United Games Marketing Review: Fantasy sports tokens
There is no information on the United Games Marketing website indicating who owns or runs the business.
At the time of publication, the United Games Marketing website is little more than a sign-up page.
The United Games Marketing website domain (“unitedgames.co”) was registered on the 25th of May 2016, however the domain registration is set to private.
Further research reveals United Games Marketing affiliates naming Natalyn Lewis as owner and co-founder of the company.
I wasn’t able to find any information on who the other co-founder(s) of United Games Marketing are.
Natalyn Lewis (right) is based out of Utah in the US, which is presumably where United Games Marketing is being operated from.
On the executive side of things, Natalyn Lewis was Director of Marketing for Nu Skin. After Nu Skin Lewis went on to become Corporate Consultant and Distributor Liaison with Syntek Global.
More recently Lewis worked with Asea as marketing consultant, developing Asea’s affiliate marketing tools.
Why none of this information is provided on the United Games Marketing website is unclear.
Read on for a full review of the United Games Marketing MLM opportunity.
The United Games Marketing Product Line
United Games Marketing affiliates distribute an app ‘allowing you to play along live with your favorite teams, favorite sports, and favorite friends‘.
Every Affiliate has the ability to share the United Games app with others, inviting them to download the app and join in the fun.
When they download the app from your invitation, that player will forever be linked to that affiliate
Users of the app purchase tokens, a “virtual game currency” that allows ‘you to play certain aspects of the app‘.
The United Games Marketing Compensation Plan
The United Games Marketing compensation plan is centered around app token acquisition.
Using the tokens in United Games Marketing’s app also triggers commission payments.
Commission Qualification Ranks
There are four commission qualification ranks within the United Games Marketing compensation plan.
Along with their respective qualification criteria, they are as follows:
- Zone 1 – sign up as an affiliate and continue to pay the monthly $9.95 affiliate fee
- Zone 2 – continue to pay $9.95 a month, recruit 5 Zone 1 qualified affiliates and have 25,000 in total team token volume (no more than 50% from any one unilevel leg)
- Zone 3 – no information provided
- Zone 4 – no information provided
Note that for Zones 3 and 4 the United Games Marketing compensation plan states only “TBA”. No timeline is provided.
App Token Purchase Commissions
When users of the United Games Marketing website purchase app tokens, commissions are paid out via a unilevel compensation structure.
A unilevel compensation structure places an affiliate at the top of a unilevel team, with every personally recruited affiliate placed directly under them (level 1):
If any level 1 affiliates go on to recruit new affiliates, they are placed on level 2 of the original affiliate’s unilevel team.
If any level 2 affiliates recruit new affiliates, they are placed on level 3 and so on and so forth down a theoretical infinite number of levels.
United Games Marketing cap payable unilevel levels at nine, with commissions paid out as a percentage of app token revenue purchased across a unilevel team.
How many level a United Games Marketing affiliate can earn on is determined by their commission qualification rank:
- Zone 1 – 10% on level 1 (personally recruited affiliates) and 5% on level 2
- Zone 2 – 10% on level 1, 5% on level 2, 3% on level 3 and 2% on level 4
- Zone 3 – 10% on level 1, 5% on level 2, 3% on level 3, 2% on level 4 and 1% on levels 5 and 6
- Zone 4 – 10% on level 1, 5% on level 2, 3% on level 3, 2% on level 4, 1% on levels 5 to 7 and 0.5% on levels 8 and 9
App Token Game Commissions
When recruited affiliate and retail customers use purchased tokens in United Games Marketing games, commissions are again paid out through the unilevel team (see “App Token Purchase Commissions” above).
- Zone 1 – 5% on level 1 (personally recruited affiliates)
- Zone 2 – 5% on level 1 and 2% on level 2
- Zone 3 – 5% on level 1 and 2% on levels 2 and 3
- Zone 4 – 5% on level 1, 2% on levels 2 and 3 and 1% on level 4
Matching Bonus
A Matching Bonus is available on commissions paid to affiliates in a unilevel team.
United Games Marketing pay affiliates a match down four levels of recruitment, with commissions paid as a percentage of app token purchases and use of tokens in games:
- Zone 1 – 20% on level 1 (personally recruited affiliates)
- Zone 2 – 20% on level 1 and 10% on level 2
- Zone 3 – 20% on level 1, 10% on level 2 and 5% on level 3
- Zone 4 – 20% on level 1, 10% on level 2 and 5% on levels 3 and 4
Joining United Games Marketing
Affiliate membership with United Games Marketing is $39.99 and then $9.99 a month.
Conclusion
Fantasy sports is undoubtedly a large industry. The question is whether MLM can successfully carve out its own slice of the pie.
The only other fantasy sports MLM opportunity I’m aware of is Fantasy Draft. Launched in late 2015, to date Fantasy Draft has failed to make a mark on the industry.
With respect to United Games Marketing’s app, if it does what it’s supposed to then I guess it works. You download the app and gain access to UGM’s fantasy sports backend.
Purchase tokens and affiliates get paid.
The danger of the business model is affiliates getting awarded tokens when they sign up, along with the perpetual $9.95 fee.
United Games Marketing ambiguously describe the monthly affiliate fee as a “technology subscription”. My guess is that’s pseudo-compliance for “purchasing game tokens every month”.
It follows then that if the majority of token purchases in United Games Marketing originates from affiliates (not forgetting that they can also purchase them outside of their monthly subscription), UGM will operate as a chain-recruitment scheme.
There needs to be a sizeable retail customer userbase using the app, otherwise UGM is a closed-loop with little to no genuine activity outside of the income opportunity.
So far we’re not off to a good start. United Games Marketing are accepting affiliate signups but in return offering little to no information about the company.
Instead the focus is on affiliate recruitment, which will invariably set the tone and core focus of the business going forward.
Add to that a lack of retail requirements, with affiliate commission qualification only tied to recruitment app token volume (which can be obtained through recruitment).
The United Games Marketing app is supposed to go live in September, and it’s not too late to rework the compensation plan and actually make retail sales a focus.
Unless that happens, United Games Marketing is an MLM opportunity you’re probably going to get pitched on as an affiliate. Which means in order to make money, you too are going to have to get out there and recruit affiliates.
Approach with caution…
Update 2nd September 2018 – In July 2018 United Games Marketing was acquired by Investview.
This is going to end up like Burnlounge. That $9.99 monthly fee is just like the Burnlounge’s “Mogul” fee.
There’s no functional difference between mogul and non-mogul except mogul get their commission in cash rather than play tokens.
If you have to pay a fee to get paid, it’s not a real business.
Great article and a nice overview. Just a few inaccuracies that I thought you might want to be aware of so your readers get the full scoop!
Jeff Henderson is the owner and founder of United Games. He has a 22 year background at NuSkin. Natalyn Lewis is his sister-in-law and is over sales and marketing. Mark Mongie is leading the charge with the game design and has an EA Sports background. Ben Eggett is the CTO.
Also, United Games Marketing app is not about fantasy. It is about sports, but not about fantasy. They actually have a game for playing along with your favorite teams but there is no draft or salaries or anything like fantasy.
You did a great job outlining the commission plan – but you missed the mark on the company focus.
You can actually hear them on any call they are on say, “YOU DO NOT NEED TO RECRUIT.” Right now, they can’t focus on attracting players on the app because the app isn’t released.
So they are allowing Affiliates to strategically get themselves ready to promote the app when it is released. If you would like to add strategic partners to your team, they encourage that, but it isn’t required at all.
That’s why there are no recruiting requirements to get paid on all our customer/player tokens. The focus is to have a very small number of Affiliates compared to a very large number of players.
Thanks! Just thought you might want to get “the rest of the story”
I own 3 businesses would like someone to tell me how you can have a real business without putting out money to make money.
I believe this is going to be big and as long as app does what it is suppose to do there will be no shortage of custmers.
Jeff Henderson, formerly of Nu Skin is credited with being an owner and founder here. Roger Ulmer is the master distributor.
I’ve been looking at UG for about a week after I started getting slammed about it on facebook.
When will MLemmings learn that “[Well known tech company] is HUGE, it’s part of like an eleventy billion dollar industry, imagine if you could have gotten in on the ground floor of [Well known tech company]” is a sales pitch that has never worked for a MLM startup?
One thing that’s pissing me off, UG is lying about their app designer. Mark Mongie has impressive credentials as a programmer which is why it’s flat out stupid for Natalyn Lewis to say things like this:
From a bit after the 4:30 mark in this video: youtu.be/8nWzKLDPvss
Mr. Mongie has a personal blog with a copy of his resume, he describes his employment at EA Sports thusly:
I would be tempted to conclude that UG was more or less using Mark’s name in vain but unfortunately he appeared on a call with Natalyn where similar if not quite as grandiose exaggerations about his involvement with Madden Football were made.
Initially I had concerns that the UG app might be considered a form of gambling. You can pay a dollar for a token and you could wager on the outcome of a coin toss, if a field goal would convert or several other play outcomes.
Now this would be gambling if the reward for winning the wager was money but it isn’t. You can win “points” which can increase your “rank” and eventually be exchanged for some manner of merchandise (ball caps, jerseys). I wonder on average how many $1 tokens need to be played to buy a $20 ball cap?
One very interesting claim made for the app is that UG has negotiated a deal with the NFL for them to stream clips from live games (on a “millisecond” delay) over their app. Imagine you are wagering if the next play will be a run or a pass, you get to watch that play and witness it’s outcome.
I could very easily be wrong (I have some experience with that) but I rather doubt this is going to happen the way it’s been described.
I don’t know what the NFL would charge an app company for licensing rights but you can look up what the networks are paying them, it’s in the billions with a B range.
Can a MLM startup get their foot in that particular door? We’ll find out in September.
Couple of clarifications. (Yes, I am a U.G. Affiliate.)
1) The UG app is not fantasy sports. “A fantasy sport is a type of online game where participants assemble imaginary or virtual teams of real players of a professional sport.” – Wikipedia)
The UG game(s) will enable players to call plays in real-time during real games as they take place.
2) Fantasy sports is often associated with gambling. UG does not endorse gambling, nor will the app support gambling activities.
3) If the majority of token purchases in UG originated from affiliates, it would indeed be a closed loop and wither on the vine.
However, we anticipate the game will be successful in it’s own right because the game designer is one of the tops in the industry. Mark Mongie was Creative Director of EA Sports (Madden Football, NCAA Football, NASCAR Thunder, and others) He knows how to make a game.
4) The vast majority of players will never know that the game is being promoted using an affiliate sales model. They’ll get an invitation from a player to play the game. Some will and some won’t.
5) The company is using a “freemium” business model similar to Angry Birds or Candy Crush. Players can download the game for free, play it until the free trial runs out, then purchase more tokens or watch advertisements from national brand partners. Affiliates are paid based on the purchase of tokens by players.
So, to be clear, it costs absolutely nothing to download and play the game unless the player enjoys it and wants to play more. Then they can either purchase more tokens or watch short ads, both of which are commissionable events.
Candy Crush had sales of $3 billion in 2015 using this same model. People enjoyed the game and they invited their friends to play it. The majority of revenue was derived from the serving of advertisements to players.
6) “The danger of the business model is affiliates getting awarded tokens when they sign up, along with the perpetual $9.95 fee.”
Nothing in the Compensation Plan document, the Affiliate Agreement, or the Policies and Procedures make mention of Affiliates being tokens as part of their monthly back office fee.
7) The difference between the UG game and others is that UG will pay Affiliates to create buzz, rather than paying Google or Facebook.
8) Regarding the statement that “If you have to pay a fee to get paid, it’s not a real business”, K. Chang has obviously never bought a McDonald’s franchise.
@A. Jones – Thanks for the management background info.
Why is it then on all the marketing material I’ve seen (corporate and affiliate), comparisons to Draft Kings, Fan Duel et al. are made?
If it’s not the games being actually played, then it’s fantasy is it not?
But if you do, you’ll earn more. What’s more ignoring retail and just focusing on affiliate recruitment maxes out the compensation plan (and pays you too on residual affiliate autoship spend).
This is a problem…
That’s all very well for single-level commissions (non-MLM), the MLM side of the business is the issue here.
@John
Why all the comparisons to fantasy sports companies then? Are you sure what you described is all UGM are offering?
If I buy tokens, gamble on the outcome of sports (fantasy or otherwise), insert convoluted mechanism here, withdraw my winnings as cash, that’s gambling.
Just so we’re clear, you’re saying UGM app users cannot make money through use of the app alone?
I noted the same and that’s why I pointed it out. The comp plan documentation doesn’t explicitly clarify what affiliates are getting for $9.99 a month.
The hell is a “technology subscription”?
MLM != franchise. Also McDonalds franchise owners don’t pay a fee to get paid, they pay a fee for the franchise.
For the most part UG is very reluctant to put things into writing, even their comp plan document is incomplete and subject to changes and revisions.
However the “we are not gambling” thing is pretty much etched in stone and for good reasons.
Draft Kings and Fan Duel paid out in cash and relied on something to the effect of a “game of skill” exemption in US federal law to avoid being regulated as gambling. Individual States have their own gambling laws and both of those companies have come under suit in multiple States.
I never played either of those company’s games so don’t care about the suits either way but their commercials nearly replaced beer ads during sports and unlike beer ads never seemed to have any pretty girls in them so they negatively impacted my viewing experience.
So yes, as a player (as apposed to an affiliate) it is impossible to make any money off of United Games’ Sports app.
Will removing any profit motive from the wagering process adversely affect the sale of tokens to non affiliates? You bet your bippy but not enough to impact initial affiliate signups.
And while I haven’t seen it in writing, anywhere official, the $10/month “technology subscription” does in fact include 10 99 cent tokens. So tokens will be “sold.”
Except comparing franchising to MLM is bogus. In MLM you are an independent contractor, doing WORK for the company. Franchising means you just license the name and pay fees. You don’t work for the company you license from.
Got any MORE bogus comparisons you care to drop?
Mate if you can’t make money through the app, nobody is going to use it.
Who are they kidding? This is DOA and only affiliates are going to be app users, which means they’ll be the primary token purchasers.
This may not even be the largest flaw in the business model. I mean, lots of people play Madden or Angry Birds, paying money to do so with no expectation of monetary reward.
Of course UG is comparing themselves to Fan Duel and Draft Kings who basically catapulted themselves to prominence as “legal gambling” with money rewards for winning. UG has of course thrown that possibility out the window.
I have a fondness for the local radio broadcast team that covers my favorite NFL franchise. The “play by play” guy is great and the “color” man is a retired player from a bygone era of the franchise. Together they do a fine job.
I try to catch a game or two at the stadium each year and I listen to the radio broadcast on headphones. Besides the game call you get information and updates you couldn’t otherwise have while watching the game from the stands.
This is the important thing, there is almost zero lag between the play by play call broadcast over radio and the action taking place on the field.
But sometimes I’ll watch the game on TV with the sound turned down and listen to the game call on the radio but occasionally they are so out of sync that isn’t workable. The video is (on occasion) five, ten or more seconds behind the radio.
If I were wagering on the game via the UG Sports App, what is it synced to?
There’s real time, as it happens. The radio which is only delayed by the human announcer’s ability to articulate the action and then there is the network video feed which can be several seconds delayed from the actual action.
If (and this is a very big ‘IF’) UG acquires a license to use the network broadcast feed of NFL football what is to keep their feed from being every bit as delayed as the network broadcasts? Again we are talking about seconds here.
But in those seconds, things can happen. If the wager is about a play outcome and I heard the result in real time but the app is synced at a few second delay I have a few seconds to place a wager that I already know the outcome of.
There are too many potential implementation problems here to ignore. IF the app comes out on time and IF it syncs to live sports and IF non affiliates actually buy tokens in hand over fist type numbers then they are really on to something.
But if all of that is true UG are fools for splitting 43% of their profits with affiliates. If the above is not true, the affiliates are fools for squandering their “social capitol” and friends lists to promote (yet another) all sizzle no steak opportunity.
I always enjoy reading the reviews of companies here. I’m admittedly only a sports fan when my boys are on the field or court but this has caught my attention because of the simplicity of sharing and inviting players.
Yes the game does not launch until Fall. Yes those who build a team of affiliates have the ability to make more money but I see this as an opportunity for anyone, with or without a team to generate some capital.
I get Candy Crush, FarmVille and 8 Ball invites daily on FB. I’ve never played a single one but even if I did, the person inviting me to play was not financially incentivized to do so.
Games launched by UG will function the same. Players can invite players and of course affiliates can invite players. Players who pre-register now to be 1sy to play, get extra incentives, points, etc.
The game is free to download. Players can play for free by watching advertisements to get tokens (Freemiums) instead of purchasing them and every token purchased or ad viewed is how affiliates generate revenue.
Only time will tell but thus far the technology, tools etc that affiliates have access to are working perfectly. I can see every team member that is an affiliate and every player too.
Until the game goes live this fall, player and affiliate invites are manually generated with 1 code for each invite. Many have taken a spot just because but those who build a player/affiliate base during the Summer will have the most success come Fall of course.
This game is a great way for organizations, sports teams, etc to fund raise and many athletic coaches will invite fans to download a free game, call shots with your favorite team, win prizes and in return it supports our team as well.
This will be another flop for idiots. It’s just another data grab. Using the free sign up to gather emails, names, addresses, and phone numbers to resell.
So, are the affiliates already paying the monthly subscription or does that wait until fall?
@Lee Powers I am a UG Affiliate and the affiliate monthly subscription of $9.99 is not being charged and won’t be charged until the app is released this Fall. This has been a zero risk opportunity and I have not put in 1 single penny.
I went to the corporate office in Utah last week, and personally met with Natalynn Lewis, Jeff Henderson, and Mark Mongie. This app is going to be incredible and it will go viral.
The affiliates will be capped and the goal is to have players enjoying the game with Freemium play.
Still seems like a flop to me, whats the point of going on the site to watch my fav team play when I can just turn on my tv.
Also, if you cant play fantasy gamez on here why would I tell hundreds of people to join a site that lets you do very little? I really dont get what the hype is for.
This could be pretty interesting. Thank you Chris Sizemore for answering my first question.
I have a couple more – primarily about ‘motivation.’ I do not play sports games, fantasy sports, or gamble but I do have a favorite team and I do occasionally play candy crush and plenty of family friends do too. What is the impetus – the motivation – to play this game especially along with a live game?
I just don’t get it. If I play the game for the sake of the game that’s one thing…and hopefully there’s a challenge to it (like Candy Crush)… however, playing “along” with the live does not seem to provide any real motivation that I can see. Am I missing something here?
Games can be a great (and sometimes not so great) distraction from regular stresses of the day. And they’re games – called that for a reason. Where’s the fun in a game alongside the live real game?
Is this like the scene from “Big” with Tom Hanks when Tom, as a boy says to the toy design executives “What’s so fun about a building that transforms?”.
Machines are cool as transformers, not buildings. Where is the fun in this game? Thanks.
I a not understanding the fuss, did anyone talk crazy when Candy Crush was born? And if you don’t play gaming apps then why are you here commenting? People kill me saying mlm is a scheme, now some companies may be, but not all of them.
And not a real business, that’s BS, I have joined mlms and gotten a handsome tax write off under my EIN, so if I pay taxes, its a business.
People are grown and can decide what company they want to work for or sell for. Most mlm complainers are ones who joined and didn’t make a dime so they say its not the real thing. Excel Communications had the same problems but they made alot of folks rich. If UGM is smart enough to build an app ad attach a mlm to it, then hats off to them.
I believe just because people can get paid for being a member they will join. What gaming app pays you to play?
If they can work it out, they will pay some bills for folks who have never made a dime online. And lets say they get 5000 affiliates and they sign up a ton of folks…this shit will go viral ad now advertisers will be jumping onboard and gliches will be fixed.
And as far as them selling data, if you know anything about data, you’re being tracked daily by invisible ads, re-targeting, cookies and more shit that RTB’s do to us without us eveing knowing.
I wish them all the best, just wish I had thought of it. Hell maybe I will launch an app with an mlm attached so I can be called a scheme too.
If there’s no retail, it will flop.
Can’t see a reason to use UGM’s app as a retail customer, other than “feels good”.
When you’re competing against fantasy sports, “feelings” don’t cut it IMO. All that’s left is affiliates using the app because of the business opportunity, which of course is a problem.
no they won’t. why do the facebook games NOT need an incentive to play from your friends but suddenly a game where someone can allegedly (and I say that because it has yet to be proven to be up and up) win money based on knowledge needs people to be paid to get people to play?
no one wins money playing the facebook games yet people are begging you to play….. and they beg for free!
I play on draft kings…… I do not have to pay a monthly fee to do so. why would I now? how are you going to weed out the States that don’t allow fantasy sports?
If an app can go viral, it doesn’t need MLM. Those with websites to spread links gets all the referrals. Those of you actually playing by the rules are at a vast disadvantage.
@WhatTheWhat…I asked a simple question and your “answer” consists of smears and points that have nothing really to do with what I asked.
My question is simple: “What is the point of playing this game?” and/or “What makes this game fun to play?”.
If the game is fun and/or challenging then it might interest me personally (as well as others).
Shifting gears to the business side: You have NO CLUE as to my interest, experience, qualifications or business interest so why would you make any negative comments towards my question.
If you are unable to address my question then I submit your question back to you: “Why are you even commenting?”.
Sounds like another Ripplin. Boom!
So viral that the moment you start charging $9.99 a month your viral aspect will die right on the vine! Don’t say you have not been warned.
Before you get ready to cash your monthly checks you may want to look around at how many are having success doing this. Then you can see your future.
Build your user base around something wouldn’t mind spending money on – not some “it will go viral” and people will be willing to spend $9.99 a month.
LOL all this talk about how great the developer was on Madden 2006. Have any of ya’ll actually even played Madden 2006?
Dude that was the absolutely worst version of Madden in the entire Franchise. I know cuz I bought and played it for a year! Madden 2005 was way better and 2007 was light and day better.
If this is the person designing the user interface (UX) for a gaming app, I’d umm… well.. yeah… So why didn’t he design Madden 2007?
How does this fit in with people using DVRs? I NEVER watch TV, including sports, unless we can buzz through the commercials.
Also… at sports bars using satellite there is a time delay… listen to a basketball game and try to watch it at the same time… out of synch. How is this delay part taken into account?
I don’t think it is. If you’re not watching live then it doesn’t work.
The most obvious flaw with the way this app is being marketed is the people marketing it are already assuming it will go viral and it hasn’t even been released.
App’s become popular not by people promoting that they will go viral, but by people using the app realizing its value and telling a others about it.
Before even divulging into the app itself can anyone answer these questions for me:
How and when will these so called commissions be paid to affiliates?
Are affiliates going to be compensated in percentage coins that don’t represent any monetary value?
Are these affiliates going to be paid in monthly checks?
Another mind boggling question is what binds these affiliates to this company?
At the end of the day when this thing goes “Live” who, or I should say, what guarantees that any compensation will be paid out once an affiliates level 1’s and 2’s and 3’s start purchasing tokens?
In any business that you market or advertise for you are bound to that company by some type of documentation for that’s your only ground to stand on to ensure you will be compensated.
I see a ton of confusion here. And a ton of assumptions as well.
First, the number of affiliates will be limited. They are closing that part down. If you are in you are in. If you are not, you will never get a chance again. It ends 2 weeks before launch which is scheduled for Sept. 15.
Right now we are looking for affiliates because those are the people who are going to start the process of sharing the app. Somebody has to start it and if you have a motivated group of people ALL over the world, it will spread way faster.
Currently there are affiliates in 115 different countries. But we only need so many so that is why no more will be allowed to join as affiliates once the app launches.
As an affiliate we don’t get anything from the monthly subscription. That just helps to pay for the servers and hosting costs of our affiliate portals. $10 per month is a joke and a non issue.
Players can download the app for free and play for free. They can either purchase tokens to use or earn them from watching 15 sec ads paid for by advertisers around the world. Contracts are already in place for this and are good to go on launch.
Players compete for rankings, perks and prizes. Prizes can be hats, shirts etc all the way to game tickets and trips. They also earn tokens by sharing the app. So besides having fun playing the game against friends and family, they have incentive to play in order to win stuff.
Affiliates are paid on tokens purchased or earned. Same payout. They are paid on all players under them no matter who invited them to infinity. They are also paid when they play the game themselves and invite others. When other people accept the invite and play, affiliates are paid on any tokens purchased or earned and used during that game.
Commission checks are monthly.
This will be a great thing for sports bars to use to create more business. They can signup as a player, spread the word to their customers and on game nights, they can send out an invite to their players inviting them down to the bar.
They can even include specials they will be having and perks like a free drink or food if a player shows up before the game starts.
The bottom line, this app is for those that like to watch sports and would enjoy competing with friends while doing so. Its just an enhancement of the actual game or race or whatever the sport is.
United Games does NOT have any contracts with the NFL, MLB or Nascar. They do have a contract with a company that provides all the real time data already and that data will be used i real time for the game.
I hope this clears up some of the confusion.
You might be wrong. First Affiliates get paid if people purchase tokens, but they also get paid on the “Free tokens” from Advertizers.
The company says you don’t need to get Affiliates and may be detrimental and they will be limiting them, so when the APP releases, you will not be able to be an affiliate.
Next, they don’t charge anyone anything until the App launches so if you want to quit before because no one signs up.. you can.
Don’t see how they will get rich on that one. All people who sign up on the APP later will be divided between the ones who are already affiliates. Do better research.
MLM companies don’t close off affiliates. It’s a marketing gimmick they used to encourage “fear of loss” recruitment.
Of the few companies that promised it over the years, they’ve either:
a. continually pushed back the close-off date or
b. collapsed shortly after stopping new affiliate signups.
ya exactly man. right now the platform looks like junk supposed coming from a guy at EA.
and the info is supposed to be quiet yet they allowed a cell phone to film for almost 2 hours. and we don’t even know if that was Ray Lewis on the telephone.
this is like the same hype I heard with SmashFund (crowdfunding).
However aside from this lack of preview and disclosure, this has insane potential. In my opinion everything else seems to pan out.
wait, in response to my own comment…why would you even want to keep something quiet pre-launch.
you should be shouting from the rooftops. why are they not showing what the platform looks like? that makes no sense at all.
Just show what the game looks like , you should have a prototype if you’re going to be selling, otherwise you just have hype.
Ive seen one poorly designed screen shot. Where’s the product!!?? you don’t need affiliates to launch a game.
You make more money direct sales if you just had Ray Lewis tweet about the game from his account.
but ya , if it turns out to be legit, it will be insane for affiliates. LOL
This is very worth the minimal risk!!
With the relevance of the app’s creators, the relavance of the app’s advertisers, and the relavance of the app’s affiliates this is going to take off!!
It’s very foolish not to take the minimal risk that there is on this one!!
I got invited by a fellow business colleague to check out this opportunity and it definitely looks polarizing to be sure. After reading several articles, etc Here are my PROS/CONS and overall opinion on the matter
PROS
– It involved sports, the NFL, and tries to target the fantasy gamer crowd
– If it blows up, early adopters could make a lot of money creating their own deep downline of affiliation
– Real time games and those that involve wagering, whether real, imagined, etc still causes a frenzy. (I imagine the fantasy guy watching NFL in a bar, while also playing this game.
CONS
– There is WAY too much ambiguity here with regards to the opportunity. There really should be more info, user agreement, and much more specificity with this than there is.
– The NFL is awesome and likely their main cash cow, but unfortunately the NFL is only for 5 months a year and the main viewing is on Sundays only. I see very few people challenging someone to cricket or a hockey game. Who is going to buy tokens when the game is almost over or it’s not on Sunday?
– I think the Madden claims and expertise are a little bit of a hype train. The game play of choosing outcomes can be very boring if not set up right and there isn’t an actual “game” Candy Crush and farmville are addicting because the user is involved with the strategy or RPG style of the game.
Yes, you can choose outcomes and play against opponents but you’re mostly going to be watching a football game.
– The time delay thing brings up huge question marks too. It’s already been discussed here, but not a fan unless they can absolutely have the fastest updates possible. Game feeds and radio broadcasts could create some massive fraud or mixed game play at best.
This is your classic Home run style opportunity. Either the several thousand early adopters make a bunch of money on a game that could make billions OR it’s a strike out on 3 pitches.
At least with Fan Duel, you set your lines up before the game and just let all the action unfold. That and it’s real money on the line, not “tokens” for a free hat or bragging rights.
Basically this reminds me of NFL prop bets on the Superbowl. A once a year thing where lots of gamblers bet on any and all outcomes (coin tosses, etc). The problem is, will gamblers get on board with this?
Other than true wagerers, no one cares about most plays in a game and if they do, they’d like to win actual money on it.
Billion dollar apps blow up because it appeals to a ton of the population and any demographic could get hooked to it or play while they are bored. NFL is a different animal.
Yes, it’s a huge industry, but I imagine real fans, gamblers, and fantasy freaks will stick with what they do and not adopt this time waster. It takes away from the real enjoyment of watching football and/or rooting for specific players through out the whole game not.
I could be dead wrong and maybe the madden crowd or casual sports fans get more on board with this, but there isn’t enough incentive, for me personally, to want to play, when I already gamble on daily fantasy and play multiple fantasy sports leagues and love NFL in general.
If this becomes popular among all sports fans, then it could take off, but I think the target market is too small and incentives too small to truly work. Still, for about $50, it’s a 200/1 bet that might be juicy to see the outcome.
I’m an affiliate, it costs 29.99 one time right now and 9.99 per month after(affiliates only).
The affiliate program will closed soon and will be players only. The app will be free.
You answer a series of questions before the game starts based on your chosen expertise. As the game progresses at certain points of the game you will be asked questions about upcoming plays, penalties, etc. NOT EVERY PLAY.
You accumulate points that can be used to obtain prizes, NO $$$. Corporate predicts it will be 7 tokens to play along with an NFL game, if you choose to pay, if not play for free.
NFL and Soccer are only the beginning there are plans for most major sports to have an app.
Most people that have commented have spent more than $40 on different lotions, potions, etc. In my opinion it’s worth it to take a look, doesn’t work oh well I’m out $40 in the 1st month.
An interactive sports app designed by recognized app experts with an associated multi-tiered affiliate marketing team. That’s never been done before. You can draw conclusions from other similar things, but the fact is that specific concept has never been done before.
In my mind, this all hinges on the app and how people respond to it.
To the question, “How will people respond to this app?”, there is only one honest answer. No one knows.
So, for a moment, I want you to consider what happens if what United Games is saying will happen actually happens. They say the average game player shares the app with 7 friends.
We start with a large affiliate base, let’s guess that it’s 100,000. There could easily be half a million downloads within days of release.
Half a million sharing with 7 each? 3.5 million sharing with 7 each?
Will those numbers happen? No one knows. Is $30 once and $10 a month worth the risk?
If it does happen, would it make sense for United Games to take no more affiliates at that point? And if it does happen, would there be any value in having in place the multi-tiered affiliate team that made it happen?
It all hinges on the game. No one in this thread knows apps well enough to evaluate the likelihood of success of this venture.
If you are deciding on United Games, make your decision based on whether you think the app will take off.
One more thing. Apps don’t just go viral. Something has to be done to get them started. The big apps spent millions to get started. Having an affiliate team to get them started is an alternative to advertising that has advantages.
I agree with the last couple comments. What an minuscule investment to possibly make a lot! Why not???!!!
I’ve blown much more on the “lotions and potions” per month and can’t say I’ve gained anything from that. No risk – no reward! Take a chance and unit being “Debbie Downers”. Ugh!
Because “why not?” is not the foundation of an educated business decision.
Hi Oz, I get that concept as do all educated business people. AND if the investment was millions, thousands, or even hundreds, I might not take a chance. However; we are talking less than $150 for an entire year as the risk….and the time and effort you care to put into this venture.
That figures to be an investment of less than the cost of two beers a month, less than one fancy drink at your favorite restaurant, less than the cost of a nice dress or pair of shoes. When you try to put it into that perspective…..again, why not?
