t disclosed is that Rippln are attempting to run a “stealth” viral campaign to attract as many people to the opportunity as possible. They’ve apparently even gone so far as to have everyone in the Rippln “inner-circle” sign an NDA.
At the time of publication of this review, Rippln has threatened to terminate any affiliate caught discussing or promoting Rippln using the information from their inner-circle (specifics about the compensation plan, including Domestic and Global affiliate qualification), until CEO Brian Underwood gives the go-ahead.
One can only assume given the lengths Rippln have gone to keep this information under wraps, that it isn’t going to be all that attractive to the end-user.
Best case scenario I imagine that if affiliates have to buy Domestic or Global affiliate status you’d be looking at something just over $80 for Domestic and around $250 for Global (I can’t see it being much higher than that).
If it’s a qualification process then expect to have to recruit a boat load of Player affiliates (free affiliates who have recruited at least 5 new free affiliates).
That $240 and $80 Coaching Bonus has to come from somewhere and it’s not via use of the Rippln app.
Naturally requiring affiliates to buy into the compensation plan would be a red flag as Rippln’s app could simply be ignored, leaving affiliates generating commissions solely on the recruitment of new affiliates.
That said, even if they didn’t have to pay a fee of some sort, with the app being given away for free and Rippln themselves seeming to offer nothing at a retail level (giving something away is not retail), there’s still a question mark over the legitimacy of the program, at least from an MLM business opportunity standpoint.
CEO Brian Underwood’s involvement in various MLM schemes of dubious reputation and legal status certainly don’t inspire any confidence on the subject. Nor do Rippln themselves when they constantly refer to their MLM opportunity as a “game” which affiliates “play” in their official marketing material.
At the end of the day this isn’t the first time we’ve seen a social concept paired with MLM and to date every single one of them has failed to gain any traction. The last social network MLM that went high-profile (and also pulled a silly viral pre-launch campaign) was Wazzub.
Last I heard Wazzub (who pre-launched in 2011), were still trying to convince people to invest in shares in the company so they can finally get the opportunity off the ground.
Make of that what you will.
I think that Rippln will be a way for advertisers to pay people to share whatever the advertiser wants them to share and they are using their own platform to show it works…
I was in Dallas on the weekend and can assure that there is a reason why there is non disclosure, and that will be pulled off when the app is available, and the company actually launches!!
This app will be very useful, fun, and give the world a great opportunity to network with each other. I look forward to rippln with my friends.
Share with who? Other people who are being paid ‘to share whatever the advertiser wants’?
You need people not interested in the income opportunity to join in that case. And we all know that doesn’t happen in MLM when it comes to anything social related.
Another business of Rippen people off!
I would like to encounter the cost of this program is $900 for global and 300$ if you just want 1 country so it will fall before it stands up
And there you have it. That’s why they’re not telling the general public what it costs to get involved.
So basically we’re looking at a $900/$300 recruitment scheme that pays $240/$80 a pop plus commissions with a perpetual 1-up plan.
Guess who’s going to be at the top of the comp plan receiving all those even and fifth passups?
But Advertisers will go to Facebook or Google, not some noname outfit that may not even survive 6 months.
Advertisers want people who will spend money, not people looking for additional income. To what segment of population is Rippin being marketed toward? Hmmm? I’ll bet you it’s “money-makers”, not money spenders.
I don’t have all the information on what the compensation plan will be or the “buy-in” costs but I do know that the app buying market is doing quite well – iTunes for example
The way this was explained to me was that it will be a social/mobile media platform where you can refer others in your ripple to apps that are available – kinda like Amazon Marketplace.
There will be a free version as well as a paid version of the program. Just like there are free versions and paid versions of many apps.
(Ozedit: recruitment spam removed)
There’s already a ton of apps like that. Even iTunes itself does that. Furthermore, iTunes PROHIBITS apps that just recommend other apps. They just yanked AppGratis, a platform for “trying out” free and 24-hour demo apps.
http://www.bizjournals.com/sanjose/news/2013/04/08/apple-pulls-appgratis.html
Which means Android already has about a dozen apps that does the same thing: app discovery. FOR FREE.
There will NO revenue from this app. Any one who paid for a position in this will VERY likely to get nothing.
I found this:
http://jonathanbuddrippln.blogspot.be/2013/03/introducing-jonathan-budd-rippln-co.html#!/2013/03/introducing-jonathan-budd-rippln-co.html
If he’s really co-founder, his blog should be on rippln’s website, not a free blogspot account, with title like “message from co-founder”.
This screams “fly-by-night” scammer, not internet entrepreneur.
Terry, well said. The only problem here is affiliates will be making money and not just the company. That is a no no in the likes of Oz and Chang and unfortunately, the US government.
FB and Google are ok because they keep all the money they generate off of the backs of free users. When this gets to a couple of hundred million dollars revenue, the APPs (I am assuming they will release multiple APPs) better be useful and they better have other products selling throughout the network.
I am not all up in arms against Oz. He makes that point very well. No useful product in an MLM and you have a pyramid scheme/scam LOL.
Again, if the products are of value, an MLM will survive. AMWAY, HERBAL LIFE etc are still here even though most of their products are used up by the associates.
If advertising is the product, and the APPs will be unique and free, then I can see how companies will pay ad fees. If that is the case, then there will be no deference between how e.g. HERBAL LIFE operates by charging to be an associate.
The app becomes entirely irrelevant when you’re charging $300/$900 to become a recruitment commission qualified affiliate and paying out $80/$240 a pop.
Useful product or no product that’s pure pyramid.
That’s so grossly simplified to the point of being untrue.
I have no problem with true MLM where you sell products or services face to face, people to people and get paid commission when your downlines also make sales.
However, there are no sales in rippln… except to more affiliates (and maybe a few people who buy the “paid app” when it actually comes out), but these “apps” where you “shop” are dime a dozen. Google Shopper, any one? Or Groupon? or Living Social? ShopKick? Need I say more?
So why are you being paid $80 when you convince someone else to join at $300? What exact are you getting paid for, if the app’s going to be pretty worthless?
You’re being paid to RECRUIT… and you bought your way into this “income opportunity”, which fits all four parts of the Koscot pyramid test. By definition, that’s a pyramids scheme.
The app’s irrelevant. You’re not selling app, because you’re not deriving any income from app. You’re selling rippln itself… and you paid into it first.
At least with Herbalife, the affiliates can claim to be selling the products, not the concept of Herbalife itself. You can’t even say that about Rippln.
Ooops! Sorry Chang. I did not know that. It is also my point. Beyond the initial launch, they better have other products to offer OR be able to hold millions and millions of “free” eyeballs. If they can do that, I see no problem whatsoever. I think they survive.
If all they have is that app for recommending other apps or products, they are DOA because there’s already ton of apps like that already… Pinterest being a good example.
I feel this could be something because the “app” they are creating IMHO has tons of potential, but who knows for HOW LONG.
Awesome information. I’m SOOO glad I always do my due diligence on companies before I invest any real time or money.
My only question is: How do we know for sure that it costs $300-$900 to join? I mean, how do we know the poster that came up with those costs didn’t just throw those figures out there on speculation?
We don’t know for sure (unless we receive confirmation) but those $80/$240 + $20 commissions have to come from somewhere. Let’s not kid ourselves and pretend advertising and app buying is going to cover it, so that leaves self-qualification via a membership fee.
In order to pay out money it has to come in from somewhere. Recruiting a global or domestic user has nothing to do with buying apps or advertising so there’s a strong probability it’s tied into some sort of affiliate membership fee.
Oz,
I saw one part of your article that I do not believe is current info. From what I have read the Burn Lounge case is not finished, it has now been appealed to the appellate level.
Personally I do not believe tis will change the original judge’s opinion.
I have reached out to Brian for an interview, and he has agreed. Like you and so many others I do see some issues, and figured we might get more details from Brian directly.
Although, I am not sure what Budd’s involvement is, I do know that Terry LaCore founder of bHip and other companies is a major investor in this project.
As for the NDA… In my review later today, I call that “Fear of Loss” reverse psychology. Instead of hurry up join or you will miss out forever as the old traditional FOL goes, it is “signed the NDA and you will be part of our inner circle.
A cool marketing campaign 🙂
But as we have all seen over the last few years, cool marketing campaigns, do not make a company legal.
On a side note, I have already heard where distributors have been terminated for cross recruiting into RippLn. So if RippLn doesn’t have some form of disclosure in the P&Ps stating their do not approve or condone raiding of other companies or organizations, then they may find themselves in a few lawsuits if the info I have received is correct.
In closing… I have heard, but have not seen or verified that the cost to upgrade is around $300 and $50 per month for the licensing rights to give away the app.
If this is close to being true, then I doubt if the app will be available at Apple, and may not be made available for Android either.
Seems, RippLn may be trying to compete with Solavie.
One this is for sure… It has caused some Ripples over the last few days 🙂
Hey Troy,
If the appeal is won then it changes the judgement, otherwise as it stands legally Burn Lounge is a pyramid scheme. It always was one of course from a practical viewpoint.
An interview would clear up alot of the missing information, although I can’t help but point out if Rippln were interested in filling in the blanks they wouldn’t have omitted them in the first place.
$300 a month sounds close to the previously quoted domestic figure. The monthly membership fee is new though.
$50 a month to promote an app that sells other apps? Y’huh… nothing but paying for the opportunity to promote the income opportunity there.
Legal Update from Rippln Facebook:
Ok, I got word from the top of Rippln that it’s a one time fee of $300 for domestic and $900 globally and also a $49 monthly. WHAT THE HECK ARE WE TALKING ABOUT HERE???
The vast majority of the people singing up in Rippln have no clue that these upgrades are coming. FOR AN APP??? What about the knock-offs that will come right behind it? What about Zuckerberg and his new FB platform in the works?? Is he going to ambush people with these kind charges. Who are we kidding here??
I hear Zuck has a platform rolling out once this Rippln scam fails that will swoop all the drop-outs up and of course it will be free or nearly free and generate revs from total outside sources. What does he need everyone’s money for, he’s already a zillionare.
The people behind Rippln are Tech wannabees, they’re going to right everything that’s wrong with social media. They are money hungry losers as you can see in the article.
People, groups have been trying to monetize social media since FB came out and not one has been successful and these MLM idiots (money hungry idiots) got it right?? It’s a greed grab! THEY DON’T CARE ABOUT YOU! WAKE UP PEOPLE!!
Zuck is fully aware about Rippln, he actually thinks it’s a great idea but with no backbone it will not work. It has been proven time after time after time after time. I’m taking an app building and website building class right now and everyone agrees that has seen it that it is very well done and it’s a good idea but the fees??? I think everyone in the class laughed out loud!
Apps cost nearly $0 to make and they come and go at the drop of a hat. You have to pay to be a cheerleader to promote the income opportunity is the way I see it. I mean is everyones head in the sand or is mine???
There have been a number of pre launch deals that let you recruit and bulid a massive team so when it comes time to launch, you’re already set up. That’s how you lose your entire team and credibility from my experience.
Outside of the rah, rah mlmers and LEADERS everyone will drop like flies out of this thing when it launches. I’ve put some people into it and they have already asked about the money issue and I can’t lie to them. They go right out the door.
WE ARE TALKING ABOUT AN APP HERE LADIES AND GENTS. I don’t care if it can bake a pizza in my glove compartment and massage my neck and keep the straw of a cold beverage to my lips while I’m driving down the street in my car… You can have it for $900 down and do a lot more with it than just have it.
I’m soooo glad I found ths website back when I did!! It is dead on point. Specifically Oz and Chang are almost 100% right. I’ve learned the HARD way.
At first it was hard to swallow because they we telling the truth and properly analyzing a lot of the companies I’m in or was in.. but we all know the truth hurts and especially when it’s expensive or it blows away your dreams of being “a successful online entrepreneur” total rubbish!
The vast majority of people that come on here don’t want to face the facts and hear the truth about the company they just dumped a bunch of money into so they will defend the company and it’s comp plan and integrity etc.. Only time will tell, only time will tell.
I won’t touch a company unless coming here to check it out. I’ve been in the last year. ZEEK, GLOBAL ONE, LYONESS, WCA, SAVINGS HIGHWAY, 5-LINX,GLOBAL HANGOUT, ADIT, WORLD PRE LAUNCH, JUBIMAX, RIPPLN and seriouly that’s just the tip of the iceberg.