The hard part of your investment to this is being a go-getter and a willingness to search out people that enjoy sports and interaction.
With such a small monetary investment; I sure wouldn’t want to be the guy living the “snooze, you lose” motto.
I maintain that business decisions should be based on the merits of the concept, not how much it costs to “invest”.
I know you’re just regurgitating what your UGM upline pitched you, but think about it… what you’re saying only benefits the company owners.
Without referring specifically to UGM, if a business model sounds terrible why would invest any money at all into it?
I’m still not convinced the general public will fork out real money to win points. Affiliates will probably be the only users of the app and that’ll die out in a few months.
Hello again OZ.
Not regurgitating anything told to me by UGM. I am my own person to be clear.
So….The concept of an interactive event with friends from all over, near or far, enjoying life together is a good one to be sure. This app is interactive with live sports events – real time – again a good concept.
Sports have been enjoyed by live audiences for centuries and now the app makes it possible for everyone to be part of live action – another cool concept. Heaven knows the world could use a little more good interaction.
The fact that an app has not been done in this fashion shows an entrepreneurial spirit to present something new. Anyone who has that kind of spirit will not be concerned with the possible loss of $150 or the unpaid work it takes to get something off the ground.
Anyone with an entrepreneurial personality will get this. They will want to take a chance at being a part of the development.
Those that need to have “proven ground” to make decisions will never get it and will continue to do their research diligently with their belt cinched tight and supported by a couple pair of suspenders.
Something new can be a scary thing for some. But eventually, when it’s not so scary, they might download the app and play for free and that’s all good too….. they will be the ones that will think “I had a chance to have a little piece of that and waited too long….. next time.”
Lighten up OZ! This is a game. It’s going to fun whether you are a free player or an affiliate. Don’t stay pouting in a corner. Join in. . May not be a “next time”.
lol. you are none of these.
Not for money. There’s no way known I’d cough up money just to make calls against friends watching the same sporting event for points.
Honestly without the attached income opportunity, I can’t see why anyone would be interested in this.
I think that’s called a chatroom. 😀
Hey Whip, no reason to make a comment that you can’t know is true or not….you don’t know me, what brick and mortar businesses I’ve owned in my life, whether they were successful or a bust, or what level of education I have and what degrees I hold.
This app that is causing such a stir is purely for fun. Can’t we simply accept that it’s going to be fun? And if you like sports, it will enhance the sport experience.
There you go KChang: kind of like a chat room but not really. More like an add-on to make the game (whatever sport you are watching) more fun for all the guests/players.
I give up gang. Peace out. Kim
Considering there’s an MLM business opportunity attached to it, that’s disingenuous at best.
The app exists first and foremost to make money, let’s not lose sight of that. Sure, it might need to be fun to achieve that… but as I understand it nothing has even been released yet.
Whether the app is fun to use (or monotonous as I suspect it will be), can only be determined by poll of users not attached to the income opportunity.
It’s not “for fun” if it’s for business, is it? So, are you a consumer for this app, i.e. for fun, or are you in it for the money, i.e. for business?
I absolutely do from your ridiculous statement.
WOW
Wow, Whip, getting a bit personal there.
I am trying to find more information on the owners or backers of this product. I believe 150% the only people that get rich are the ones pitching us to become affiliates. Better said, the owners of the company. Meanwhile, we see nothing.
One has to get 5 people to spend 25,000 tokens before we make 10% or 5% of what?
The comp plan is very vague has people have already spoken about….
Imagine, 100,000 affiliates x 30.00 plus 10 for the next 12 months …. That is serious money for doing nothing..
Are we supporting the creation of the app or will it even come market after they collected their 3,000,0000 split by 4.. Is not bad money!
Sorry to be so negative. Show me the MLM that everyone but the top people are getting rich..
Why does this app have to be distributed through a MLM-type method? Why not just sell the app to users like virtually every other app? Good apps sell themselves over time.
And what exactly is UG selling? How do you promote and hype an app which does not yet exist? What if it’s a bust? What if people don’t like it?
The fact that this elaborate “affiliate/player” system is being put in place, and people are being charged money, before the app has even been released is alarming.
Why would anyone invest in any product or business when they have not been able to view or use the app?
When the main thrust of a product is about getting people to sign up — and not the product itself — red flags should go up. Just my opinion.
I’ve been doing this since august 1st. Its not a scam.
The game is being distributed through affiliate marketing. If Pokemon had 50 k downloads on the first day this game will surpass that already with the amount of affiliates promoting it.
You do not need to be sign up other affiliates to profit from this, you can invite players for free entirely and make commissions from in app purchases.
I was out downtown today promoting to bars. There were a few new esport bars that opened up (Overwatch and League).
The funny thing is, this new app is a type of esport that the sports crowd isn’t even aware of yet. Its going to take the market by surprise if its even half as good as its being billed or what it’s supposed to do.
And I’m apologizing for my comments earlier because they were skeptical and uninformed opinions.
Would you like to get involved in the next billion dollar app?? Do you see what you have in your hands?
Uh, predicting the outcome of moments in sport against friends for points isn’t an “esport”.
on aug 9 it was announce that there will be no tokens included in the $9.98 monthly tech fee.
oz comment #11 written on june 5,2016. the affiliates will have to purchase tokens. how many? they said the app business is changing every day. so the final details are not out.
You have a great deal to learn about schemes and scams if you think 14 days is long enough to come to that conclusion.
Right, because this is how a legitimate business operates.
Open the doors, have people sign up and then change the business model “every day”.
OZ…. if its the affiliates that buy the tokens to stay in. then this i’ve learned in my high school business class that this is a pyramid scheme.
The affiliates are looking to sign up new affiliates until there are no more people in the world to sign up. But it is better than buying tons of soap powder, vitamins or make-up and storing it for resell.
Tokens take up no space. Tokens is the product. I’m still in high school learning about the world of business. But, i guess the owners will make money.
100,000 affiliates spending just $500 a year is $50 million dollars. plus advertiser income. you, k. chang and whip on this blog i take are not affiliates of this company.
If i’m wrong i will be losing a great opportunity. but, i’m young and can wait to make else money.
you’ll notice not one of these scammers has addressed the simplest of legitimate questions posed in post #21
At least you know people can *use* soap powder, vitamins, and make-up. Who uses tokens?
Note: you have to be affiliate status to invite free players in order to generate an income. You can still invite free players as a free player but you are just sharing something fun with friends. No income.
The company gets free “word of mouth” advertising and gives up a small percentage of the game profits to the affiliates who did the advertising work.
The harder you are willing to work, by shear numbers of players you will make more income off the game. As for players, it can remain free if they want.
I found this and thought it quite interesting and illustrative of the potential of sharing as an affiliate. It’s based on the pay out structure for United Games just sharing the app with only FREE players and not having ANY affiliates under you.
Think Small Scenario:
Affiliate A- has 0 Affiliates under him/her; zero; none
Affiliate A however, is able to share the FREE APP with 100 Players, who invest $0 to download the APP, and spend $0 for Tokens. Rather, he watches Five 15-second ads per day, earning 5 FREE Tokens per day.
The 100 Players then PLAY just one NFL game per week, ‘spending’ their 35 tokens per week that they acquired for FREE.
Affiliate A is paid on Tokens acquired and Tokens Played….let’s do the math—
100 players X 35 Tokens/week = 3500 Tokens
X 2 (when acquired and when played) = 7000 Tokens/week
Assume that each Token is valued at $1 (actually they will be worth 99 cents-$1.50) Affiliate earns 10% Commission as each Player is Tier 1 under him, so….
7500 x 10%= $750 per week; $3,000 per month
Would that be helpful to you, a family member, or a friend?
What if the Affiliate can only get 50 Players, for FREE, to play for FREE…ok, he only earns $1500 per month.
THINK SMALL…… it still can be BIG ENOUGH TO HELP.
@doctor
There is no justification for a pyramid scheme.
In other words, you’re working for peanuts and spare change. Is that right?
So they must be really raking it in hand over fist to share that “small percentage” with you, yet can still afford to pay 20% matching bonus per level, among other bonuses, eh?
Why don’t you ask the real question… HOW MANY TOKENS has your upline sold to non-participants? (and how much does that earn?)
So the example I found is for a perfect scenario if you only promoted the game to 100 FREE players AND they all got their free tokens for watching the 15 second ads – 5/day – to obtain their total of 35 free play tokens AND they all played with their tokens and used them all at least 1 game/week.
If it worked out like the example, wowza!!! I wouldn’t call an extra $3500/ month peanuts and spare change. I’d call it Sweet!
Of course that most likely won’t happen so obviously you would need to have many more players under your team umbrella if you don’t want to get any affiliates below you.
Now once a Free player is in, whether they sign up with an affiliate or through the iTunes, etc, and when the actual sports app goes live, expected to be the 2nd or 3rd NFL game, those Free players can invite their buddies to play as well. BUT no compensation to the player inviting or to the new player accepting.
Reason to invite would be purely to have fun.
I’m betting now you are wondering why the 2nd or 3rd NFL game for the sports app to go live. -it’s being played now by BETA testing. (To work any kinks out, if any) So far, so good, and I am told very FUN.
It’s been BETA testing with MLS for awhile. Affiliates have been invited to come to Las Vegas at the end of August to get a look and play the game before release.
As far as selling tokens- we don’t sell anything. Not a single token. We just share/advertise the game. That’s it.
I believe you are a wrong on the 20% check match on each tier/level bonus. Wish that were true but nope. I believe that is for tier one only; affiliate with the first level affiliate below you.
In answer to the game making money hand over fist- I bet it will and I’m excited that I will get a teenie tiny piece of that action. This sports app is expected to be huge and stay huge.
From what I have heard about it, it sounds really fun and really timeless. It’s backed by some really big companies, big athletes, and big celebrities – all of which we are asked not to name drop about right now, as much as we would probably all love too. It’s their right to stay behind the scenes for now.
I hope this helped??
I think you might be overestimating what people without a financial incentive will be willing to do for tokens.
Remember, I said….Of course that most likely won’t happen so obviously you would need to have many more players under your team umbrella if you don’t want to get any affiliates below you.
Also, I haven’t played a game yet that didn’t require you to use tokens to play. And the games like Candy Crush and Poke Mon Go take in millions of dollars each day from the sale of tokens.
Playing Candy Crush and Poke Mon and having all the graphics and bells and whistles is fun. People pay for fun.
I can tell you that whether a team passes the ball or runs the ball is not fun..
UNLESS THEIR IS A CASH WINNING OPTION available .. Plain and Simple.
If you can not win money as a customer with this thing then it is done. There is just too much other stuff around when it comes to NFL or other sports.
Let me give you an example…. If I have 25 dollars and looking to enjoy the NFL and the plays that occur….am I going to give it to company A who offers me the ability to win against a competitor and then overpay for a hat.. OR am I going to give it to Company B who offers me a chance to win daily money, then weekly, and maybe even season money.
I will let you make the choice.
UMM….that would be a NO and is the reason for this discussion. But hey, if I am missing the boat on this then so be it.
All I know is that everyone I know will have no interest if it is just for fun.
There are so many avenues where people can have fun about calling plays. In fact, you can even gamble on this stuff straight up with Sportsbooks these days.
So again, It better behave and react like Madden Football (Which is FUN and people pay) but how could it ever on a little screen…
NO WAY.
Will be interesting to see
Really? What does “backed” mean?
Do you know how often people make claims like that only to create hype?
Even if God herself backed the app, what difference would that make?
I will never play United Games. I am sick of their spamming.
Only a fool would pay $9.95 a month to play fantasy sports. This is one big scam.
I was recently contacted about this scam.
The app will definitely launch; from what I understand that is the only way they can take your $29.99 fee and first $9.99 month fee.
200,000 folks “invest” = just shy of $8,000,000 USD
So when the app fails, it is not their fault; it did not go “viral” as they had hoped.
$8,000,000 (less $10,000 in development fees)
$7,990,000 split between the folks that started this scheme. Not bad for 4-5 months of rhetoric.
I believe Dr. Dre said it best on the “Cash Money Insert” on NWA greatest hits back in 1989:
“You know what im saying you know what im saying. All you people listening”
“thank you for all your money”
Hahahah
“we really appreaciate it; its going to a very useful cause”
“the help Dre get a brand new Testorosta Ferrari Fund”
Hahahaha
Thank you K Chang! EXACTLY!
—
For those of you that haven’t done the math. Candy Crush currently generates $665K/day. Minus the app store fee results in $465K/day of revenue.
So even IF (and that is a HUGE IF) this game was as popular as Candy Crush, has 100,000 affiliates (conservative estimate), and payouts are 10%, it will generate 47 cents/day for you.
That is $169/year. Minus your annual fee of $119 and you make a whopping $50!!!!
Come on!
However if you do the math for the creators. $418K/mo for equivalent success to CC. However…. They have guaranteed income of $999K/mo from affiliates.
Essentially $12M/year from their MLM scheme regardless of game success. The game flops and affiliates get $0 but the makers still get $12M/year.
This whole scheme is setup and guaranteed to make money only for the makers. Not affiliates. Don’t buy into it.
I should have provided backup for my CC revenue.
thinkgaming.com/app-sales-data/
Look at the numbers people. Take 10% of daily revenue. That is what would be distributed between 100,000 affiliates. Since they are charging affiliates $33,000 / day the break even point for affiliates would be revenue of $333,000 / day.
Do you really think they can guarantee revenue in the top #10? You are crazy if you think so.
The majority of affiliates, at $9.99 / month, will lose money. So when do you drop out?
DARREN, THIS IS A MLM. YOUR DOWN LINE IS GOING TO HAVE TO BUY TOKENS AND PLAYERS HAVE TO BUY TOKENS.
IF YOU ARE THE UP LINE YOU ARE GOING TO MAKE MONEY FROM THEM BUYING TOKENS. PLUS, UNITED GAMES WILL PAID YOU SOME OF THE ADVERTISEMENT INCOME.
YOUR MATH IS VERY GOOD BUT HOW YOU KNOW HOW MANY AFFILIATES 100,000 ARE SIGN IN. ONLY WHEN THE DOWN LINE IS BUYING THE TOKENS AND THEY THEMSELVES CAN NOT FIND A DOWN LINE TO BUY FOR THEM. THEN THE SCHEME WILL FAIL.
I AM NOT AN AFFILIATE SO I DON’T REALLY KNOW HOW THEY ARE MARKETING THIS APP. I’VE ONLY VIEW A FEW OF THE VIDEOS ON YOUTUBE FROM THE AFFILIATES LOOKING FOR A DOWN LINE FOR THEMSELF..
I’ve read many of the comments and rebuttals and a few things come to mind.
First, I enjoy watching competitions to an extent, but have always said to my friends, “I’d rather be playing the sport than watching it.” I think many people feel that way.
The game brings out the competitive nature in people. On the other hand, I’ve only “bet” a handful of times on sports; not because it doesn’t make the game more interesting… it does…. but because I’m not interested in losing money.
There are 290M sports fans in the USA alone and about 56M play some form of fantasy and participate in betting. I understand the average amount spent on fantasy apps per year is about $465.
When fantasy players are asked why they play they admit the number one reason they participate is for the “entertainment value.”
Most admit they don’t even expect to win and those who win consistently are probably the same 5% of the players.
Which brings me to my next point… this app seems to be a solution for the fantasy player who wants entertainment, but has become sick of losing money.
It also seems like there is an unmet need for for perhaps the other 234M sports fans who may want to participate in something that brings them into the competition but doesn’t turn them off due to the gambling and the potential outcome of losing.
I think it’s natural for those with reservations to feel the way they do, but at least this game seems like it’ll provide fun competition for the water cooler trash talk the next day at work or in real time in the game.
Imagine hearing about the not yet launched Candy Crush or Angry Bird game? The concept would be mind numbing…. why would we play that stupid game?
Well, the joke would be on you, I guess. Which brings me to my 2nd to final point….do you think more people are interested in sports to be intrigued enough to download and try a game like the United Games app vs the number of jewel or bird fans there were to make people intrigued by those other games?
It will all come down to entertainment value…that is the “why” that some of you are not grasping. We’re not all gamblers, but we all want to be entertained…
Lastly, for the love of God!!!! It seems quite clear that the UG technology fee is not a payment to UG.
It is the cost of the dedicated website that each Affiliate gets that has the information they need on it to run and track their business.
The domain costs money and someone has to maintain the site and basically be the custodian of the site adding information like Affiliates and Players, revenue and commission tracking, marketing materials, help lines to communicate and ask questions to corporate, etc.
My WiFi costs 3X or 4X that much and I need that for all my businesses and I sure wouldn’t want to try to keep track of my team and revenue myself.
So, yeah…$9.99 per month? Doesn’t seem like it’s a big deal. And $150 first year investment. Can’t see how you wouldn’t make your money back even if it is a flop.
But what if it is the next Billion dollar app? I think I’ll take that bet…… Americans waste more on a night out….and what for? A headache the next morning?
It might be cooler to gamble that you might be a part of something that could be huge. The first of it’s kind, global, live interactive sports app that puts you and your friends in the game….sounds cool to me.
If you have a gambling problem and just have to bet, make a side bet with your friend who plays with you..loser buys you lunch next time you hang out, or a beer, etc.
Your logic fails upon consideration of what makes fantasy sports entertaining. That is, even the smallest chance of winning money.
A replicated website (script-generated) on a pre-paid domain + hosting doesn’t cost $9.95 a month. It’s an affiliate fee.
“What if” doesn’t have a good track record in MLM.
So when I hear this argument made I have to chuckle myself. If you don’t understand why Candy Crush and Angry Birds have been insanely popular, what makes you think you are in a position to predict success for this app?
And if a maker can guarantee app success, as K. Chang: said previously
A few things starting to shape up:
First, the app launch is delayed until October. It was originally pitched as launching with the new NFL season (September 11th) but for what ever reasons it’s being delayed. Shame, by launching in October they are losing out on no fewer than three of the NFL’s 16 regular season weeks.
The “shutting down” or “cutting off” of affiliate signups has been softened to a “pause” and it’s being folded into a larger marketing strategy.
A “few weeks” prior to the app launching affiliate signups will be paused and they want all income opportunity references removed from social media by the people who posted them, compliance being mandatory.
This will signal an orgy of player signups (or pre signups prior to app availability) and UG doesn’t want anyone talking about the income opportunity side at all, just share the app.
Seems as though they are wisely attempting to distance their app from the sort of stigma most people associate with cheesy MLM opportunities.
And we have a sorta live demo of the app on video:
youtu.be/7-Nt31m89HU
“Sorta” live because they didn’t have a live game to sync it to but it gives you a good feel for what to expect. I am not overwhelmed. (Numbers in parentheses are timestamps in the video)
(2:13) Players need to manually enter and affiliate’s referral code. So much for infinite levels of players signing up players all in your downline, the first person who loses the piece of paper they wrote 2ed45f on wont pass that code on to their next person.
(4:17) They’re being pretty elastic as to the cost of an individual “token,” there was something like a presumption that 1 token = $1 but I kinda hope that isn’t true. In the example provided they list 5 tokens as the buy in price for that game event. How many people are going to pay $5 to play a game when if they win, all they win are “points” they can use to get hats and stuff with?
(4:50) Here’s where we get to the “meat” of the game, two game modes, pregame and live.
Pregame seems to be filler questions, pick the score against the spread, pick over or under on total points, nothing new. Will player X meet a given performance target, a little better, some rooting interest at least. Which team will commit the most penalties of a given type? If there is a cutting edge you can’t see it from here.
(7:15) Live mode, starting off with an add is honest at least, they did prod you to opt into push notifications, didn’t they?
The app is set to ask you four questions per possession but some drives have double digit numbers of plays while some can end on a turnover on the first play so this is not all together awesome game design.
UG lists six ways a NFL drive can end, touchdown, field goal, punt, turn over, safety, turned over on downs or a missed field goal. They combine the last two and assign a point value to each of the six choices and you get to guess which one it will be (I guess they never saw a drive end when the clock expires).
Hurry, you have 12 seconds to guess which one and also to guess if the offense will throw a pass of 20+ yards, be tackled for a loss and if they will commit a penalty during the upcoming drive.
I’m trying to be open minded here but I also know that despite numerous attempts no MLM company has ever launched an entertainment related app that has ever appealed to anyone not being paid to promote that app and I’m struggling to see how this will be any different.
Remove the income opportunity here and what do you have left? A “guess the outcome of the play” kind of game you have to pay to play, or you can sit through a bunch of adds on your device and they’ll give you a few free tokens to play with.
And with enough tokens and enough lucky guesses you can win points. With enough points you might be able to get a shirt or something.
Credit where it’s due, UG is being smart by trying to hide the MLM component here. Nothing could kill this deal faster in the eyes of the general public than to be branded the “Amway of Apps,” not even asking people to pay cash for a mediocre game with frumpy prizes. Though that would be a close second.
Ha! Love it! 🙂
email on August 30th from Jeff Henderson CEO, Founder United Games:
They don’t want to be seena that way but then he goes on & promotes the affiliate program for fundraising.
MLM compensation plan = MLM opportunity.
Jeff Henderson is talking out of his ass.
Let’s face some facts:
Founder had worked for MULTIPLE MLMs before starting UG.
Company’s marketing model is “sharing” the app to create referral downlines. That makes it at least affiliate marketing, a cousin of MLM, and a term often co-opted by MLM to avoid the MLM curse (remember Vemma?)
So basically, UG claiming to NOT be network marketing is like Herbalife claiming not to be MLM but merely a nutrition company. It’s hilarious. It’s obviously both.
In denying the truth, the company is confusing the affiliates and possibly dooming the company.
Why does an app require liability insurance? Am I the only one worried about that?
yet even before they see the insurance they want you to plunk down $99. ummm yeah!
Scenario: NewCo is a business that is founded on Hype and funded by Greed. It is set up such that it is guaranteed to generate cash immediately from Greed funding, but operational cash flow beyond that is questionable.
Question: No matter what happens operationally, who are you confident is going to make money on this deal, Hype or Greed?
Many ‘experts’ on this page. The ‘investment’ required, in question, is ludicrous. Where are they going to get their ‘capital’ moving forward is also ludicrous. Basic economics at the fee structure given.
United Games essentially took ‘themselves’ out of the 501c3 premise with the necessary parameters set and who really cares?
Furthermore, this app is not for children and in no way can be compared to Angry Bird or Candy Crush or Pokémon which are child-centered for the better part…..and, this over-hype with those apps being mentioned is a huge mistake in my estimation.
So, time runs out on ‘drive’ and so what? Time runs out, period. Are you thinking they are going to ‘reverse’ the points accumulated up to that point? Why would they do that or need to? The points ‘effected’ would become null and void and am certain that has been taken into consideration.
Lots of ‘doomsayers’, here. Insofar as Players and the ‘download’ ….. Affiliates will be assigned/attached to Players that have not received a ‘direct’ invite from an Affiliate. They become that Affiliates Player, forever.
This is done by an established logarithm they have in place, already. Yeah, I know what someone is going to respond….how can we trust them to do that?
For the ‘huge’ investment I am making (dripping sarcasm)…I am giving United Games the benefit of that ‘doubt’.
Most of the arguments here are from over-analyzing ‘politically correct’ individuals (it just smells of that) …. it is the sign of the times all over in our nation and they are entitled to think whatever they will and/or must.
I will take this ‘incredible’ chance given all and if I go ‘broke’ then so be it. Have a nice day, everyone.
^^ You sound like someone who makes sound business decisions based on solid logic. Best of luck in the future.
And that is why this app will tank….
I read the whole entire comment section and the most interesting thing I realized is that the people who bought in as Affiliates vehemently defending an app that does not even exist yet. Then the comments all started to follow the same pattern:
1. This app will go viral
2. I am only losing $30 for a chance to make a killing
3. What do I really have to lose.
So I have been following this app for about a month now and I have not committed to it because there is nothing to commit to. There is no app!
The launch date is vaguely said to be the “fall 2016” presumably coinciding with the start of the NFL season. Today I heard from an Affiliate that the app is still under testing and won’t be available until mid October.
By my calculations UG basically lost 6 weeks of a sport that has 16 weeks of game time. It also tells me if they can’t get the app to work properly for a sport that plays three days out of the week how are they going to get NBA, NHL and MLB which almost have games daily.
I saw the app on the Apple Store for two days. The first day it was called United Games the second day it was called Affiliated Games. Today it does not exist on the Apple Store.
Also, it was never available on the Google Play store during the two days I saw it on the Apple Store. There are just too many red flags going up for me even believe this is worth my time.
So can an Affiliate tell me when the app is actually going to be released? Or do I get the standard answer “Fall 2016” which covers about three months of the year.
It’s actually worse than that. Even if they get “the app” up and running, it sounds dumber than dirt.
You’re not interacting with the game, you’re interrupting with the game. It doesn’t bring you in closer to the game, it’s a trivia quiz on top of the game or guessing game on top of the game.
It’s the digital version of the jerk who won’t shut the hell up at a live game as he spouts off trivia and guesses the next play.
Where is the social networking aspect that doesn’t already exist? If people are just dying to text each other during a game, the just text each other. They don’t need a trivia quiz to get the conversation rolling.
Oh, and uh, one other thing. Check out this firm, SportRadar, and see if that doesn’t seriously deflate your overhyped balloon.
And also check out the $40M investment just made to expand into the US market which was spearheaded by Mark Cuban, Michael Jordon, and Ted Leonis. So that would be the owner of the Dallas Mavericks, the Charlotte Hornets, and the Washington Capitals/Wizards/Mystics owners respectively.
And also notice that SportRadar, a firm that’s been around for over 20 years and has the digital sports feed market by the balls with exclusive contracts with the NFL, NBA, NHL…. blah blah the world over with every swing major sports federation.
Yeah, look at all that and then come back and compare it to these dorks.
Funny that you mention SportRadar because I’m pretty sure they are UG’s data supplier.
There was a compliance issues call in late July and one of the “stop saying this” bullet points was that some affiliates were claiming UG had a “strategic partnership” with Mark Cuban and that is far from the truth. UG has a subscription to SportRadar’s data service and that’s as close to a “partnership” as exists.
The fact that the app launch was pushed back IS a sign of trouble. NFL football has a drive structure and game flow that is pretty ideal to the sort of game the app is shaping up to be but it’s played basically three days a week, 17 regular season weeks a year and UG is on track to miss out on no less than about 1/4 of that season, if not more.
They’ve already written off the September billing cycle and three weeks of token sales, no one is getting billed but no one is getting paid either.
Well, that’s not quite true. I’m in a few of the private downline facebook groups and almost all of them are selling things like capture pages, lead gen and bulk “targeted clicks.”
Some pretty seedy marketers got the “tools scam” launched here long before the app goes live. It’ll be fun to watch UG try and pretend not to be a MLM company with thousands of mass replicated recruiting websites online.
United Games hasn’t even launched yet and they are already increasing the fee to join. I have not heard the reasoning behind it.
The affiliate Fee to join United Games is INCREASING Sept. 15, 2016
A one-time business suite cost of $29.99 is required to join the Affiliate program. Beginning September 15, 2016 this cost will increase to $39.99. In addition, the monthly technology subscription is required to keep your Affiliate account active (current cost $9.99).
Weren’t they stopping affiliate recruitment?
At this rate they’ll miss the whole NFL season altogether. Keep paying those affiliate fees though.
These UG criminals need to be shut down asap… fleecing people of $10 bucks a month… COME ON!!!!!!!
Well, we have a ring and a date, for affiliate signups leastwise:
The same email did not mention if they were sticking to the timeline of the app launching “two to three weeks” after affiliate signups close. If so the app can be expected October 24rth or 31st after missing out on seven or eight weeks of the NFL’s 17 week regular season.
That’s seven or eight weeks of potential affiliate earnings being kissed goodbye without a single note of explanation. The safest guess is there’s a hitch with the app.
But they did clarify an issue, the onetime enrollment fee does climb from $29 to $39 if you don’t enroll before the 22nd of this month (pushed back from the 15th) but in either case you wont be billed until after the app arrives. That’s smart, they don’t want their merchant processing yanked in prelaunch.
And a final note to UG upline leaders selling capture pages, funnels and all manner of lead gen to your recruits, make sure to inform them they’ll have to take all those pages down in less than one month. Then remind them of your no refunds policy.
Glim, It wouldn’t matter if they missed 6 – 8 weeks of game time. Just with 50k affiliates alone would bring in 500k per month for the company….and for what ? I can’t wait for this to crash and burn…popcorn is ready.
Slayer, You cant wait for it to crash and burn for what reason? So you can feel satisfied that “I told you so”. So your going to continue and troll this board on a subject you only want to see fail. Stand up person you are.
Don’t you have something better to do like go find a Yankee,Lakers,Cowboys or Alabama message board to go troll on?
“Not for kids”??? Hello!?!?!? All those devils will certainly be the ones to watch the adds for free tokens…
Ex:
-Hey 10th grader (college student, low income adult), your favorite team is playing tonight. I think I can accurately predict what goes on during the game better than you. Wanna see who is “smarter’???
= Heck yeah! How do we play?
-Download this free app. Before, and during the down time of the game, it will ask us questions about what’s going to happen. But it will cost you $5.
= I don’t have $5
– No problem. I’ll put the $5 in for you. Just watch watch 25 15 sec adds, and we are good! $5 for 10 minutes of your time. Worth it?
= Awesome! I’m in.
The following week this young man has already gotten (only) 7 of his friends to play. All but one of them watches the adds. That “one” is rich and just buys them.
They all want to be the king of any game they play with their friends. And they don’t have to be athletic, or a genius.
How many of their friends, and friends of fiends, will be playing in 6 months (yeah, even in sports they never really watched before)?
Competition…the only ones who don’t like it are the ones who “know” they can’t win. I don’t see that being an issue here. Free competition with no cost.
= Oh yeah, kid. Save up enough tokens and you can play in a game with your favorite star!”
– No way! Awesome!
Then there is this:
Sports Bar Owner: Come in tonight, join our game, and the patron with the highest points gets (fill in anything). Think “Texas Holdem'” and how many play that for free for some small (or big sometimes) prize.
“No reason to play.”??? People play anything because they enjoy the competition… and enjoy having bragging rights. Sad, but true…
So, as an Affiliate, I’ve got my kids highs school and college friends, and some strangers I shared this with at a bar, playing and sharing it with others. I could sit back at this point and just collect my share (which will continue to grow for some time).
To give it six months to “try” it out would cost me $90. Wow… one less drink a night. If that is a bad risk for you, great! Thank your fiends for me for playing… they are under somebody!
= Heck yeah! How do we play?
It’s super easy Mr. Get Rich Quick. Here’s what you do, give me $40 upfront and $10/mo thereafter.
= Awesome! I’m in.
Then get your friends and family to do the same thing!
– No way! Awesome!
Thank your friends for me for playing… they are under somebody!
Mate, I know it will. Would you like a bag of popcorn also ??
We can watch it together, come tumbling down.
Fellas, I have a far better proposal for you, a proposal that puts money back in your pocket immediately!
All these United Slick Willys here have to offer is is hype, lots and lots of hype. You know what I think? I think you’re smarter than that.
I think you can tell the difference between pie in the sky unbelievable get rich schemes and a sound financial play that I’m gonna offer you.
Here’s what you do. Let’s take that pile of money you were going to send to United Games and we’re going to put it into two equal piles.
The first pile you’re going to send to me. Now here’s where it gets complicated, so watch my hands.
I know what you’re thinking. You looking at the other pile ain’t ya? Wondering about it, right?. Guys I’ve been right there in your shoes and thinking the same thing — “Here comes the catch”.
I want you to listen to me carefully because you’re not gonna believe your ears. Guys, that other pile, the other half of the money? I’M GIVING IT TO YOU!.
Let me say it again. I’M GIVING IT TO YOU! Hell yes, it’s yours, do what you want with it.
You’re still suspicious aren’t you? Why on earth would I do that, just give you the other half? It makes no sense!?!?!?!
Friend, I’ll tell you why. I’m giving that money to you because I BELIEVE IN YOU!!! Yessir, I am making an investment in you.
Why? Because I know you are gonna bring in more recruits to our team. And you’ll be able to make them the same deal.
They send half to me and I invest the other half in them. Now who on Earth wouldn’t want that deal?
So does anyone know if there is a requirement on how long you have to stay in the affiliate program?
I mean, you would think get in, spend $30 upfront, stay in at 9.99 for 3-4 months to see if this thing has any legs, and if it does, you get paid, if it doesn’t, drop your affiliate status and stop paying and you’re out what, $60-$70?
Honesty, it sounds like if the general public likes the app and uses it, affiliates will be compensated, but if the app doesn’t generate enough play w/ the public and only affiliates are playing, short run. Just my 2 cents worth.
It’s official. The app blows. Told ya.
youtube.com/watch?v=2OrLtfeFEzo
For nothing but points, that looks like an awful lot of work. You’ve pretty much got no time to watch the game itself.
Here is my .02 on it. Yes i am an affiliate. I work a normal 9-5. Do this is my spare time. I have found it pretty easy with social media, and various websites to attract players and have been able to sign up 11 affiliate directly below me.
This is after about a month of doing this. Right now I have over 40 people in my tier 1 and 70+ total under me.
Will this app flop? I don’t know
Will it go viral like they are promoting? I have no idea.
Anyone who says yes to either of those is just making an assumption because noone knows.
Experts fail all that time at predicting stocks,sports,movie revenue etc. No one goes into anything expecting to fail. But they all believe in the cause no matter what it is.
So yes.. I may in 2 months time be saying well that didnt work out and be out $40-$50 bucks (yes you can cancel anytime) and some free time that i spent promoting it. That is the absolute worse case scenario that i’m facing and can live with that.
So great, someone made some coin off me and others.. Sounds like whats happens to the consumer in our everyday lives anyway when we go to movies, ballparks, casinos etc.
Question is… can you live with the fact that you knew about this app.. You laughed and mocked it. The Affiliate window is now closed. And now people are making thousands of dollars off of it a week.
I know I couldnt.
Best wishes to those involved. To those that are not. You better hope your right.
^^ So you got in because of “fear of loss” and have “no idea” about the viability of the business itself.
Yeah no, sounds like a totally solid business decision. You’re exactly who United Games want on board.
Seeing as the app hasn’t launched yet, the only source of revenue entering United Games is affiliate fees.
If the people “making thousands of dollars” a week are doing so by collecting fees from recruited affiliates, that’s a pyramid scheme.
Folks aren’t being paid (or billed) yet.
Natalyn Lewis just (yesterday) held a somewhat snippy sounding lack of update, update call. She can not say how much a token will cost or how their freemium advertising model will work, the details are always in flux and any answer she gave right now would almost certainly change by the time the app launches.
They are already a week and a half past their projected launch date with perhaps as much as a month before it’s currently expected to do so and they still have a whole lot left to on the game.
Perhaps more interesting they’re rejargoning their player rewards (the points you win when playing the game) system. They seem to fear that directly tying performance in the game to a points reward system would come too close to gambling.
I have no earthly idea what they mean by that but it doesn’t sound good. One quote was that “UG can not tie rewards to predictions.” WTF!!! That was the sole focus of the gameplay in your demo video. That was how the game worked. And they can’t do it any more???
They’re pitching this now like a “loyalty rewards” kind of deal. You get a card at a sandwich shop and for every sandwich you buy, they punch your card and your tenth sandwich is free.
That’s just bound to go viral. Pokemon Go, get out of the way, we have a loyalty rewards app with participation points only it’s a game and it will get your competitive juices flowing.
If they can’t tie rewards to predictions I question how they will tie rewards to anything resembling a skill. It’s a game after all, if you can’t win it by being a more skilled player what kind of game are we talking about?
And it looks like we’ll just have to wait for when the app launches to see for ourselves because if they told us now, all the details would probably change between now and then.
(I think they’re quoting Rippln.)
(Ozedit: Offtopic derail attempts removed)
And no, They have not collected a penny and legally can not until the app launches.
If the Affiliates are right and this is a success using their definition of success, then this will be the first successful MLM in history. That alone would be an epic accomplishment.
People making $1000’s lots of places.
Just that going in with this so called app.
Sounds like you love to gamble away your free time now and after the app launches.. But do show us how many are really making the $1000’s from this app a week.
I think you would be looking at the owners not the players.
How does it feel to be part of the joke people are laughing at really?
Since you won’t be the only one going broke using this app.
And yet you also wrote…
This is comedy gold.
There is a zero percent chance this will ever get significant user adoption. PrePlay Sports, for example, had the exact same idea, raised a ton of money around it and forged partnerships with the broadcasters themselves..and where are they now?
So you’re telling me that an app with worse game play, with zero broadcast or legitimate partnerships, one that is delayed, one that looks and feels like a pyramid scheme, with questionable management is going to do better, several weeks after the actual season has started?
Idiots. You deserve to lose your money. UG may be a fraud with pathetic, incompetent thieves at it’s core, but you all are the ones who are enabling it.
Oh Man! Talk about a turd in the punchbowl, lawdy! Go on and google it for yourselves you greedy grubbing goobs. UG is identical to PrePlay except the MLM feature.
Pregame trivia, call the play, earn points, get rankings, convert your points for crappy prizes.
There revenue sources were ads/sponsors and premium play purchases from players. They raised $8M and had exclusive deals with NHL and MLB.
The app was live from 2011 – 2015 and generated 50 million play predictions. Doing some back of the envelope calcs, that looks to be around 50,000 players (50M / 5 years / 200 predictions per year per player).
Here’s a demo of their app. Look familiar?
youtube.com/watch?v=dHVGKE0BF3A
It’s hard to believe that UG didn’t know about this or that nobody has pointed it out to them. And yet they have all of you believing they are the first to attempt this.
I don’t know why they bothered building an app since they could have bought this one instead. It’s actually a cooler looking app too.
So, who wants to step up to the plate and explain why UG is going to be mo betta? Anyone?
So you’re not treating it as a business, but as a “gamble”. Is that right?
So I found a video of PrePlay CEO Andrew Daines providing some interesting perspective after having been in this exact same space for four years. He said their player base was 20,000 – 30,000 per game and that their revenue per player was $8.50 per year.
When asked if there were people who just didn’t like the game he said “Most people don’t like the game, that their target market was the niche intersection of someone who is both a hardcore gamer and a hardcore sports fan.
If you didn’t catch that fairly significant observation, here it is again in slow motion and loud volume
MOST PEOPLE DO NOT LIKE THE GAME
youtu.be/ePJsTOR8L10?t=8m03s
I would say Yes, It’s a gamble. At this point I have not even invested a penny into it. Hardly a business for me.
Some of you guys are thinking way to hard about this and your comments are funny. (Ozedit: Offtopic derail attempt removed)
Again.. Not one of you has answered. For something that is destined to fail like you predict. A lot of you can not step away from this page for some reason. Something keeps bringing you back. What is it?
I don’t know much about preplay. Never even heard about it. Maybe that’s why they failed. Because nobody knew who they were.
Did they have affiliates? Were people being “paid” to spread word through social media? Saying preplay didn’t work so United Games wont is like saying Atari went out of business so Nintendo has no chance.
Maybe just maybe UG learned from the mistakes of others and corrected them with this app. Nah.. Never mind. What am i thinking?
Have a good day Ladies and Gents
You’re not thinking. Gambling does not require thinking. It just require your wallet.
So why do YOU keep coming back trying to explain your thoughts about UG, while you argue for not thinking? Your actions do not match your words. Any cognitive dissonance “up there”?
You are not thinking, or you are thinking like a child.
The reason you don’t give a fuck is that you’re playing with pennies and you give no more thought to what you are doing than if you were to toss some spare change into a wishing well … except this is not anything as benign as that.
These schemes are criminal enterprises that not only take your money but launder other money along with it…billions of dollars annually when aggregated together, courtesy of twits like you.
You and the other self-styled “gamblers” are funding things you do not understand or even know about while the promoters are laughing at your gullibility.
I’m done in the back and forth games with those not interested in the app. Best of luck to all of you in whatever it is your into.
(Ozedit: recruitment spam removed)
There is a a worthwhile psychology and economics study right here real time that somebody should be analyzing.
Humans are inherently risk averse. And yet here we have a surprising lack of risk aversion. An absence actually with the aversion door welded shut.
I’ve been working on a hypothesis but it continues to shift. And now with this latest denial I need to rethink my hypothesis.
There is something very interesting going on here that is not normal behavior. Kinda like the Trump phenomenon has the pundits flummoxed.
I need to ponder this some more. This is very interesting indeed.
++++++++++++++++++
To answer Joe Bob’s question, I can only speak for myself, but I used was approached by a friend who gave me the pitch to which I said hell no and tried to convince him to just walk away which he has done now that he realizes he sucks as a sales guy (most people do) .
But I was interested in it and kept researching it and analyzing because I used to do this sort of work professionally as a Financial Dude: evaluate business cases, help structure and model business ventures, perform S&P credit analysis of prospects, perform due dilli, analyze proposals, analyze start ups, financial support for deal development on massive contacts starting at $50M up to $1B was the largest I ever worked on.
I was the guy who did the leg work for the C-Levvel executives to make it easier for them to do their job….make decisions. I still find that analysis interesting. And occasionally looking out for guys like you actually.
The other thing that is appealing is you learn a lot about markets, emerging trends, new technologies and so forth and it makes more sense because you have some context with which to apply it and conjecture on your own. .
For example, in this case I’ve come to know a really interesting emerging market that I’ll call “experience enhancement”. It’s sort of an augmentation to experience using technology (not VR), overlaying or layering on top of an experience that then provides for an even deeper experience.
This dealeo is not that. This is exploiting the experience to divert attention to a a different experience. competing in a separate game.
An experience enhancement would be an audio feed from the huddle and from the coaches making calls from the sidelines and data feeds on all the players so you get to a more intimate personal level with everyone involved which makes it a far more intimate experience. The guessing game app is a distraction.
This experience enhancement space is shaping up to be a DOH! opportunity. Like Facebook was the first time you examined it,. or the Uber model.
Those are classic DOH! business models where the opportunity is so compelling and obvious and was staring all of us in the face but we were unable to see it. But as soon as they were revealed, it was DOH!.
This dealeo is not a DOH! btw. It’s more of a Ohhhhhh…
@Joe Haven’t had a good dummy spit in a while. Cheers.
A gamble that you might be participating in a potentially illegal pyramid scheme, or a gamble that you might lose money?
I had to look that one up. Glad I did.
I nuked pretty much all of it but he went on a bit of a rant and then threw in a recruitment pitch. Cheeky bugger.
Yeah, that is a good one.
So I’ve run into the Number One UG recruiter who has signed up 800 so far and a guy with 500 whom I guessing s Number 2 recruiter. Both of these guys are slimeballs. Greedy money grubbing creeps.
I was surprised the numbers are that low. I would have guessed the number one slot having…? I dunno, in the thousands at least, not hundreds.
My guess is that the total is 10-15,000. Fairly underwhelming given the amount of hype.
I’m particularly amused with the growth and revenue assumptions. Number 1 recruiter is telling people that if all they do is get 10 players, they will make $18,000/mo.
He doesn’t do the math but rattles off that if those 10 bring in 5 new players each and those 50 bring in 4 each and those 200 bring in 3,. then 2… Presto $18,000
I added up the number of players, 4,000, and pointed out that to generate $180,000 in revenue the ARPU (average revenue per user) would have to be $45 per month. Right now the industry ARPU is $22 per year.
Number 2 recruiter is telling people that it is “mathematically” possible to start with 10 players and grow to one million. And at $50/mo per player, that’s $5 million in commissions. He then says that’s probably not likely but it it is possible.
One kid I kinda feel sorryy for because you can tell he’s just a regular guy and he’s just overjoyed that his ship has come in.
He went out and bought a big whiteboard so he could map it all out and prove to himself it was for real and didn’t have any holes and then proudly made a video.
He worked out a slam dunk scenario on his new white board with the assumption of 100 contacts producing 5 players. Then it would grow at 5X. But he screwed it up right from the get go by growing at 100X and rolled that four times ending up with a potential pool of 5,000,000 contacts and assumed 5% of those become players yielding 250,000
His eyes sparkled as he laid out this ultra conservative assumption: “If each player bought, acquired, or played JUST ONE TOKEN PER MONTH per month, that’s $250,000 in revenue.”
Then to demonstrate his command of the deal and commission plan, he points to his commission table he had put together earlier on his just-bought, brand new white board (the big bidness white board) “Now those are all Tier 1 Players and that generates 10% commission and that works out to $25,000 a month and that’s not a bad deal”.
He nods his head given it his fair-play, square-deal of approval. Then says if you get 4 Affiliates to do the same thing, that’s $100,000 a month in commissions (it isn’t,. he screwed that up too). Every step in his commission calc was wrong.
So I posted a comment pointing out his math error and worked it out correctly, step by step, using his own assumptions and it came to $78/mo in commissions. He took his video down.
If you don’t know dick about this industry, the assumptions being tossed around sound conservative and believable.
For example, their model assumes 100% conversion of people signed will download the app. Every download equals a 100% engaged player, in other words they will play along with the app for every game there is. And every player will spend or generate ad revenue every single month. Then each of these Super Players will recruit five to ten more Super Player clones and those recruit 5-10 more each and they recruit and so forth out to infinity.
The recruiting happens automatically. You never lose players and it never stops growing. You OWN your players for eternity.
Every single one of those assumptions is bullshit. The average downloaded game is partially played once and dumped. Only 16% will play the app more than twice.
In terms of engagement, even the Heroin of apps, Facebook, only commands 30% engagement. As far as every player spending money, 50% of industry revenue comes from just 1% of players. The vast majority spend NOTHING.
But before you even get that far into the model, there is an even bigger assumption that is just taken as a given.
It’s beyond optimistic, it’s wildly unrealistic — the app is gonna go viral and will be as as big or bigger than any game app before it. Even though no one in “management team” save one has any experience whatsoever in this space. Even though it’s been tried before and failed.
Apologies for the long post….a lot to cover.
Can someone please explain the math. Can see 1000 members making $18000 grand a month.
Sure. Here’s the equations:
1) Huge Number of Players * Lots of Money Spent Per Player Per Month = Huge Revenue Number
2) Huge Revenue Number * 10% Commission = Ridiculous Monthly Income For Doing Nothing
But it’s more fun to start with how much money you want to make. How about $25K/mo? Here’s how you do it.
$25,000/10% = $250,000 Revenue Required
$250,000 / $5 spent per player = 50,000 players required
or you could do few players who are big spenders
$250,000 / 10 players = $25,000 spent per player per month
Either one get’s you $25,000/month commissions.
EASY MONEY
The scammers already convinced him by taking advantage of his cognitive biases, and there are too many to list:
Ikea effect, ambiguity effect, avaiailability bias, bandwagon effect, belief bias, cheerleader effect, choice-supportive bias, confirmation bias, belief revision conservatism, continued influence effect, distinction bias, DUnning-Kruger effect, endowment effect, expectation bias, focusing effect, barnum effect, framing effect, gambler’s fallacy, hot-hand fallacy, identifiable victim effect, ilusion of validity, illusion of control, information bias, sunk cost fallacy, mere exposure effect, neglect of probability, normalcy bias, omission bias, optimism bias, ostrich effect, overconfidence effect, Peltzman effect, selective perception, Semmelweis reflex, status quo bias, subjective validation, survivorship bias.
Is there an actual launch date for the app yet? That is IF the app even exists.
What are the chances they’ve tried to sign up as many affiliates as possible with no intention of ever releasing a working app?
Though I suppose if – as they claim – they’ve taken no money yet, they’ll have to release SOMETHING in order to bill their affiliates.
To their credit they are not billing or paying people until the app launches. There are very specific rules about when a credit card is billed and how long after that the goods/services paid for, must be provided.
If a credit card company saw enough “I paid with my card but it’s been X weeks and the product hasn’t arrived” complaints it could very well damage UG’s ability to use credit/debit cards. Thus far they’ve been smart enough not to take that risk.
So the app will launch, probably in the next month (or so) but we are lacking anything like a clear picture of what it will be like when it does get here.
I’m still kinda blown away by Natalyn Lewis and her “UG can not tie rewards to predictions” quote from last week.
The gameplay in their demo video was 100% rewarding players for correct predictions only now they say they can not do that.
But doesn’t changing that change pretty much everything?
If they are no longer tying rewards to predictions we are no longer talking about the game they pitched to affiliates in Las Vegas last month. UG has a few more weeks to invent a brand new one, more or less out of whole cloth.
I think they will probably change it so the points you earn are purely cosmetic, for the ‘leagues’ where you compete against people.
Prizes will probably be gifted -if they still exist- as a loyalty reward for spending enough tokens, like someone else theorised earlier in the thread.
just came across a youtube video by a dustin mitchell who is suing united games? what is all this about? i am not going to get rich now.
Dustin Mitchell is suing UG? So that’s what that 24/7 sideshow in search of a circus is up to these days. I wonder how his lawsuit against Dubli turned out?
He’s also planning on launching his own sports gaming / income opportunity app and to show us his mastery of all things technical Dustin will launch his on the Blackberry.
Brilliant thinking right there.
Too bad their primary focus is on the NFL, which almost no-one outside the US give a flying *(^% about or lives in a suitable timezone to play along in real time.
Considering they claim to have affiliates in 200 countries already it would make far more sense if their primary focus was on soccer as they’d have about 5-billion more potential app users following 100’s of regional leagues across the planet.
Then again, the gaming model would probably be even more dull:
Next stoppage in play is for A) Foul, B) Goal, C) Corner Kick, D) Throw in.
Next shot on goal will be for A) home team B) away team.
Pretty hard to get excited about!
There’s only two real main possible results which reminds me of Pascal’s Wager.
Here’s the two main possible outcomes:
1) The App is a total flop
2) The App is a huge hit
From what I’ve seen of the App, it doesn’t grab me so I reckon 99% chance it will be a flop.
Ignoring the mlm arguments, and treating this as I do with other investments, if United Games were to offer me 1,000 shares as an angel investor for $50, I’d take it. I’d also expect to lose. But if I’m wrong, then brilliant.
And that’s Pascal’s Wager… If I’m wrong and it’s a hit, I win big, if I’m right and it is a flop, I hardly lose anything.
Seems like a sensible wager to take to me. Clearly others will disagree. That’s the whole point of a chat forum. (Ozedit: Offtopic derail attempt removed)
Business shouldn’t be a wager. Especially not an MLM business.
Going into an MLM opportunity and “ignoring MLM” is dumbassery.
So does an affiliate earn commission only when people that are in their “tiers” purchase or earn tokens?
They earn commission anytime anyone in their tiers use tokens in the app, watches an ad, purchases tokens and 20% check match from tier 1 affiliates below them.
AN AFFILIATE IN ONE OF HIS VIDEOS STATED THERE WERE 300,000 AFFILIATES. THAT COMES OUT TO 300,000 X $40= $12,000,000 DOLLARS UG WILL MAKE THE DAY THE APP COME OUT ON 10/11/2016. PLUS 300,000 X $10= $3,000,000 DOLLARS A MONTH JUST FROM THE AFFILIATES.
FOR AN AFFILIATE TO EARN $90 A MONTH. UG WOULD HAVE TO SELL $300,000,000. IN TOKENS.
THE COMMISSION IF AT A 10% PAY BACK IS $30,000,000. DIVIDE BY 300,000 AFFILIATES COMES TO $100-$10 TECH FEE = $90 FOR AN AFFILIATE PAY OUT. WILL THE MARKET SPEND $300 MILLION A MONTH.
IF SO THEN UG WOULD NEED A HUGE ACCOUNTANT FIRM JUST TO COUNT, SELL AND PAYOUT THE COMMISSIONS. WHO IS THE CONTROLLER.
THE MARKET WILL BE THE AFFILIATES BUYING THE TOKENS WILL 10% COMING BACK TO THEM. IF THE APP FAILS IN 3 MONTHS BECAUSE THE NFL WILL CLOSE IT DOWN THEN UG WOULD HAVE EARN $24,000.000 FROM THE AFFILIATES.
Let me help you out “who cares”. If I have one hundred people in my tier 1. All of those players Acquire 1 FREE token a day.
Every token is worth .010 so thats $10 a day for 30 days. Thats $300 a month. This does not include the end of month check match nor the tokens when they actually are spent.
Now what if I have 200 active tier 1 members that avg 2 tokens a day? $1,200.
Your doing math for 300k affiliates. I’m doing math for 1 (me).
I have affiliates under me that have 0 people under them. I also have affiliates that have dozens.
Advertisers are paying the tokens. Not UG. Advertisers pay UG to run ads. We watch the ads and earn a token for doing so. You know just like pretty much all other apps you play these days.
Do you think those ads run free? Of course not. They are paying the app creators to run. Everytime you watch an ad on youtube,an app etc someone is getting paid. Welcome to 2016
Hello all, this has definitely been an interesting read. I can see both sides of the discussion and agree as a UG affiliate with the “no big loss fees” to try something that has potential of being a hit. I also share some of the concerns of those who question the legitimacy of UG.
My younger brother, who is a natural salesman told me about UG. I signed up after he sent me a link with a code that is tied into his affiliate number. That is how the company tracks who is signed up and how the affiliates are paid.
It was easy to sign up. List my name, address, phone number, credit card number and favorite sports team. Read the terms and agreements that also stated that I would not be charged the 29.99 until the day the app is released.
That was early August and still no charge to my card. Checked my credit and nothing has been opened under my name either.
It hasn’t been easy to get people signed up and spark an interest especially since the football season has already started! I agree, they missed the mark on that by pushing back the launch date.
I’m not even concentrating on signing up affiliates. I have 3 and that’s fine. I’ll get 10% off of whatever they do, but that isn’t where the money really is. It is in the players!
I agree also, it is a big if there is the possibility of a want to play vs a need to play. You have to find sports nuts who are very competitive.
Also, players are 13 and older. Affiliates are 18 and older. Players don’t make money off of other players and starting out they won’t be able to invite other players. Only affiliates can send invites to players and other affiliates.
It’s not exhausting like Amway or NuSkin because you aren’t selling any products. You are sharing a free app! It doesn’t cost anything to play on a beginner level.
Yes, you can purchase coins 1 coin = $1.00. Affiliates get paid 10% of each dollar (yes, very small-that sucks!) Affiliates get paid 10% every time a player watches an ad or participates in a survey.
Now, I love to play bejeweled and wsop poker on FB. I watch ads all the time to earn coins. Someone is making money every time I watch those ads!!
I’ve seen the video for UG app demo and it is easy to follow. Yes, I’ve had concerns about a lag time and real time play. I know that there will be glitches when it launches and there is a possibility that the site will crash just like p-go did.
I don’t think it’s fair that the affiliates don’t get a percentage of the initial one time fee upfront charge, nor do they get a percentage of the 9.99 monthly fee. So, yeah the people in the main office will have a huge pay day the day the app releases (if it releases).
That thought is what really bothers me! They have moved the date twice! Also, we have been told that the first checks will be mailed out Nov 10th 2016.
You have seen the pay scenario and yes you have to think big to get paid big. You have to get people excited about the app and playing it. Who knows, it might start out like gang busters and fall off as soon as the superbowl ends if they haven’t set up the app to ready players for the next pro sport (basketball).
The app will also become available for download on the app store and google play. Those downloads and new players are suppose to be distributed equally among the affiliates.
I have 3 affiliates and 2 players.
Guess I won’t make much at the launch..lol. Oh well, gotta start somewhere.
At least I don’t have to go buy a new outfit and go to a weekly prep meeting! I can sit in my comfy recliner after work and send out invites from my phone.
If it goes viral, cool. If not, it really isn’t a big deal to me. I’ll cancel my affiliate status and cancel my credit card.
The only protection I have with my investment is that it is on my credit card and protected by fraud insurance. Plus, I can easily cancel my card and get it replaced if after there is a charge and no app is launched.
My other concern is that there is a potential trojan virus attached to the “locker room” on the affiliate site that I access on my phone or my ipad. Someone who is tracking my every keystroke and seeing everything I do.
I’m not trying to get rich quick, but I do see potential in this app to make some extra money with little effort and expense. If it happens it happens, if not that’s okay too.
Thank you to the people in this feed that are trying to protect us from ourselves. There is no need for name calling or talking down to people for wanting to try something.
Now you see why I’m on the fence 🙂 and proceeding with caution. Have a good evening everyone!
(Ozedit: Repost without caps please.)
Yep you and everyone else has the same exact idea. Yet what if it does not go viral for years and you cancel?
or if it never goes viral and you never really promoted? Either way seems like a loss for you.
Odds are the owners are the ones running to the bank while you want to wait for it to go viral.
There is no free lunch.
I haven’t figured out why the creators of what is supposed to be a sure financial windfall chose to share the money with affiliates?
If this thing is going to make billions of dollars, why give some of it away?
So they don’t have to advertise? It’s 2016. If this app does what they claim it’ll take one commercial to get it downloaded on every sport nuts phone.
And then there’s the monthly fee. Very slick.
One comment said “$10 a month is a joke”. I disagree. $10 a month, times 12 months, times who knows how many affiliates and the good guys at UG don’t need the app to be successful. They just need their monthly fees.
I’m not saying it’s a scam, but it’s suspect in my book. I’ve never seen a company share their profits except with employees. And I’ve never seen employees have to pay a fee to get paid.
Big E… affiliates are not employees of ug. they are self employ independent contractors.
it would have cost them less in advertising cost then paying affiliates commission.
why made this a mlm business model. the customer base are the affiliates. they are the players of the app. which mean the affiliates will be the people buying most of the tokens.
No you won’t. Not immediately you won’t. UG will be spinning the hype non stop, success is just around the corner, and you’ll hang on.
“What the hell” you’ll say. “It’s just $10/mo”. You’ll stick around a year easy. And you’ll play the game and buy tokens.
It will feel like you’re putting money back in your own pocket by giving the app a little boost and $50/mo in tokens is peanuts. “Besides I like the game” you’ll convince yourself although none of you friends want to play it.
You’re into it for probably a grand before it’s all said and done. You are the customer, make no mistake.
if there are no more technical delays the app will come out end of October. but still,as of the video on 10/07/2016, they do not know the price of a token or how many free ones i can get from the advertisers.
the cost of playing a game is going to make this app work or not. i have to buy all my promotional materials like posters and business cards from ug.
i want to see the prices i have to pay for this stuff. i can save money by copying this stuff on my school printer.
even if the game is 100% fun, i don’t know how much my players will spend each month. these players i sign up like my college friends are just plainly broke.
Love this thread… Thanks to Oz and Marvin for keeping it all sensible. And “marin”? For bring everything all down to pure mathematics.
As the owner of an app review website, I can tell you that everything depends on the quality of the app and whether the “fun” of playing it converts to engagement, retention and expenditure, be it watching ads or buying coupons.
If it’s an interactive experience then maybe it will have some success, if an interruption then certainly not.
Any developer acquires users through channels by either earning them, owning them or paying for them. As this app isn’t live yet, the app is gearing itself to the 2nd and 3rd option. The ROI on those channels is 100% dependent on the quality of the app.
This all impacts on the expected revenues for the affiliates. The end users will either be almost only those within the circle or will go viral, and I use the word “viral” in it’s original meaning and not the overused hype version. If it spreads by word of mouth then it’s viral. Having a cold and giving it to everyone you meet won’t mean the whole world will have a cold by the weekend.
From a business point of view, the fact that there is nothing of any significance from the company raises so many red flags. People can make their own decisions after knowing this. Oz is correct. Business is not a 100% gamble but is a calculated gamble. So far there is nothing to base any decisions on. Nothing real. Only hype.
We have been approached several times from recruiters with the “get in before it’s too late” crap. My site could get 10,000 downloads a month for the app but can’t promote it until we see if it’s any good.
The response is “too late then” which makes me laugh. Our obligation is to our readers, not to an affiliate looking to make money from an app he hasn’t used.
@whocares who said UG has 300,000 affiliates? has an official number of affiliates been announced?
that is a huge number of marketers competing to sign up free players.
@Jack. It must be just hype but if true then it’s 300,000 affiliates getting 100 users each totaling 30,000,000.
Seems we need the whole world to watch American football AND engaging with the games through the app AND spending a lot of money or watching ads 24/7 for anyone other than UG to make any money.
30,000 would be an expected number as @Marvin has pointed out and that’s a long way from 30,000,000.
Some serious flaws in the approach.
1. No soft testing.
2. As yet, no app.
3. Very late for this season.
4. Almost no real proposal other than “go sign up other affiliates”.
5. Changing of rules before the ink has fully dried on the previous set.
Today is the last day for affiliate sign-ups. After that they are telling everyone to clean up any reference of money making opportunity online that you may have.
They are then going to release the app name and release all of the new marketing info with it on it and do a complete re-brand. We will then create our own unique codes we can share under the new name.
To those that are involved best of luck to you.
To those that are not and do nothing but troll. Look forward to earning money off of you when you play.
Oh and BTW, Some low end t-shirt company called Under Armour is a sponsor. Not sure if anyone has heard of them before.
Hey Joe, you better read this from Natalyn. (Oh and BTW, Some low end t-shirt company called Under Armour is a sponsor. Not sure if anyone has heard of them before).
I wouldn’t mind betting United Games extend the affiliate sign-up period.
A lot of people have touted the fact that UG has a breakthrough app on their hands. With big name sponsors and everything.
That may very well be the case. But that does not translate into affiliates making money necessarily.
It would translate into UG making money, but the rest will be on their own.
A lot of MLM companies have good products. I think that’s a prerequisite of any legal (successful) business.
You may be right JohnH.. The affiliates are making a last ditch effort to get people to sign up.
They could care less that if those people do sign up at the last minute, they won’t be able to recruit affiliates under them.
This message from United Games corporate shows EXACTLY the kind of Hype and misinformation that is going on.
I know people who are already quitting their jobs over this yet no money has even exchanged hands. They have no idea how much money they are really going to make yet they think they are already millionaires.
When I first heard of UG I thought it sounded like a great opportunity. But the more I watched, the more disheartened I got.
The final straw was the whole “Pause” thing. Why? Just to create fear of loss? It really does screw over anyone else coming in the future. That’s no way to build a business.
The other thing that really has me frustrated is that the whole premise of the game is to “guess” what will happen next. That really only can happen in Football.
Basketball moves way too quickly. And soccer has NOTHING to guess. What are you going to bet on? That someone gets a red card or scores a goal? Totally worthless.
I know there is a ton of money to made in the app world. Pokemon Go is the perfect example. But that game can be played anytime, anywhere at leisure.
Whatever they call this new UG game, it will only have appeal a couple of times a week for a few hours, and at times of the day that only work in the USA.
I once had hope, but I can see now that it is just a terrible idea that will implode after the first few months. That is really too bad.
(Ozedit: See quoted email in comment #156)
Voicing an opinion doesn’t constitute trolling. Almost all comments that are negative towards the app and the concept are sensible words of caution.
Of course there is a lot of cynicism, but considering it’s all hype up to this point it’s justifiable I feel.
If they have 300,000 affiliates or anything close to that then the downloads will be phenomonal but the retention ratio is crucial in it’s long term success and the earnings of the affiliates.
@Disappointed. That’s sad to hear, and preventing situations like that is what threads like this, and the responsible comments here try to avoid.
That the United Games website is nothing more than a landing page is almost criminal behavior, having started this hype and thinking that an email to their Affiliates is the right course of action rather than having a FAQ page or blog on the site to allay any fears.
The maths are wrong. With 300,000 affiliates chasing an addessable market of so much smaller than 60,000,000 worldwide people leaves at most, an average of 200 players per affiliate.
By not using this nonsense approach of “if only 100 people spend $250 a month” and using more realistic figures closer to those experienced before such as $22 a month then 200 players would spend $4,400 a month for let’s say 6 months of the year.