The vast majority of these companies are all losers and if they are not now, they will be. IT COMES DOWN TO GREED PEOPLE! You might have integrity, you say but the vast majority of the mlm companies do not and don’t care about you no matter what they say. Neither do most sponsors.
You’re supposed to build a team, yeah right that’s funny! Everyone is out for themselves, period! Thank you Oz and chang for telling it like it is and for your analytical eye.. no matter how painful the truth is. I KNOW, I LEARNED THE HARD WAY.
Now some people dispute what I’m saying but those are usually the highly talented schemers that have the ability to make tons of money and manipulate people into these scheme traps… and I say to you, I hope you make more so you can take it with you!
I’m like a magnet for mlm scum. I’ve lost a great deal of credibility in the last years due to these scams. It’s my fault, I’m not blaming anyone but myself. Rippln isn’t telling you everything! They are keeping a lot of things hush hush. RED FLAGS ALL THE PLACE.
Have fun getting people in other countries paying $900 to upgrade. HAVE FUN GETTING ANYONE TO UPGRADE.. ARE YOU SERIOUS???
If you are in Rippln and will pressure people to upgrade when the time comes.. You need to take a long look in the mirror and change some things. Oz and Chang, keep fighting the good fight!
@Ventura
Nice bit of marketing their from Rippln’s legal dept. Nobody (at least not here) mentioned anything about a Brian Underwood lawsuit or SEC investigation. He was credited by Ty Tribble as being the master-distributor of BurnLounge, which was shutdown by the FTC for being a pyramid scheme.
iZigg, which he was CEO of also looks to be dubious.
SEC lawuits against Underwood and investigations most certainly would appear to be false, however his involvement in dodgy companies at a master-distributor and executive management level certainly isn’t.
That of course won’t stop Rippln’s affiliates going into denial. The following was published in response to Rippln’s legal update:
Yeah, we need to retract what we never published. Good one guys.
Thanks for the encouragement and support!
I have read the appeal a few days ago. The pyramid scheme part was rather weak, it was mostly about “FTC failed to prove” rather than about what BurnLounge really was about.
But that’s probably normal for a FINAL appeal. It’s not about the case itself but about how the other Court have handled the case.
Some of the points in the appeal:
The appeal is typically about the Burden of Proof and the different types of evidence used there, e.g. 40% of the Moguls CAN have bought the product packages because of the products (not because they offered higher income).
The main focus in the appeal seems to be about reducing the Monetary Relief, “get some of the money back”. Many of the arguments are about the value of the products, that people actually received something in exchange for their money.
Of course not, because nobody ever mentioned the SEC, or any current lawsuits.
Typical strawman tactic… deny something that nobody had ever accused.
A: Are you doing something illegal?
B: I was NOT investigated by the FBI.
It’s a complete no-sequitur.
Sounds a lot like those angry protesters whenever Brian Dunning of Skeptoid pops someone’s bubble about some crazy beliefs. He just did one on UFO believers who sent him nasty email. Reading some of those replies, and you’ll have deja vu… they sound so much alike.
Nobody here said anything about SEC, investigation, or lawsuit against Rippln. Yet Rippln fanboys clearly came to the conclusion that BehindMLM did.
Perhaps the the Rippln fanboys have very active imaginations (like those UFO believers)
http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4358
So,
is this the same Elliot Brian Underwood who was part of the BurnLounge pseudo MLM prosecuted by the FTC ??
It’s a shame the review you give has produced such angst among so many uninformed.
This company is officially 1 week old today, they haven’t even released the app or introduced the platform to any of the public; they’ve showed you what they can about the compensation plan and cost to join.
They’ve got over 100k people in this “free” phase that’s controlled and done in a professional manner. No MASS mailing work with this one. And yet, people are so quick to judge a unique opportunity like this. I guess they were the same people on MySpace who poo-poo’d Facebook when it first arrived.
BWaahahahahahahahhaaaaaa I’m rippln and I think it will be something people enjoy doing to earn a comfortable income. I don’t need millions. Have fun. Keep rippln.
Yeah… cuz anyone who’s not in Rippln can simply be dismissed as “uninformed”. So too can the facts and critical analysis. It’s all simply “uninformed”.
Here we go again with the all to familiar cult-like behaviour that pops up whenever a “viral” MLM opportunity surfaces…
@mlmsucker
You said “Zuck is fully aware about Rippln, he actually thinks it’s a great idea but with no backbone it will not work.”
Where is he quoted saying this? Did you meet him for a Starbucks this morning? Can you provide a source for your word-smiting?
Where did you hear “$49 per month” for Rippln? Do you know what the platform is? How it works? What it does? Please enlighten those of us at the top of the feeding frenzy. 230 countries…150k people in a week. They’re doing something right. I don’t think it’s just hype. You just sound bitter.
Like someone who never really found success because they were always pissing and moaning about this cost or that fee, and you were never really “into” your product; you were the greedy one. That’s why you didn’t succeed. YOU didn’t care about the people you sponsored.
Any good MLMer knows you have to support your people and do for them what they can’t at the beginning. But since you have never seen leadership at work in your own life, you can’t be a leader for others in MLM. And that’s okay. You’re a better “pisser and moaner”.
There’s another one.
Coming up next, ‘you just don’t get it’ followed by something about agendas and if we’re lucky, government conspiracies.
Where is the money coming in to pay people?
There has to be someone putting money into the system to pay out and I’m guessing it’s another “training system” that teaches a user how to sell the training system to other users who will sell it to other people ad nauseum.
Time to repost the “bad rebuttal generator”…
http://amlmskeptic.blogspot.com/2012/08/humor-item-bad-argument-generator.html
I have been following the progress of this for the last year by attending events they have been throwing and I am sad to report that people are really being mislead right now by folks they trust.
People really need to separate the fact a trusted friend might have told you about this but that does not mean anyone has done their proper research.
Anyone who has been around this knows they are copying a company called Zooplr a really cool tool coming out for Educators and Entrepreneur that is not a MLM.
It is clear that Ripplin is simply trying to launch a MLM version of the much anticipated Zooplr without trying to look like a MLM.
However Rippln does not have a app yet that actually works and they are just trying to do a massive email grab , but worse they are trying to trick people into thinking this is not a MLM.
They also are playing on peoples sense of community by making vaporware statements like this app will somehow “Shift Humanity” a Buzz word that Jim Bunch likes to use all to fast as he sells from the front of the stage.
It is these types of over stepping claims that is really causing people to lost trust in what they are doing. Way to much hype for something that needs to be tested.
The FTC & Dsa is really cracking down on this type of hype and also on service based companies like this who do not have actually products to sell. Not to mention the customer requirements to be a legit MLM.
I have been amazed at how people with audiences have so quickly sent out a invite to Rippln as if that will not come back to haunt them with the attitude they have nothing to lose ! Really nothing to lose ?
Last time I checked people expect you to not violate their trust but I keep hearing things like Russal is a good guy, and Jim bunch seems nice , but neither of these guys have any experience with the restrictions or the politics of MLM. Oh don’t get me wrong they will say they do but they have never been actually running the MLM behind the scenes.
Now when it comes to Johnathan Budd and Brian Underwood , yikes they clearly have made millions off the fringe of MLM for years as they both have been kicked out of companies for violating best practices. I mean do people not realize two of Brians companies where shut down? That is not a small thing to have happen.
I am shocked by the authors or leaders who are about to get a black eye for passing this on to fast to their communities. I do realize the pitch from stage is compelling as they play on your heart strings about changing the world but it is being done by people who are not qualified to speak on these subjects.
It really comes down to this is just this a bunch of good intentioned people getting themselves all excited over a app that does not exist and business that is not proven and talking about topics none of them are qualified to talk about. Trusting that this must all be for real because that they have been a fan of this internet marketer online for years now.
However the ramifications of what they have all just stepped into can be very serious and hurt a ton of people.
Last time I checked when you send a ton of your fans or friends to a MLM meeting without telling them what it is or making sure it is legal people get upset. So wake up and stop falling for the cheap fear of loss technique.
You should be scared of losing trust with your people.
I don’t really spend much time investigating new apps and I’m sure there are some people around here more current with them than I. But what I’m wondering is if anyone knows of an app that funnels a stream of more or less untargeted advertisements for goods and services to your mobile device?
Imagine we were to create such an app and somehow convince a hundred thousand people to install it. That’s a respectable user base and we could turn a few bucks by selling access to our customer list to various advertisers.
Hell, if we were to send out solicitations from affiliate marketing deals we could score a commission off of every signup we could generate.
But the problem of course is to convince that many people to install our app and not uninstall it when all the spam started hitting them. I know, we set it up so that people can pay to use our otherwise free app in exchange for the income they can make by getting other people to pay to use the app as well.
This way they’ll be so busy spamming everyone on their contact list that they wont have time to complain about all the spam our app is sending them.
Nah, no one would ever fall for that.,… 😉
Yay!!! (I like this part) 😀
There are only 203 or 206 countries in the world?
206 if we include Somaliland, Transnistria and Nagorno-Karabakh in the list.
The list can be expanded to 246 if we include “non self governing territories”, e.g. Antarctica (0 inhabitants), Pitcairn (48 inhabitants in 4 families).
Currently 249 countries, territories, or areas of geographical interest are assigned official codes in ISO 3166-1.
If they have done something right, it’s probably about finding the right group of naive people willing to believe in almost anything, willing to repeat everything they have been told without engaging their own brains.
Anyone who signs up for this is an idiot… All they are doing is making you advertise across the globe FOR FREE (barely telling you that you have to buy a reseller license). This reseller lincnese is probably much more than any of us are willing to spend!
Withholding the truth is the same as lying… If this guy got charged for scamming people before he’s going to do it again…
If you can’t read between the lines then your a F***ing idiot and you deserve to get your money and time taken from you.
Another Great Coverage Piece here Oz! I saw this back a few months ago and could have gone to San Diego and of course Dallas but did not see any “VALUE” in the program as all that is transparent is “HYPE” , “NON DISCLOSURE OF TRUTH” and “NO REAL SERVICE OR PRODUCT”
The fact that no one was able to learn compensation until around the Dallas event was a ~HUGE~ Red Flag. If a promoter is going to put their time into marketing a program, they need to determine in the due diligence phase how much ROI they could potentially get.
Also, as what marketer with integrity I would not want to Rubber Stamp my name behind any company with no legitimate product/service offering. We all have seen the scams and border line opportunities that make a bad name for home based business arena. Why people put up with HYPE driven Zombie marketing makes no sense to me.
Again, thanks Oz for all you do to expose truth and allow for integrity in our industry to rise among a busy sea of commerce. 😉
From the article:
That was my impression too.
It reminds me of other failed internet marketers who once have had success in a program several years ago, desperately trying to repeat it without really having an idea about how to do it.
They usually have a few “followers”, people willing to add to the “marketing noise” in exchange for positions when a new opportunity is released. They will usually spam the internet with “fake it till you make it” statements to make it LOOK “successful”.
Rippin has many signs of being a program like that, a short lived pyramid scheme where “social marketing” is the main idea (rather than having a GOOD idea). The 40 or 50 followers will make enough noise to make the program look active, by spamming social networks. SOME will probably fall for it, “new idiots are born every minute”.
Most of these self-titled “internet entrepreneurs” are just “MLM star” with subtype of “recruiter”. They only know how to recruit, obtained a measure of success, and through anecdotal fallacy convinced themselves that it is the way to riches, and attempted to replicate the success, not realizing they are trying to recreate a pyramid scheme if they don’t understand the difference between MLM and pyramid scheme.
http://kschang.hubpages.com/hub/Six-Types-of-Network-Marketers-which-type-are-you
Quite reminiscent of how Wazzub doesn’t even have a website that does anything at the time, but managed to sign up “millions” of people (definitely massive email harvesting), and tried to make people believe they’ll be the next Google or Facebook, not a MLM, even though you have to recruit to qualify for the eventual payout.
Brian Underwood isn’t really a recruiter, either. He’s a “pretender” type of internet marketer, if I have interpreted it correctly (when I checked iZigg).
The “pretender” type will typically sell the dream of becoming rich through the “internet goldmine”, by releasing or selling the opportunity to participate in “the next big thing on the internet” (just like Wazzub).
They are noisy spammers rather than real recruiters, surrounded by a small group of other noisy spammers, trying to make marketing methods like “fake it till you make it” replace having a good idea.
They are trying to market themselves as “expert marketers” and “top earners” rather than market a product, but sometimes it can be difficult to see the difference (a product is usually involved in the marketing).