So, you need to find 200 engaged players in American Football/Basketball/Baseball which probably means you need to invite 2,000+ people, or 4,000 to get a 12 month user base if Soccer and Cricket works.
I use these numbers as a template but you can edit to suit your own expectations. The reality is that to acquire these users would be a full time job earning you probably $400 – $500 a month.
One item that has been sorely overlooked is that Apple charge 30% of all purchases made within an app. Free apps aren’t exactly free.
Watching ads may earn a player $1 a week and I’m being generous.
Good luck Joe.
@teirnan not exactly, i got 10 schools in my area with more then 2200 signups already and it took me exactly 3 weeks to peddle my broshures from school to school so i beg to differ.. Its about working smarter and not harder.
@Henry. There’s no doubt that people will sign up. In this situation you are working smarter but also this rate is unsustainable. Facebook show ads sooner to their high convertors, thereafter, the cost of a download increases as the audience thins.
So for 3 weeks work, 2,200 signups, maybe 220 players paying $22 a month for 3 months totals $1,452 this year and I would guess $726 next year giving a LTV of $9.90 per engaged player.
I use 2 years as the life time value of a user as either people will get bored with it or if, although I doubt it, the game is a huge success, by next season a competitor will enter the market with a better product.
So for 3 weeks worth, $1,452 is your income, less $150 costs PLUS whatever other surprises come your way like having to buy merchandise and tools etc. Discounting those, I optimistically estimate your pay is $1,300 for the 3 weeks work although my estimates are very high compared to normal retention rates for apps. Flappy birds, due to it’s addictive nature, is not a good comparison.
I genuinely hope you make a good income from it, I am posting these comments here as it’s the only site I found that wasn’t a pseudo recruitment site for downline affilates I could find. and the claims made by recruiters are possibly fraudulent but certainly misleading, considering that it is an investment proposition.
@Henry… I assume these are players and not affiliates depending if they are in high school or college.
You sign them up as players but the app has not been launched. You have your unique code already.
I always thought when the app is launches thru itune people would download the app. The players you sign up would download the app thru your code?
I would keep working handing out post card size advertisements. Except now I have to use United Games official ones.
Like I said on an earlier post of mine. College kids have no money. High school kids would need to use their parent credit card. Why would the advertisers paid these kids to watch an add for a token?
Still don’t know, how much is a token? How many tokens to play a game? Will the affiliates have to buy so many tokens a month to play along?
Like everything success will depend on cost to the consumers. Only United Games knows how many affiliates there are and how many players. That information will never be told like in all MLM.
The affiliates are told very little. Only clean up the web sites and follow orders given them and a good credit card or you are out.
Good read. Thanks everyone.
Also, with united games releasing the app, then not billing OR allowing a refund within 15 days what is the risk.
To m3, it sounds like you will have a chance to experience the app first hand and make an educated decision.
This deal just keeps on getting worse, you can no longer say that players can win prizes (prizes are a naughty word):
youtu.be/BOjFKE2t1nE?t=41m4s
There is a loyalty rewards program (like Visa Skymiles) but players are going to pay to play the game for the same reason people pay to play Clash of Clans or Candy Crush.
There will be no rewards for winning the game other than the pleasure of winning the game. You know, like Pokemon.
No wonder they’re in no bleeding hurry to release the app, near everything they’ve been saying about it for six+ months is no longer going to be true.
Except that this will be a viral smash hit and affiliates are going to be rich of course.
Of course.
It’s Simple, If this app is fun it will make a lot of people a lot of money. If it sucks it will be forgotten about and only the people collecting the monthly fee will make money.
All the breakdowns and pros/cons are pretty irrelevant.
Fun app = $$
Bad App = no $$
From what I have seen of the app it looks fun and something I will enjoy playing. Maybe i’m in the minority though.
Fact is this app will be released no matter how many people want to try and take shots at it.
I am glad to have found this site. It’s near impossible find a similar forum elsewhere or discuss concerns with the converted. I want the assumptions that have been accepted by myself and others to be challenged in a constructive and thoughtful way.
For example, I accepted the lack of information from head office without complaint but am realizing more and more and especially through this forum how it is putting me and others at a disadvantage. We are expected to make decisions without adequate information and it’s actually pretty manipulative if you think about it.
There is a lot of talk here about the $30/40 launch fee etc. and that is valid but what is of a higher cost is the amount of time that affiliates have invested (not to mention additional advertising and website costs) and without yet knowing enough to warrant that investment.
I’ve heard that drink coasters, table ads, business cards and other items will be available for purchase directly from UG for promotional use.
Do companies sell these to their associates at cost or do they look to make a profit off such items? I wonder if I’ll be forced to buy this kind of stuff?
Also, does it sound like UG has a partnership with UA or are they merely buying product for resale to their associates? Again, I wonder if I’ll be forced to buy this stuff?
I’ve been lucky that I’ve signed up numerous sports bars, civic organizations and youth teams. I’m either going to make some money or I’ll have a lot of questions to answer.
Good for you @RamFanLR. My feeling is that sports bars and orgs are/were the way to go because I think that players will need to be prompted to play… either by invites or with special events… and I think UG knows that… thus the additional ‘invite commission’ and fundraising model.
Unfortunately, I believed the bad math and viral expectations of the player-only model and decided to focus on that.
It sounds as though we have to buy all ‘material’ from UG. I expect it to be retail and another source of income for UG… otherwise would they not have said? Not happy about that.
When i heard about “partnering” with UA I was cautious to jump on that wagon. My other business team has UA gear.
We submitted our Logo to a Sports Shop and the info was printed on shirts, bags, shirts etc. We pay what i believe is cost from the shop – no mark-up from founders to team members
UA pays (Sponsors) colleges to wear their gear. The same goes for Steph Curry.
I’d say you are NOT FORCED to purchase anything marketing related. BUT if you do want company approved material go through them. You could get an official card/table topper/ flier and photoshop/edit your info in.
There are 2 packages already created letting you know what comes in it and a price.
Exactly – focus on the app. I know when i was building my APP i thought how would i make money. Mine was for corporate sales so i decided put it in sales peoples hands and take a percentage of their sales if there was demonstrated increase in sales people revenue.
Another idea was a renting or licensing fee. Sounds like most people here would say why do i have to pay for this technology…
Sorry for the side track – IF the app does MORE than play calling – Say a game to play while bored (candy crush / pokemon) while your sport is not being played, could be good for user engagement and retention.
Remember dev is saying you are being shown 1/16th of the apps features.
@Joe
Mmm. I feel it is relevant to those here, that do not have their minds made up, who are deciding whether to invest more time, money, energy, their reputations… to decide whether UG is conducting business in a forthright manner and deserves our trust.
The wait and see method isn’t likely to be a winning strategy with this business structure.
This program is closed and further discussion is irrelevant.
Why irrelevant. UGM users might want to know that totally random person trying to get them to use the app has a financial incentive for doing so.
It’s not like the MLM business opportunity ceased to exist just because ya’ll stopped promoting it.
As @Oz points out, the relevance continues. With the American football season well underway and the app not yet released, affiliates will soon be having to consider a new set of issues:-
1. How to get players for the other sports , if any
2. If not, then will the $9.99 a month be worth it while waiting for next year’s season.
3. Any other surprises from UG
Many questions remain.
The app has not yet been released.
The current affiliates have not yet been charged and can still pull out, and will continue to have the option of cancelling monthly payments.
The affiliate pause will likely open again as new league versions of the app are released and app becomes more global, or for any other reason.
Do we know if United Games even have permission to associate themselves with or use the NFL (or any other professional league for that matter) name or logo?
@JohnH Good question. I seriously doubt it.
A couple months ago, at Buffalo Bills training camp, there were affiliates going around trying to sign people up. They were using official Bills logos on their sign up sheets.
It was obvious their intent was to give the impression that UG has a legitimate affiliation with the team and/or NFL. I’m pretty sure the NFL wouldn’t be too pleased about that.
@Connor, Natlyn Lewis spoke specifically about the affiliates that were doing this and said it is not allowed and needs to stop.
What is United Games waiting for? The App have been developed a long time ago. All the affiliates has signed up. No more new affiliates.
Launch the App so every body can start making money off of the NFL. It’s delay since September. Anymore delays and this NFL season is over with.
The bars don’t need permission to show the games on their T.V.. I ‘m sure management of U.G. has this under control.
NFL would have to sue the affiliates for using their logos, they are private contractors. Just have to read the polices and procedures on UG web site.
Every affiliate must have known this. The affiliates credit cards will be charged then finally money will be made, Tokens sold, advertising shown, the game played. affiliates commissions sent out. Lets get rumbling.
…unless the owners got a cut.
Only one reasonable answer, UG doesn’t think the app is ready for prime time.
Time will tell but I suspect all this “purge the entire internet of any mention of our being a MLM” thing is nothing more than a delaying tactic. UG could have prevented 100% of any associations between them and multi level marketing many months ago by simply choosing not to be a MLM company. Straight up.
Now every week that passes (today will be the sixth) without the app being live is another week the affiliates and the company can not make a dime off of it. There has to be a very strong reason for this to be true.
If “our affiliates haven’t done enough to pretend we aren’t a MLM company” actually is that reason then this company’s problems run much deeper than their app not being ready for release. Though I suspect that is the real reason it isn’t live yet.
It’s more like UG never considered how its affiliates can destroy their marketing campaign… or they really think they can keep affiliates on leash.
I have it on good authority that the original investors are scrambling to sell this thing off before it totally bombs as they recently found out that per the App store and Play store policies, it is against the rules to pay out on more than one level, so the entire comp plan has to be revamped.
Those that thought they were going to get rich off of their downlines are going to be very, very upset.
The Apple guidleines cetainly can be very restrictive and with good reason in most cases.
Anything that would tarnish Apple would have difficutly in being approved. The app has morphed from being a gambling app to a rewards only app and still I think there will be issues.
All IAPS (tokens, coints etc) are subject to a 30% take from Apple.
These IAPS can only be used within the app itself although various interpretations of what “gifting the winnings” means are possible.
As there are a multitude of gambling restrictions on each Appstore and location use, they will have further issues with USA players gambling on a UK soccer match. I’m Irish, have access to an Irish gambling app but can’t use it in my country of residence for example.
My guess is that for the last week they have been trying to finalize the releasable version and are still having legislation and Apple guideline issues.
ATTN UG Affiliates:
Stop emailing me with demands I remove this post. UGM is still an MLM opportunity and app users have every right to be aware of the business opportunity UGM affiliates are participating in.
Any emails received with demands this article be taken down will be ignored.
As I’ve been telling UGM affiliates who have emailed, I’m not an affiliate and couldn’t care less about your internal compliance.
@K. Chang
They’re dreaming if they think they can keep these types of idiots on a leash. Since the people attracted to this industry aren’t exactly known for their wisdom, restraint, or impeccable business ethics, it certainly shouldn’t come as a surprise to UG that they have a bunch of loose cannon affiliates shooting their mouths off.
It’s kind of like herding cats…. if cats were greedy and stupid, that is.
Just saw a similar app, Pickk, on the Apple Store.
First of all, I wouldn’t have touched UG if I hadn’t thought it was a unique and proprietary app. Guess I should have checked!
This is from the Pickk page:
If simulated gambling alone is enough to make it 17+, that could be a real problem. Personally, I see this type of app as suitable for a 13 yr old.
@lookieloo Pickk, along with Fanzcall and snapcall, which makes the yet to be released UG app far from unique. Each of these 3 apps got less than 5,000 downloads in September from the Apple store.
Lol!
behindmlm.com/companies/nu-skin/nu-skins-47-million-dollar-pyramid-scheme-settlement-approved/
That is amazing. All the reviews say they like the concept! Sounds like a winner in my books
@CoCtDe Yes, they are good apps but the point is that even with a good app the market is still limited. I saw that you’re an Indie dev. It would be cool if you gave some input on the usual retention rates and level of engagement an app like this might have.
I see some flaws with connectivity and the User experience.
I don’t want to say there is any “usual retention & engagement” rate.
You will only know what Daily Active Users are post launch. You originally mentioned <5000 downloads, i think you are calling that a small number. That is a problem for any app going to market, getting lost in a sea of apps.
Supposed projections are 500k initial downloads for this app. If no one plays, then it doesn't matter, BUT there is a better chance of viral and mass traction compared to me creating an app and asking the 200 people in the post to check it out.
From an engagement standpoint it will be best if the app pushes engagement OUTSIDE of just sports users play in. If left to my own means, I'd probably forget to open it on sunday(game day).
If they can build in an in game mobile game ala – car racing, throw/catch a ball, anything to do to kill time, the app will stay in the players mind.
My mindset is Apple did NOT create the MP3 player – they enhanced what was already on the market and everyone ate it up. I remember buying audio SD card readers from JAPAN for $10, but i have to admit the iPod trumped my solution and the world recognized it.
So with everyone listing there are these 10 other apps, that floundered…. cool maybe this app takes the best and innovates somewhere.
Can someone who is reading this and is in voled in UG, please contact a person named Teresa Moran.
She has fraudulently signed me up as a player, when indeed I did not and the only way I now is because I was trying to sign up under my friend who is an affiliate and it said I was already registered which I was not….
I am in touch with someone that I e mailed from their web site, but that was two weeks ago…. to me this is fraud and I am not off to a good start with this so called company that says the are not MLM.
Gesh, dont’ they all say they arn’t but they are….
I personally don’t see this going viral over and above the initial signups. As you see, forgeting to “open the box” on game day would be an issue.
Watching your team takes first place and then, unless the app has an addictive or very fun feature, most people would just get on with watching the game, betting with the person sitting beside them in the sports bar.
I just bet with my friend on Liverpool V Man utd using Viber but we do that twice a year although I never miss a Liverpool game.
I do call 5,000 a small number and so much of the hype is based on friends, and friends of friends signing up, Although Henry got 2,200 signups, I would see no more than 50 staying on past the first day.
I find it hilarious that all the UG affiliates are on a rampage telling other UG affiliates and people who do reviews to take down there videos on YouTube so they can continue to Phase 2 and to protect their Brand.
Good luck with that! LOL It’s even more hilarious when they are ignored. hahahaa!
Yes 5000 is small, what number do you think is NOT small. How do you feel aboit 1.3M?
Why is it hilarious? The fact affiliates are wasting their time policing when it doesn’t really matter?
@coctde 1.3 million is huge. Although I doubt they would get that many.
Either way, the fact that some pretty good similar apps only got 5,000 or less last month is a caution. I would excpect that number to be higher if the concept is that much fun.
Affiliates have been told to expect an ever-growing group of players and that ‘studies show’ that a game app player will share with an average of 7 others.
So, some of the more ‘conservative’ play-only growth/income models have used a share rate of 5. However, they don’t seem to take into account the adoption rate, whatever that will be.
We don’t know how many of those 7 shared with will 1. download, 2. try, 3. continue to play, 4. and share the app. And those models suggest that a person shared with automatically turn around and share the app… but they are not necessarily going to be a ‘game app player’ as in the ‘studies’.
I do think that the initial download will be large. With perhaps 400,000 affiliates plus family and friends, pre-registered players and initial contacts and a real push by many affiliates to get the app out the initial downloads could be substantial.
Some continuation of play can be achieved by affiliates that continually invite players to events / fundraisers.
But, I just don’t see how the average individual affiliate is going to even cover their sign up and monthly fees.
With 400,000 affiliates putting out the same corporate materials on social media and being told to not even have a dedicated website for the game.
We don’t have the numbers for game cost and value of ad watching (do we?) but I don’t see them being as favorable as some speculate…why would they be? And, why would players be loyal to the one app when there are other similar apps and will be more copycats as soon as this app gets some recognition?
I would really like to hear a reasonable real-world income model that takes all this into account (at least for the average affiliate because I am sure that you, as an affiliate, are planning to stand out among the crowd and employ some unique methods of marketing).
Agree, But many things to consider.. Who sells more movie tickets.. The highly anticipated Summer blockbuster or the indie film?
These apps do not have 100k+ invested Affiliates including celebrities with large reach pushing it. That’s the major difference.
Sure the app may cool over time.. It may be hot for a few months and then fade away. In those few months though everyone will be playing it and if it can keep up steam post NFL season then this thing may just be getting started.
For them to say on a webinar NHL is basically not important and will not be available this year tells me they are really focusing on global sports with massive fans.
Fact is nobody really knows what is going to happen in the coming months. Those of us invested are hoping for the best. Those of you that are not are hoping for the worst.
@Tiernan – Had you heard about these other apps 6 months ago?
@lookieloo – Everything you mention is unknown – so there is no need to speculate. The speculation should be the amount of money an affiliate is willing to come out of pocket and for how long.
@joe – i love indie films! It is rather challenging to stay abreast on what is being released. I heard Netflix just released 13th. I found out through a friends FB post. I Wonder if that is how things spread.
If i were into this company, i’d probably make sure my slush fund was in the $1k-2k range.
I was at one of my local sports bars for Monday Night Football. One of the managers is an affiliate for UG.
A scuffle broke out when a couple of other individuals who are UG affiliates were bothering patrons trying to watch the game. I wanted to go and crawl under a table and hide since I’m an affiliate as well.
@cCoCtDe @lookieloo – Everything you mention is unknown – so there is no need to speculate. The speculation should be the amount of money an affiliate is willing to come out of pocket and for how long.
I am referring assertions and income / player acquisition models (player-only model) put forward UG (not officially but on youtube and maybe calls – now mostly scrubbed I expect) and repeated by affiliates, especially after the affiliate ‘pause’ was announced (so that it would make sense to be signing affiliates that had little chance of recruiting).
It was clearly a very flawed model but it spread like crazy and I believe it to be responsible for many signups. How if you invite 10 players and they invite 10 players etc. etc. you end up with 20k/month. I know…sounds crazy when you say it like that.
If you do not want to back it up or offer an alternative that’s fine but please do not dismiss out of hand.
HAHAHAHAHA – makes sense, no control over the people putting the word out. But more so most people will go for low hanging fruit – people at sporting establishments.
@CoCtDe Yes, of course, it’s my job to know. Indeed, I knew about Pickk a year ago and Snapcall 3 years ago and reviewed MLB Preplay 3 1/2 years ago.
@Joe Where are you getting these numbers from? The limits of scale already highlight several problems.
#1. So lets assume 100,000 affiliates getting 1,000 players each. That’s 100 million people all on a server, using internet/4G at the same time in close locations.
#2 100 million people downloading an app and using it for more than 2-3 times? That would fall to 10 million, if even. So now the 100,000 affilates have 100 players each under their tier spending $22 at most a month for 3 months gives an affiliate income of $220 a month.
#3 100 million downloads is a very optimistic number so I don’t think problem #1 will apply which makes problem #2 a bigger one.
I’m not “hoping for the worse”, I just think claims should be in perspective. It will make money but it can’t make “a lot of money for a lot of people”. It can only be one or the other.
@lookieloo,
I appreciate the way you are looking at this. Don’t seem to be a name caller. Or saying this is stupid, etc. But just trying to get a breakdown of numbers, and reasonable income assessment.
I think I can address a couple of your questions, as I feel like I am a level headed person, with low expectations, and I am an affiliate.
Your statements about adoption rate are pretty dead on IMO. People seem to be under the false guise that every player they get on board represents a lifetime annuity. Here is my take on some of the comments/questions you made/have.
With 400,000 affiliates putting out the same corporate materials on social media…
For this question I think 400K is a high estimate, my guess is closer to 200-300K currently, but since corporate doesn’t release those numbers I can’t say for sure.
I have around 70 affiliates in my org under me. I’m guessing upwards of half of them will do absolutely nothing with this.
I think they looked at it, as a small investment, and thought they would build an org, and never got around to it.
I’m guessing that my org is very similar to many. So, IMO it will be more like 100K-200K affiliates in the end who are actively pursuing players.
The other 100K or so will be absorbed up into other affiliates orgs as they realize they aren’t going to make anything off this and they will change to being players, rather quickly, probably even before launch.
We don’t have the numbers for game cost and value of ad watching (do we?) but I don’t see them being as favorable as some speculate…
So far we are told that players can watch 5 ads per day 7x per week, so a total of 35 tokens available via ads. Token value not set but projected to be around $1.
I agree with your assessment, and I think people should really lower their expectations with this.
Due to the market being adults who have jobs, I doubt many will be watching 35 ads per week. My guess is more likely to be watching a few before they play on a Sunday, so maybe 5 ads watched per week.
And, why would players be loyal to the one app when there are other similar apps and will be more copycats as soon as this app gets some recognition?
This one is pretty easy to answer. I think it is the same as Clash of Clans. Why are people loyal to that app? Mainly, because it is the app that their friends are playing.
The other apps I’ve seen have the same functionality for the most part, but don’t have the players, nor the affiliates pushing them to the app.
I see it more or less being almost all or nothing. People aren’t going to bail and play a different app, unless their friends do as well.
Overall this whole thing hinges on whether people actually have fun playing the app, which I don’t think will be the case on an individual basis, hence why none of the other apps have many users.
I think what you mentioned about fund raisers will be important, and I also see sports bars being very important too.
Hundreds, if not thousands of sports bars are signed up as affiliates. If they make it fun for their patrons to play in a group setting, and they couple game nights with discounts on products I see that being a driver.
I’m of the opinion that on a nightly basis there will not be enough people playing this app for it to be really profitable other than for football, as far as US sports are concerned, but I could be wrong.
The other sports don’t have that large of a nightly following, and some aren’t even conducive to real time interactive play. The estimates that many have (get 10 players and you will be profitable, type) are not thought through very well.
As an income I think people should look at it like this.
1. Don’t quit your day job.
2.If you do not have a VERY large organization, like 1,000 people or so don’t expect this to amount to much income at all, UNLESS, you plan on working for it. By that I mean, hounding your 25 friends or so to play every week, to share with their friends, to watch ads, setting up your own league, and making it fun.
If you think you are just going to sit back and get rich, you are probably in for a let down.
My calculations for pay and what I tell my affiliates are this. My guess is an adoption rate of 1 in 5 players. My guess is they play once per week during football season and use 5 tokens.
To break even for the year you will need to make $150 or so. That will take 12 players playing the game ACTIVELY during football season.
Any other sports or if they share with people or use more tokens is gravy. At that 1 in 5 adoption rate, I’d say you need to have 60 players to break even not counting your affiliate team.
One other thing to consider with UG treating MLM as the “industry which dare not speak it’s name,” their app has a chat function.
There have been several
hundreddozen attempts at MLM social networks. Think “it’s just like facebook only you pay to join and it pays you,” actualy the failures go back far enough that the pitch was once “it’s just like MySpace.”One problem with pert near all of them is that they were infested with “the next big thing” chasing serial MLMers and the majority of what passed for conversations were just naked and repetitive solicitations to join new harebrained bizzopps.
UG is refusing to launch their app until affiliates scrub any mention of their being a MLM off the internet, what are they going to do when a thoroughly depressing percentage of chat posts on their app are bizzopp pitches?
Queue Natalyn Lewis on yet another unlisted YouTube video admonishing UG affiliates to stop acting like network marketers. “You’re ruining our income opportunity by trying to build a downline.”
@Tiernan – Were you familiar with BarBets? It’s a local to me app. Also, in your knowing about the other apps – are you familiar with how they went about their marketing and WHY they did not get any initial traction.
I can not say anything about numbers, so I do not give projections.
I know that the project i am a part of – we are in 17 million homes and I can’t say if we will reach 18 million next year. That’s the analyst job and business development to make happen.
Are you suggesting that the only people using the app will be people vested in the company? And those vested in the company will only be chatting to bring people into another MLM?
@CoCtDe
The majority of initial players will also be affiliates and if that doesn’t change in a hurry it will be a negative indicator as to the appeal of the game.
The “pause” in affiliate signups is unusual in the industry. Of the possible reasons behind it one could be to try and stop affiliates from using the app’s chat function to insistently spam pure players inviting them to become affiliates (preferably in the downline of the spammer).
But even beyond that it isn’t in any way a bold prediction that unless UG takes significant pains to keep their affiliates from using the chat function as a prospecting tool their affiliates will put into practice the lessons taught to them by their uplines, namely recruit, recruit, recruit, recruit, recruit and then recruit. It is the golden seal secret of success in any MLM and most non MLMers find it highly obnoxious.
Which of course explains, in part, UG’s fervor in trying as hard as possible to pretend they are not a MLM company.
@CoCtDe BarBets has a fatal flaw that UG at least doesn’t have. The cost and time in maintain a system of rewards tied to a specific location or group of venues far outweighs the benefits to that venue/bar. Users are then low and interest from venues falls off a cliff. It’s the same flaw that “gift a drink” style apps have.
Keeping this to the relevant issue, the marketing of the UG app is being farmed out to affiliates on the premise of rich rewards for them. If they truly have 100,000 affiliates promoting their app and perhaps getting 100 players each then the cost to them initially is zero.
If they were launching the app without this then I would guess a marketing budget of close to $10 million would be required and that’s being optimistic.
To put it in to context, @Henry would have earned $11,000 or more if he had got 2,200 downloads for one of the fantasy sports apps that promotes their app on a CPI basis ad remember, those 2,200 are for an app that doesn’t yet exist.
If it pans out that Apple sees tiers on tiers as a pyramid scheme then a large value to the affilaites is gone and they would only benefit from direct invites.
Why on earth would UG refuse to release their app because of internet posts? Sounds like complete BS to me.
@Malone Respect for bringing the expectations down to a more reasonable level. I do however have a different view on the pay to watch ads element.
If they are valuing an ad at $1 per view that converts to a revenue per 1,000 views of $1,000. That compares to an industry average on mobile of $3 per 1,000 although some networks claim to offer up to $30. Either figure is vastly smaller than that touted by UG or affiliates as the value.
There are several apps that purely operate on a paid to watch ads basis and the returns for the users are in the pennies.
@Tiernan,
I definitely wouldn’t pretend to know anything about those numbers. I honestly have never heard an exact value of an ad. I think it has been said that it depends. So it’s pretty vague to this point.
The token value has been somewhat declared but I think you could be required to watch more than one ad (maybe 3 or 4) or do a survey to get a token. So I apologize for my example which insinuated that it’s a one for one thing.
It will be interesting to see how it all plays out. Lots of speculation and not exactly lots of definitive answers. But it does look like things are moving forward.
@Malone. You’re a gentleman)) You’re not expected to know numbers like those. I am in the app marketing business and am expected to know them. It’s the reason I jumped in to this thread.
It will be interesting to see how it all plays out. It is vague still as they haven’t decided on many things yet it seems.
I do feel that having a dual currency system weakens the business model to some degree and simple market economics kicks in at some stage.
If the value is 1-1 then I would expect most people to “watch the ads” if even just pressing play while watching TV or doing something else just to rack up the credits (tokens) instead of using hard currency to play.
That “exchange rate” would be vital to get right. Too generous and people would opt for the free credits, too stingy and no one would watch the ads and the “free” tokens are pretty worthless.
Taking that idea further, these free tokens are sponsored by the advertisers regardless of the internal exchange rate decided by UG but do rely on an engagement factor by the users to give the advertisers value for money. So the funnel from advertiser to UG to the user must make sense of that aspect or it will collapse.
@malone….it the same like ship broad credit on a cruise ship. it giving you a $1 for free to play but it’s not worth a $1 on the ship because everything is so very over priced.
to the ship that $1 is worth 10 cents. they are giving you not the same $1 in worth as a player buying a token for the real price of $1.
the advertisers are not going to pay ug a dollar a token per view. they will just advertise on cheaper apps. tiernan knows what he is commenting about.
@malone thanks for your time addressing my queries! and for bringing things down a notch.
@whocares “it giving you a $1 for free to play but it’s not worth a $1 on the ship because everything is so very over priced. to the ship that $1 is worth 10 cents.”
interesting… but yet the affiliates will receive a real 15c (the signing affiliate and the inviting affiliate) plus addtl. levels / check matching and presumably Apple store will receive a real 30c… or did I misunderstand what you meant? 🙂
Biggest problem I believe was they have always said Fall 2016. Never wavered off that. But affiliates hoped it would be earlier and promoted it as such.
With that being said… The name will be released in a couple hours. Ball is certainly rolling.
Hopefully in a few months I can come back and laugh at some of these comments.. Or you guys can laugh at me. Time will tell.
And the name of the app is.,….. FireFan.
No official word on a launch date but we have schwag:
imgur.com/a/Ihjdo
They are asking affiliates to pay $300 to $500 for FireFan logo gear packages. Natalyn implied but did not directly state the $299 package would have costed you close to $700 and the $499 close to $1,200 if they weren’t being purchased in bulk so it’s really like UG is saving you money on this purchase.
The MLM cynic in me points out that these are being referred to as “Exclusive Affiliate Packages” but the subscript reads “5,000 Player Acquisition Premiums” on the larger pack and 3,000 on the smaller.
No clear updates were made on the comp plan but “player acquisition premiums” sounds a lot like MLM speak for some sort of sales metric for commission purposes.
One thing I begrudgingly respected UG for is that they had been avoiding most of the obvious comp plan pitfalls of the MLM underbelly, enough so that I’ll wait for them to issue further explanation before drawing conclusions but this might be a significant misstep.
Sales aids, things only affiliates would purchase should never be commisionable, assuming you wish to operate legally. If UG pays commissions on the sales of their “Exclusive Affiliate Packages” they need to hire a better MLM attorney in a big darn hurry.
I had a girlfriend like that once. Insisted a fur coat that cost $1,000 used to cost $2,000 so she saved me $1,000.
Not too sure if FireFan LLC would object to the use of their name and breach of their copyright by someone else. I certainly would.
They are in the app business so probably yes.
@Tiernan
Yikes.
UG applied for a trademark on August 19, 2016 in the field of “Downloadable electronic game software for use on mobile and cellular phones, handheld computers and other mobile devices”
and it is not yet approved.
You are a cynic. I noticed it too BUT I was smart enough to realize yhe marketing material , fliers, ti attract players totaled to the fine print.
6000 and 3000 on each package. Or broken down 3000 fliers plus 2000 tickets.
On my cell so not correcting numbers, but you get the point. I do AGREE if marketing packages is tied to comp this would be bad.
Who is firefan llc. I am not seeing abything othere than UG on the pro c ess of trademarking.
Their Facebook page is just spammed with register codes from affiliates. facebook.com/FireFan-1197769906964112
Slightly confused, ar you saying the music app would be upset?
That page doesn’t look to have anything to do with the music app at *.net
I’m not a legal expert but think copyright has limited protection whereas a Trademark would be a stronger claim.
This could mean that if UG gets that approved, then they may get the FireFan LLC to change their name even though they used it 1st.
The description “Downloadable electronic game software for use on mobile and cellular phones, handheld computers and other mobile devices” is almost exactly what the LLC does.
Either way, it’s an issue that might come up and may casue problems for someone.
That Facebook page is that of the UA app called FanFire……you see the confusion already caused? My point exactly and usually the deciding factor in infringement cases.
So far the name launch has been messy. Corp seems to be learning as they go along. And many affiliates are, of course, already being spammy. And, they have used the name of another app. Odd.
The promo videos are not bad but I don’t know why I am am spending time on this. It’s hard to market this beyond family and friends without breaking the rules… and even so, everything connected to this app is going to end up being spammy.
FireFan FanFire…what a mess. And to think UG didn’t secure their username pages before launch.
One of the affiliates jumped in and got facebook.com/firefan and so UG is using realfirefan lol.
Agreed, if you are marketing this DISAAOCIATE yourself from firwfan fanfire whatever it is. Oyhwrwisr you will het yourself lunped into peeople who will tarnish your image.
I was in l.a this past weekend and my buddy actaullu, used a Lygt codeof handed to hin from. A street vendor.
II hinestly thought everyone had downloaded it and no need to share a cose. I def missed out on 25 credit!
I use lyft uber as an analogy of the ‘soam’above post. Every event I go to if theres a FB oage soneone will say get your girst ride usong code…. Grabted southwest chaseof and large companoes have it kn their site as well.
My bad, should have said FireFan. It’s confusing for sure.