The main idea revolves around social marketing in one way or another, around marketing rather than product developments and sale, around selling some type of opportunity that’s supposed to be very “successful”.
It’s typically about a small group of followers. 40 or 50 people can make lots of marketing noise, but it’s typically more noise than results.
I really appreciate what is going on here on this site. I wasted a few days on this because I was introduced by an IM guy I trusted.
None of my people would pay for an upgrade that is just for the right to recruit. It is easier to make money with a legit business. Recruiting sucks and most people will not do it. Giving away a free app is easy, getting it to monitize with a good ROI is hard.
Thanks again. Also I heard a video where Russell was explaining his expert product. I clicked off when he repeatedly stated gross income like it was net profit referring to amazon.
I have sold on ebay and amazon both for years and I can tell you there are costs. Listing fees, product costs, shipping and packing cost, warehousing, advertising, gas to drop off shipments, time and labor, CC or Paypal fees.
If you make 8-15% net that might cover you own time maybe. Russell is not that credible to me. I love his videos though, they are good.
Common story. I don’t know about thing about this subject, so I trusted someone (who talked about this subject) who I had trusted before about something else.
You at least did the due diligence by conducting your own research. A lot of other people simply “went all in”, “go big or go broke”, “no fear” without the due diligence, and dismissed all the other people’s due diligence as “negativity”.
So you’re saying is they aren’t really successful, so they’re more of a MLM Grunt Type II or Type III (see the link above) pretending to be MLM Star / Recruiter.
I can accept that. 🙂
I checked a few different things, like a couple of iZigg reviews (“Pissed consumer” + 2 others), the number of Youtube followers and views, one or two Youtube videos, a forum thread, one “Free Press Release”, other similar stuff.
He reminds me of someone who have read or followed different “selfdev programs” and “social marketing programs”. It was reflected in how “Pissed Consumer” described the situation, in the type of marketing arguments and the lack of something real (e.g. external clients).
I used very simple keywords to search for material, e.g. Brian Underwood lawsuit, Brian Underwood iZigg, Brian Underwood Youtube, etc., and I checked around 20-30 different sources
Some of the sites I visited (links disabled):
izigg.pissedconsumer.com/izigg-is-selling-you-a-dream-alright-don-t-20111001265383.html
networkmarketleads.com/reviews-izigg-giant-lizard-or-text-message-marketing/
mlmblog.net/site/2010/08/izigg-scam-will-the-ftc-step-in-and-file-a-lawsuit-to-shut-this-down.html
WHAT he’s marketing is the “Internet Goldmine” dream, combined with “the next big thing on the internet” (and that’s typically about advertising tools).
HOW he’s marketing that is about “fake it till you make it”, exaggerated income claims and similar methods. It’s about MANY different details, but putting them together indicates a specific TYPE of “marketing ideas” (e.g. Mike Dillard, Magnetic Sponsoring, Attraction Marketing, etc.).
Marketing ideas like that are typically about selling “income opportunity packages”, e.g. a compensation plan with some tools attached to it. It’s about selling the opportunity itself to income opportunity seekers (others won’t be very interested).
Normally, marketers like that are not very successful. They spend too much time on creating a fake image of success rather than producing something of interest for a market. Usually they believe they finally will hit a goldmine if they repeat the same methods over and over again.
“Pissed consumer” described how annoying it was to listen to conference calls, where “top earners” clearly gave a false description of the income potential. People who normally are able to get some results will usually HATE that type of marketing.
In other words, these “conference calls” are just as useless as “press releases”. All marketing hype, no actually “useful” information.
Looks like I have to add a caveat to that classification: that initial apperances can be deceiving, due to “fake it till you make it” mindset. 😀
I have been approached numerous times to come join this. I have asked for further information and am not given any. I will not be a part of something without knowing what all the points are. I Say NO.
I have been ripped off to many times in the last 8 years. I finally found a biz that works and will not jump into something that will destroy my credibility and integrity. Good Luck to all who jump blindly into this.
To Clarify, $300 domestic and $600 global total $900 Have faith, it’s free. When we are out of the NDA phase, You will see. My question is, how can you get ripped off when the offer is free?
Global and domestic are exclusive of eachother?!
Wow, that’s some milking right there. Get your wallets out folks…
What exactly is free about $900?
Rippln seems to have retracted their original comp plan video. For the affiliate’s sake I hope that means they’re scrapping or altering the pass up plan.
The plan as expressed in the video had you passing five of your first ten paying recruits up to your sponsor and one of every five after that. That’s a comp plan only a pathological hyper recruiter could love.
I’ve already seen some people making comments rationalizing this as (my words, not theirs) a pyramid within a pyramid. You see you only pass up five of your first ten but the five you keep pass up five each so you lose five to gain 25.
But how many 3 to 9 hundred dollar signups will the average none hyper promoter get? Two or three if they’re lucky.
We’ve all seen a million schemes using a matrix plan blather on about spillover but this diseased form of unilevel might go on to coin the term “spillup.”
There goes the doublespeak…
Sure, none of the no-income users will be ripped off… Since they’re just “trying” stuff… for free.
But you all who put in $300+$600 are not “no-income users”, right?
And that would be you, right? If you don’t pay, you don’t play (or get paid), right?
That means the company wants your MONEY. If they just want your promotional efforts, they could have paid you FOR the promotional efforts.
Wake up, people.
Hi All,
This is Jonathan Budd. And I just want to take a minute to address all the opinions flying around.
First off, Appreciate you Oz for trying to do a good thing & sharing what you know with the industry. I can respect that, and can respect you looking out for people.
I’d like to take a moment as someone who’s part of the founding team at Rippln, to address much of the mis-information coming from many commentators, and the opinions being offered as fact.
As of writing this, we released the Ripple to the world 8 days ago. We are currently in a buzz building phase. The entire point of this phase is to simply share the main concept of Rippln with the world… and allow people to start laying the foundation of their ripple.
We believe that the world’s social graph is missing transparency. We see a vision for the future, where all people have the ability to track how their social graph spreads, & understand their ripple effect on the world.
We also believe people deserve to participate in the value they create in the market place. If we are creating billions of dollars in value for many technology companies, we believe the people deserve to be rewarded a % of what they create.
It’s a simple concept, which obviously has proved many people agree with us. We’re not surprised that many critics will come out, and attack something they don’t understand… but it’s important people have the proper information.
Much of the philosophy behind how we’ve operated the last 18 months coming up with Rippln can be summed up in this book:
“The Lean Start Up” – by Eric Ries
I highly recommend everyone reads if you haven’t already. In today’s fast paced environment, the market conditions are changing so much the most successful companies are the ones who are most agile. The ones who can iterate, and change their models quickly… to adapt to what’s happening.
The criticism so far for our model, is frankly something we cannot fathom to us because no one knows any details yet. After the model is fully released, we welcome criticism as we believe that will strengthen the model. However, at this stage, we recommend you wait until we release it. Then you’ll actually have something to analyze critically.
We are unbelievably committed to our vision, and will do nothing that has the chance of risking it. This is about more than just building a great company to us… this is about fundamentally creating something that has not been done before.
We want to transcend how business has been done in this marketplace. And the model we’ve created… is truly a blue ocean in that respect. There’s not one like it… no matter what people try to compare it to, or say about it… none of those comparisons are accurate.
The Ripple is larger than any one technology. We are not an app company… we are a PLATFORM. We are the platform that tracks your ripple effect across the world, & rewards you for the value YOU create in the marketplace.
Any technology, product, or service we choose to integrate… can tie into our platform & our users will have the ability to be rewarded for the value created in their ripples.
Rest assured, ALL factors are being considered. We are highly sensitive to case law & the regulations that govern the business opportunity world. We have full time in house legal counsel, as well as multiple other law firms we have been working with in the development of this plan.
Our Ripplr’s can be sure we have their legal interests, as well as our own, at top of our hearts. Like I said, what drives us is our vision to reach hundreds of millions of people, and rebuild the social graph on top of a platform that rewards the PEOPLE for the value in their own networks.
We can’t possibly do that, unless we are very careful with our legal responsibilities as well.
Concerning the statements about Brian’s past, Brian was never an owner of a single company investigated, or shut down, by the FTC. To this day, all the companies owned by the partners in Rippln are STILL operating, still paying commissions, & still changing people’s lives around the world.
The team at Rippln truly represents many of the most proven, & talented people existing in this space. Over $1 billion dollars has been processed through our genealogy & commerce platform.
When it comes to an international opportunity such as Rippln, I couldn’t think of too many people BETTER to be partnered with then the team who’s behind this.
Also, there were comments on here about myself getting removed from a company for violating policies & procedures… which is completely false. That simply never happened, & I have no idea what “Tony Story” is referencing.
This is an example of mis-information being spread, from people who simply aren’t qualified to give real perspective. I welcome the opportunity to tell my story to anyone that is interested.
Emotional statements generally evolve from personal biases, and typically from people with ulterior motives. I could only guess the myriad of feelings & motives of the many people who have been posting so far.
In the least, this is a highly searched traffic term, & it appears that many people may be trying to create controversy, simply to capitalize on Rippln’s brand & search traffic.
I would like to make a distinction between facts & opinions at this point.
When someone criticizes how you market… that’s not a fact, it’s an opinion. If you don’t like our marketing, our story, our concept, our philosophy, our vision… that is completely fine. This is a free country, you can choose to disagree with us about anything if you want.
But to insinuate that the character of the leaders behind this company are bad, that we would ever want to hurt our team mates, partners, even family members who all participate in this with us… is simply wrong.
I believe many people don’t even think about the negativity they spew into the world before they say these things. Many people will simply tear something down before they know anything about it.
The sad thing is, most people who are like that never have the chance at doing something significant. The most significance they can muster up… is to criticize someone else whose ideas are actually MAKING a difference in the market place or world.
One of my favorite lines I’ve heard recently is… “There’s no statue built for a critic.” And it’s quite true.
I would invite any person to truly THINK about what they are saying before they say it. Have actual information to base your opinions from, and recognize the impact those opinions may have on others.
It feels A LOT better when you are actually part of something that’s successful, & making a difference in people’s lives. That’s what the people behind Rippln are all about.
(Ozedit: attempt to take the discussion private removed)
Give us a little time, and we will gladly take care of you, and answer any question you might have.
If anyone has true critical analysis of our model, products, plan, or has questions… please post them here and as soon as time permits, I or someone from my team will address them.
We ENCOURAGE all collaborative discussion, and welcome any feedback you have to help us perfect our model even more.
If you simply want to share unfounded opinions about what we are doing… that’s fine too. But I believe it’s important for people to recognize the difference.
With that said, we will continue to update everyone each time we have something new to share. There’s a tremendous amount of work happening behind the scenes… a LOT of technology being scaled up as I’m sure you can imagine handling 180,000 users in 9 days is not an easy task to accomplish. Yet our team has handled it all, and is working around the clock to bring the rippln vision to fruition.
Hopefully I’ll be able to connect with many of you at one of our events soon. Until then, wish you all the very best.
Yours Truly,
Jonathan Budd
Exactly what the WebsiteTesterBiz people said when it was making the rounds on the Ponzi boards in 2010.
People got “ripped off” by providing names and email addresses to Ponz-board ripoff artists, who later used their databases of dupes to recruit people into scams such as MPB Today, Zeek and Profitable Sunrise.
On a side note, Rippln is coming out of the gate very much the same way scams associated with Phil Piccolo have come out of the gate: Create a shiny object, harvest email addresses by the thousands — and then try to get people to pay once they’re inside the system.
The most recent shiny-object scam associated with Piccolo was TextCashNetwork. Its website now is throwing a server error — this after the MLM troops planted the seed that TCN had a bright and shiny headquarters in Boca Raton, Fla.
The Boca Raton Police Department took care of that myth.
Hard to say right now if Piccolo is involved with Rippln. But he is infamous for his shiny-object scams and for creating scams by stealing the ideas of other scams — for example, DataNetworkAffiliates (like NarcThatCar) and OWOW (like DNA and predecessor scams starring Piccolo).
PPBlog
Let’s not forget that WebSiteTesterBiz guy went on to create Wazzub, which is an even BIGGER email harvesting operation.
I doubt Rippln will live up to the hype. The mobile app and social media aspect are just excuses to launder money amongst friends.
I’m still trying to figure out what it is they market, still unclear about that. Great post by the way.
I think we missed the waving the magic wand part.
@Jonathan
Great to see you jump into the discussion.
First and foremost I’d like to point out that there is nothing revolutionary or unique about a pass-up MLM compensation plan. It has been done before.