Seems the Facbook page FireFan already existed for some time and the Twitter they use is FireFanSports because @FireFan was also taken already.
@Tiernan
Mmm, perhaps they found the copyright notice online. Clever, but I don’t think they will be able to keep using it.
I plan to purchase a few of the promotional packages sing up code is printed on it. I will place the flier on every car in in the parking lot in the game. That’s a $1000 investment for me to find players.
there are 20,000 cars parked on any game. MY downline team will have to set up zones so as not to cover the same cars.
I am guessing that more than half of the affiliates will purchase this material.It’s cheap because it’s being bought in bulk. All the affiliates should be made to buy this material.
Why am I spending my money to advertise for those who won’t spend their money. WE SHOULD HAVE THIS COMMON LOGO ADVERTISED THAT’S 300,000 PACKAGES X $500=$15O,OOO,OOO THIS IS AT COST.
THIS WILL GENERATE 1,800,000,000 FLIERS AROUND THE WORLD.THAT only A $150 MILLION ADVERTISING COST.
All the affiliates should be made to purchase this advertising package with the logo. Why are the affiliates who are purchasing this spending $500-$1000 giving free advertising to those that won’t purchase this material.
There are 300,000 affiliates X $500 =$150,000,000 that would generate 1,800,000,000 fliers around the world. $150 million in advertising cost is nothing for a billion dollar business.
this material is at cost to ug.. they are not making money from this. the affiliates are going to make money when the app is out.
@WHO CARES , marketing the game is no longer the real issue. The cost of each download grows as the size of the remaining addressable market falls. 1.8 billion fliers to me sounds like way too much overkill.
Remember that for the version 1.0 app, only American Football is available. So why would Affiliates in rural China have to buy these advertising packages? It’s of no use to them.
This seems to me to be what will happen:-
1. 300,000 ( if true) affiliates will generate 100 downloads each on average giving a launch day(s) volume of 30 million. That will put the app on the top of the charts.
2. Organic downloads from with the Appstores will generate almost all the possible remaining potential players. UG claim these free range players will be allocated to affiliates based on some algorithm ( no details).
3. Invite codes would then become nothing of any real value and it would become like a “Tell Bob I sent you” style referral system.
@Tiernan The game will have a player-to-player invite feature.
One hopes that personally invited players will be responsible for growing one’s network of players. They may be prompted to add all Facebook friends to list etc. How would that fit into your scenario?
@lookieloo I think that’s of course fine to grow your user base but not an overall good idea if an app is restricted to “invite only”.
My understanding is that the app will be free and available for anyone to download but if they need an invite to register and play the app, it will stunt the growth.
Yes free for everyone and NOT invite only. You hear about the app in passing on the radio, barbershop etc. you Download. Those already in the system may be given tokens (lives) to invite friends.
I have already tapped into the international market and DO NOT see NFL as my bread winner.
International soccer rolls out to begin with as well
I do not agree with forcing everyone to purchase marketing material. ALSO, i am inclined to say maybe a mass spamming of the name like you’ll do at a NFL game isn’t the best approach and tarnishes the name for responsible marketers.
I live next to Sports Authority – IF i decide to do a game, get to tailgating a.m walk through the lot and actively engage each person – then immediate download OR hand over a card.
Thanks to everyone for putting their time and effort into this discussion!!
I have been following this for about 4 months. I have a family member and a bunch of friends that are affiliates. I came very close mydarnself, but I just do not get the appeal of the app … at all.
Admittedly I am not a game guy and for this reason, I must be missing the “hook”. I am hoping someone can set me straight.
My take is that the app is more of a quiz than a game. In a game you use skill to succeed. With practice you get better at what ever it is you are ‘playing’. There lies the hook … if I continue to play and keep getting better, then I have an incentive to continue.
It seems that you need knowledge to succeed on this one. While having knowledge can and is a great thing, it just seems that the hook will be absent.
I was a pretty good student, but using my knowledge was never fun… not even close.
Playing sports was fun. I was completely ‘hooked’… hard work resulted in improvement. Knowing about sports seems like it may not be near as satisfying.
I sincerely hope that I am ‘missing it’ . I have a few very good friends that are very excited about this, and I hope they are right, I really do.
Somebody set me straight!
Thank you and God Bless.
@Not Gettin’ It
Yeah, I agree. To me it seems like a quiz and as @Marvin said…
Originally (early days) the app was to allow players to win prizes according to their ability to predict the game. That could have been a decent hook but that aspect was removed because they wanted to steer clear of claims or categorization related to gambling. Perhaps this was necessary but if not it was a big mistake in my view.
The people most excited about the app have dollar signs in their eyes:) I’m very interested to see how the general public will respond. I once imagined the general appeal of the app but more and more I feel that it is actually very niche.
That niche being MLM – nothing more, nothing less.
I’d suggest brushing up on MLM statistics and what the the owners of UG have been up to the last 22 years. One place to start would be the NuSkin PYRAMID SCHEME as I posted previously.
There’s no app yet so nothing to get))) So far we know of 1 similar app that failed at this and 3 others that are having very little success.
At this time it’s a concept of an app that is being “pushed” by hundreds of thousands of people “hooked” by the potential to earn a little money by doing very little or to earn “lots” of money by recruiting and recruiting.
I can’t dispute that the app will get a lot of downloads on launch but there are so many things that must be right for the app to succeed over and above getting downloads.
In this context, there are 2 beneficiaries of success:-
1. For the Affiliates
2. For the owners.
For the Affiliate, they will fall in to 2 camps. Those that have done enough to feel happy about the returns on their efforts to date and those that didn’t yet get enough mass/users to justify further expenditure in time and effort in running their organization.
As the breakeven amount is not significant, you’ll find that even low ranking affiliates will keep spending the $9.99 a month on the basis that it’s extra income. Only those who did nothing, or almost nothing, will drop out.
Even those with monthly revenues of only $0.99 would keep trying I think in the belief that that will grow.
For the owners, they only need enough affilates driving their user acquistion to make big. The sheer size of all those monthly $9.99 affiliate subscriptions ensures a sizeable revenue stream, regardless of the average spend per user.
My thoughts are that the promoters have leveraged their 22 years of experience in the psychology of greed in to generating as much momentum for this app, and have left almost no room for thinking about the details concerning the app itself.
Well said. This is the telling point and has been all along. To my way of thinking the discussion begins and ends right there.
This thread sure did come to an abrupt halt. Interesting.
Until the app is released there’s not much else to say. It’s 2 weeks and 2 days since the closing of the program. Maybe a futher delay?
Wanna bet?
Dude! I have some speakers in the back of my van to sell you…
Yeah hawking sketchy stuff in parking lots is a winning strategy. Not.
Exactly!
Similar statement to what I said weeks ago. The ONLY people guaranteed to make money here are the owners, and that money is made on the back of the affiliates. 300,000 x $10/month is $3,000.000 month in their pocket irrespective of the success of the game.
People need to understand this MLM scheme is a scam for United Games to make money off affiliates. Popular mobile games do NOT need to be pimped.
If the game tanks in a year UG doesn’t care. They will have made $36M and will be sitting on a beach while the affiliates have a closet full of marketing flyers to put in recycling.
Depends on the bet. 30 million downloads in one day would put any app at the top of the charts. In fact, 300,000 would do it.
To acheive 300,000 then I would estimate, and that’s only a guess, that they would need to drive 200,000 downloads through their affiliate network with the balance being from organic and/or the extra hype that they would get.
Ignoring the BS about 400,000 affilates and taking a rough guess of 25,000, a figure I believe closer to the truth, then 8 downloads per affiliate would do it.
Who makes the Speakers?
Upon further consideration. What is sketchy about hawking free?
Example – Hey check this out and keep walking?
I am feeling generous now, so if you post your PayPal addy I’ll send you some money
I think its hilarious when people say stuff like this…
Do you think your Billionaire NFL owner cares if his team is terrible? He still sold fans $100 Tickets $10 Beers and $6 Hotdogs 10x a year. And if you decide you have had enough he will move on to the next city with fans begging.
He laughs in his luxury suite or beach while paper stacks up. What do you have to show after a game? A blowout loss and a cup you paid $10 for?
Ask any season ticket holder how much they spend for tickets, parking etc in a season and what they “got out of it”? I can promise you it isnt $9.99 a month.
I fail to see the funny side.
You, along with many other recruiters, are making outlandish claims about a business opportunity that doesn’t yet have a product.
Equating a scam with the ups and downs of watching your team win or lose, and all the excitement that goes with that, is out of context.
The app is now 3 days overdue. What BS will they come with next?
What day was it due out?
It was due out on Monday the 25th. AS stated it is 3 dyas overdue with NO DATE of deivery given. Even so, who would believe a date anyway…
I signed up as a player earlier this month, I was excited for this app until I came across this thread.
I asked the guy who recruited me about the 25th launch date and he said he’s not sure where that came from because they were never told a launch date yet.
He did tell me that they will be finding out tomorrow evening when the actually launch date is. If that actually happens I’ll let you “super excited about the app” people ;p when that is.
It hasn’t cost the affiliates any money as of yet. Except for those who bought the flyers and quit their jobs.
If this keeps getting delay, I’m going to loose a whole season.
If the app is not ready for football, then is it going to be ready for baseball, basketball, soccar, golf, and tennis. It going to cost me $50 only. But, I have to work to keep my players inform.
Still don’t know how much is a token to play or how many the affiliates have to buy a month to stay in? Do they have enough advertiser to pay for free tokens?
Yell, I guess it’s going to be a scam to get money from us affiliates. Maybe, they haven’t hired enough accountant to make all those payouts to us?
Handing out $300 million a month to the affiliates commission is a lot of book keeping. Let’s get on with it!
Where did the due date of Oct 25th come from? I had heard Fall 2016(calendar dsys that ends 12/20). I also heard launch month is October…3 days left.
My software (company) rolls out to 17 million ppl and we never deploy on our internal schedule. No biggie on my eyes
As a player, why would this thread lower your excitement? Are you afraif the app may take up too much memory on your phone? Is free to.expensive for you?
And yesI, release dat is supposed to be stated this week. I guve until Sunday, BUT normal work weeks.end.Friday
When you say you’d miss out on an entire season, is it a big deal if you got this football season or next? Also, why fo you have to keep informing your players? What do they have vested in this venture?
I see a difference between a regular update to your software for your clients, and the release of a much hyped app where people are leaving their jobs to beome involved with. Credibilty falls as each deadline is missed and this app has missed several.
They have never announced a launch date other than Fall 2016. So for those that say its getting pushed back or they dropped the ball etc are only saying that based on there own wishful launch date.
The affiliates are the ones expecting or hoping earlier release dates. It’s nothing UG is putting out to the public.
I challenge anyone to find me any article or youtube video that say anything other than Fall 2016 as the release date.
So as tiernan asked “what bs will they come up with next”.. No, it should be what baseless lies and assumptions are you gonna spew next?
If this app has not been released by Winter. Then you can say they “lied”. Until then they have been on point with what they have said including being sponsored by a small clothing company called under armour.
How do you define a lie?
The closing date for afiliates to register was the 10th of October, 2 weeks before the launch. Their words.
The app was promoted as one thing and is now said to be different from that.
Affiliates are claiming “huge” success for an app not yet released.
UG promoted this with “zones” 1,2 3 and 4 and zones 2-4 appear to violate Apples rules.
Where and when did they say that? I heard from affiliates it was going to launch numerous dates. All assumptions. Nothing concrete from UG. So i’d love to see where that was said by UG or written.
Wow, UG is being sponsored by Under Armour?! How so?
Curious about that Under Armour sponsorship also??
All firefan (the app name) gear for sale has under armour logos. Backpacks, tshirts, jackets etc.. If the celebrities that signed up wasnt enough, the backing of Under Armour assures me and should most that this is no scam, Get rich quick scheme etc.
It’s legit. Under Armour would never put its name on something that wasn’t
But no doubt some will keep trying to convince people otherwise. They will # crunch and anything else to prove the point.
Will all 250k affiliates make $$ from this? Absolutely not. But the ones that have put in work have a great shot at doing so.
Why some here put in so much time and effort to bring something down that has yet to launch makes me wonder what there angle really is.
They DID NOT say 2 weeks after Affiliate close. The closet thing they said is “Once Affiliate Registration closes we will/expect/hope (choose your word) to be in the stores in a few weeks. As another person said launch has always been FALL.
As Joe said all Apparel is from Under Armour. I will not say SPONSERED, but the brand UA and FireFan will be tied at the hip.
I do not know how those affiliations work. If each company vets each other to make sure each other is on the UP and UP.
One of my Businesses has our insignia on UA gear. I did not set up the order, but i know it went through the local sports dealer. I assume they need to Vet as the middle person so their UA lineup doesn’t get pulled.
If someone left their job – hmmm, you live and die by your decisions. The down payment on my range rover is still sitting in the Checking account. Not looking past my nose
Already addressed your concerns – But i will say i did try to stretch the example with our updates – the customers don’t even know we are getting ready to push out nextGen updates 🙂
Once again there has never been a deadline – Example Apple Just talked about new Laptop coming out. People are speculating. I do not see anything about a release date.
APPLE could say it will be available for the HOLIDAY SEASON. The ball is in your court to decide what HOLIDAY means. Would you bemoan if it wasn’t in stores by 12/25? is 12/16 the end of the holidays?
UG has said FALL ’16. I addressed that earlier – the calendar tells me Fall ends 12/20/16
Here’s why.
When a team of reputed scammers, sets about convincing hundreds of thousands of people, that if only 7 of their friends get 7 of their friends to spend $35 a week on an app, whose concept has already proven not to work, and that by them ONLY spending $9.99 a month will make them rich, then forums like this are here to expose it.
Do the words “nothing concrete from UG” not ring alarm bells in your head?
@CoCtDe “Example Apple…”
Had been thinking about that type of product launch with regards to lack of information from UG and all the room for speculation…but I don’t think it applies here as there really aren’t many players waiting for the app.
There are however, as Tiernan points out, many affiliates waiting anxiously for a first pay check and more solid financial details having ‘staked hopes’.
In this case, the lack of information causing almost all information to be speculation has been incredibly irresponsible…or manipulative…or unprofessional…or pick any.
@Tiernan “reputed scammers”?
Is that based on MLM being scammy in general, or the illegality of NuSkin doing business in China, or the fact that only a very small percentage of NuSkin affiliates earn a reasonable amount of income for their efforts, or something that I haven’t heard about yet?
Where are you getting the number 250K from? UG said this?
All 3.
I quote @Darren “Popular mobile games do NOT need to be pimped” as additional weight behind my belief that the promoters are using the MLM route, whether or not they call it that, as a mechanism to drive initial downloads for the app.
To me, this is a big gamble. Apple reacts strongly against any type of “gaming” in their charts and if they take the view that this method is an “incentivized” system, then it’s possible the app will be removed.
Oh, and then there is this… winviewgames.com
Interface might be more simple than FF with just yes or no answers but it is already out, and completely free – no tokens / completely ad-based – and somehow the players can win actual cash (if small amounts).
Imo, if FF had a chance, it was with the incentive of gameplay-based prizes.
Both Pivit and Winview had less than 5,000 downloads each last month.
itunes.apple.com/us/app/pivit-what-do-you-think/id549985452?mt=8 also has the bet on “next move” element.
So herein lies the rub. We now have 6 apps similar to the “unique” FF one and none has succeeded so far.
And then there is WinView and Pickk and Fanzcall and Snapcall and Ringit!Pro and Preplay
If you quit your job to invest in a fantasy sport app then i have to think you weren’t running the company. I mean… at the very least…
@Joe
Are you serious??
I work for a software company with 25 people. We had a golf tournament and wnated to give shirt for their sponsorship. We went down to an embroidery store and now we have Under Armour shirts and Nike hats.
@John Doh
I don’t know about people quitting jobs but I do know about a few people in between jobs or in tight financial circumstances investing scarce time and energy which could have been put elsewhere and perhaps getting themselves into a worse situation.
@lookieloo
I wonder if win view knows about this?
@lookieloo @John Doh
There is an affiliate my friend works under who is totally neglecting her current job and focusing on this. It’s very sad; she thinks will retire from this…
This is a reference to PIMPING – Do you consider Mobile Strike Paying Arnold AND the t.v. ads as Pimping to get downloads?
I have nothing to say about the app store regulations
I guess they could be working on their resume and job searching, but I’m sure getting players to register, especially using the internet, isn’t a time sink.
The incentive of gameplay-based prizes is an important thing. It all comes down to why am i racking up points? HOWEVER, if I person/organization sets up a game – they can supply a prize.
There is nothing stopping me from having a $100 prize if you win a game i put on….
Pimping wasn’t my word but I do see a big difference between legitiate user acquisition and “pushing” an app based on inflated claims of financial rewards.
Legitimate Acquisition – Are you saying that legitimate means I say A paid advertisement on T.V and that peaks my interest?
Why do you think that differs from an affiliate, a marketer, driving people to the app, with the possibility of financial reward?
Are you a beer drinker? You should download TapHunter – Is that organic? Seriously you should download Taphunter if you are into Craft Beers.
It’s different
…….because those apps exist and this one doesn’t.
…… because affiliates don’t usually commit to paying $29.99 to become a member before the app is released. Indeed, I’m not aware of any app programs that insist on any money befing paid upfront by the affiliate.
…….because the owners of the other apps behave responsibly in their business affairs.
…….the owners communicate with their affiliates the facts as they happen.
…….I have never been approached in a parking spot by someone “promoting an app”.
…….other affiliate programs have clear statements about the product.
…….other affilate programs outline the compensation plan before the user signs up.
I’m not a beer drinker but my site reviewed TapHunter 2 years ago.
We liked the app then but my previous comments about the difficulty in maintaining the app appear to be true. It currently has a 1 1/2 star rating whereas before it had 4 stars previously.
TapHunter is a good example of the problems FF app may have. What if it’s a bad app?? 250,000 paying $9.99 a month to promote a bad app?
So your major concern is how they do business. I’d agree my Business School professors, as well as lay businessmen, would agree with your points.
However, the only point i’d like to counter is the Pay Upfront to be an affiliate. If there was an affiliate program POST launch, would you limit registrations OR how would you allow delineate the program? (NO MONEY HAS BEEN PAID – NOT BILLED TO 15 DAYS POST LAUNCH, every affiliate could cancel, what’s the harm?)
Should a person still pay into the company once they have sampled the goods? How would the name of the app get out?
– Has every business you have worked with(Start-ups) had all the i’s dotted? Have any of your ideas or your friends, been involved in Y-Combinator or something similar?
Finally, I am not defending UG tactics, and not saying that they can not be improved upon, BUT at this conjecture – I’d focus seeing the app.
*Would you have given APPLE money to start-up their computer business in the garage in the initial days?
My concern is that the claims and product need to match in this and any other business. I wouldn’t get involved in any MLM business as it’s not my type of comfort zone.
That’s not to say that many people don’t get financial independence and job satisfaction out a whole raange of MLM products. Retail itself is an MLM system IMHO, from producer to distributor to retailer to consumer.
I jumped in to this thread after my site was contacted by several recruiters and I responded in the same way to all. “We can’t promote an app that doesn’t exist yet.”
There’s no big harm in someone taking a risk on $50 or so if there is any basis for the success of the venture. But I’m in app marketing for 6 years now and personally don’t believe in the stickiness of this app and it’s concept.
For that reason I wouldn’t put $5 in to it and prefer to try out a craft beer instead.
I think we see eye to eye. A lot of people are putting their Reputation on the line and on the backs on a lot of unknowns. Some people have more at stake than others.
If you tried to “promote” this app on hearsay – your site could lose all credibility. I like to think of myself as my own brand.
There is nothing that can detract from my Career as a programmer at a Top 3 cable. HOWEVER, I am standing behind the apps possibilities (i care more about flash/technology than substance(guess a play) when i tell friends. Download and give me in-game feedback and opinions please.
As long as the game comes out – and looks like a firm put it together i have won. If people don’t like the concept – i still can say i find excellent companies that can put out technologically sound products, and I hope you check out my next one.
I have another app in the pipelines to promote. So if this is a hit, that should be 90% guarantee people listen come round 2.
Respect.
My site could get 5,000 downloads a month for the app if only American Football was available but 20,000 a month if Football (soccer) was included. That’s if the app was a good one.
I’m not in the MLM business and can’t promote the app that way.
If the app is a bad one, then, as it would be automatically listed anyway on my site (iTunes version) , Google would probably send 1,000 visits a month to the page at the beginning.
Which is your 1st app?
@Joe
Legitimacy by association? Get out of here with that crap son…
Also how does purchasing apparel from a third-party manufacturer turn into said manufacturer “backing” the purchasing company? Or even a sponsorship without an official confirmation announcement?
If I buy a tshirt from Kmart they aren’t sponsoring me. Nor have I entered into a partnership with them.
Celebrity endorsements are for sale too. Even Tweets can be bought from some big names.
Higher level information released. There is a date you can hold.the.company to now
The effort at UG now is to set up the business. They are hiring accountant, office worker, writing up contracts with BANKS, CREDIT CARD COMPANIES, testing programs etc.
This is a big undertaking to start up a billion dollar business. They need the time, that’s why the app isn’t out.
How is this scam? UG investors must be spending millions in salary payment for these worker, office space, and etc.
Looking for affiliates and creating the app is but one part of the business. I would be asking who are the advertisers spend money for the tokens.
Still no one know the price of a token or how many the affiliates have to buy each month to play along.
I don’t want to spend $100 a month to buy tokens to support my upline. I would need to make $110 to break even for the month.
@coctde
Somewhat disappointing news for affiliates with regards to launch date and value of tokens and games. Now that thousands of affiliates are lined up and waiting, the app will now be beta tested… though one month of testing seems quick, I guess.
Apparently, there are nearly one million pre-registered players? These are people that signed a form so they could at some point download an app (I don’t get that.)
Anyway, I think I am having a Soylent Green moment. The affiliates are the players? With so many people ready to play (and share with 7 others who will share with 7 others:), who really needs affiliates anymore anyway lol.
@who cares
10 cents for a token. Still not sure why you say that affiliates need to by tokens. Did I miss that somewhere?
@who cares
Is this sarcastic?
Beta testing would be very normal procedure for a new app but I would have thought that had been done already.
They would use a service like ‘Testflight” to distribute a version .9 app (as opposed to version 1.0). The name or number is really irrelevant.
During this period the app isn’t available for download in the app stores. 1 month is possibly sufficient but that would depend on whether or not any critical bugs are identified.
Launching an app filled with bugs would be a disaster. More so in this particular situation.
My opinion is that after the launch, affiliates are no longer needed but then, I also think that afffiliates no longer need to promote the app and that all this hype is geared around the pre registering of players.
The point being that those 1 million (or more that register up to launch day) will download the app on launch day and after that, almost all downloads will come from the stores themselves, bypassing the need for these affiliate codes.
If so, and if the report that new players will be assigned to existing affiliates using an algorithm is true then further efforts to recruit players will be restricted by the laws of common sense.
1. Who else is left?
2. Why would someone use your code to download an app that is freely available?
I sell tweets. Fifteen quid apiece or 9,700 OneCoins.
Beta is always necessary. My company is just finishing up.field testing. 106k in one market. Weve addressed issues and ready to scale the launch to millions.
Noting was said about.affiliates buying tokens
There must be more than 1 million pre-register players that are holding the 300,000 Affiliates codes. Each affiliate was signing up at least 100 players each. That would be 30,000,000 pre-register players. Those that download without an affiliate code will be assign to an affiliate
@lookieloo… 10 cents a token? It was suppose to be $1.00 a token. Then how many you need to have to play for free? How many free advertisements you have to view to get a free token? If affiliates don’t have to buy tokens then they play for free?
How is their upline making money off of them. I’m not being sarcastic United Games would be training hundreds of accountants and office staff to start the business.
These are employees of United Games company and are earning a salary being pay by the investors until the app make a return or from the affiliates sign-up and monthly fee.
Roughly 10% of the money goes to the affiliate’s commission. 90% goes to United Games as business expense to pay those salaries and over head etc.
Have affiliates already paid their $39.99 affiliate fee? (x 300,000?)
Is it only the $9.99 monthly that won’t be charged until after launch?
@who cares “10 cents a token? It was suppose to be $1.00 a token. Then how many you need to have to play for free? How many free advertisements you have to view to get a free token? If affiliates don’t have to buy tokens then they play for free?”
Still plenty of unknowns. Currently, affiliates are adjusting to this 10 cent token price and how they can possibly make near their expected predictions with a half season of NFL games. Some are creating new outrageous income models. But, those here knew that a $1 token would not jive with free-tokens-for-watching-advertising.
@char “Have affiliates already paid their $39.99 affiliate fee? (x 300,000?)
No fees have been charged and won’t be charged until 15 days after launch…I believe…so December.
@whocares
Affiliates can earn 5% commissions from the players of their personally signed (tier 1) affiliates (conditions apply).
I’m not aware that affiliates HAVE to play but they WILL play so that they can invite players and earn ‘invite’ commissions… which could be really annoying and continues the marketing as does the promise of new leagues with new apps in the future, fundraising etc. keeping the affiliates hanging on.
@who cares “training hundreds of accountants” through me off!
This is all above my pay scale. I don’t understand what is beta testing. I don’t care to know.
I know in the next month’s time more of FireFan logo advertisement packages will be sold to the affiliates at $300. and $500. We will be in the play off by the time the app launches.
So far it still hasn’t cost me any money. No one is cancelling out. I can’t even understand what’s happening if the cost of a token goes from $1.00 to $.10.
Does that mean the advertisers are going to pay $.10 a view. The players must watch 10 Adds to get a free token? Tiernan.. mention about this per view cost in comment #216 and #218.
If after the football season ends and there are no more football games and United Games has not come out with any new sports app like basket ball, soccar or baseball. Will the affiliates continue to pay the $10 monthly fee until the next football season?
I would guess a lot of affiliates will drop out and take the lost of $50. rather than paid for nothing or pause the $10 fee.
I would still have the football sign up players to my code for next season. If the app fails after the football season than it all over if there is nothing else.
A few points from last nights email:
I sincerely hope UG is not exclusively using affiliates in their beta test. Affiliates have a built in financial motive to like the game that isn’t shared with random players. A biased test pool will yield biased test results.
Perhaps I’m making assumptions on too little data but (given the current price structure) if 12 tokens is enough to play the game for one NFL game wouldn’t that mean the average commission paid to an affiliate from an enrolled player playing one game is 1.2 cents with another 1.2 cents if the player purchased their tokens? 2.4 cents for both.
If true that would mean an affiliate would need more than 414 player games played per month just to break even on their $9.95/month fee.
I really hope I’m drastically wrong here because a hard core football fan, unless they use tivo can watch five games per average week with one or two more some weeks. Sticking with five that makes 20 games per month so a potential affiliate income, if the player buys and uses tokens for each and every game, of 48 cents per player per month.
One other point of note:
Most if not all of the clothing items displayed there are not Under Armour products, they’re Sports-Tek. So much for a sponsorship.
@GlimDropper
For sure. I expect they would like to include some affiliates in the beta so that they can communicate to the rest of the affiliates about how excited they are and how much the app rocks.
@GlimDropper
12 cents maybe?
How to Get a Couple Hundred Thousand People to Pay for Your Multimillion Dollar Marketing Campaign and App Launch.
Thanks for the catch Lookieloo, that does make it a fair sight better.
An affiliate would earn 12 cents off of 12 tokens not 1.2 cents. That’s on tokens acquired.
Tokens played is 5% , so they would earn an additional 6 cents if they played in a game they they were invited by the affiliate.
So instead of 2.4 cents it’s 18 cents. So they would need over 55 players not 414 to cover their monthly fee.
To acquire 1 million pre registered users would cost roughly $5 million. Instead, UG have found 300,000 people to pay them $1 million for this.
I’ll try to help.
UG had a problem in trying to make a parity between bought and earned tokens from watching ads etc. At $1, the bridge between the two was too wide, causing an issue.
Solution seems to be a “split”, or “devaluation”, in the value of a token to $0.10 to make these 2 currencies closer in value.
So, is the value of an earned token $0.10 to UG? Taking what the average cost per view (CPV) to an advertiser is worth, $3 per 1,000, or CPM in adspeak, or, $.003 cost per view and factoring in the difference between interested eyeballs based on targeted content marketing and adjusting for the fact that these “eyeballs” are incentivized, the real value to an advertiser is significantly less.
Even ramping up those figures, UG won’t make $0.10 per view so now the next question will be “How many views needed to earn 1 token?” If the answer is 1 then UG has only partially solved the problem.
There are too many vested parties involved:- players, the owners, affiliates and advertisers for there ever to be a satisfactory solution to all.
As people have pointed out, UG has a very large incentive to release the app and hope people don’t cancel in first 15 days. Problem is the extremely misleading revenue model presented to all the affiliates.
There has never been any chance that CPM was going to be $1. It also won’t be $.10. More like the $.003 Tiernan posted above.
The extreme exaggeration of the revenue potential will result in huge negative impacts to all the poor souls who fell for yet another “Are you tired of not being filthy rich… how would you like to get in on the ground floor of something bigger than google!! All you have to do is be prepared to invest some of your time and money and you will reap riches beyond your wildest dreams, no more struggling to get by on a regular paycheck!!”
Barnum & Baily were correct, there is a sucker born every minute. Either the leaders of UG are either completely ignorant of the realities of their bsuiness pitch (hard to imagine they are that uninformed) or ???
One thing for sure they will want to get the app launched and make sure no one cancels and wants a refund. Most peole having put their heart and soul into UG will continue to willfully ignore the facts right in front of their face for months before finally accepting that they have been used and will not realize their dreams via the UG illusion.
What is amazing is that many of these people will chace the next get rich quick scheme that comes along….
look at all the other similar apps already on the market, the real economics of the “ad-watching business” and figure out how little $s are actually available.
If they had kept the gambling aspect of the app, then people might have put some real money into this app, without that it is hard to see where the revenue will come from.
It is possible that with 300,000 people pushing the app there could be high emegagement initially. What happens after the initial push and particularly after the NFL season is over is a big question.
Another question is who are the investors footing the bill to build out the infrastructure required to run this size operation? The people out front have not ever built anything of significance before. A couple of highly exagerated and inflated resumes and ??
Who is funding the development? How many employees are working full time at UG? Has anyone visited their HQ?
People are spending hundreds of thousands of hours, maybe millions if really 300,000 affiliates, yet who has performed any real diligence on UG?
From the beginning they have been as vague as possible on everything except how huuuuge an opportunity this is…. wel delay after delay, after delay and the NFL season will be over if there is yet another delay.
You know they really really want to get their hands on the $12 mil of initial signup fees plus the $3mil first month signup, How could they be so incompetent to have said they would launch in fall 2016 and still not have done any beta testing??? Amazing!
If this was intended to be legit, it has been horribly mismanaged….
I entered this in to Google translate:-
I got back this:-
@Tiernan “Dear affiliates. We will be cannibalizing your compensation scheme by giving away 12 free tokens to every new player.
Instead of earning $180 per thousand players that you got for us, we will give you at most $60. Giving you a CPI of $0.06 is our way of thanking your hard work and believing that $0.06 is a much better reward than the average $6.00 available from many other sports apps.”
Ha ha. I didn’t even catch that. I thought they said that they WOULD actually pay the commissions on those tokens. I am so gullible!
Are the other sport app like basket ball and baseball etc. being beta tested now for the up coming season.
After the foot ball app launches the affiliates will have paid the $50. which is $15,000,000. if after the football season there are no other sport apps will the $10 tech fee be paused.
If affiliates cancel out the players that they signed up, will these be reassign to the remaining affiliates or go to United Games without having to pay anyone a commission for that player?
If the Affiliates program open up again it will make it harder for these new affiliates to find players. Then this becomes just looking for affiliates to spend $50.
The first comment on this blog stated on June 4. Things have sure changed in 5 months.
In reading all the comments, as of late I haven’t seen too many comments defending United Games not like in the beginning.