Also there’s nothing unique about an app that lets people communicate with eachother (communicate with people on a cell phone!? Why didn’t the manufacturers think of that!), or download other apps or be advertised to.
Except of course for the Rippln compensation plan material released by Rippln themselves.
In what appears to be a difference in core values with Rippln management, let me just state for the record that I’ve no interest in self-fellacio.
At no point in my life have I ever had the goal of having statues of myself erected around the world.
Great! So let’s start with how much does it cost to become a global and domestic affiliate?
Please note that when you answer the above question that neither myself or the rest of the MLM industry reading are interested in being pitched on how unique Rippln allegedly is, how wonderful the founders are or any other marketing waffle and excuses you might want to throw in, cheers.
Yea but you have to admit that if your intentions where less grandiose putting yourselves at the top of a short lived pyramid scheme could rake in a butt load of cash for you.
You have many fine products and services which people are willing to spend money for without being motivated by compensation. THAT is what makes you a legitimate direct selling/MLM company.
So how much does your app cost again? (Not the buy in for the pay plan though those numbers would be appreciated as well)
It’s cool that eventually, one day, perhaps soon you would like to reward people for their viral efforts at promoting products. I get that, it’s cool.
The problem I see is that in order to build your network you seem to be planning on paying your affiliates with their own money. You can’t get app makers to pay your affiliates (down ten levels) until you have several hundred thousand (paying) users so while building your network all you can do is move money from one affiliate to another. And that just isn’t sustainable, or, you know, legal.
I used a different method …
1. Do a quick search and look at the results.
2. Anbalyse it from what you can find there, e.g. what you can find about previous projects or marketing methods, or any other relevant information.
I compared the product to MyShoppingGenie and similar products, i.e. “toolbars, apps and similar products”.
I looked at CURRENT marketing methods, and compared them to PREVIOUS marketing methods (iZigg), and compared them to other known marketing methods (e.g. Wazzub, CarbonCopyPro, MyShoppingGenie).
For some reasons, I ended up comparing it to failed projects rather than to working ones. “Failed” = “user experience”, just to use a definition there.
That’s why I compared it to other vague ideas, where the only working idea has been to make people BELIEVE there’s actually a business idea involved in it (other than a recruitment scheme).
You could easily have shared the details rather than telling us “no one knows any details”, couldn’t you?
100-130 lines of “visions” could easily have been replaced by a few lines of facts. If you believe some of the comments have been unfair to the business model, address the facts rather than your own feelings about it? I don’t think anyone (other than yourself) is very interested in what you FEEL about something.
Please be more specific? What exactly is “our genealogy and commerce platform”? And what is “processed through”?
All I could see here was people following different “recipes”, e.g. marketing recipes.
BTW, you’re TELLING us about an idea, but you’re clairly failing to SHOW it to us?
Quote:
“the market conditions are changing so much the most successful companies are the ones who are most agile. The ones who can iterate, and change their models quickly… to adapt to what’s happening.”
Normally we would have expected YOU to be the first one SHOWING us the idea in practice, rather than telling us about the THEORIES?
“The market conditions are changing so much, …”. You should normally be the first one to detect it, and to adjust your marketing model to the new conditions (here). Instead, you told us about the THEORIES for how to adjust to changing market conditions?
No, I haven’t read it, and I don’t have any intentions about reading it either. Is this some type of school project or something? But thanks for the recommendation anyway.
You could easily have addressed the facts here, rather than spending 50 lines on theories about “facts vs opininions”?
That’s why I asked “Is this a school project or something?”. Your statements were mostly revolving around THEORIES about something.
You have obviously discovered a new market, where millions of people have been concerned about their own “social graphs” and the “ripple effect” it has on the world? Or do you plan to CREATE that market?
All I can see here is a rather vague business idea, in all other parts than the recruitment scheme. The core of the business idea is about selling the income opportunity to income opportunity seekers.
The free affiliate option is simply a recruitment method, while the paid affiliate alternatives will be where most of the money comes in.
Thank you Jonathan Budd.
Appreciate your taking the time to attempt to clarify a few points. For those who make a living of the buzz you are creating (negative marketing), we can only hope your position remains clear moving forward to those “thinking and positive” folks in the world.
People, from an anthropological point of view, do not like change. Change causes stress for many folks and should there be personal limiting factors…well, it is much easier (people like easy) to point the finger of blame, than to learn, accept and adapt.
My personal experience (over 30 years) with business models which incorporate multiple layers of commission (generically referred to as MLM), is that the vast majority of folks parrot “that’s a pyramid scheme”, without having any real conception of what that means. A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing! :>)
MLM companies that are providing full time incomes for folks who represent higher quality product than found at retail level, are to numerous to list here. It is about time an internet based company has been far sighted enough to blend “word of mouth” promotional income with the rampant use of social media.
Why shouldn’t the folks doing the promoting get a “piece of the action”, instead of making a single person like Zuckerberg so wealthy it would take several lifetimes to spend it all. Is that “socially responsible” of any of us to condone yet again applaud, in a world of ever decreasing resources?
Folks would rather “voice” (in most cases, as here in this post remain faceless/nameless….safe) their opinion than be educated to a new way of doing things. History is full of instances where creative thinkers were both reviled and ridiculed for their new approach. Unless of course should “they have thought of it” first! :>)
And please…stop with the “government” agency “approval of” this and that. If you are one of those folks who still believe the “government” has your best interests at heart….well…. The “government” is more interested in protecting promoting their (big business) interests and growth, rather than the interests and growth of the people they are paid to serve. That should be clear to most “thinking” folks at this point.
My hope is that the good folks at Rippln carry on with their efforts and perhaps we will see some serious social change arise as a result of their marketing.
Could the entire Rippln effort fall flat? Of course, anything is possible. However, lasting social change very rarely occurs with the first kick of the can, but relies on educating and at times making courageous baby steps towards change. Thank you Rippln for being courageous!
My experience and research is telling me that the folks at Rippln have started something that at the very least, should encourage new companies considering making internet based opportunities available to us “social masses”, keep our welfare at the front of their business model designs and incorporate decisions that reward us for assisting (participating in)their marketing efforts.
In my mind, Rippln has already accomplished that and good for them!
(Ozedit: removed offtopic ad-hominem insults)
Thank you again Jonathan for taking the time, from what I can olny imagine is a very busy schedule, to address the “folks” on this forum.
All the best and stay positive! :>)
Not here. You might have skipped over the review but that doesn’t mean it wasn’t written.
Because when they’re getting a piece of the action for encouraging others to join and pay money so they can get a piece of the action too – that’s the very definition of a pyramid scheme.
Thirty years of MLM experience and you should have learnt that much at least.
Oh and cheers, there’s that “government agenda” comment I mentioned a few comments back. The cult is strong with this one.
Social Proof?
Now for a very blunt opinion, and I’ll explain WHY I have it. If you can find flaws in my reasoning, like not enough data, feel free to add to it. I am open-minded if you show me enough data to prove me wrong. However, open-minded doesn’t mean believe in bull**** founded on no data.
Any way…
In my opinion, Rippln is an amateurish attempt to tap into the buzzword “social graph”, and make some money off of it, with NO clear plan of monetization other than to charge money from those INTENDING to making money.
Yes, social graphs are “real”. It’s just a modern buzzword for “relationship”. People had that for millennia. Facebook and other social networks got popular because they allow people to see their relationship online.
But Rippln has NO IDEA how to make money from it, because it has NO social graph data AT ALL. At best, it can replicate a tiny fraction (0.001%) of Facebook, but that’s worthless to any advertisers and such. And new networks like Pinterest are already snapping up new users by being simple.
So how will Rippln make money? It will make money from people willing to BELIEVE in the idea of “making money from it” instead. By charging them an enrollment fee (That $300 or $600 or whatever). It would have virtually no other income stream, not for the forseeable future. So where’s the money used to pay the coaching bonus coming from? From the affiliates willing to pay the fee, of course.
That’s a pay-to-play game. And it’s ILLEGAL. Sure, SOME PORTION of the population can get paid without paying into the system (i.e. free member recruiting a paid member) but they’re getting paid peanuts ($20 out of $300 or so).
Let’s face it, Rippln has no business revenue (any time soon) other than membership fees, and Rippln is paying out these “bonuses” with membership fees. That’s a pyramid scheme: I pay (mostly) for the right to recruit, and I get paid for recruiting.
Go look up Burnlounge, Mr. Budd. THEN ask your compliance attorney how close is your current business model to a pyramid scheme, in his HONEST OPINION. And I really hope you have one (the attorney AND the business model)
Sounds like you’re one of them. Care to recite the 4 crteria of the Koscot test for me, and why is it called a Koscot test?
Ah, was waiting for that bull**** argument. It just happens that I wrote blog entry on that today, so I’ll give you a free quote (not from me)
– Carl Sagan
So far, this looks more like Bozo the clown than Columbus.
It is MLM. Why are you shocked? Seems to me you have never been an MLM?
I spent $20,000+ over a period of 4 yrs chasing the “AMWAY dream” and by the time I quit, I had nothing to show for it. And yet some folks made and are still making money and Amway is still around selling “the dream”.
Why have they and the likes not been stopped my the SEC?
Well, this is technically off-topic, so I’ll be brief:
1) Pyramid schemes and MLMs are under purview of FTC, not SEC
2) Amway is “just legal enough” to be NOT considered a pyramid scheme. It being legal, however, has nothing to do with it being good to you financially.
But actually I think Tony Story is NOT being positive on MLM. Or perhaps just Rippln itself?
I got it straight from the CEO, that the upgrade is $300 for Domestic and $900 for International, plus $50 per month! OUCH!!!
You have to do a lot of recruiting to get that money back! Income is based purely on recruiting new suckers…sorry, “Players”! Scam!
Run away as fast as you can!!!!
@Chang
You are right. Amway is “just legal enough” just like the rest of the big MLMs. I hadn’t seen the post by Mr. Budd until now.
Well lets see whether they have something up their sleeves. Anything is possible under the sun. 🙂 They just might stick with affiliate marketing approach with a twist.
I guess until Budd and co show their cards, we can keep on speculating. Nothing wrong with that IMHO.
@ Oz
Did you draw the cartoon illustrating the comp plan? 🙂
Nah I’m rubbish at drawing. The crappy red circles I draw on some screenshots should confirm that :).
Hi Oz & friends,
First off, I appreciate you taking the time to respond to my post. I can tell you all put a lot of thought into it. I’m happy to share more details with you.
To answer your question OZ…
Right now the price points are not finalized. In addition, we may not have a global or domestic license at all. Rippln is constantly evaluating what model to bring to market, that equates to the best value proposition for our users who decide to participate in the rewards plan. We will be updating the market place as soon we have finalized it.
To answer your question Glim Dropper…
The app we are releasing as we enter into phase 2, our communication utility, is completely free. Our goal is to fill in the gaps we’ve seen with other communication utilities, & create an amazing product people love to use, and share with their friends.
Once our app is released, I invite you to test it for yourself, & we will welcome feedback on how we can improve the user experience & create the best communication utility in the market place.
To answer your question M_Norway…
Our platform is a 14 year old commerce & genealogy software that processes payments, handles international shipping & logistic information, tracks organization genealogies, plus a host of other features.
We have processed over $1 billion in transactions through this platform. It is currently the platform that handles all the shipping, logistics, & commerce in the 48 countries we do business in on a daily basis.
Not only do we rely on this platform for the companies we currently own… but MarketVision is the go to software for many other highly successful companies inside the networking industry.
It’s this platform… that we have been building an API on for the last 18 months to be able to integrate apps, websites, & other technology services with. By sharing any app, website, or service through our platform… we can track our users ripple effect across the world.
IE: how many people are using that product or service, because you referred it to your friends. This is what we mean by providing transparency into the social graph. We are very proud of the hard work our team has done to develop this API, and the 14 years+ of experience that has gone into getting this far.
I am more then happy to continue to dialogue as time permits. My simple request is this… please treat us with the same respect we are treating you. The connotations that we are being misleading, or hiding anything, are undeserved.
We are working as hard as we can to continue to scale our platform with the growth we are experiencing, as well as create the right educational & media assets to share with the world about the rippln opportunity.
I am not the only person who’s part of this team, yet I will speak for myself when I say that so much of my life’s work has been put into this.
What we are doing is far more meaningful to us then I think many of the people on this thread realize. And even if you don’t like our ideas… to treat us with disrespect prior to having all the information is not serving anyone, if you’re truly intent on providing an unbias review on the products & opportunity we are bringing to the marketplace.
All of us have put our credibility, resources, & the faith & trust we’ve developed with communities for decades into this.
Frankly it’s short sighted to think that people who have MASS exposure in this industry, who are highly public, who have a tremendous amount more to lose than anyone commenting so far would ignore all the basic principles required to succeed in this industry.
I can absolutely promise you… any amount of thinking you have done about the legal, financial, operational, and product concerns for our company… we have done 10,000x more. Every single person on this team is committed to creating a rock solid, long term, very unique & innovative company.
Our philosophy in life is one of growth & contribution. We believe if you’re not growing, you are missing out on the full potential of your life.
We have a desire to grow into new areas we have not been before… and for us Rippln challenges us to become better entrepreneurs then we were before. And we are excited for those new challenges, & to bring very new ideas to the market place.
We are not here to criticize you or anyone, and we welcome ALL the feedback to our model you have. I personally believe there’s a lot of great feedback you can contribute, and we’re happy to incorporate that where we can, and as it makes sense.
Please treat us with the same respect we treat you, and lets discuss logically the premises of our model, & our reasoning behind it so that everyone can get a fair chance to see what we are about.
I appreciate your time. And look forward to updating more as Rippln gets closer to market.
All my best,
Jonathan Budd
@Jonathan
Putting aside the app for a second, purely because it hasn’t been released, don’t you think affiliate costs are something that should have been finalised before you went into soft/buzz/pre/beta/ssh (whatever) launch?
Moreso before a compensation plan video went out (psuedo-NDA attached to it or not)?
As it stands now the momentum behind Rippln is built on the MLM side of things, without the affiliates aware of or even you yourselves the basics of the Rippln compensation plan.
MLM companies are built on their business models which are rooted in their compensation plans. If I were you guys I’d drop everything and make finalising the comp plan your priority, followed by getting that information out to the purported 100,000+ free affiliates you have currently signed up.
Otherwise no matter what the app is like or does, come launch you’re going to have an angry mob of MLM affiliates on your hands who feel they were duped. The fact of the matter is the released (then pulled) compensation plan video was what a lot of affiliates were sold on.
You and Rippln reserve the right to change the details of the compensation plan at any time of course but continuing marketing efforts (the Rippln Facebook page is currently nothing but a recruitment marketing machine) without plotting out such a crucial part of your business model isn’t going to end well.
Oz has been respectful to you. In fact I was just thinking earlier that this is the most congenial and mannerly thread I have seen yet.
Jonathan, you managed to come on here and post an absolutely substanceless novel. What did that accomplish?? All you did was verify how confusing and sneaky you guys are trying to be. ALL FLUFF (again) NO MEAT!
Is there any way Rippln can use the app to track the Ripple of bull**** the company is leaving behind them?? Can I be the first to “upgrade” so I can pay $900 and $49 a month to play “no ticky = no laundry” on my phone while waiting for my Americano at Starbucks and see how many of my friends are playing it too?
I AM SO GLAD TO SEE SOME PEOPLE WAKING UP!!! The whole thing is pure garbage. Typical money grubbing, company jumping, decietful, diabolical, maniacal mlm garbage. These people are totally blinded by their own phony, fake ego and self-hype making them dillusional.
The people who don’t drink from the Rippln fountain are “ill informed” or simply “can’t wrap their minds around it???” Well, it seems to me some people on this site are easily wrapping their minds around it and it’s creating quite a buzz.
Don’t get it twisted this is the real buzz about Rippln. Every leader From Rippln I refer over to read this article and comment section starts hypervenilating.. you should see how CRAZY they get. All of those hopes and dreams GREED and selfishness.
“The pie in the sky” picture painted to them starts to crumble. They are truly coming out of the woodwork for Rippln.. I mean all the leaders and mlm scum out there. It’s like an all-star line-up!! I think I’m over 100 invites at this point, lol..
The person who referred me to Rippln, who is in the “top 100 leaders” has HYPED UP 5 or 6 companies in the last six months. All with equal or more hype to Ripppln. I’m talking relentless conference calls, videos, emails, EVERYTHING! Talking about how these are sure fire “world changing” “Paradigm shifting” on and on and on..
One of those companies didn’t even launch, 2 or 3 are about to get shut down and the others have not paid a penny!!! This person just moves on to the next thing like nothing happend. It’s a sickness. A complete and total state of disease. They will stop at nothing.
Also see how ugly these promoters of Rippln get when you ask them the simplest of questions or request some real information. They want to gauge your eyeballs out. The claws truly come out. AND THEY DON’T EVEN KNOW WHAT THEY ARE MARKETING.
Just because a couple of hot-shot punks with a spurious at best trail behind them say they’re gonna fix everything that’s wrong with social media and everyone “gets their piece of the pie” PLEAASE!!! That means the leaders will make more than enough for their troubles before they replicate the same exact procedure in the next Hyped up bag of crap.
And they have the audacity to keep coming back and coming back and pitching you and pitching you. MLMers have the shortest memories of anyone I’ve ever come accross. Just watch the videos, it’s completely a slap in the face.
The comp plan is a cross between Empower network and Lyoness amongst others. I would really like to know who exactly is behind the company. Johnathan Budd is obviously the visible front man. A lot of people are waiving their fingers in his face and partly justified but you know the deeper you dig the more garbage you’ll find.
I love how people at Rippln say “we can’t possibly fathom the extent of what’s about to happen” HOW MANY TIMES HAVE WE HEARD THAT??? Who are you trying to fool. You’d be surprised, try us.. there are some very intelligent people coming to this site, (not myself included) I’m sure we can figure it out and then make an informed decision. Instead of getting force fed the same prison food from the same people.
I would Ripple away from Rippln as fast as I could.. ALL THE SIGNS ARE THERE, IT’S VERY OBVIOUS. And people PLEASE look at the person who is marketing this opportunity to you. That may be all the info you need. Just asking??
Ok, after reading Johnathan Budd’s latest post and I DO SEE he’s trying to sincerly explain somethings about Rippln. I will apologize to him and the company for the harsh remarks in my last post.
I’m not trying to be disrespectful to anyone who comes to this site. It’s just very hard for people who come here to hear the same “buzz” and “catch” phrases time and time again. We are looking for honesty.
The problem is… with two very long and detailed explanation, Mr. Budd has managed to avoid one primary issue…
What is Rippln selling, and why would people want to pay $$$ for it?
Almost everything else is derived from that. Without something to sell, comp plan means nothing (and in fact, means it’s a pyramid scheme, as the only thing to sell is the “opportunity” itself).
it’s fine to talk about “social graph” and “platform” and all that, but again, nothing on what is Rippln selling.
I think you preached a very good hell fire and damnation sermon there (and it’s also more fun).
Got an address for you:
Rippln, Inc., 901 Sam Rayburn Highway, Melissa, Texas 75070
(from http://rippln.com/tandc.html)
Which points to this building:
http://goo.gl/maps/vb7SB
The problem here is there is no suite number. Judging by the size of the building, that would be a virtual office. Real businesses in that building have suite numbers.
This video is pretty informative on Rippln. He mentions the address in there somewhere..
Interestingly, this is also the US corp address of b:HIP, another MLM (without the suite number).
Can’t find ANYTHING about “MarketVision”. There’s several companies that goes by that name, but nothing about API, platform, software, or such terms, despite its alleged 14 year history.
The MarketVision logo also brought up nothing. It almost sounds as if MarketVision is MLM support software (affiliate payment and that sort of thing), which may explain why.
It was done by Adtoons.com
http://www.adtoons.com/about/
And guess who uploaded it? A member of OceanSide MLM. 🙂
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm….
I’m telling you, it just doesn’t end.. All I want to know is how did the network marketer sneak into Noah’s Ark??
He was hiding in plain sight, disguised as a snake.
He’s a descendent of Noah. Noah had to CONVINCE the animals to board his ship. He couldn’t have caught them all. It was spread through viral marketing (MLM-speak). 😉
I made some ‘comments’ about lines upon lines telling us about THEORIES, rather than showing us the RESULTS of those theories.
All I was able to detect at that point was a rather vague business idea (the App), combined with a pay to play recruitment based income opportunity, combined with a free to join recruitment system, combined with marketing recipes.
I found several ‘potential hits’ by adding some combinations of the keywords “direct selling software”, but nothing conclusive. “Gateway” gave some other non-conclusive results. But then I found out how meaningless it was spending more time on it, so I decided to drop the whole idea.
MarketVision is probably involved in the project, e.g. development and marketing. Which “MarketVision” is another story, there’s several companies using that name.
I don’t know about Ripplin but (Ozedit: There are no buts, this article is about Rippln).
Interesting… TechCrunch just posted an editorial on “how not to do a prelaunch video”, and both supporters and basher turned out in droves.
http://techcrunch.com/2013/04/22/what-not-to-do-in-your-startup-promo-video/
In there are a couple interesting tidbits:
1) Rippln is trademarked by Terry Lacore, who owns b:Hip
2) As pointed out above, b:Hip shares same virtual address as Rippln
3) JB was on there defending Rippln as well, and he’s getting indignant, like “I am surprised how TechCrunch let this sort of thing gets published”
Glancingweb claimed that Rippln was run by Underwood, Budd, and and guy called Russell Brunson
http://www.glancingweb.com/1894/underneath-the-slimy-ripples-of-rippln
And Chris Voss is asking hard hitting questions as we are here:
http://thechrisvossshow.com/rippln-investigation-is-it-a-mlm-pyramid-scheme-scam/
It was interesting. The guy in the video clearly wasn’t the right type to fall for that marketing strategy, and neither am I.
I identified the marketing strategy vaguely in post #48, as some type of “Attraction Marketing”. It involves many “psychological theories” for how to filter out / attract specific types of people.
Some people will actually get MORE eager if they will need to DO something to get what they want, “make some small commitments” or “solve some minor obstacles”. They will feel “rewarded” each time they’re able to get some results from their own actions, even from minor results.
I’m pretty sure the NDA is part of a “make a commitment, reeceive a reward” system with many other similar methods, with gradually increasing commitments.
Hi Oz,
This is untrue. Here’s why…
Currently, there is 1 app in the Itunes store called “Clash of Clans”. This one app, earns over $1,000,000 per day. That $1,000,000 per day comes from tens of thousands of micro transactions called “In app purchases”.
In app purchases are the model by which the largest app companies in the world, monetize their audiences. Now, most of these highly popular apps, which create billions in value together, are shared person to person to person.
Yet none of those in app purchases are tracked back to the people who shared them. The people who drive the marketing for these companies… do not get rewarded for the value they are creating in the marketplace.
This is where Rippln is different. Inside Rippln apps, we share a % of the in app purchases and transactions taking place within our apps… with the people who shared those technologies in the first place.
The allegations that the money made in our model is from people referring others to refer others… are FALSE. Money is earned in a variety of ways, including the in app purchases & transactions that will take place inside our apps as described above.
Our model is the first ever model to share the value taking place from within apps via in app purchases & customer transactions… back with the people who shared those apps to begin with.
For all those criticizing our model, it’s become apparent to me you have very little education in how businesses are being run in the app space today. I recommend you go educate yourself so you can be a proper informant to the market place.
If you have any more real questions, please organize them appropriately & I’ll be happy to come back & respond. But to all the opinions about whether or not you like how we are releasing rippln to the world, what our marketing is, etc… that is your opinion.
If you think you could do a better job getting 210,000+ users in 11 days, by all means… I encourage you to leave the world of commenting & go become an entrepreneur.
Thanks for your time.
All the best,
Jonathan Budd
mumblemumblemumble sprinklemagicdust mumble mumble recruit recruit recruit mumble wave magic wand recruit recruit recruit mumble mumble mumble what’s that over there? recruit recruit recruit.
In app purchases are generally for buffs and unlocks. They are completely personal and thus would not be referred. A buff for you at level 15 would be useless for me at level 20 (or level 10).
If you really think that you have some rude awakening coming.
Apple and Google are not going to let you tap the in-app purchase or even app purchase history. As mentioned before, Apple already tossed out AppGratis. And there’s already a dozen different “free app of the day” apps on Google.
The world doesn’t work the way you *think* it does.
Oh, by the way, your figure’s out of date. Currently Clash of Clans is doing about 1.4 mil a day. Of course, a big chunk of that, 30%? Goes to Apple.
I know exactly how monetizations and microtransaction works. EA is putting it in all its games, and EA was also voted worst company of 2012.