With all the affiliates renewing their commission forecast, by 1/10 and the continue delay of the launch it doesn’t look good this is going to be the new “GOOGLE”.
@sportsjunkie… BURNUM and BAILY.. there’s a sucker born every minute. @lookieloo… I am so gullible.
I strongly disagree. People were finding hope in the App to change their life.
They made Videos for youtube, they talk their family or friends to join to let them in on a winning bet. Now it is so disappointing that it “may not” happen.
Affiliates are so down now that they don’t need to be put down. There still maybe hope. Give them some kind of hope, this is not a scam, only a delay.
So, in the parallel universe in which you live, when is it permissible to use the benefit of your experience to warn people they are about to lose their money to a bunch of charlatans and their hopes and dreams shattered even further ???
In the real world, the longer “hope” is the driving force, rather than logic, the more devastating the (inevitable) end result will be
@ OZ COMMENT #190. I am so glad you did not take this post down. This is a great study of people on how they think of this MLM United Games.
This post should be studied by future affiliates and students in business school. There are people posting that understand apps, understand the MLM business, computer programers, psychologist, hopeful and hopeless affiliates, people who thinks this is a scam, people who don’t believe this is a scam, wise guys,etc. But, I think UG did not horrible mismanaged this, they knew every step of the way what they are doing.
From the start until now. How can you not have beta tasted the app until after the announce launch date.
Every step:
1. delaying the affiliate closing date.
2. delaying the launch from September to October now to December.
3. selling logo packages.
4. taking down the youtube videos.
5. pricing of tokens 6.under armour sponsorship, and many more i have no knowledge of.
It was the affiliates who pay for and worked to finding the players for the app. At a small cost to the affiliates of $29.99 or $39.99 payable to United Games.
The $9.99 affiliate fee will keep the business up with a steady income stream. No affiliates is go to cancel out even if they won’t be bill for 15 days after the launch date,for the simple reason they haven’t receive their first commission check to know if they will become rich..
They will stay in, because this will be hype and sold to them for the next season or next app launch. They just get hooked.
When the affiliate program opens again, from this pause, they will be right back looking for new affiliates to join their team as a member of their downline.
@Who Cares
Please stick to the one alias if you wish to continue to comment.
I personally don’t believe the Beta testing story released by UG.
My call is that:-
1. They have now only realized that Apple only allows a 1 tier affiliate system it seems and they are busy, very busy, looking at workarounds to do a multi tier system using some type of attribution allocation to the upline/downline flow.
2. As many of the original affiliates focused more on the recruitment of other affiliates rather than players, that may present an issue on the legalities of it all. Any system where the bulk of compensation is derived from the recruitment process rather than selling of the product would possibly be ruled illegal as per recent cases in the USA and UG is trying to understand the implications.
Good perspectives posted. This opportunity has given be the ability to dial in my marketing skills.
I am one of those people that will pay 9.99 a month no matter what. That is 1/10 my hourly wage, not gonna keep food of my table
Interesting scenario))) At a $100 an hour pay level I just can’t begin to consider how this could be more favorable to you if you’ll market it in car parks.
Brushing up on your marketing skills may allow you to focus on acquiring players in a much more targeted manner and give you experience for your own app launch.
@ Tiernan… comment #329.. You are right…even if not for all the reason you posted. United Games has external reasons and not any internal reasons for not launching this app.
15 days after launch they can charge those affiliates credit cards and make millions. If they are delaying this launch till a few football games left in the season and if there are no new sports app after the football season they may as well close up shop and take the money to the bank.
@Sportsjunkie …comment #321..your post is similar to my post #302. to track the tokens sold and issue 1000’s of commission checks would require United Games to have a huge infrastructure already in place.
They would be spending millions in salaries before the app launch. If this is not set up now, who can say this is not a scam.
It would have been easier and cheaper for United Games to market this app to players without Affiliates.
Just run adds on social networks. They would not have to pay commissions and hire a huge staff and just keep all the token money them self.
@WHO CARES I very much doubt that the “scam” is that. I just think it’s fooling a lot of people in to promoting the app for a low return.
If they charge the fees against 300,000 cards before the app is live then they will get so many chargebacks that the card merchant will cancel their facilities and refund the monies.
Much of the resources needed in admin are easily automated and should already be set up, or rather SHOULD already be so. If not, it’s as easy to outsource that. @CoDecT could probably write the program in his lunch break.
If Apple only allow MLM apps based on a 1 tier system, then I don’t think that affiliate recruiters will find it that hilarious. What you think @Joe?
If… If… If… That’s all I ever see from you. Speculation plus doom and gloom.
Thanks for caring so much about what I and others do with our $10 a month. Frankly I don’t care about your opinions. If i eat $40 i’ll be ok.
I have a better idea for you. Go to an NFL stadium and tell fans that instead of buying a 16oz draft beer for $12 they can go buy a 12 pack for the same cost at a gas station and watch the game for free.
I do get a bit annoyed when the discussion repeatedly returns to the fees that UG is charging and that they are small so no big deal.
While those fees are an issue in the wider scheme of things, they are not the heart of the matter.
No one is going to get anything by paying the $10/month and waiting to see what happens. People are spending a lot more than $10/month. Just look at the ‘marketing packages’ that UG is pushing, for one example.
I care nothing about what you do with your money. I post here to make others aware of the BS that you and UG is spreading about the potential returns.
The ‘ifs” are because there is little or no real communication from UG, the reason being that IF they revealed too much then their scheme would be exposed for the useless rubbish it is.
Comparing an app that looks like being at best so so with a 12 pack of beer is ridiculous. I’d go for the 12 pack every time and I don’t drink beer.
You quoted 300,000 affiliates but only 1 million pre registered players. More BS?
I never quoted 300k Affiliates. I said 250K which was direct from UG. Also per UG they have 1M registered players. I’m not blasting out how much money i’m gonna make or could make. I see it as a very cheap opportunity. Simple as that.
If it hits. Great. If it doesn’t, Im out a chilis dinner. Will UG get rich in the process either way.. Very likely.
The reason I point out beer sales etc is no one seems to have a problem when 70k fans run to 16 diff nfl stadiums every week and stuff Billionaires pockets.
You have a motive and it’s not “looking out for us”.
I assume you are not an affiliate.. In which case how exactly do you the truth from the bs? Is this message board your source of info?
On Dec 10th when i get my first check i’ll be sure not to cash it because you told me this was all just a scam.
I am corrected. You did say 250k. I apologise.
@Joe I have never denied that some people will make money from this. I believe they will. However, I don’t accept that “it’s only $9.99 a month” is a compelling argument for a business decision.
I don’t have a problem spending $4.99 on nachos and cheese when I see a movie and a beer at the game may well be the NFL version of that. But, I don’t believe “cheaper than a beer” is a valid answer to the question “will people spend money using it?”.
My motive is 100% pointing out the holes “as I see them” in the chances of success for the app based on my knowledge and experience. Statements like “bigger than Pokemon Go” are not an assurance that the app will succeed.
Statements like “the average app is shared with 7 people” are in fact not true and 49 times not true if the next sentence is “they share with 7 others”.
I’m not here to doom and gloom the app, just counterfoil what I see are misleading statements. You posts are here as mine are and people reading them will at least think more before deciding.
I don’t believe it’s a scam, I said earlier that UG is using hype and giving false expectations in order to boost their launch numbers and that most affiliates will be losers.
Some, maybe quite a few, will be winners but they won’t be millionaires. Why not? Because the numbers don’t add up no matter how many 7 time 7 times 7 people share the app.
No one is speculating that a similar app tried and failed. That 5-6 other similar apps are having a modicum of success. If anything, the speculation is that this app is sooooo much better that it will be a phenomenon.
Doom and gloom is the default position for 90% of apps.
Just checking in. This thing hasn’t cratered yet?
What would be great is if there were a way to short this “opportunity”. That, my friends, would be the real easy money.
@JOE… Post #337.
Correct me if I’m wrong. You were to get the first commission on DEC 10. If the App was launch on OCT 25. The date has been delay to do BETA testing. The first commission checks will also be delayed.
Will you tell this massage board your commission on this a post. I still will make my money the old fashion way, get a job and go to work everyday until this is bigger then GOOGLE.
The Commission date doesn’t change. It will always be the 10th. Let the game roll out the 9th of the month and you will have 1 days pay. Granted you MAY miss the pay because all the tax forms may not be in and processed.
Remember people have a 15 day cancellation window. Now that i mention that – I wonder if that shifts pay. Release date PLUS 15 may push past the 10th of a month.
Interesting you say go to work the old fashioned way. What exactly does that mean?
In my world it is wake when you want, get to scheduled meetings, do what the company pays you to do. Keep it moving.
Been working for 10 years now. I must say things didn’t get awesome until the mid-way point
Since the company isn’t public or have an IPO – Could you propose how you’d like to do a man to man short? I may have some cash laying around to consider a “wager”.
Oddly enough I worked alongside a friend launching a HRIS platform within the Cannabis industry. The back office is easily scale-able. As long as it is automated the system would check the values entered.
Challenge will be the labor to verify information when errant data is entered
I agree with everything you said regarding HYPE. I think we can all agree that Apps and Video Games, many do not get traction. I think one problem will be Affiliates Pushing players to play when they don’t want to. How do you get the phone out of someones pocket.
The same as I want a pizza (been craving Pizza Hut), but i forget about it after the commercial is over.
Sunday i went for a bike ride. Thought damn i could get the 6.99 pizza, but can’t carry it. The feeling left me. One of these days i gonna get the darn pizza. Don’t know when.
I say that to say this app NEEDS to push notifications, WHICH i do think it will do – people list their favorite sport and team.
Also, the app has a build it “ESPN” scoreboard feature. If this can keep me from using multiple sports apps for updates this MAY stay relevant even when not being played.
Those that have signed people up with EXAGGERATED statements may have some backtracking to do with their friends and family. I have only statement quantifiable information to certain people.
7 tell 7 tell 7 Hey i don’t know if ppl will share it BUT IF they do they the numbers work. IF a person plays you get paid.
FINALLY – if corporate isn’t pulling our legs saying the demo I saw was 1/16th of the final product i’ll be on board. Everyone (with right cause) thinks it will ONLY perform like the others on the market.
FB was just another MySpace. Then evolved, made something good better. That’s all you can HOPE for here
@Tiernan Looking forward to your dissemination of the latest UG corp email, especially the part about token value.
from UG:
I think this is a bit rich since some of the projections came right from corporate and now that they are out there, there is no taking them back… unless UG would go on the record and say what IS a reasonable income projection to counter all the unreasonable income projections.
@lookieloo I was thinking the same thing… as the launch gets closer, UG is scrambling to counter everything they’ve been selling us for months.
Natalyn Lewis straight up gave the presentations about how 10 friends could turn into $3500 a month pretty easily and now “it is against policy to discuss potential earnings with other affiliates” lol.
I can’t tell you how much I wish I could see what kind of sales pitch she’d use to get so many on board now.
I’m not even sure what to tell the sports bars under me at this point.. are they even allowed to give out prizes for party plays they host or will they get “benched”?
I don’t get it so someone will need to post it here.
My comments so far about token value are based on my experience in apps and app marketing. They are a useful method to increase engagement and loyalty just in this instance they also pose a conflict of interest.
I disagree so much about UG using a multi currency system. UG seems to have 3 currencies:-
1. Paid
2. Earned
3. Bonus
How sure are you that this will work on TV?
When I watch a football ( soccer) game in a sports bar where I live I get a notification from a LiveScores app about a goal, then I see the goal on one TV then, about 30 seconds later I can watch it again on another TV that shows the HD channel.
If that’s the case with US football and US TV, then that’s a non runner. I had noticed that the marketing videos and other promotional photos give the impression of playing along AT the game although there’s a quick scene of people at home standing in front of a TV in the video on their site.
@Joe… comment #337 “United Games states their are 250,000 affiliates.”
@lookieloo…comment # 303 ” 1 million pre-register player with affiliates codes”.
that is an average of 4 sign-up per affiliate. That means to me the affiliates were looking for affiliates to sign-up and not players.
When the app is launch and ready for download most will download without affiliates codes.
If 10,000,000 download this app on itune, then each affiliate will get 40 additional player under them. On the average each affiliate will have 44 players.
@ Williams… comment# 313 it was determine that you need 55 player/game at $.18 to make up the tech fee $9.99. These are averages. People like in Joe comment# 109 who has worked to build up a large team of affiliates and players has a great opportunity to be very successful.
605 player/games would be over $100 commission paid a month. This is… if the tokens remain at $.10 a token and you need 12 tokens to open the game for play.
With 13,750,000 player/games a month and everyone would be even. That is 250,000 affiliates X 55 player/games/a month = 13,750,000 total.
That would be then 13,750,000 X $1.20 a game=$16,500,000. You just have to do the math and look at it in different ways to understand this.
$2,500,000 will be coming from the affiliates tech fee. The affiliates with a large team of downline and hard core players are going to make some money.
Mathematically it impossible for 90% to even get even.
The Affiliate sign-up program is pause now to never start up again. Why?
As the existing affiliates slowly drop out, the players that signed up with these drop out affiliates codes will go to United Games as players they won’t have to pay a commission for them buying tokens.
See lookiloo… comment#303 and Tiernan… comment 304. United Games may want their $39.99 start up fee and $9.99 tech fee but, I doubt it.
These new affiliates can not sign up new players, so why would they want to be affiliates for to be someone’s downline?
Players are going to sign up by downloading the app on itunes without an affiliate code. Why does United Game need new affiliates for once the App is launched and on itunes, to paid out commissions to or get their fees? Wow!
So this is as looKiloo… comment #316 and Tiernan… comment #319 They are using these first time Affiliates to fund the the marketing and launching of the App.
So, in reading comments #246, # 247, #248, #253 maybe all be correct. But, if United Games reassign the players of the drop out affiliates to the remain affiliates and the remain affiliates get the new downloaded non affiliated code players.
Then the affiliates that stay in will make some money. Story is, stay till the end you will move to the top.
United Games is differently a winner with $15,000,000 from the affiliates.
Well that’s just it. With an equity short it’s simply betting on a lower price in the future. Pretty simple. With a wager it would be far too complicated to frame the same bet, not to mention the unlikelihood of collecting on it.
That said, I would bet on just about every assumption that has been built into this “opportunity” pitch if I knew for certain I could collect.
Keep your money. You’re gonna get taken for enough as it is.
I for one would love to see that $6.28 check. That will put me in my place for sure.
As far as I know, UG has not stated how their ‘algorithm’ will place orphan affiliates. Another important detail which left vague favors UG as high-achieving affiliates will speculate that it may favor them and low-achieving affiliates will expect it will distributed evenly, possibly offsetting the fees and give the a chance…and then there are the affiliates that used it as part of their recruiting and motivation.
Sorry Marvin, You will never know what my checks are. Regardless, whether its $6 or $600 nothing will be able to put your ego in it’s place.
Good point.
Time to put on our “game theory hats”. Will people stay on in the hope of sucking up the players from affiliates who drop out?
UG holding that carrot out. I presume they’ll honor that…
So, I read all this and have found out through emails with ‘support’ ….. you all are wrong in how this works and the commission part inclusive.
Your ‘secure’ access code in any and all pre-registration Players and Affiliates is not ‘secure’ in the least and has nothing to do with anything on any ‘tier’ ….. unless you ‘invite’ again those pre-registered to an ‘event’ and ‘invite’ to share the app with Players that will be ‘invited’ and can be ‘invited’ by any Affiliate, anywhere.
You get paid ‘zippo’ when this happens. You heard right. You do the ‘math’… Your ‘secure’ access code means nothing and over the months means nothing, period….. in the team that you have ‘built.
I went through every avenue with ‘support’ and this is the ‘result’.
Do I think it is a con, now? Yes, totally. No one bothered with having Natayln having to explain the ‘connect’ until I did with support and they side-stepped it and quickly.
She goes on and on and the ‘potential’ and now the ‘gear’ stuff and the new beta-testing and this and that. This is a total con as far as I am concerned. Good luck!
Just to add about how egregious this is in nonsense.
You have say 250,000 Affiliates ‘worldwide’ as ‘they’ claim’ and 1 million pre-registered Players….. the Players are not pre-registered as any Affiliate can access them and there is not one need for any definition in a ‘code’. You have 250,000 Affiliates the can ‘create’ a game with only X games per week.
They get paid by creating a game….. your secure ‘code’ is null and void and that is what makes this an entire scam and it took me a bit to figure it out.
It is sad that this had to happen as know many were hoping, otherwise.
If an affiliate drops out, the players below him just condense to the affiliate above.
@denny, If I am a player referred by you, you get 10% of any revenue I generate through obtaining tokens.
In your diatribe, did you mention that part? Is that an sense of security you are talking about?
@DENNY… Maybe “support” confused you? There are many affiliates on this post using an alias. Not one has reported this.
Sounds just crazy. A player has your code FIREFAN/_CODE_______. a player buys or view adds for tokens and plays token under this code.
The affiliate that owns that code gets 10% when bought and 6% when tokens are played. I think it’s that simple. Would you please go over your comment# 358 again.
“You have 250,000 Affiliates the can’create’ a game with only X games per week.” Will you cancel out and lose your players to your upline?
It hasn’t cost you any money yet, only your efforts, and you own these players. I guess a player can jump to another affiliate’s code? But, for what purpose?
@DENNY…
I understand what you are talking about now. It’s called tokens played commission. If you organize say 10 players regardless of their sponsorship tree (any code) to a game or event of yours and say they each spend 12 tokens that’s a total of 10 players X 12 tokens X $.10 = $12.00 you will get 5% which is $.60.
It’s call TOKENS PLAYED COMMISSION. I meant 5% when played not 6% that I wrote on an earlier post # 361.
I think it just did.
It seems that you must get the players, then get them to play games “under” you to earn anything? My goodness, What a mess.
These UG guys are complete tits. Any commission structure must be clear and attainable. This is neither.
You get 10% when they acquire tokens and “if” you get them to play “under” you , you get an additional 5% on the tokens used to play in that game.
@Tiernan I’m not aware of changes to commission plan with regards to commissions received for tokens acquired by referred players (10%) and tokens played by invited players (5%). Two separate commissions.
@Denny Understanding that, do you still say that there is an issue? Can you back up your concerns with a quote or text? Otherwise, I wonder if it was just a misunderstanding. The two separate types of commissions can cause confusion.
so no one can explain why I should pay a monthly fee when I can play on draft kings and fanduel for free? I’ve only waited 345 posts. seems the scammers want to ignore this glaring issue.
@ Whip, you dont have to pay to play Firefan. Its free to players. Also, fanduel and Firefan are 2 totally diff games.
@ Denny, Its already been stated numerous times. You get 10% (and always will) from all your tier 1 players as they acquire tokens. If you then create a “league” you get 5% from them or any other people that may join your game.
This has been established since day 1. Your the one that it took months to understand.
This was/is no “diatribe”. Tiernan is right on point with this. It is an entire ‘mess’ right now.
Simply, your secure ‘code’ means nothing that is ‘attached’ to your Players on your team on all tiers…. zilch…. unless you organize a game and re-invite those already pre-registered and on your team on any tier.
I was quite direct and asked this question every way possible with ‘support’. Natalyn has never addressed this in any commission video and have requested she do so and all Affiliates should do the same.
You will be as ‘shocked’ as I was with the response which is what I am stating. I was even told that I was ‘backwards’ in expecting to do ‘nothing’ and get paid for it after months of work and time and money.
If you don’t believe me and are still drinking their hype then check for yourself. The math is this staggering…. if you have 250,000 Affiliates creating an event (organizing an event/game) and only 20 games each week how in the world is any Affiliate going to make any money even with 1,000,000 pre-registered Players when the secure code attached and have as pre-registered and on your team means absolutely nothing!
Reads total con and scam to me unless There is something that I am missing…… don’t think so! Ask for yourself…
There is no monthly fee for players.
It is not free. Tokens must be acquired.
If true, that is very serious. More serious than just about anything claimed here.
I watched that long video where Natalyn drew diagrams on a white board explaining the commissions and I don’t remember anything linking the ‘acquired’ commissions to the ‘played’ commissions.
From the start, ‘players being connected to affiliates forever’ has been an important aspect of the opportunity. However, I would not be surprised if there were ‘insecurities’ with codes because as the details are revealed, assumptions are squashed.
@Denny…
Let me try to explain this. These are BONUS token given now to the per-register player. These BONUS token are has no commission on them as sold tokens, no 10%, THEY ARE FREE.
If you want a commission on these, “tokens played commission”, BONUS tokens you have to set up a game or an event to get your 5% commission by an invite.
Please read Tiernan post #322. and Lookieloo post #323. they explain it.
Bonus tokens have no affiliate code as sold tokens because they are BONUS tokens. But if you play them under a affiliate code because that affiliates organize it then that affiliate get a commission of 5% under their code.
READ THOSE TWO POSTS 322 AND 323. I hope I can help you.
How is Firefan going to be different then Winview? Plus Winview allows you to win money. winviewgames.com/
You are entirely missing my point. Read what I have stated and do some research with ‘support’.
If you can ‘possibly’ think that you are going to make money with this app, regardless of all the ‘facts’ you are stating, I have lake – front property I will sell you in the middle of Sahara desert.
I don’t care if it goes ‘viral’…. it will not go ‘viral’ as the app is no Candy Crush or Angry bird…. not even remotely close.
It is way too sophisticated for ‘kids’ to play ….. so the Player marketplace is already down-sized significantly…. and, who in their right mind is going to sit on their computer and create some league or event for a couple bucks a game… and that might be ‘high’…. when ‘thousands’ of Affiliates have done the same thing?
This whole thing looks like a complete disaster to me. Lord, just do simple math with what I have stated already and now know regarding the ‘code’ that you cannot get through your head.
You have really been ‘sold’ a bill of goods, friend.
You have missed the boat completely and are wrong in so many ways. It took you 3 months to figure out that Affiliates can create leagues and we get paid nothing from them if our players are in that league.
On the flip side I can create a league and get paid off others players. This was stated from the beginning… Yet we are the fools? Smh. Haha.
250K affiliates.. Correct. Of those 250k i’ll estimate based on my own affiliates 2/3 will never create a league or be active. So that leaves roughly 85K.
Of the 1M players.. that number is going to skyrocket once the players themselves can invite other players to join as well. How much no one knows but if 250k affiliates signed up 1M players.. How many more players can 1M players sign up? Time will tell.
Stay active, Create leagues and have large tier 1 that watches ads. That’s how your going to make $$ in my opinion.
This boat has so many holes in it that “missing” it is no loss.
1. Players are then targeted by 250K affiliates to play in their league? That’ll make for an unpleasant user experience.
2. There will be no skyrocket. There just won’t be the demand or interest.
3. Even if you get 50,000 players I would be surprised. And those 50,000 would be spread out amongst the various sports giving significantly less activity per sport.
4. The income from ads is miniscule. That’s the reality. Ads, surveys, email sign ups etc. They are small value items and the bridge between giving value to the advertiser to giving value to the player can’t be crossed.
There is almost n intersect between the cohort of users who have disposable income and those that watch ads to earn tokens. If UG don’t drop this “watch ads” component then they are complete idiots.
Dammit! Tiernan, I wanted an ‘exclusive’ on that property and thought I had it! So much for ‘realtors’ being honest!
It’s a huge property, as you know, how does a dime an acre sound to you and we can avoid costs and ‘impound’ fees and any ‘underlying’ mortgage ‘encumbrances’ and confusion with tide in and out! We will then ‘split’ the profits 50/50!
Nocando. Sorry. I found the client so will take 2/3. You can then invite them and get 1/3. But understand that 249,999 other people will also be inviting them, so invite them early and invite them often. I think that will work.
The value of a token is set at $.10 is not the important thing. What is important, is that you need 12 tokens to play the game. That mean it will cost $1.20 to play this game.
Is this the market price to play a game? What about $2.00,$3.00 or even $10.00 to play a game? I guess not, because you would have to view too many $.10 ads.
The advertiser, I doubt are even paying $.10 to view an ad. See my post #219. Yet, you must view enough ads to give you 12 tokens to play for free.
The advertisers are paying for not only the tokens but also UG to advertise on their app. If UG drops this watch ads and play for free they will lose this source of income from the advertisers.
Then UG source of income would come from token buyers. But, you could charge more to play the app game were not for free play by watching ads..
I wouldn’t call it irony. I have started to see the funny side. Your recent comment about users watching ads will make the money for affiliates really made me laugh.
A user watching an ad is worth $.01 at most to an advertiser. Incentivized ads are worth less. Regardless of whether UG passes on 10% or 100% of the ad revenue to Affiliates, it’s a rubbish compensation plan.
This advertising is all based on performance and although Nike might run an add, there are certain Key Performance Indicators that they will need to see to justify any ad spend.
Linking it to rewards dilutes that value immensely. They would need to see 10 purchases for every 100 sign ups for example to their online shop to justify the rate paid.
You make money without even creating a game or league so not sure why your hung up on 250k affiliates creating games and leagues?
Sure, I think i understand the mechanics of it all:-
1. 10% of the value of tokens acquired by a player goes to the affiliate who originally signed up that player. The exception being the 1st 12 tokens gifted by UG. That player is tied to that affiliate for life unless the affiliate drops out.
2. 5% of the value of tokens used goes to the affiliate who arranged a game or league.
The logical next step, after finding the players, is then for that affiliate to arrange games and leagues for their players to create further additional activity and token acquisition by the players.
I feel people are now hung up more on the fact that “their” players are now open to all affiliates to pursue as Joe seems to have as his game plan as the “flip side”.
That to me is a big problem unless I don’t understand that particular mechanism.
1,000,000 players out there? How would an affiliate reach out to them? If it’s completely open season then 250,000 affiliates could be reaching out to all of them? Seems crazy to me if that’s what will happen.
Affiliates, no matter how much of a stinker this turns out to be, no matter how much ridicule you have to endure for the rest of your life, no matter if your wife leaves you and your kids disown you, remind yourself that at least the Cubs won the World Series.
Tiernan, you are correct in your posts. An ‘event’/game MUST be organized by any Affiliate in order to earn commissionable tokens. There is no other way and all you have to do is ask ‘support’ and find out yourself.
They call it ‘temporary tiers’ that are formed in definition in the commission plan given. That is what raised my eyebrows and got me thinking and talking to ‘support’….
These ‘temporary tiers’ are separate and apart from your ‘my team’ tiers…. you must do this each and every event/game you organize and have the luxury of competing with tens of thousands of other Affiliates for a penny…. actually much less than that as Tiernan touched on.
This can not work…. Natalyn has never touched on this and if this were known and defined clearly as should have been months ago….. this app would already be toast.
We all bought bought the hype….. not any longer.
If every player will be getting multiple “event” invites before every game then the app will be deleted before the game kicks off by almost all players that aren’t affiliates.
Getting all those notifications “come join my game” will piss people off more than you may think. There are studies and best practices in the timing and frequency of notifications devoted to getting the balance right.
Any app needs engagement but get it wrong and users are gone. 250,000 invites might be a little over the top.
Sisyphus emailed me and wants in. Who I send him too?
DENNY who recently came on this post, to sum it up… became a affiliate thinking this was a great get rich quick scheme with little work.
Now realizes how much work it will take to become wealthy and is disappointed. He did not understand what this was all about.
There were posters 3 months ago this post (before all the delays and placing a token value of $.10 and you making $.12 on a player/game that it would take 80 player/games to break even,the app hasn’t been Beta tested etc.) that saw this was a scam to get those affiliates to fund a multi million dollar marketing campaign and app launch.
If they could have UG would had launched this app long ago in September to collect the $15,000,000 from the affiliates. Now say he was… “sold a bill of goods” this is a “con and a scam”.
Many affiliates probably free the same way. Well, he can cancel out and take back his credit card and save $50. His efforts and hope of getting easy money are a lost.
Then there are affiliates like JOE who be will staying to the end. Who is willing to put the time, money, work and effort into this.
When everything looks so bad, you have to have faith. The belief that “tomorrow will be a better day”. Well, every body did have a great time in Las Vegas, a great place to think you are going to be wealthy from this app.
People got into this for money?
@Denny
Why do you keep repeating this, that is not the only way you get paid on tokens.
If a player under you wants to play in a live event he has to buy 12 tokens or watch enough adds so they pay for the 12 tokens for him. The affiliate gets 12 cents for that, if that’s all he wants to do , that’s all his check will consist of.
If the affiliate wants to create a game and gets that player to play in it, he gets an additional 6 cents because that player used his 12 tokens in that event.
And to all the invite notification comments ….how would you be able to send an invite to every player playing the app??? Just like any other game app, if you want to invite people on facebook to play the game also so you get free stuff- you get to invite your friends not everyone that has a facebook account.
@William. My post #382 says this but @Denny is told something different by support it seems.
Now this is where I see a disconnect.
I accept that Facebook friends etc can be invited…… but how do the existing players get invites if their owners don’t arrange an event? What about the people who just download the app direct from iTunes?
@tiernan. Those existing players would see games from the home I. Your sport, your team, play against the world.
if my fan base is large enough I set up a game, I provide a prize to entice people to play with me.
Example ESPN pickem. I seed my national rank, but I am in a friend’s based league and winner gets 1000. He’ll year I’m focused on that…oh and I see other independent leagues
@CoDecT
Thanks. I was trying to understand the process of affiliates connecting with potential players and how the next level of recruitment will happen.
If it’s through the app chat system then that will just become flooded with spam the same way their Facebook page filled up within minutes of launch with affiliates posting their codes.
If the affiliates then have to go finding the players not through chat I don’t see how that will work efficiently.
My question is “where is the connection” point on an ongoing basis?
Getting it more now just the extra click reduces engagement save for the real fans and that to me is a big negative. How many in the ESPN system?
I’m not sure how the leagues will work. What my hope is that your able to create a league for say X amount of tokens. People then find your league and join up based on criteria within the league.. Maybe the area which you live, fav sports team etc.
Similar to the way Draft Kings etc work..You find the league that meets your preference. Not the other way around.
I see. Honestly Joe. I see that as the inherent weakness in it all. I get that people like playing sports games and we get 4,000 downloads a month for 1 sports app and we don’t even push it.
However, adding a step to the process makes conversions and engagement much lower. People forget. It’s that simple. It’s also not unique as we know.
I know you call me Mr Doom and Gloom but it’s the reality in apps that with so many of them out there, people spread their attention across so many different ones that overall, the time spent on each falls. Facebook of course the big exception.
the ENTIRE espn STRAIGHT picks(3 options spread and confidence), I have no clue BUT i am ranked 5976 out of the system.
For the league my friends set up, within the league, there are 55 people. Every week, I am doing some research, launching the app/going to the website. If i win the current week i get a payout, if i win the overall season i get a lump sum.
I will bring that mentality to setting up games. My hometown roots for one specific team. I set up a game saying play along for free and the winner receives $50 maybe tickets to the next home game. Maybe i say you need to invite 5 of your friends to be considered.
This is from ESPN “Message your friends and start a group today – you make the call on your format of choice. Good luck and have fun!”
I am holding back my promoting and building interest UNTIL i can see how the app works. Works in the sense of UI and engagement. I have a lot of promotional material left in reserves and don’t want to double back on potential “clients”
Rob… Just joking. I’m on it now and it looks like everything FireFan say their app will be. But, FireFan hasn’t launch yet. So you can’t compare the two.
But, United Games must know who they are completing against and just maybe making theirs better. Some posters are going yes it,s the same and others will say no. I can’t see how FireFan can be much different.
@Rob… I believe your post was dropped because you connected a web site on to your post. OZ… monitors the posts and has rules like no profanity, no selling of products etc. My follow up post was dropped also. READ OZ…. POST #190.
Who is “we” and is that the reason your so negative towards this app? Competition? Did you just reveal yourself or was this already established?
he reviews apps, has a blog or forum where he is followed?
And that other app that was brought up. Good for them, but I currently don’t see them having a first movers advantage yet.
Finally, I think FireFan app will have more built into it than just prop guessing
I/Me/We is an app review website as previously stated. We were contacted by 3 affiliates looking to add us to their team.
One of our pages for sports apps ranks #1 on Google for live sports apps which is how they found us. And my subsequent diligence about the app lead me here. The 1st 9 sites i found were recruitment sites passing off as a blog examining the UG app.
After reading the comments about the app, rather than the MLM theme I began to contribute.
My negativity stems from the, what I believe, are the inaccurate statements made about how easy it will be to make the app a success. My experience tells me otherwise.
In the last 6 years we have reviewed 20,000 apps, included 30,000 in different articles and I personally have looked at roughly 100,000 apps. I monitor 500 specific apps, and their performances, across different categories and have quite a good knowledge of what will and won’t work.
@ Who Cares… Thanks, I was wondering where those 2 post went, np.
So in your opinion.. Will any affiliates make $$ from this? Where is the line of money makers and non money makers drawn.
Do not doubt your knowledge on the subject overall.. Just dont understand where you are getting your info.. If its based strictly off this page it seems pretty amateur to make such strong statements on something you know very little about.
As you can see guys like Denny apparently are affiliates and he still is clueless how this works.
In response to me thinking this was a get rich scheme…. I have felt that right from the beginning this would absolutely not be a get rich deal… and, advised my Affiliates to not ‘buy’ into all the hype, period.
I told them this would be a slowly evolving app at best. Now, the ‘scheme’ word is entirely accurate!
Think about how many ‘baits’ were thrown out there! Come fishy fishy! This has been so beautifully orchestrated… it is darn near genius!
This all started with the Las Vegas ‘show’ August 25th/26th. It continued to evolve until now. The ‘delays’ and excuses for.
Natalyn is a fantastic saleslady and could probably sell that Sahara property for us Tiernan and get a buck an acre.
The ‘arrangement’ with GoDaddy is not one any Affiliate has thought about. You can bet your bottom dollar there was a kickback there to United Games.
VIP/TopGlobal is an Affiliate organization…. I would bet a fin that that they have the largest Affiliate/Player organization for United Games.
Who can monitor the ‘condensed’ team of any Affiliate becoming a Player or cancelling….. they have all your info!
You have my prior posts and how it actually works on the commission side. If you think that United Games did not know they would lose at least half their Affiliates before launch… you are kidding yourself.
Now, guess where the teams of these Affiliates go which is entirely ‘private’? That is a difficult guess, huh?
Cutting the commissions to .10 a token which you will get a .01 is beauty…. from what we all thought was a minimum of 1.00 a token.
Natalyn tried to sell it in a video…. it didn’t sell with my team in the least… they all called BS… as a last straw BS with all the other things that have gone lately.
You don’t think that wasn’t pre-arranged and known far in advance…..come on, now. This has been a thing of beauty to behold….genius!
This is all protected by…. well, no one has paid yet! The promises in the algorithm and I don’t think they are done yet!
The Houston roadtrip deal on Nov. 15th in a Q&A will be a thing of beauty to listen to in replay!
You must pre-gesiter, of course…. it will be Las Vegas part 2 as it will be ‘stacked’ with the ‘big’ guys at the top end of the food chain.
They (United Games) did not want anyone to pay yet until the hook is set, completely! This is an entire, well-thought out piece of con artwork! My applause!
I think some affiliates will make some money and others will make quite good money. None will make huge money but I think the seasoned affiliates already understand this. New entrants to the affiliate world are believing too much of the hype.
All my answers are based on my knowledge outside of this thread, all my questions are based on any lack of knowledge on how this app will gamify.
On one side, there is a large demand for sports related apps be they those that already exist or an app like FireFan. Sports fantasy apps are big business and developers of those apps are prepared to spend $10 or more on each user acquisition. The value to the owner is the income stream naturally.
As the real life sports games are limited to their actual seasons, an industry emerged that allowed those season gamers to play in simulated games. It’s similar to betting on horse racing. You can bet on live horse races, or if that’s not enough for those hard core gamblers, they can also bet on a computer generated horse race.
So now it’s important to understand if FireFan has found it’s perfect market fit and my speculations and questions are my effort to get behind what the final product will be before being able to answer that question.
At a live game, most of the attention of fans is directed to the game itself. The only useful addition to this experience I have seen is the launch 20 odd years ago of “live ref” transmissions in Rugby and maybe some other sports. This filled in the gap between attending a sports game and watching it on TV. At a sports game when a referee calls “foul”, about 20 people shout ‘What?”. If one person says “It’s because…..” then 20 people turn to that person to hear the reason. So any app that can deliver a real time interactivity could do well.
The success of Firefan will depend on the gamification they bring to the experience of following your team. We know from before and from the minor success of the existing apps that in this particular niche, the demand is not huge.
My opinion is that FireFan hasn’t hit the sweet spot in discovering what actually motivates a fan play and keep playing a particular app/game. The biggest driving factor in most comparable situations is recognition. People like to be “King of the hill”, “top of the league” and that’s where successful sites like Tripadvisor and Quora get their user base from.
By going “big” I feel they will miss out but then again, if community planners like @CoCtDe engage his followers in an interesting “Micro league” that would be different and it’s this particular aspect that led to some of my angry posts here.
UG has hyped this app on 2 factors 1. Make money by sharing an app and 2. make money by creating additional engagement. I think by separating those 2 statements in all releases from them that I am aware of, they “sidestepped” the important recipe of “make money by sharing an app AND engage those users in leagues etc”.
I think that tactic was deliberate as it allowed them to cast a wider net. I don’t think that’s bad at all but has led to some of the confusion and negative feedback on how they communicate. I think they realized what I feel now to be true. There will be 2 types of affiliates with a small intersect between the 2.
1. Those that go out and get as many players as they can find pre launch and their reward will be a 10% revenue share from those players forever.
2. Those affiliates like @Joe and @CoCtDe who take on the role of providing interesting formats to keep those players spending. Their reward will be boosted by an additional 5% but from a bigger pool.
Nothing wrong, just badly communicated.
If the app is limited to 20 games a week for the last remaining weeks of the NFL then the monthly fees are the next big issue. It’s not big money if there’s realistic opportunity to make several time that back but…..NFL nearly done and many, but not all, of the already recruited players would be NFL based.
So will there be soccer soon and will the format work? On a fantasy league level yes but my understanding is that FireFan is more than just this. I think they are trying to be both fantasy league and interactive predictions. How they will deliver that successfully I can’t tell yet because I don’t know if it’s possible.
My personal thoughts is that the interactive predictions aspect is a bit of a red herring. It’s a feature being touted as super and enticing but the underlying logic is to make money from leagues.
There are several other apps doing this as stated and it’s not a big success. Getting people to actually spend $12 to do so is a push.
It all boils down to a numbers game and the reason behind all the hype and false promises/expectations ( pick one depending on your point of view).
So, to fill in the numbers I think it will go as follows:-
1. 1 million people play on launch and that will quickly fall to 50,000.
2. 1 million come on board after launch and that will fall to a combined 100,000 players.
3. 250k affiliates ( although I think there are much much fewer) having a vested interest in the success of the app.
4. These affiliates have sunk in money and time acquiring those players and will have the monthly decision to stay or go. Some will immediately cancel, probably because they did nothing about it. Others will have found a large user base and will wait to see how the revenues go and others will ‘pick up the ball” and set out optimizing their own players, other players and those they pick up as other affiliates drop out.
Is it good business sense the way UG is formatting this? Yes. Is it ethical the way they are misleading, or allowing people to be mislead? Not in my book.
The biggest mistake I feel is this earn tokens by watching ads. The sooner they drop that, the better the chances of success,
I don’t think it’s the next big app success but it is an opportunity for some people to earn money, just not at the levels expected.
@Joe
I post separate comments as it’s difficult to combine them all in one without appearing convoluted or contradictory.
As I believe it’s very much a numbers game, the growth of the app depends very much on the retention factor. If one takes from the lesson from post #119 and the failure of PrePlay in to account, the only way to beat that is by acquiring a huge amount of players in the expectation that a large number will drop out and that’s the reason UG have adopted the MLM scheme.
So UG have done this:-
In a similar vein to the NuSkin scheme, they are getting people to “buy in” to a dream and this, to me, is the scam.
There is no way that they can think that all 250,000 ( or 25,000) affiliates can get a return from their $9.99 a month fee, let alone make a profit. It’s just not possible and the numbers tell us all that.
As per now, after all the hype, there are only 1 million pre registered sign ups. That’s an average of 4 per affiliate. This is where I feel their hype now works against them. It’s either a super app and millions will jump on board or it’s mostly hype and 4 signups per affiliate is normal.
As a combine, the affiliate family must pay $2.5 million a month to stay on board which means that each player must spend $25 a month just so that the affiliates can break even. As NFL is almost over, 1 million other players for the other sports must be found to continue covering the monthly overhead.
Those 1 million will fall to 50K or thereabouts so I think 20 million players must be found to end up with 1 million active players.
I may be wrong with the fall off numbers but there’s no way it will be 100% retention. That retention rate will depend on how good the app is but expect it to be between 5% and 10%.
So to answer your original question better. Will affiliates make money? Overall no, but individually some will and here’s how:-
The start off number of affiliates will immediately fall by a large percentage. I can only speculate but lets say 50%. As that increases, the shift towards active affiliates increases presuming that UG do indeed assign those benefits over to remaining affiliates.
By some sort of Darwinian selection, what will remain is an affiliate base of those no longer making a loss from their efforts, be they pre launch sign ups or ongoing activities. For those breaking even or perhaps making a small monthly loss, there is no solid reason to retire.
I believe it’s this “game theory” in action that UG have utilized to make the most money out of the situation. We could disagree all day about how many players there will be, what motivates them to stay, how much they will spend etc but the fact remains that the hype, hope and general BS put out is to keep affiliates on board and keep spending the $9.99 a month and those who actually make money will generate the additional revenue by being creative and active in engaging the players
There’s an opportunity to make money but realistically very difficult to do so and UG have encompassed this model by selling mini businesses on a “so what if I lose” $9.99 a month” basis along with a “share with 100 friends and they will share with 100 others etc” to produce an almost risk free business for themselves.
Their structure is geared towards taking money from as many people as possible until they drop out and transferring some of their loss towards benefits to those who remain. Either way they won’t lose.
@Joe
What specific info are you referring to? If app related it’s from my own experience. If MLM it’s the same but on a lesser scale and only from a non active role.
If about UG then my posts are mostly reactions to others posts but also from other publicly available information. If about property in the Sahara then that was just a joke.
I feel like we just recieved fRee consulting.
Tiernan essentially gave a viable ‘overview’ not being an ‘insider’ Affiliate.
There will be thousands of Affiliates leaving if that haven’t already. This will occur in two ‘exits’…. the initial one with the notice that Affiliates are going to be billed.
The second ‘exit’ or ‘exits’ will occur on Dec. 10th and Jan. 10th…. paydays.
There may be and I say maybe 25,000 Affiliates….left. I think this a ‘generous’ estimation….. there may be… 100,000 Players left… this is also generous I do believe.
The Houston pre-registered requirement is a ‘last; ditch effort to get back the ‘hype’ that they know is no longer there. 29.99 + 9.99 is a bit of change and risk free for United Games as Tiernan mentioned.
He ‘waxed’ positive with the only possible scenario for Affiliates making any money as ‘creating’ an ‘especial niche’ in inviting Players. That would take much work/time on the part of the Affiliates doing this and and is more than likely to go ‘South rather than ‘North’ each payday ‘unless’ the application is a ‘huge’ success and I do not see that, period.
The ‘exits’ explained are for ‘starters’. For myself…. I do not see how this application can be in ‘real time’ ….either. It just isn’t possible…. their will be real time delays between the app and the TV…..it will ‘look’ like ‘real time’….and, as soon as Players watching get that figured out…..and, they will and quickly.
This application is dead and for many other reasons already mentioned here.
We shall see!
What Tiernan said!!
The ad watching business is a scam. The numbers presented were and still are ridiculous.
Look up what the going rates are per thousand impressions. They haven’t adjusted the expectation enough yet.
The value of incentivized adds is even worse than the tylical published rate. Why? Because advertisers don’t value “paid impressions”.
Tiernan has researched and studied apps for years. I would wager has seriously reviewed more than 100 fold the number of apps as any UG Affiliate. Why do people not wake up and smell the coffee. You are wwasting your time, money and ruining relationships. Why are they called “get rich schemes”‘, because they are “schemes” read as “scams”.
It isn’t just the fees you will pay when thye ultimately launch, it is your time effort and reputation. Hopefully you aren’t getting sucked into buying, banners, clothing and whatever junk thye push on you. Thne you ware also out more $$.
Look at the numbers in Tienrna’s above post. The numbers don’t work. Then adjaut for real value of ad watching and it is….truly puny…..
Last post. Hope you don’t waste more time money or soil your reputations further.
I pray you remember this experience next time some one gives you the get rich quick pitch.
Word! Aristotle himself could not have improved on the logic of this post.
I still don’t understand the “commissionable value” of a token. Do I get 10 cents per token commission, or do I get 1 cent per token?
@John Trole…You get $.01 on a token but you need 12 tokens to open up the games. So a player/game is worth $.12 plus if you set up a event like group play.
You will get an additional $.06 from any player. Any coded player because you set up this event, you worked to look for these players and did the invite. So they will play under your code. This is called “Player Game Commission”.
At $.18 a player/game you only need 55 player/games a month to break even a month with your $10 fee. If you are not going to invite players to a game then at $.12 a player/game you need 82 player/games to break even.
There is no commission being paid on free tokens for first time players. This is to get them started and train on the app. I hope I help you with my answer.
You get a penny. Acquired tokens…. 1/2 a penny for Played tokens. Yeah, different tires at even lesser amounts and check matching which ‘will’ never happen a 20%… so, a nickel.
This is a con or a scam however you want to look at it. I have an ‘extensive’ team and I can flat out tell you that even with 100% participation…. which again, is an entire impossibility…….
If ‘anyone’ is foolish enough to ‘buy’ into this in their latest attempt to ‘hype’ it up with the Nov. 15th Q&A that is pre-registration required and cough up 40 bucks in this charade and that is the reason for this masquerade….. you are absolutely crazy!
The ‘hype’ is absolutely gone and this con was well-crafted from the beginning….. it would have taken a ‘genius’ Affiliate to put all of it together when it began….. now, many have!
They are getting to set the final hook when they send out the tax info….. don’t be a fool…. the tax info will probably go out about the same time as they ‘attach’ your credit card.
They have ‘no risk’… never have. Affiliates that bought the ‘gear’ have been screwed big time. Have a nice day!
Denny has an extensive team of affiliates, as he just said…. If his under line drops out because he has been saying this is a con and a scam, then he will get all the player of his under line affiliates as first tier player for himself.
Is this why he has been so strong in his comments that this is a con and a scam? The other people that has said this is a scam were never affiliates and have nothing to gain.
I think the affiliates like Joe knew what the story was all about before they stated to recruit other affiliates and players.
This a MLM business from the get go. Who’s doing the con…the affiliates made those YOU TUBE videos to Hype this app. They con them self into believing this. Invest $50 and get rich.
Look, who cares. You are grasping at ‘straws’ in saying that is what I may want as what I have posted is quite clear.
Joe, whoever, is a total ‘genius’ if he figured this con out that quickly…. ain’t buying that in the least if he was an ‘early’ Affiliate.
Hell, I don’t care who gets my team in the upline as they will make zippo, period. There will be only a few and you will find that they are connected with topglobal/VIP…. United Games created this scenario right from the start.
I am totally out of this as ‘never’ would I give this ‘outfit’ any money let alone my tax information. One would have to be entirely crazy as I said.
I’m a total genius or I can just read. If it requires 12 tokens to enter a live game or 1 token valued at $1.20.. Whats the diff? It’s still a .12 Commission.
Denny, Nothing is new. All of this that you are writing is info that has been in black and white for months. Maybe it was YOU that thought you were gonna get rich quick. My expectations are small. But I will never turn away free money. And by free I think I can make much more than 9.95 a month.
With that said I know have more tier 1 affiliates and players than most people. Certainly more than anyone on my team.
Im not the with VIP or whatever that is that people refer to. Like ive said i’m a normal guy working a 9-5 and trying to earn extra coin off this. If I dont. Life goes on.
Never will understand the purpose of posting the way you do. No one that is an affiliate will read your rants and suddenly bail. At least tiernan has for the most part well thought out posts. I don’t agree with them all but at least they have substance.
SCAM! Con! Crazy! Dont do it! You sound desperate
This thing hasn’t even got off the ground yet. Can we at least give it until Jan? My Goodness
Thanks all! One more question – if Affiliate Paul recruited Affiliate Amy. Affiliate Amy recruited 5 Players. Does Affiliate Bob get a cut of Affiliate Amy’s players- for the money spent or games played by Amy’s Players?
Actually nevermind – I think the answer is here: For those who choose to do so, we also want to reward affiliates for encouraging these same behaviors in other affiliates.
You will be rewarded with a bonus which matches a percentage of the commission that your Active Affiliate earn for both their Tokens Acquired Commissions and their Tokens Played Commissions. The percentage of that check match is as follows:
United Games with your tax information would then know which affiliates to target. Those affiliates with money can invest in them in some kind of way.
Those affiliates that have no money is useless to them or are they your best targets to con and scam? I would not give out my tax returns to God. Not to these people with their history.
They should only need a W4 form for you to pay taxes on your commission. Affiliates are private contractors it’s your business. You need to hire a tax lawyer for this?
Let me make this clear and to all. I am hardly desperate and I am ‘out’ for reasons I have mentioned in detail.
Joe, I did not say that you were with topglobal/vip, ever. Get this ‘straight’…. topglobal/vip is an ‘Affiliate’. Starting to make some sense to you all? Do I need to paint you all a picture?
This was a con and a scam or whatever you want to call it right from the beginning. If you think that paying 9.99 a month after the initial 29.99 that you will make money given the commission schedule that ‘we’ all know and the parameters to do so.. makes it virtually impossible to do so….then, you Joe have re-defined gullibility!
Why waste the time… so, it is only 40, huh. Hell, get a Pizza and a beer…. my Lord!
I fully understand why people are getting angrier and angrier.
Let’s not forget that this was touted as “The next big thing” and “get in before it’s too late”. The language used by UG was designed to convince people that they could “make money by simply sharing an app” and if those “100 friends shared with 100 others” then they would make easy enough money. Saying later that “You didn’t really believe us?” is not a good excuse.
Even the explanation “The companies paying us to advertise are willing to pay XXX one day and YYY another day. It changes from day to day and sometimes hour to hour.” is another example of exaggeration, What happened to good old “X and Y”?
According to their Twitter they had a live simulation yesterday.
The fb posts are quite entertaining. Apparently they were collecting phones at the event. HA! I wonder how it went and if people were let down.
I don’t understand why they don’t just release the app and get their $ rather than allow all these opportunities for people to drop out.
John, I am certain that they were hilarious for the better part. Yeah, ‘things’ are starting to hit home for the ‘underlying’ Affiliates. Google Fanfire application and read that ‘stuff’ there with utube videos from Affiliates that are entirely clueless as to how it ‘really’ works.
I know how it works and ‘defy’ anyone to contact ‘support’ and find out for themselves. You will be ‘gone’ in a heartbeat. Those that got ‘conned’ into buying the Player packages …. that is so damn obvious that comments I made prior are right on the ‘money’….it was the last dead-giveway for me.
They will not ‘bill’ until they are very close to app launch date and get the ‘Affiliate’ mechanics spreadsheet put together. Who will be in and who is out, essentially.
Said before that topglobal/vip is an Affiliate group and they are at the top of the food chain. I will bet on it. You all do as you please, of course…. but you are throwing away your money and this is my opinion. This and has been a total con and scam right from the beginning.
@Denny… Please enough! It is a scam, it’s a con,it’s crazy, don’t waste your time. Give it a break.
Look in your locker room, the app will be launch Nov. 21 in time for the Thanksgiving Holidays. You still have 15 days to cancel after that date.
It’s going to be a good Christmas for the affiliates or for United Games or both. We all will see, soon enough, who’s predictions will be correct.
Who cares…..what are you talking about? Do you know how to read or are you just incredibly naïve about this whole gambit?
I will express my opinion and not ‘blindly’ follow some con that is ‘genius’ and I stated that. Who cares… who cares… go ahead and pay your money and fill out the tax information and hope and pray that you ‘even’ get a check Dec. 10th.
I hope you do but it will amount to zippo! If you think that you are going to get a paycheck that amounts to anything on Dec. 10 ….. you are nuts! What the hell does the app launch date do with it?
All Affiliates already know that. You take the cake for extreme ‘gullibility. I said I was ‘out’, already. Incredible!
Denny stumbles upon this a week ago. Since then he has done nothing but flood this board with the same tired stuff.
What is the real reason is the question? Why does he waste his time trying to convince everyone to drop out? He’s not just being a good guy and looking out for people. Something else to him.
For someone that is so against this, what took him so long to take this stance? He’s had months to talk to support etc. He just now came up with this info and found this site to start posting on.. Where was he before he knew it was a “scam”?
Gimme a break. Dude is a fraud.
Now lets hear Denny say how im gullible and can spend my money however.. he doesnt care.. he is out.. its a scam… blah blah blah.
‘Had’ 223 Affiliates and 334 Players. Good bye.
@Denny Can i buy your spot? We will roll the CC info and i’ll pay a TBD cash amount
Ya, I’ll be happy to take it as well. Since we are all suckers ill be happy to pay you money for that.
This isn’t about whether you’re a “sucker”, it’s about whether you’re a fraudster prepared to participate and help fund a scheme.
The owners are pyramid schemers, the math doesn’t work, delays and excuses have happened, and it’s an MLM. C’mon man!!!
JOE… I think you’re right about this Denny. The Dude is a fraud. He has under him 223 affiliates and 334 players and now he thinks it’s a scam and con.
He is the guy that recruited all these people. Why doesn’t he just tell those 557 people it’s a scam. Is this a joke?
His affiliate’s players are all link to him. If his affiliates drop out, their recruited players still has their code.
If you drop out now, your players become first tier to your up line. Denny maybe conning his 223 affiliates to drop out and get their players. Who knows how many players his 223 affiliates signed up. That is why, if you hang in there, you will get more players.
Denny must have put in some effort to get 223 affiliates. Denny must have answered 1000s of questions from his affiliates. He must have known everything to answer them.
I would pay his $50 for him. Denny lets make a deal. Just joking.
Agree 100%.. Unless this guy is some social network genius or public figure .. it’s next to impossible to get that many affiliates convinced to fork out that type of money.
You would have to be hustling day and night. He would have known this business inside and out and not just magically discover something as he claims.
CoCtDe…..I would not do that to my ‘worst’ enemy. Mutt and Jeff have not a clue.
If they bothered to read my posts above (which, they obviously haven’t), and; they just continue with their posts. Rather comical, really.
I have stated that if any Affiliate goes to ‘support’ and asks one question…. Do I get paid if I do not ‘create an ‘event’ aka organize a ‘game’? The answer is no.
Further, an Affiliate that does create a game/event does not ‘guarantee’ that any Player that ‘plays’ the ‘game’ is ‘attached to you regardless of your ‘code’. The ‘Affiliate’ that creates the ‘game’ gets paid.
Your ‘secure’ code means nothing….. you are in competition with xxxxx number of Affiliates. Mutt and Jeff get a clue!
No one knew that when this started and obviously you do not either. Char’s comment is right on….. who is the ‘fraudster, here …. Mutt and Jeff?
Further, how many Affiliates do you think visit this site? Not many, Mutt and Jeff. All Affiliates get the same notifications and as independent contractors they make their own decisions….they are ‘big boys’.
It is not my responsibility to ‘alert’ them to all the changes….. My Affiliates know my ‘take’ and then they make their decision as to what they will do. Wake up Mutt and Jeff!
You are so clueless it pains me to read. I thought you were leaving.
This was written in black and white from UG from day 1. See below
Summary:
Players are linked to your code when they earn. Period.
It says multiple times when YOU invite others to play a game you earn commission.
So yes, I knew it when this started.. I read.
Sorry it took you 4 months to realize and still had to ask support for clarification when it was right in your face the entire time. This isnt breaking news.
Denny do you really have 223 affiliates and 334 players? Have you already canceled you affiliate spot?
Mutt or Jeff? Makes no difference as one and the same. Read it closer, Mutt or Jeff.
You are missing a ‘huge’ point. You have x number of Players that are already pre-registered with you and are ‘connected’ to you under your code, already.
Those pre-registered Players are not, in fact,’unless’ you organize a ‘game’ and re-invite them when they are already pre-registered and therein lies the scam or con or whatever you want to call it.
All Affiliates that I know did not have a clue that that is the way it worked. Hell, common sense tells you that making money in the scenario that ‘all’ know now is impossible.
Look, posting this and that means nothing to me nor does it to any other Affiliates that get it, now.
Posting the ‘bylaws’ is interesting. You are beginning to look like a UG plant to me. Too funny and I couldn’t resist. Denial is a bitch there Mutt or Jeff!
I am willing to be worse than your worse enemy. I know what I am getting myself into and offering you financial gain to step-out of a position that you already want out of.
William, yes I do have those numbers.
(Ozedit: There won’t be any auction here.)
Denny, are you going to cancel your affiliate spot?
Look, Mutt or Jeff. Only a fool would convert to a Player. I have notified my affiliates that I will cancel my account.
I wanted to get involved in one last Q&A and introduce myself and let all know my questions and they can hear the answers. I could give a shit about this whole con and that it is.
Good luck you fools and this is my last comment…. so comment to some other ‘idiot’ Mutt and Jeff! Now, you all get rich!
@Denny
I really don’t know what to make of you, and really doesn’t matter what I think.
I think it is you that is missing the big point about players being assigned to you. Do you realize that you earn a commission when the players assigned to you acquire a token (that isn’t free)?
It doesn’t matter what affiliate or player starts a game and invites your players. The person that created the game will earn a commission on tokens played, but the affiliate (you) that signed up the player will still have earned a commission when that player acquired the tokens that will be used to play in the game.
I have understood this from the beginning. Most of the income projection information that I saw was only showing commissions from tokens acquired. I will agree that most of the income projections were overly exaggerated.
Interesting question the more I think it through.
For example, no matter how spectacularly this app flops flat on its face, UG makes money, correct? I think we all can all agree on that point.
Btw, what are some other models where you win no matter the outcome? Casinos? Insider trading? Churches?
What I’m wondering is what’s next? UG positioned themselves as an “app developer” and have structured their business such that each app is an MLM-able offering.
To be clear, when I say “UG” I’m referring to Whatsherface and her Bro-in-law CEO. The day those two Swindle Shits are app developers is the day I’m an Astronaut, but such is the mindset of the serial swindler.
What they really are, as Tiernan aptly pointed out, is Merchants of Greed whose mantra is “Fake it until you make it.”
It’s very clever when you thing about it. Their model is much like Oil Wild Catting in that you don’t have to build a new company each time you drill a well. Instead each project is structured as a separate legal entity thereby isolating the risk and reward to the project itself.
And like wild catting, investors know on the front end that is both high risk and potentially very high returns.
Can we expect another “bigger than all outdoors” app? I think it’s quite likely and if so the next question is how many existing affiliates will make the mental transition from “once in a lifetime opportunity” to “you-win-some-you-lose some” investor?
You have to admit that UG has one helluva mailing list — a ginormous pool of fools” — they could milk this con for a looooong time.
Like rust, greed never sleeps.
So I attended one of the satellite events recently.. Notes from it
1. NBA is following NFL. They are trying to get NCAA sports involved.
2. App is launching prior to Turkey day games. Will either be 21st,22nd or 23rd.
3. Affiliates will be charged AFTER its released on Dec 1st. Meaning you will be able to get a feel for the game. If you dont like it.. If it’s not what you envisioned etc..
You still have the option to get out after playing it. (would love to hear the detractors try and spin that)
4. They have just under 250k affiliates and over 1 million players.
5.Saw the app on Presenters phone. It’s simple and clean. They recorded NE/Sea games and showed us it in action. Impressed
6. Create leagues private or open. Join “celebrity” leagues. Invite players to them and you get commission as well from that.
7. Ads will NOT pop up during live game play.
8. You can share tokens with other players etc.
9. I recall him saying the max # of tokens you can stored is 1k.
That’s what I remember as of now
Any other questions anyone may have let me know and ill be happy to answer what i can.
@Joe – You covered the Road Trip pretty much. I am sad MLS is not launching. I have tickets to championship which is the weekend after launch.
I hope we are given a 12 hr heads up about the launch. That will be the final pre-register push.
Since this thread is about spam – The idea of not being charged is good.
You did miss that ads won’t be running for 3-6 weeks. So that will cut into income generation .
I am still trying to figure out what would be the reason for a person off the street to use the app if its not for the money?
or
why would they play more than once?
Where is the repeat play value?
Love to.
Affiliates are really investing more than just the $40 or so in this “business opportunity” and everything relies on the attraction of the game to a HUGE audience for 250,000 affiliates to convert both the effort and money in to a reasonable return.
A very large part of the success of the app will depend on whether it works in real time for players not attending that particular game.
Was that clarified?
I feel the thrust of argument has moved very much away from the “only $9.99” which is up to any individual to decide is ok or not to the long term dynamics of a business model and enviroment where 250,000 people are chasing a limited audience.
Still only 4 players per affiliate?
I’ll take a shot at it. It’s a throw away feature. They’re not sacrificing anything.
Prior to this you were touting “They wont charge jus unit the app is rolled out and say it all proudly to demonstrate you’ve thought this one though and that right there is is your fail safe. Can quit anytime.
You guys just don’t get it. You have giant hooks in your mouths You’re in. You’ve already bought into the dream.
I guarantee that both you knuckleheads will be card carrying, dues paying Affiliates come next years because you didn’t a get a full season in last years a n basketball a nd baseball a nd exerting did’t do as well because….. But hey, this was always about football and that’s where it will make it’s final stand…. yada yada yada.
Yeah, you could could have gotten out for free, gave it a test drive and opt out. But you didn’t and you won’t.
How I do? That was pretty good logical grenade on that one I think.
Thank you for the “boots on the ground” report Joe, it’s appreciated.
No spin, it’s a wise choice on their part.
They’ve been stringing the affiliates along for months, it’s hard to guess how many people put their credit card info into the website and have either forgotten about this deal or simply lost interest and forgot to blank out their info.
Either way there will be people asking for charges to be reversed and that’s never a good thing on a fresh merchant account.
By waiting until December 1st to run the charges UG is not only doing the “right” thing (and I give them credit for that) but they also can tell the card companies how far they’re willing to go to be reasonable.
Again, it’s a wise choice but doesn’t this push the first payday back into January?
Are they really trying to cultivate the impression that the NCAA is going to be somehow “involved” with UG/FireFan? If so queue Natalyn spending the next few weeks schooling affiliates to stop saying that even though heard from UG first.
I love the way the last email added:
to the list of things that need to be scrubbed off the internet.
Gee, where did UG affiliates get the idea that Mark Mongie was in some way responsible not only for Madden football but for several other EA Sports titles as well?
Well that would be the video UG put out last summer with Natalyn interviewing Mark and both of them lying about his credentials.
Darn those affiliates for repeating some of the lies UG told them.
Anyway, it’s about a week till app launch, I wonder how long we’ll have to wait until we find out what the player engagement numbers are shaping up like?
Ha…exactly. What they really mean is that hell yes you cheat and lie all you want. Turn a nobody into the world foremost expert, put numbers lie $25/K in people’s heads and say it’s easy.
All of that is fine….IF YOU KJNOW WHAT YOUR DOING and knowhow to do it. I’ll bet Nattie Whatsherac says “Those stupid Mother Fuckers” at least 10 times a day.
I tell ya the one that cracked me up and affiliate after affiliate would do this in their set your hair on fire UG Sermons, they would make some outrageous claim and follow that up with “I guarantee it!”