Microtransactions are generally for unlocks and buffs, and cosmetic items (outfits). They are NOT referred. The apps themselves, maybe, but do you really think people would “ripple” share stuff like “OMG Buy this cool Sword +17 for UberGame Y!” Hmmm?
For all the defenses you gave defending your model, all you can say is “industry trend”, not how it would apply to you. Your logic thus far is “rising water floats all boats (and I’m about to launch my boat)”.
That’s fine talking to fans, but not a good statement to give to people demanding ANSWERS.
And then comes the “chicken and egg” problem. I’m assuming that Rippln will not be the authors of all the apps they purport to sell. Before anyone cuts them in on the income stream for their apps Rippln is going to need many thousand paying members.
How do they expect to get those paying members before the app makers will return their calls? Simple, pay the paying members to pay for the otherwise free Rippln app.
I understand that Rippln is back peddling as fast as possible from near everything they’ve published about their business model. I can’t blame them for that, they’re getting hammered by both the tech community and the people who care about legitimacy in MLM.
Rebranding themselves (even prior to launch) as about the only way they can recoup sunk costs. But again, the chicken and egg problem.
They can’t even pretend that anyone is paying them to sell apps for them until they have a boatload of paying users for their own app. And until other app makers are paying Rippln for promotion they can’t pretend that they are paying their “players” and “coaches” with anything other than those self same player’s and coache’s money.
I appreciate the irony and I understand the difficulty. Troy Dooly had mentioned that before and believes that a company gets a “grace period” for 6-12 months where they are in affiliate acquisition mode, then transition into customer acquisition mode.
This is the danger period: because there is virtually no income, the temptation is to charge the affiliates for joining, then in turn, pay new affiliates with that money. However, that creates a pyramid scheme.
The initial videos virtually confirms that’s what Rippln was planning: charge affiliates to join, then pay the high performing ones (those that recruit at least five).
The lack of distinction between user (consumer) and affiliate is also troubling. Seems the only difference is whether they paid into the system (or not). This is where the secrecy hurts the company.
In a normal startup, they have a warchest where money is spent on getting “ambassadors” or “evangelists” to show the app to people and get them adopted for free, but merely acquiring them is a cost that is paid out of company’s budget as operating expenses.
Twitter, for the longest time, had NO income and was basically burning through its reserve for YEARS. (2006 to 2009)
At the risk of beating the chicken and the egg metaphor to death…
Rippln’s choice basically is to
1) Start small, buy a few pairs of chickens are let it slowly double and double into a large herd, but without “sales” to tap for revenue there’s nothing to feed the chicken with. And nobody want to give you feed if you don’t have enough chickens.
2) BUY a few thousand chickens (i.e. pay for the affiliates out of your own budget) and hope that’s enough to get some interested parties to use you instead of Google or iTunes. THEN someone may give you feed.
But instead, Rippln so far has all the signs of…
WTF?! You want the chicken to bring their own feed?!? So you can give it to other chicken? All for the PROMISE of more feed in the future?
Many well made points Kasey and I do remember feeling my eyebrows raise when I heard Troy say that.
But I think what it gets down to is that (thanks to the DSA) it is ~technically~ possible for a MLM company to have 100% internal consumption and still not meet the definition of a pyramid scheme.
As absurd as it sounds the FTC needs to be able to read minds. The important factor is what an affiliate’s motive was when they made a purchase.
If they genuinely wanted to purchase the product or service for their own consumption/use then it’s still legit but if they are buying the product or service primarily for compensation then they’re in pyramid territory.
Of course it would be kinda hard to prove that all of a companies affiliates had a genuine desire to buy a product divorced from the comp plan if no one outside of the comp plan was buying the stuff.
And when you add in the fact that the only product that Rippln is “selling” is a free app that draws a rather sharper line as to the motive for the people who pay for it.
If they love the app and want to use it they can do so free of charge so the only remaining motive for paying for the app is to get paid for paying for it (and encouraging others to do likewise).
Let’s just say that I don’t think even the DSA’s standards are low enough to grant membership to Rippln.
@Jonathan Budd
Is the review here relatively correct?
It’s missing some details, e.g. about the upgrading costs and monthly costs, but are the factual parts of it relatively correct, other than that?
For the purpose of the question, “factual parts” can be limited to “Product Line”, “Compensation Plan” and “Joining Rippln” (excluding the intro and the conclusion).
Factual info might actually be in conflict with the marketing strategy used here (if I have interpreted that part correctly). But “the market conditions are changing so much the most successful companies are the ones who are most agile. The ones who can iterate, and change their models quickly… to adapt to what’s happening.”
The market conditions HAVE clearly changed here.
The question CAN be answered without revealing more details, e.g. by a “Yes, it’s relatively correct in most parts” (or specifying which parts). It can also be answered by adding or correcting details.
That method should be relatively fair. I’m not pushing for any specific types of answers.
It’s not being marketed to critics or people who’s doing deep due diligence, M_Norway. 🙂
People are making up all kinds of theories to defend recruitment driven business opportunities. 🙂
An affiliate in another company released a theory about different rules for “baby companies”, i.e. that FTC have a separate set of “kindergarten rules” if a company is less than 3 years of age. He disappeared when I asked him to link to those rules.
They don’t need to read minds. Pyramid scheme rules doesn’t revolve around internal/external consumption, like DSA seems to believe.
A promotional pyramid is a plan or a system …
* where a consumer gives consideration (payment)
* for the opportunity to earn financial gains
* that derives primarily from the introduction of other participants (rather than from sale or consumption …)
“Plan or system” isn’t limited to the boundaries of a single company structure, it can involve less than a company or more than a company. In BurnLounge, the legal parts of the business were allowed to continue, only the illegal parts were halted (the Mogul parts).
“Consideration” is any type of payment, not limited to monetary payments, not limited to an initial joining fee, not limited to direct payment. Buying over priced products can be a consideration.
“Financial gains” will follow a similar “not limited to” logics.
“Participant” is normally a person who has the right to recruit other participants (and earn financial gains from it). It’s about the RIGHT, not about whether or not he actually has recruited anyone. The company itself is normally an organizer type of participant, not a consumer type.
@Jonathan
Please cut the crap, you are not iTunes.
Then why have Domestic and Global membership fees?
Only if you launch without any affiliate fees will I consider that said fees will not be recycled to pay commissions to affiliates.
One of which is clearly the recycling of proposed Global and Domestic affiliate fees.
Yeah, we “just don’t get it”. Heard it all before son.
You’re primarily an MLM company and that’s what the focus is on here. You can’t hide behind your app side of the business when you and I both know it’s not going to sustain hundreds of dollars in commissions for recruiting paid affiliates.
Deflect, deflect, deflect. This has never been about Rippln’s marketing.
1. What is Rippln’s product that affiliates will sell to the world? (third-party apps are not Rippln’s product)
2. Why have affiliate membership fees if commissions are going to exclusively be generated via the app (advertising/app sales)?
Another type of “consideration” is recruitment, work rather than monetary payment (or in addition to monetary payment).
Introducing other consumers into a plan is a consideration rather than an “entrepreneural activity”. It’s not about “building a business”, people are only fooling themselves to believe so. Building a customer base IS an “entrepreneural activity”, but solely building a downline of participants ISN’T.
Exactly, there’s a huge difference between building a sales team (selling to customers) vs. building a recruiter team (recruits more recruiters).
In Rippln, there is NO separation between the two (just like Burnlounge).
This also exacerbates a MLM weakness… emphasis on “residual income” (i.e. let others sell for you). If you teach people to recruit, they will only recruit and never both with retail. Without retail, the company’s essentially a pyramid scheme.
Budd someone has to make a buck riding the search traffic for rippln info. Nothing wrong with that. Right?
Someone stated that the 100,000 or 150,000 folks already in got in via a ‘controlled’ way and no mass emailing was done. I disagree. 4 of my email addresses continue to receive Ripplin “get in now or else” emails.
I have a lot of useful apps on my mobile phone. I also use skype, facebook and instagram on mobile phone. And bank of america and ringcentral provides me with free apps. Every app i own is FREE. And my social network is a-ok.
So to all who continue to tell me to get in at the top, my answer is and will continue to be this: Let me see the product.
Let me see this awesome app. Cuz if you tell me a gazillion people will be in, then shucks! if i am member 300,000, there are a gabillion people who will come in after me. So I am okay.
finally, i ain’t paying $900 nor $300 one time and $50 a month for an app and the opportunity to make money on an app. There are TONS of apps out there.
So when the product comes out and if I find it of tremendous value, then super. But I search for apps using the Google Play ‘Play Store’ App sitting on my Samsung Galaxy Note.
shhhh…. it is a secret .. shhhh…. but get in NOW… shhhh….
Finally There ain’t even close to 100,000 people in Ripplin. If it were, (not to put on an impression that I am all-knowing), I’d freakin know about it.
At this time, the Ripplin Skype spam has slowed considerably. And the emails have as well. I have been online for almost 2 decades, and I tell ya, inflated numbers is just another component of la la land that is par for course.
I want to build an inventory-based platform which is driven by external after market skus from their product line that encompasses groceries, widgets, wadgets, vehicles, or any consumable product that exists in the world.
The cost to present this platform to the gazillion businesses will be a big fat zero cuz i know i will make a boatload of cash from the businesses who are wowed by my platform as i roll out fully tested quality assured feature after feature after feature to bring in MASSES of consumers who purchase goods and services.
Anyone want to help me develop this? i can’t pay you but you will get a load of business and technology experience that will pad your resume with loads of acronyms!
That would be huge as a social networking platform!
oh yeah… i forgot … there is open source software folks who already do this for FREE.
I’ll just integrate them all and I will be done in a year.
Never mind!
Faith Rambling on again on something seemingly unrelated to the untrained eye. LOL!
Tootaloo again!
Programs like Rippln will normally give this website poor Search Engine results, because of all the other activity it generates (e.g. people spamming forums and other social media). So we’re not very interested in programs like that, not more than any other program reviewed here.
The marketing strategy will create too much “noise” on the internet to be of any interest for most people. And the programs are normally very short lived, so it isn’t worth investing too much efforts into reviewing them, either.
Rippln has ONE point of interest. It will allow people to SEE where and why some marketing strategies fails. So the review will probably be of interest for some people.
rippln
R.I.P. poor little nothing
Be careful, the Rippln organizers will probably steal your ideas. Normally you should first share the ideas with a few hundred thousand trusted people around the World in a few hundred countries, before publishing anything on the internet.
A few hundred thousand “Inner Circle Members” will clearly give the project some momentum.
Hi all,
To answer your questions one final time.
#1. Rippln will be developing and acquiring our OWN brand of apps. Our customers are all our users of our own apps, in the exact same way a Zynga, or Rovio who develops a portfolio of apps has customers. We believe we will be one of the largest app networks in the world, because our users will actually have the chance to get REWARDED when they refer something… unlike all other technology companies in this space.
Not only that, but the ripple will also be able to distribute hard goods as well. Think “Group On” for network marketing. Much of this will be revealed as we continue to update the market place on our product roll out strategy.
It’s important to remember Rippln will be in beta, until October, when we are currently scheduled to release our full eco system. All of this criticism for such a new company is honestly flattering to us.
We KNOW we are doing something right, when just 12 days out of the gates, all the blogs are talking about us, all the critics are criticizing us, and we are the talk of the town. So truthfully, from the bottom of my heart THANK YOU for all the energy you keep pouring into us. It’s definitely letting us know we are on the right track.
I can’t wait for you all to download & become customers of our apps as soon as they are ready for the world. For now however, we’re in pre-launch just building buzz, in anticipation of our products to be released. And just to re iterate, the ripple will also be distributing physical hard good products as well. All through the ripple.
Can you please share exactly how you would create a pricing model to meet all the massive costs of scaling our infrastructure, technology, & offices around the world so that the ripple can exist for our customers?
Please, by all means… provide us a detailed example of how you would run the financials of our company, price our products, and I’d be happy to look at it, and incorporate all your relevant feedback.
Otherwise… we are going to do the best we can to create a net profit margin of 10% in our company, which is honestly where most good companies shoot for to be able to operate sustainably to provide for our users & partners.
There are a MYRIAD of factors for us to consider when factoring our pricing model, like run away server costs from our viral growth, as well as technology, infrastructure, operations, etc. Rippln corporate is committed to providing the absolute BEST service to our business players, for the BEST value proposition we can… while also sustaining the company.
And like I said… I’d love to see your suggestions for exactly how you would run the financial side as well since you seem to have so much experience.
Thank you for your time. Good bye.
All the best,
Jonathan Budd
Well folks, when you have a massively publicized pyramid scheme and Faith Sloan isn’t interested in promoting it, take note. She is a true expert in the field who isn’t the least bit squeamish about trifles like legality or sustainability.
If she doesn’t think this is worth flogging her downline with that should give you all cause to question the opportunity.
Rewarding people for building a community is great and almost everyone would agree with that but crippln isn’t even doing that! They are amassing a huge amount of targeted leads “make money online prospects” without even having a solid comp plan in place and without paying those who are currently building the network for them.
Since when do you start a business and not even have the financials in place?
This will take ages to come out of beta but in the meantime the people signed up will get the opportunity to promote a and profit from a few other mlm’s to their existing dribbln downline…
Oh yeah and Russell Brunson is involved with this. He’s the guy behind theviralsecret.com, a program all about building lists of “make money online seekers”… Russell will tell you that the money’s in the list and by the looks of it they are building a very big list over at rippoffln !
And when it comes “official” launch time or “upgrade” time, those hyper recruiting leaders are going to be out for blood to recoup their $900.. just because they saw the vision in San Diego and Dallas. While no one else will want anything to do with it. When you turn it down your Dr. Jeckel and Mr. Hyde leader will dismiss you and tell you how much money you’ve missed out on, breaking all communication with you.. wanting nothing to do with you at that point. That’s when you know you’re truly free! Just have to find out how to stop getting those stupid update texts..
Truly entertaining, this is by far the biggest “paradigm shifting” mlm site I’ve ever been on. Folks, when you feel that paradigm starting to shift or your mind starting to blow out over some pipe dream. Come on this site and get some real talk, the straight dope, get those feet back on the ground..
@Jonathan
So as of now, despite going public you don’t have them?
Is this another “trust us guys it’ll sort itself out… we hope” part of the business model?
Who will be developing the apps, who are you going to “acquire”, or have you not thought that far ahead?
Vouchers and coupons + MLM doesn’t work. Seen it before plenty of times. Vouchers and coupons (discounts) ala Groupon is also not a product.
I don’t know about “all the blogs” but you’ll find I try to review as many new MLM startups as I can. Rippln aren’t being given any special treatment here.
Sure, here it is: Sell products.
Given your MLM niche, if you can’t do that much with apps and have to rely on affiliate membership fees to pay out commissions then Rippln is obviously not a viable business model.
Rippln is not the first app based MLM company we’ve seen, with those prior having largely failed to take off. A lack of viability would be hardly surprising.
You can make up all the excuses you want. When the AGs come knocking and/or you’re hauled infront of a judge, they don’t care about your “operational costs”, “infrastructure” and “technology”.
Are you paying out commissions on the recruitment of new affiliates to existing affiliates, funded by fees charged to new affiliates?
If so, you’re running a pyramid scheme.
Rippln’s publicly released business model indicated this was exactly what you planned to do. Now you’ve distanced yourself from that, but failed to provide an alternative business model, and are now asking me to provide you with one.
Not exactly confidence inspiring.
Easily answered:
“When it’s a HYIP or ponzi or pyramid or endless chain recruiting system” and you need to give it the illusion of legitimacy so you can advertise on the usual suspect HYIP ponzi and get-rich-quick scheme forums.
After all, who cares if it fails ??
Run three or four of these and “only” rake in $10,000 from each one with little or no expense, other than the cost of a cookie cutter website, and you’ve got quite a good little earner
The only way Rippln is going to monetize in-app purchases is if they deploy their own app store and their own in-app purchase platform. No way Google or Apple or Amazon is going to let Rippln piggyback on their systems. There’s privacy and other **** involved.
What are the chances of Rippln getting app makers to use THEIR app store when there are much bigger markets, like Amazon, Apple, and Google?
You be the judge.
(This is now so f***ing reminiscent of Wazzub, who promised to rival Google and Facebook in search and social network…)
To Jonathon Budd your Clash of Clans hypothesis its the silliest thing I’ve ever heard. The reason its successful is its in IN THE APP STORE and has the potential to have like I dont know 100 million people potentially to download it.
Any MLM app Rippln makes will likely NEVER get into the Apple App store with its rules. If it gets in MLM complaints will get it kicked out.
At best you might get what 1/2 a million MLMers jerking each others chain on the Private Download App, hell lets say a million. Thats a far cry from the 10’s of millions who make apps successful in the App Store. Which mean you’ll in NO WAY EVER achieve that income volume, not even close.
Hmmm… it all becomes a bit clearer. Direct Sales Software Inc, which seems to be joined to bHIP (they share the same lawyer, same address) is also joined to Rippln.
Entry on Direct Sales Software inc, note “registered agent” Jenifer Grace
http://www.bizapedia.com/tx/DIRECT-SALES-SOFTWARE-INC.html
And here’s Jenifer Grace, claiming to be General Counsel for bHIP
donotlink.com/frontpage.bhipglobal.com/en-us/news/pressreleases/amwayvictory.aspx
And here’s an article outright stating that Rippln is a part of Lacore Enterprises
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2013/04/25/2550576/rippln-questions-can-raise-app.html
(NOTE: That article is not very accurate in stating that app needs to be downloaded. There is no app… yet)
Checking Corporation Wiki confirms that this is the HQ for Lacore enterprises and related companies.
http://www.corporationwiki.com/Texas/Melissa/901-Sam-Rayburn-Hwy-Melissa-TX-75454-a23202462.aspx
So basically, Budd is trying to sell an app called Direct Sales Software called Rippln (also trademarked by Lacore Enterprises) while not mentioning the Lacore name at all.
Terry LaCore has a 5 year restraining order (a five-year officer and director bar) from September 2008, plus a permanent restraining order from SEC.
http://www.sec.gov/litigation/litreleases/2008/lr20702.htm
Brian Underwood, Jonathan Budd and Russel Brunson might simply be front figures and recruiters, rather than real organizers.
The 2 people from the 2008 SEC complaint were
* Mark D. Woodburn
* Terry LaCore
The company involved was Natural Health Trends Corp.
Well, I went and paid the freaking $1.00 fee to search the TX sect of state site. I guess Rippln is sucking me in too, just not the way they planned.
The official record of formation submitted to TX s.o.s in September of 2012 lists only two names (directors), Terry LaCore and Jenifer Grace.
uspto confirms Rippln trademark owned by LaCore’s company.
I would imagine that with the Budd’s and Hoverson’s, and Underwood’s, and whoever else is a key player claiming co-founder, that LaCore simply gave them shares to be master dists. so they hold a title.
This one is going to be interesting.
Incredible.
The best that could happen with Rippln is to be the next Facebook or Twitter, to be bigger than email, and make those who can own no stock in Rippln as rich as those who have owned stock in Facebook and Twitter since the beginning. And to bring massive value the lives of billions upon billions of individuals around the world.
The worst that could happen is for Rippln to create more bad will on the internet, network marketing, mlm, direct sales, and affiliate marketing than they could’ve ever imagined by promising something that could never be delivered to more than 250,000 people (imagine how many people aren’t signing the nda?).
But that said, here’s what I care about: The individual beginners who repeat the above claims will have no credibility left after doing so.
They’ll have emailed, called, and instant messaged friends and family and strangers because they wanted to believe that surely no one would say such things if they weren’t true.. and especially if there wasn’t at least a definite plan. Many of these beginners are broke already. They just need to earn a little honest money.
And thats all they wanted a chance to do. Maybe even to be a part of something special for once in their lives.
Here’s to the value of trust and good will folks – the most precious commodity in business. Thankfully there are plenty of choices for those looking to invest.
Usually it’s not worth spending too much time on companies like Rippln.
The claimed number of members can normally be divided by 10 or 15 (14,000 to 21,000 “interested”), sometimes it can be divided with 100 or 200. It’s simply a marketing strategy to claim tens or hundred thousands of members in several hundred countries.
Rippln was prematurely prelaunched, and people will probably have lost interest long before a launch. We have seen that in other projects, e.g. Wazzub.
It will probably be remembered for being prelaunched “101 years after Titanic”.
So yesterday I signed up to “Russell (Rippln Copywriter) Brunsons” Rippln team training centre to see what they were saying behind the scenes… Was wondering how long it would be until my throw-away email address was hit with an offer from him trying to sell me something…
Just now less than twenty hours later I received an invite to purchase a system that would allow me to build 3 income streams at one, and yes… one of the income streams is rippln!
Here’s the sales video page: appcashsystem.com
Those that are here investigating whether rippln is a viable opportunity take note. You will just be joining the largest list of “make money online” seekers ever and you will be constantly hit with their shit until you get out!
Well color me impressed guys, that’s some great investigation there.
I’m putting it together in a seperate article so we can add anything further on the ownership/corporate structure of Rippln.
No wonder Rippln’s lawyer was so keen to distance Brian Underwood from an SEC investigation. Hello Terry Lacore!
Oh, there’s worth fates… like all 250K names ended up on some sucker list for “the syndicate” like the one profiled on The Verge…
http://www.theverge.com/2012/5/10/2984893/scamworld-get-rich-quick-schemes-mutate-into-an-online-monster
Wow…The complete package! Imagine giving your credit card number to thieves and these same thieves pass your info on to their connections. These scammers know that these scams will only last a few short months…So their goal is to get you to pull out your CC and drain as much they can from you.
Then on to the next best scam program!
I really find it interesting though how these scammers produce their video’s and are using techniques of ” Hey I’m like you and I am so excited and I am just over whelmed…Make the negative thoughts disappear and make money and have fun”!
ARE YOU IN?…You need to focus~~~
Ok then pull out your credit card.
The new way of mlm scam sales is looking like it is going towards “REALITY TV” instead of the generic recorded make millions video’s you might have seen in the past.
Bla bla bla.
That video shows how the mlm industry is doomed to fail because of scammers that keep on preying hoping the next fool will send them money!
When these scammers tell you not to worry and just pull out your credit card to “invest” and we will “close” the sale(S) for you…RUN!
Wow I am so glad I found this! I got a TEXT message from Rippln stating my friend wants me to be a part of it.
I love my friend but she has never been one to research. I am afraid to point her here because I don’t want her to feel foolish.
The few site I found supporting Rippln seem to people who are promoting their own lines. This has been by far the most informative site I have found about this…ummm thing.
Thanks for all your time and input!
Tay, Are you saying Rippln has a way to send you text messages via a ‘short code’ like 90210 or 22030? If so, that is considered spam if you never gave them permission.
If you get another text like that.. let us know. Given the CEO owns iZigg Mobile Marketing it’s very interesting. Thank you.
This was published on Rippln’s Facebook page a few hours ago:
There’s no need to send her here. She will probably feel better if she doesn’t visit this site. And we can’t convince her about anything either, unless she’s already willing to believe in it.
The rumoured price for upgrading to Domestic / Global distributor was $300 / $900, with a rumoured $50 monthly fee. You can probably use that as an excuse for not joining her “ripple”, e.g. delaying it until you know more about the costs.
Well, found this today… Here’s some of the Rippln “Players”
http://noexcusessummit.com/new/rippln-training/
NoExcuses Summit is basically a gathering of all the various income opportunity schemes where they can grab even more people. That’s the West Coast version. The East coast version is called “Underground Online”, and it was investigated in that Verge article I linked above. From that article:
May be interesting to compare the list of presenters… 🙂
Though this doesn’t really show the other people. Lisa Grossman is an internet marketer. Same with that Hoverson guy. I think Rippln paid them to appear together, or they’re just buds from other internet marketing.
But listen to his guy talk about Internet Marketing: (still from that Verge article)
Yep, this is EXACTLY what’s happening with Rippln.
I compared Rippln to CarbonCopyPro, Mike Dillard (and Wazzub) in one of my first comments about Rippln. That comparison was spot on (only partly for Wazzub).
That market is more like a set of small “communities” (or sects) than a real market. It doesn’t have a large supply of new people coming in gradually over time, so they will need to create some “excitement” around it to attract new victims (people willing to PAY).
The drop-out rate is also HIGH, almost like a collapsing pyramid scheme. Wazzub shrunk from 6 million claimed members to 30,000 members when they asked for personal details. But it probably never had anything near the claimed number of members.
From my viewpoint, this isn’t exactly the most “successful” part of the market. It’s mostly about faking success, to make people BELIEVE they’re buying “valuable training”. But they will become “successful” for short periods of time if enough people are willing to believe in it.
It’s about selling the dream of becoming successful. If you sell it to enough people, you will become successful yourself (in THEORY). One problem is that the market is very limited and easily will get exhausted. Another problem is negative side effects.
Thought provoking insights as usual K. Chang and M_Norway.
I’ve got experience with the No Excuses crowd over the last 2 years. I purchased courses from Ray and Ferny (SEO Networker – SEO course), Ray Higdon (Pro Blog Academy – blogging course), Mike Dillard (Magnetic Sponsoring – attraction marketing business plan theory), Ryan Angelo (Leadership Confessions – mindset course, including interviews with inner circle of No Excuses crowd), Brian Fanale and Norbert Orliwitz (MLSP, Leadership Intensive – lead system and wordpress course) Rob Fore (Posting For Profit – article marketing)
I stopped purchasing because I learned all that crowd is willing to teach. Meaning, they’re not going to teach you exactly what their own strategies are no matter what they claim.
With exception to Rob Fore’s course, all the above courses were unique and valuable, and fulfilled my needs. Full disclosure, they’re all affiliate products. At the time of my last purchase I realized they were rehashing products being launched by some other ‘leaders’ in their various communities. But that rehashing isn’t illegal in itself, I don’t think anyway.
I’m interested on your thoughts about where exactly the lines are crossed in a affiliate product/lead system ‘community’ from valuable, to abusive.
Last year there was a flurry of intense product launches with some of the folks I’ve mentioned above, and a few of the folks who’re in charge of building Rippln’s current massive list (J Budd and Hoverson were the product creaters of last years craziest launch – Futuristic Marketing). I had zero issue with any courses I purchased because they all taught me something valuable and I needed to know what they offered. However, as it concerns selling/inviting prospects into those affiliate product and lead system groups.. I stopped doing it because of the repeated rehashing of like products. It became absurd.
Just to clarify. What I said about not thinking it’s illegal in itself to rehash products.. I mean, it’s so hard to prove that adding one thing to an old course, or teaching a course using slightly more current information, is wrong enough to be classified ‘illegal.’ That’s all.
It would be great if there was a clear, simple definition for what exactly makes a lead system/affiliate product community abusive to it’s members.
The way things are nowadays online, purchasers are no longer just ‘purchasers.’ They’re members with potential for tiered affiliate earnings. We all no that’s potential for trouble.
I actually found Jay Kubassek (CarbonCopyPro) and Mike Dillard (Magnetic Sponsoring) as speakers in one of the previous “No Excuses Summit”. And that didn’t surprise me.
That market can be compared to small independent sects, all believing in the same religion, but following their own leaders. It’s “us against the outside world” as long as everyone is following “The Rules” (e.g. about supporting each other against “them”).
The religion involved here is basically selfdev theories, some more useful than others. It has nearly all the stuff a religion will need, from “Hallelujah meetings” to “selfdev bibles” to “gurus”, plus organized regular meetings.
It has other similarities with religious sects too, e.g. the constant need for MONEY. Money is a very central part of the religion, e.g. as “proof” for potential and existing followers. Money is of course needed for other reasons too, but I can’t be too detailed.
The similarities to religious sects will also explain why the market will be relatively limited. “New suckers are born every minute”, but the supply rate is very unstable. 🙂
With no compensation plan out after the retracted one, what exactly are they going to be able to “train” their affiliates on at this summit?
Y’know… other than how to recruit new affiliates and a boatload of hype. I wonder if there’s an affiliate agreement between Rippln and No Excuses and this is just a way to milk some money from the affiliate base without… y’know, actually just taking money from people.
Kinda breaks the whole “don’t worry about our business model and compensation plan just join us, it costs you nothing!” mantra they’re currently flying.
I know. Some of the content is actually valuable (I have only watched a few videos).
It becomes abusive when you have an income opportunity connected to the products (rather than stand alone products), when you’re selling the opportunity itself to new members (and where they need to “upgrade” themselves to higher commission levels by buying a higher level).
That will make the products easier to sell (to a higher price), but it will also lead to a much higher failure rate among new members. It will also make the companies become unsustainable.
In addition, communities like that will only be attractive to specific types of people, with too limited sets of “values”. That will usually not work very well in the long term. It will often produce similar symptoms like the ones you can find in religious sects, e.g. where people becomes extremely focused on “The Rules”.
NOTE:
I have only analysed a few of those opportunities from the “outside”, but with several inputs from former members. I have neither analysed Magnetic Sponsoring nor MLSP.
I have actually studied CarbonCopyPRO, its growth and fall as I could see it in a market in 2009/2010, and the continued spiral downwards in 2011. Other than that, I have mostly checked the high price seminars companies (most of them derives from Global Prosperity Group, Liberty League International and a few others).
That’s pretty obvious by including Haverson and Grossman… how to recruit a lot more people into their downlines and continue to build buzz and only buzz. Then you can upsell them on something else.
I personally think they got thrown in last minute (it was “latest news” on the No Excuses website) as sort of a “draw” for the people to come checkout the latest “opportunity”.
I have no problem with Internet marketing if it’s being used to sell something useful, but internet marketing to sell internet marketing to wannabe internet marketers is basically a self-replicating meme that needs to die a horrible fiery death.
Purchasers are also prospects for upselling, and in the hands of the worst offenders, sheep to be fleeced until they bleed.
Some of those marketers do know what they’re talking about… but what are you going to use it for? Selling something real, or sell more buzz that sells more buzz? 🙂 That’s a question we all need to answer.
Check out that Verge article… some of those boilerrooms fleeced a disabled guy out of 30K selling him on bull**** lessons and income systems, and other woman who don’t even know what Internet and PC is out of 20K. THAT is abusive beyond the pale.
They were so called “low hanging fruits”.
Recruitment to income opportunities is about selling people their own dreams about becoming successful, make them really believe in those dreams and make them ignore the reality.
It’s not more difficult than that. It’s about identifying typical sets of dreams, shared by enough people to make it become a market, and deliver solutions to those dreams (real or imaginary solutions). It will of course also be about HOW, WHERE and WHEN to deliver it, and about making people interested enough to pay for it.
That’s how income opportunities works. It will be a steadily supply of new people coming into that market each year, looking for the best way they can find to make some money. They will typically be looking for the financial “promises” and “potentials” the opportunity can offer them.
Adding something to an opportunity can make it become more attractive to some types of people. SelfDev training is one of those factors, internet marketing training is another.
But the trick is actually to find something close to people’s own ideas, what they believe themselves will be the best solution for them. Zeek (as an example) offered the idea about how profitable penny auctions are, people’s IDEAS rather than the reality. SpeakAsia offered work, or actually people’s IDEAS about how that work would generate a profit in one year.
Some people obviously have the IDEA that following “recipes” and guidelines from “gurus” will be the best solution for them, what they really need to become successful themselves. They will get the insight and the “guru” will get their money, so at least one of them will have got something of value.
A trouble with the “guru idea” is that it often is the MARKET itself that generates the conditions for ideas to work, rather than the “recipes” and the methods.
Rippln’s primary market is network marketing communities. They have attached a short lived pyramid scheme income opportunity to it to make it become more “attractive” to that specific market. That actually makes it become less attractive to other markets.
A few things to consider:
Why would the person starting ripple be involved with several lawsuits involving pyramid schemes?
Why doesn’t anyone question the financial status of the CEO? Seems to me that if he has built 20+ companies his portfolio would consist of actual funds.
Why would the CEO have his attorney on this blog defending him like an hourly employee?
Why is narrators voice and artwork in all Ripplin videos the exact same person who narrates other pyramid schemes and end of world catastrophe videos!
In closing this is a great idea. Con the general public into building a ripple that stretches millions of people to give him a tool to market. After all the work has been done he then forces you to pay 300 or 1000 dollars to become a player in order to get paid.
That’s right folks the work is already done and now you have to pay to get paid. His hopes are you will walk away. He has what he needs. Genius!
Not only do you build him something to market! You have to work out your own con and get those below you to spend their money in order for you to get anything! I LOVE IT!!!!!!!! What A GUY!
The comments above crack me up! A Con is a Con!
Now that is deep!
@James Tipton
very interesting commentary..
I’ve been following Rippln for weeks even months now and it just seems to me that they’re everything that they are claiming not to be and are not the one thing they are claiming to be..
Very, very shady dealings early on here with them but then again what do expect it’s a jungle out there.. They can go change the comp plan and not finalize this and that etc.. whatever.. the point is it won’t be anything different than what it’s intended to be…
I agree..
Of course not. Have you read the “Rich Dad” Kiyosaki books? They are rehashes of rehashes. 🙂 Yet they’re often on the NYT Bestseller’s list, proving crap sells, when you market it correctly. 😀 And crap includes empty promises, esp. when the empty promise itself is a sales message.
The video has been produced by the same third party company, a video marketing producer. The company has vaguely been named here somewhere.
Adtoons.com
I haven’t read it, but it has probably been designed for a specific market, the crap market. It’s probably EXACTLY what the buyers wanted, something that reflects the ideas they already had.
Post #154:
People in that market are not looking for anything NEW, they are looking for “authorities” and “experts” confirming their own ideas. They have specific sets of ideas, and the author will need to work close to those ideas when he’s writing.
Most SelfDev and Self Help books works in the same way, repeating ideas people already have and want to believe in. Pure and simplified crap will meet a bigger market than too complicated stuff, but the crap will need to be presented in specific ways (e.g. as “real story examples”).
I often use similar techniques myself, simplifying ideas rather than making them too complicated. A typical example is when I KNOW an idea is commonly shared among most people or a specific group of people, and they will fill in all the missing parts themselves (their OWN version of it).
The idea there is to make it common enough for people to recognize it, and vague enough or general enough so they will have to fill in the details themselves.
Methods like that can act as “glue” (binding YOUR ideas to THEIR ideas), or as a “bridge between different ideas”. Too much of it will make people become suspicious (your ideas are simply TOO close to their own, it might feel more like a parody, or the idea doesn’t look “genuine” enough). There has to be a balance between “old ideas they already have” and “new ideas they can be willing to accept”.
Robert Kiyosaki has probably received relatively mixed critique, e.g. from financially educated people. “Why would anyone write a BOOK about something like that? I knew most of it when I was 16-18 years old!”. Note: I haven’t read the book, so I added an imaginary critique here.
Jonathan Budd received some “comments” from me in post #63 and #64, e.g. about number of lines filled with “visions and vague ideas”. It can be compared to the imaginary Kiyosaki critique I used as an example, i.e. “Your work contains too much ‘fill’ and too little substance”.
The REAL trick is to balance ideas like that against quite opposite ideas, e.g. by adding equal amount of substance to the ‘fill material’. Without that, the idea won’t work very well.
I had the same experience as well when I asked for more background info about the principals of the company. Even in their own company literature in the Q&A’s they beat around the bush.
I sent an email to Brian Underwood a few weeks ago and to my surprise he replied right away. He was very interested in the questions that I asked in my email with respect to who to approach about this “opportunity” and asked that we connect by phone the next day as he was on a plane at the time.
I responded immediately and offered a time to connect and I never heard back from him. I attempted to contact him by email two more times and again he did not reply. I was NOT impressed needless to say and my impression of the company plummeted.
It would certainly to be great to work with a company online that delivers on their promises.
That depends solely on your own ideas, on what you EXPECT them to deliver. If you have relatively low and realistic expectations I’m pretty sure they will deliver “something”.
Rippln haven’t made any promises, other than vague “income POTENTIAL examples”. It might have SOUNDED like promises, but it’s actually vague examples.
But like any other opportunity, if YOU generate income for THEM you will receive a fraction of it yourself. The more “leaders” you have over you and the more they reward those “leaders”, the lower your own fraction of that income will be (even if you recruit people under you, your own fraction will be lower).
Rippln is FILLED with “leaders” like that, eager to reward themselves and become more successful. Some of them are coaching people and are using their own income as example in “attraction marketing”. You will need to generate THEIR income more than your own.
Thanks, I appreciate your input Norway. All I keep hearing about is all the Leaders that are involved and the Leaders seem to know how all of this will roll out.
SOOOOOOOO many leaders and not enough money to go around except for themselves for the most part as you’ve explained it.
As already announced in Rippln have to pay $ 69.95 per year and $ 25 Monthly.
Are the recruitment commissions still there?
It seems there are two ways to win for sponsoring and for those who purchase within the app.
Coaching Rewards Program (Paid Weekly) and Loyalty Rewards Program (Paid Monthly).
Tracked down a copy of the compensation plan, I’ll have a review out once I’ve gone over it.