UH, Mr.Affiliate, here’s subpoena for a civil lawsuit…
Yes real time without needing to be at, or watching the,game. Picture me following the eagles through espn app, while watching Broncos. The same live game feed with moments will stream through app.
The Mutt and Jeff team is not giving you the ‘real’ picture in the least.
You will be charged for the tech fee prior to the ‘start up’ fee being charged and that will be done the 21st of this month or whenever they decide but about then.
You will be given a 50% discount of the 9.99 (really nice of them)…. they will ‘conveniently’ separate that from the tokens that you ‘purchase’ to ‘play’ the game and ‘share’ the app….. these ‘tokens are a buck a token for Affiliates. Is not that gracious of them!
Hey, I just watched the videos posted yesterday. Go ahead Mutt and Jeff and tell me I am wrong….. you guys have your heads up your buttox!
You are wrong on the “tokens are a buck a token for Affiliates. Is not that gracious of them! ”
Prove me wrong and i have $10 for ya.
Watch and listen to video and the charge for tokens in the video…. it is based on the dollar a token that is 10% or a dime, now.
That is commissionable tokens that are pre-paid for in a few ways to share the app. I should have clarified that.
The latest video is by a Merle guy that tells you flat out that this app is nowhere near ready to go ‘launch’ and is ‘still’ in a ‘beta’ stage’….and, I mentioned ‘social media’ before….. if you can possibly that think that anyone in their right mind is going to ‘live’ on the site and just do this for a penny….. possible per token played. You are living in ‘fantasyland’.
This is the best con that I have ever witnessed. Have fun! Save your money, cdoetec or whatever …. I don’t need it!
@Denny I am still waiting to hear you back up your claim that affiliates must invite or create new events in order to earn a commission from the tokens acquired by signed players.
If you don’t coherently address or retract that claim then the rest of what you say has no credibility.
Contact ‘support’ and ask the questions to confirm what I have stated and have asked that all Affiliates do that and find out for themselves…..and, so stated that on this site!
Why haven’t you done that? If you are ‘all’ so convinced then that you should have done weeks ago! Lord have mercy!
You ‘all’ want to remain ‘incoherent’ of the facts! You are living in a ‘dreamworld’ and am certain Natalyn is laughing right now while dummies like you ‘fund’ their software beta testing ‘ongoing’ as Jessie Merle ‘defined’ in the latest video and handed them a nice ‘pot’ of onging money monthly at the same time!
Calling me ‘incoherent’ is a compliment! What does that make you ‘all’? Dumb and Dumber!
I have contacted support and not sure how you come up your claims.
They told me you earn 10% commissions on all tokens your players acquire. If you invite your players to use their tokens in a game you created you earn an additional 5% commissions on those tokens played.
They said if you don’t create games to invite players to join you lose out on earning 5% commissions but you still earn your 10% commissions on all tokens acquired regardless of where they play them at.
Is this app in the App stores yet or what? Wasn’t it promised for the 21st or 22nd November?
@JohnH – Promised for the week of the 21st.
Tokens acquired at a penny a token for pre-registered Players.
How many Affiliates have enough pre-registered Players to make any money? That is an easy answer….. none, other than those at the top of the food chain and the app must go viral and quickly even for them.
The second part is that you must create an event to get half a penny…. and, the players can play with anyone that creates a event….. even if they are your pre-registered Players….. the commissions go to the Affiliate that created the event….. not you.
There is not one possible way that 99% of the Affiliates will be able to cover their monthly tech fee.
For those of those Affiliates that just ‘refuse’ to get the con…. watch the latest two videos by Natalyn on ‘how the token purchases’ work. And, how the ‘download’ will work and what is ‘necessary’ for you to do as an Affiliate to ‘engage’ Players stage by stage.
Hell, you don’t get it? Geez…. it will only cost you 10 bucks for a 100 tokens for Affiliates… so, do that in ‘advance’ in your ‘backoffice’ and guarantees that you will save 30% of the price that the app store must make as part of ‘business’.
Are all the Affiliates on here that have been staunch proponents entirely braindead!
My God….. wake up!
I will take it one step further for those Affiliates that are entirely ‘brain dead’.
If you listened to Jessie Merle’s video and that ‘part’ about being ‘perfect’ and ‘creating’ a Facebook or Twitter of ‘sports’ and keeping in contact and ‘sharing’ and the ‘likes’ and ‘creating’ a social venue on the ‘now’ ‘sports app’ version….. you wonder why it was only 10% of a dime token value.
One penny and 1/2 a penny but you Affiliates purchase before so we can get a ‘feel’ of what we have going forward. That is why the ‘token’ value is 10% of 10% or a penny….. this was set-up to appeal to social media and now they have flat out stated that.
Why, the 1 million pre-registered Players that will ‘never’ spend any money on anything ‘unless’ it is ‘free’.
They have been touting that for weeks….. you do not think this is a con…. again, brain dead.
Agreed on most people DO NOT spend money in apps.
Forcing affiliates to pay to play is bad. I think many affiliates thought they would be able to watch ads so that they could play during the week.
So yes – For The company, get 250,000 ppl to spend $10 or more to get these tokens. and keep them doing it, generates a lot of money AND is only from the user base.
Are we in ponzi-scheme territory when the affiliates are the main source of income for the company?
Because unless this app turns out to be very popular, it’s the affiliates spending all the money on ‘tech’ fees, tokens and marketing materials and who knows what else that may be in the pipeline.
Yeah, that video was awful… not inspiring confidence.
natalyn lewis posted a video on facebook around 9 hrs ago, asking affiliates to keep their eyes ‘peeled’ as firefan was coming soon.
apparently apple wanted some small change which has been complied with, so launch is any time now [like today!!]
phew..this firefan game thingie better be worth all the testosterone that has been flowing for months now!! 🙂
facebook.com/RealFireFan/?hc_ref=SEARCH&fref=nf
Anyone read the latest email? The app will launch in the morning but it will be a beta version for the next few weeks without ads or token purchases? Am I reading this wrong?
Yes, except that the tokens can be purchased (13 cents each) through the app stores.
Denny, don’t forget to cancel otherwise you’ll be charged in the morning
this thread is very long and i’m not sure this has been covered here already, but a guy called dustin mitchell who is running for being elected ‘justice court judge’ in fresco texas, was in some sort of a dispute with united games and was threatening litigation.
on november 2nd, 2016 mitchell posted on facebook:
it appears that mitchell settled his dispute with UGM out of court.
however on november 14th, 2016 mitchell posted :
affiliates better keep an eye on any upcoming litigation. lawsuits can severely burden a new launch financially, and affect growth when there are allegations of ‘deceptive practices’ as mitchell has alleged.
as it is, UGM is coming across as poorly managed with the app being delayed several times, and now launching in ‘beta’ mode for who knows how long. there is only so much excitement that affiliates can maintain over such extended ‘waits’.
also to be noted is that negative comments on the official firefan FB page keep getting deleted. after continuous delays it is only natural that there will be some exasperation and some questions.
if the management has the time to delete these comments/questions surely they have the time to give proper responses?
soooo firefan launched a couple of hours ago except that it hasn’t launched!
it’s available on google and apple play stores but cant be downloaded!
affiliates are disappointed after all the noise and fanfare about the launch.
corporate does not have the decency to post just a few lines on facebook about the exact status of the launch, so that affiliates don’t have to stand around pulling out their hair .
looks like a botched up mess so far!
someone just posted that the available version is ‘bugged’ and the final version will be launched shortly.
does this sort of thing often happen when apps launch?
not looking very good!
Big surprise that corporate didn’t just send an email.
affiliates are claiming that apple store has crashed ;
finally an announcement from corporate;
the proof of the pudding lies not in breaking downloading records but in playing firefan and continuing to play firefan.
so how’s the game ??!!
an affiliate has summed up the launch very aptly:
firefan better be so good that it can retain customers or else UGM will end up being a pyramid scheme.
I hve the app…anjali, another update please.
you go first. how’s firefan??
well since CoDecT isn’t sharing, here’s a glimpse of the slow motion train wreck playing out on FB:
what fun.
All the time as no amount of Beta testing can recreate a live environment. Not great though when the sign up page is a 404 (not found) one as is was the case for me.
Seems to me as expected, players can download without an invite and find a league without any need for affiliates. The top ranked leagues will. win whereas those not at the top of their search will lose.
Is anybody at all surprised that the app doesn’t work?
Playing with the IOS app now. This is the single most unresponsive app I have ever used.
It has just crashed and I received an error message.
What has ex-EA sports Mark Mongie been up to all these months?
the problems with firefan continue as of this moment, with affiliates complaining they either cant download or the app is too slow.
the problems are being blamed on the high volume the app is attracting:
the initial reports from a few affiliates who have been able to play the game are good:
i think we will get a better picture of firefan after the app [and the affiliates] has had time to settle.
Ho hum! Have not heard a positive word from any Affiliates. That is rather odd to say the least.
Conveniently done was taking the Affiliates off the board in ‘purchasing’ tokens for the time being while this ‘beta testing’ period is done and God knows when that will be as they have not a clue, either. Positive remarks are ‘plants’ and would bet a penny on that.
Sarcasm….sure. The ‘ponzi’ scheme would kick in and it is there. How much money will United Games…they ‘split’ with the app stores in assistance?
If you think that had not been agreed on…. prior…… wake up.
United Games is just getting a feel on how much further they want to go with this right now. Right now, they are SOL and as things go in the direction that they pre-arranged…..they cannot turn back.
Software crash when they knew that prior with no systems support and they ‘knew’ it was going to be that ‘big’. Total bullshit, period.
They will get no ‘money’ from me as have already taken care of that. Hey, do as you will but know this is a total con and always has been.
Lastly, do not think this is ‘enjoyable’ for me. I am certain that many here thought this was the real deal other than a few that ‘spotted’ it right from the beginning.
Have a nice Thanksgiving evening. Wish you all the best one way or the other.
Oh, phooey. It’s downloading fast because people are eager to make money, NOT because they want to use it and spend tokens.
No))) They have been too busy with all the hype and are making some seriously stupid mistakes. Already the app has received more than 300 5 star ratings in iTunes with users saying how they love playing games with all the family.
It’s normal not to employ the “rate my app” feature for early versions to avoid the negative ratings a new app would generally receive as bugs are common, but UG just ploughs on thinking that hype means delivery and success.
Of course the app crashed with 250K affiliates and up to 1 million players downloading it on release. A fair percentage of those players will now be lost after the hard work done by affiliate recruiters.
It has been a comedy of errors so far and I believe this will continue for some time
And, someone would believe those numbers why ???
Given the number of lies and half truths told since the beginning of this saga, why would anyone choose to believe the numbers are accurate ???
I think some people would believe those numbers but most people of course don’t. I’m just using their released statements as a it’s the only numbers given. I think 25,000 affiliates which included downline etc would be closer to the mark.
I think the app crashed not because of numbers but because they are idiots
What? They didn’t bring Apple down? They didn’t set the all time download record? They didn’t eclipse Candy Crush? They didn’t set the world’s hair on fire?
Unbelievable. Truly.
Well, not to dismay. All Affiliates will be given 12 ‘free’ token to give this another chance as it was ‘terrible’ and a ‘bit better’ and ‘getting better’… and, I travelled all over the nation promoting this and only charged 5$ a head and leave your cell phones at the door. And, you really think Dave & Busters gives a rat’s ass.
Our nation has gotten very very small with the nationwide tour…. this Nataly lady is an incredible con as all this is…. it is ‘amazing’ that they will continue! Damn, who knows what they will come up with next.
Hell, this app cannot possibly work with the NBA as 90% of the players have not one idea what they are going to do next….. the NBA is a joke and getting worse each year.
(Ozedit: Offtopic derail attempt removed)
this app is dead in the water and I was too stupid to see it from the beginning as some did.
Oh, and I do know that the NCAA will ‘never’ allow any program of this ‘type’ as this Jessie Merle has mentioned a few times.
Looking at his video…. he looks like he has way too much caffeine or something else. Going to watch some football…. on the TV set.
a bit of backstory first.
so, mitchell used to be an affiliate of UGM, something happened , he threatened to sue them for deceptive practices and get an injunction to stop the launch, and UGM threw him out.
MLM attorney kevin thompson was hired by UGM, who spoke to mitchell on oct 31, 2016, and as of nov 2, 2016 the matters were smoothed over with UGM promising to change some things and mitchell taking down youtube videos and articles he had published about his fight with the company.
mitchell, FB, oct 31:
well, yesterday’s launch has not gone down well with dustin mitchell who posted a few hours ago:
also, while the official firefan FB page is ‘moderated’ and has affiliates in the ‘be supportive! be positive! everything’s GREAT!!’ mode, on mitchell’s FB page affiliates are voicing more honest opinions:
if the firefan app is really not all it was touted to be and mitchell resumes his legal feud, UGM may be in hot water right off the bat!
I am quite amazed that the app is using the official NFL team names and logos…I would have thought they did not get permission for that.
The ‘separation’ that United Games has done with the application named FireFan is rather ingenious and well thought out… ‘beforehand’.
The Affiliates as ‘partners’ will be or could be included in perpetuating a ‘fraud’…. once they are billed and pay the start up fee…. they are ‘partners’. United Games is thinking about that right now and do not think they are not.
The ‘data mining’ is right there for United Games and have always had that thought and that is a ‘chunk’ of money right there and probably has already started. Any Affiliate should be extremely wary right now.
Only a suggestion…. I will delete my account today…. I remember a ‘conversation’ with ‘support’ they alerted me to the fact that… “that is what I signed for” when asked ‘support’ some very pertinent questions that I have voiced…. right here.
You do not see all the ‘proponents’ of United Games here responding, anymore. Now, why is that?
All the messages and the Affiliates are on record in this way…. emails and contacts and ‘teams’….. I see a class action suit coming for ‘fraud’…….. United Games is in some serious trouble and I have a thought they know it. Just my opinion.
I don’t know if that Mitchell guy is solid but he is right about the beta fib. Quick back-step to call the mis-launch a beta.
Too many details remain unclear. And not just because I find it hard to watch the ‘training’ videos which are somewhat patronizing and mainly a continuation of the sales pitch. Please just write the facts down, UG.
Affiliates are being told to not share with players yet and there isn’t (yet?) an in-app invite option or direct way to have players sign up with one’s affiliate code so it seems like a missed opportunity.
Even pre-registered players remain as orphan players until UG gets them assigned on the back end so referrals from those players probably go into the orphan pool… a potentially large loss for the very active affiliates… perhaps exciting for those without a big downline but to my knowledge UG still hasn’t said how it will distribute orphan players through the ‘algorithm’.
Fairly accurate statement, lookie. The ‘Mitchell’ guy is ‘solid’. Easy to do a search and find this out yourself. You were given that info right here on this site above.
Using the term “somewhat patronizing” is laughable at this point. There are those of you that will refuse to believe that this is a well-orchestrated con right from the beginning.
I am guessing that they will continue to thank you as Affiliates and ‘use’ you to avoid answering questions that should answer but cannot or choose not to do for God knows what reason.
You mentioned ‘orphaned’ and the algorithm… where do you think the Players went that downloaded the app?
Here is my guess….. this is a ‘beta’ stage and all those that did download the app are now ‘captive’ and ‘recognized’ and will go to those Affiliates on the ‘highest’ levels and in collusion with UG and topglobal/VIP as was the ‘deal’ right from the beginning.
This is where they will have a real problem with ‘fraud’ in an organized ‘ponzi’ scheme….. from the beginning. They are in a quandary right now trying to figure out the mess and know they are being scrutinized closely, even by the State Attorney General of Utah… check it yourselves.
Is this also sour grapes? Just too much seems to add up that this is going to be one of the biggest ‘busts’ ever depending on how you want to define ‘busts’.
dustin mitchell has announced his plans regarding UGM a few hours ago:
he is alleging there has been ‘Major Major Fraud’ but is not revealing anymore than that.
i guess we have to wait for him to file his complaint. that is, if he doesn’t ‘settle’ for some money and ‘forgets’ all about the fraud!
A beta testing is done prior to launch. A “soft launch” is where selected countries are used to test some aspects of an app in a real environment but UG has done a full launch, and calling it “beta” is a lie.
right. affiliates are saying this too!
moreover, affiliates are having to buy tokens to play. though some free tokens have been provided they are not nearly enough as tokens are getting lost due to several glitches. beta tests are supposed to be free.
UGM better not charge affiliates anything, including any monthly autoship, till their ‘beta test’ is over!
anjali, lookieloo, DENNY… make a google search of Dustin Mitchell in the St. Louis Post. you will find out who your idol is.
Colorful histor
Colorful history but doesn’t detract from the fact that UG is stepping through a legal minefield at the moment.
Ponzi, MLM or pyramid will be defined by where the bulk of their revenues, and those of their affiliates, comes from.
For me, this is the reason they have been so adamant to get affiliates to remove all references on the internet before launch, cloaked with the BS “protect our brand” statement.
The app is not unique, it’s not anything special, and all tose false calims may well come back to bite them on the ass.
uh, who said anything about mitchell being an ‘idol’?
as far as i’m concerned, he’s an ex UGM affiliate who is threatening to get an injunction against them and alleging ‘fraud’.
i’m interested in the message, not the messenger.
Bigger than Candy Crush! Bigger than Angry Birds! Bigger than Pokémon! Get in now before it’s to late!
I just checked the App charts. FireFan is nowhere to be found in the top 150 apps.
Such a scam by UG.
there are some affiliates complaining that united games corporate is refusing to cancel their accounts.
the long wait for the app to be launched caused affiliates to request corporate to cancel their accounts. now after the launch, there may be dissatisfied affiliates seeking to cancel their accounts.
but according to reports, UGM is practicing a ‘no cancellation policy’:
another affiliate commented on FB today:
AFAIK, an MLM company cannot refuse to cancel affiliate accounts as this would be an ‘unfair practice’ falling under the purview of the FTC.
firefangamereview.com/united-games-no-cancellation-policy/
Just cancel your credit card existing and have a new one sent.
The reason is simple when you talk to the credit card company…. suspected fraud. Understand this is being done by many, already. This only adds to the ‘turmoil’ that UGA has on their hands right now, legally.
All of this could have been avoided if they were ‘legit’…. really legit and not a con operation which believe it has been right from the beginning.
One thing is certain…. this app is dead right now and you will never hear from the ‘outfit’ again ‘promoting’ any ‘internet’ venture.
Everyone Loses
===============
The contrarians sigh,
The angels weep,
The punishing lashes of greed denied
“Another One Bites The Dust”.
Latest video by Lewis said they are not running cards until 2 weeks from now, or until app works perfectly. They are also delaying commissions until 01/10/17.
A quote I found interesting in regards to paying the commission “We know you wanted the commission but we have to charge (your cards) in order to pay commissions” … seems funny to me.
Maybe they can charge the Affiliates $9.99 and pay them back 10% commission of that as that will be their only revenue. Ha! What a deal!
prior to the beta launch of firefan, affiliates had been signing up players with the promise of prizes for winning games. they could download firefan for free, buy tokens for playing games and could expect prizes. the offer of prizes was no doubt a strong ‘incentive’ for players to sign up.
this is how an affiliate marketed firefan on facebook in oct, 2016:
a recent email from UGM to affiliates has now withdrawn the offer of prizes, as legally this would be considered ‘gambling’. now they expect affiliates to offer prizes themselves, if they so wish. :
already there are affiliates complaining about the the quality of the app, they are having to purchase tokens for playing in beta phase of the launch, and now they have to finance prizes themselves for attracting players!
just yesterday an affiliate has announced a 20$ prize for players in his downline. currently affiliates haven’t even begun earning commissions and they are already investing in tokens and prizes!
after having affiliates work for free for several months in preparation for the Biggest Game App Launch Ever, UGM is failing them on every front.
If the prizes are draw-based and have nothing to do with the app… uh, why bother?
You say that like this wasn’t the plan all along? You hook your affiliates, bleed them for everything you can, then burn the whole thing and move on to the next scheme.
The comments I have received from Affiliates to this point that are on my team are entirely negative, all.
Do I personally think that this is being done/has been done by UGA by ‘design’, yes. The last video by Jesse Merle told a ‘story’….he says this ‘glitch or glitches’ in the app were foreseen.
Yes, the Affiliates have been ‘used’ and are continuing to be ‘used’ right now in this ‘beta’ testing which is an entire joke to me.
Many have spent more than time in real dollars and cents that could present a real legal problem for UGA in the future…. not that are not having problems legally right now and an educated guess tells me that they are quite aware of this and trying to do a real tap dance while the ‘beta’ testing goes on.
Affiliates are partners in crime and they (UGA) are making that quite clear in their …… thank you Affiliates as our ‘partners’.
I have cancelled my card as stated so I cannot be billed…. in the meantime, I can watch this ‘unfold’…..
I see not one positive for the Affiliates other than those at the ‘top’ of the food chain which is TopGlobal/VIP in collusion with UGA and this was all arranged from the very beginning so UGA/TopGlobal/VIP has a win win regardless as even those that refuse to admit this is a con as they are in such denial with all the time and money they have wasted and were so duped, it downright embarrassing for them.
I foresee incredible problems for UGA down the line….. legally. This whole application is a complete disaster.
I have been watching this since July when I joined as an affiliate.
It’s a complete and utter disaster. The idea was great, the execution is joke at best. The app has major programming flaws that’s why it’s slow and full of bugs. Bugs that won’t be worked out buy this time next year.
I’ve been a part of large software rollouts and app builds, I see the writing on the wall because I was once in the same situation.
You can have 30 of the best AWS servers and still have an incredible slow and shitty app. In fact if throwing servers and capacity at an app doesn’t fix it- you know you have major coding and database problems.
Horrible code is the cause and to resolve it would mean rebuilding the entire application – I guarantee you that’s not going to happen.
The app looks like it’s build in a webview – google “webview apps” and read about all the performance issues. If they actually think they can fix everything and have the app work in real-time or even near real-time they are kidding themselves.
Then we have winview an app that does the exact same thing, that’s in both app stores and works without issue – why would anyone use firefan other then the affiliates that simple don’t know any better?
On the subject of affiliates – I feel really bad for them, 99.99% of them don’t have the technological knowledge so see through the Beta bullshit and to actually see that the app will never work as promised. They just keep promoting it like a bunch of lemmings. It’s time for everyone to wake up and move on.
Watch all the UG corporate videos from right before launch to now. Jesse says that there might be a crash two days before the launch, – he’s not 100% sure there will be a crash but he warns affiliates. Then in the next video he says that he know with 100% certainty there would be a crash and that’s the only way to stress test. TOTAL CROCK OF SHIT.
If that’s how this team stress test a new app – they there’s your proof that they simply do not have the knowledge or knowhow of how to build an app.
Move on people life’s too short for buy into this BS from these inept idiots.
Correct me if I am wrong but it was my understanding that Winview has a simpler set of questions… with the only possible answers being yes or no, not that that takes away from the rest of what you said.
I’m a developer. That is just to tinetomoveon:
When billing time comes I will call my affiliates to inform them it’s time and whether they should exit.
I get nothing from my friends burning 50. My goodwill stretchs further being upfront. In my case I’ll pump money into it. Half a pair of jeans odds nothing.
The drive pixks qere interesting n
The latest communique from UG is a doozy! This was yesterday and citing how a dad and his 9 year old son enjoyed the application soooooooooo much with both playing ….and, the 9 year old thanking his Dad for such a great application!
God, even the most ‘loyal’ to the bone Affiliates on this site have to be thinking that UG is totally losing their collective minds to ‘peddle’ this bullshit!
It is so bad it is downright hilarious! Man, they are flat out calling all Affiliates dumb!
@Denny
What’s frightening is the Affiliates are still eating this shit up.
Tomorrow will be another disaster and the Affiliates will still believe that “THEIR APP” is coming along nicely.
This is how cults happen.
@TimeToMoveOn
It will make no difference to these ‘disciples’ of this application as they are part in parcel of all this by ‘design’ if I don’t miss my guess.
They have not one clue what you mean by “THEIR APP”…..or, do they?
I got it. I got the ‘cult’ thing, also. Jim Jones is probably thinking that he needs to give another cup/drink of that nice tasting beverage.
You send in your tax information and pay the ‘dues’ then you are bought and sold as ‘participant’. I will let the Affiliates figure that out.
All Affiliates are ‘independent’ contractors and no sponsor ‘owes’ a thing to any Affiliate as all get the same information.
It’s a ‘trap’ for those that pay there dues and send in their tax info. I wonder why? Give it a thought.
UGA is not other than a well-conceived con. The absolute best have seen.
Glad you have figured it out.
Sad truth is, it’s just another one to add to the list.
If you haven’t seen this article already, you might find it an interesting read. It’s very long and thorough and one of my favorites. Check out the list on the left column which isn’t even up to date. Scary!
financialindustryscam.com/mlm.htm
@Char
I took a look at the article and nothing surprising there as ‘cons’ are a nickel a dozen, nowadays.
Nu Skin originators was a subtle tip-off to me from the get-go. Like most figured what the heck as the premise was so enticing and ‘new’.
This ‘outfit’ has had FTC violations before in Nu Skin. It appears they haven’t changed their spots….. in deception. But, damn… give them credit in ‘deception’ under a ‘new’ guise.
Why Mongie got himself involved with this…. boredom, I guess…. or broke.
Jesse Merle is easy to figure as ‘snowfall’ might be his biggest problem. He is hilarious.
Natalyn is a ‘pro’ and has been involved in many other ventures as ‘lead’ into con and she does it well, too well. She can wear ‘hats’ in a milli-second! She is the best lead a con deal can have.
This is becoming a ‘topic’ and nothing more.
@denny
Mongie is no longer with the company. Affiliate CC’s were charged, then the game was a disaster on Thursday.
They have token subscriptions that they are encouraging affiliates to subscribe to because E it’s a deal. This whole thing is a joke of a scam.
@TimeToMoveOn
Had not one clue about Mongie but hardly surprised he has ‘vacated’.
If that is the case then all Affiliates should get a ‘clue’ but for most ‘remaining’ they will go ‘down’ with the ‘ship’.
Those ‘Affiliates’ are the ‘ones’ I defined as UGM/UGA/topglobal…. VIP and FireFan as it is an all in one con and has been from the beginning.
These ‘groups’ are the ‘real’ Affiliates that ‘did’ have any ‘chance’ of making any money. The ‘other’ Affiliates were totally ‘used’ and ‘defined’ as ‘partners’ in this well-conceived ‘con’.
Now, that those going down with ‘ship’ have been defined through the credit card billing and tax info agreed to then they are participants in this con or scam or whatever you want to call it. Tough to call it a total scam as the above-mentioned….. have ‘protected’ themselves well.
My credit card was attempted on the 8th and as I stated it had been cancelled…. I was given a ‘grace’ period until Tuesday the 13th to contact my credit card company and tell them to allow the charge to go through.
Curiously, there was no mention of me using another card at this point. Now… why is that? Does ‘data mining’ come to mind?
I just have this thought….. we have not heard the ‘last’ from this ‘outfit’ in involvement in legal proceedings. Not only is the app a disaster, at this point, but also the entire ‘organization’ is ‘toxic’ it appears to me.
Oz comment #11 back in june 5 said the affiliates will be the primary purchaser of tokens. Oz called it right 6 months ago.
The affiliates are funding their own commission. Affiliates will be stocking up on tokens instead of soap powder, make-up or vitamins.
I cancelled my membership with these people over a month ago. They billed my card today anyway.
The number they list for billing inquiries has a message on it that says they don’t offer phone support.
The email they have for billing issues is the same email I sent the cancellation to to begin with. This is not a good sign.
it seems other affiliates have also been complaining about not being able to cancel their membership [see post#505].
you could ask for a chargeback on your card alleging fraud. if many affiliates are in the same position as you, then chargebacks will cause trouble for UGM with their bank, and they may stop charging cards indiscriminately.
I also cancelled and they are trying to charge my card.
This is such a crafted con it’s not even funny. It’s almost worth the affiliate fee to watch it unfold but out of principle I don’t want to give these guys even 1 dollar of my money.
the firefan app continues to have major problems even over a fortnight after it’s release.
UGM can beta test it’s low quality app forever if it likes, but has no right to charge affiliates autoship or make players pay for tokens till the app is functioning properly.
as it is affiliates have to invest their time in ‘testing’ the app and reporting glitches, to expect them to pay for this ‘privilege’ is adding insult to injury.
these comments from firefan’s official FB page from a few hours ago represent the frustrations of affiliates. this is for the record before someone wakes up and deletes them, because most of the time you just see ‘rahrah, firefans so great!’ type of comments [which i assume are because of regular page cleanup’s]:
@ Anjali
Your comments are hardly a surprise to me. Certainly, they will disappear if they haven’t already.
There are those on this site that ‘believe’ they had this all figured from the start. They did not as this ‘con’ was all too well-conceived and done in ‘stages’.
No one could have or would have picked it up with the ‘sketchy’ information’ given by UGM at the beginning. Not much solace for Affiliates right now.
Why Affiliates are ‘even’ bothering with this application ‘still’ is beyond ‘incredible’!
In my opinion, UGM (cronies) made a ‘grave’ mistake in how they are handling and have handled the credit card situation…. the token purchasing…. this does ‘smack’ of ‘fraud’ right now in my estimation.
‘They’ may have gotten themselves into some very deep water that they will not swim out of.
Sharks are known to eat each other and anything else so they say. We shall see how many of the ‘sharks’ involved survive this.
It’s amazing to see the rating system manipulated in iTunes. Out of 700 reviews; 124 are 1 star, 560 are 5 star.. (rest are in between)
@TimeToMoveOn Auto-Renewing token subscriptions?!! omg….. this con is a thing of beauty!
What’s their plan once the first round of commission cheques come in and affiliates drop off like crazy because they realize they can’t make any money?
What’s the end game. They promised to break download records and they best they could do is trending on iTunes. Players won’t pick this game up, affiliates won’t make any money and everyone will drop off.
Sure is quiet from the Rah Rah side. No fun saying “Told you so” if they’ve all run off. Take your beating ya greedy punks.
I agree that it would be nice to hear something from the faithful but there really is no need for name calling. It was the logic of one of your posts elsewhere that first had me doubting what UG was saying.
Don’t ruin it for me. Wanting to make a good living and beleiving a sales job can be greedy but not necessarily.
@lookieloo
You ‘experienced’ the sales job of a bunch of super cons and bought into it ‘hook line and sinker’.
If there is any solace for you it is that ‘con’ job and hopefully it will not happen to you again. The ‘faithful’ have gone away …. those that were so ‘sold’ on this ‘con’ and paid their dues and gave out their tax info are already trying to get that info destroyed.
Those ‘faithful’ that remain will be gone in January. You had every warning from many right here and chose to ‘ignore’ the obvious….. it’s on you, totally there ‘snowflake’.
I’m, still around, punched my tax info in. Was billed for myself and itjers I paid for.
I cant talk much on the game play since I don’t play.
If, and only if, this is lookieloo’s first MLM rodeo, I think we could cut him a little slack. The reason being that the con artists in MLM have the spiel down to a science and can be very convincing.
Network marketers have had 50 years to perfect the sales con pitch and can sound legitimate to the MLM naive.
I agree that “successful” MLMers are indeed “greedy punks” – thieves, con men, liars, fakers
Oh, I phrased that wrong. I mean don’t ruin your credibility with me by lumping everyone in together as greedy.
Again, Denny, not sure what you are on about.
More promses…NBA., next season of football, global sales….
oooh wait, maybe I should stick around afterall…
@lookieloo
You are a trip! Either you are extremely beyond ‘moronic’ or your posts are ‘dripping sarcasm’.
I am not certain why you are around, either. You do add a ‘flavor’ being either!
Incredible! In my ‘spam’ folder I found ‘Token Talk With Natty’ and watched the video sent to me even though I am out, totally!
This is so damn beautiful in the ‘con’ that I could not be more impressed! It focused on getting your ‘profile info ‘exacting’ for billing now and in the future…tax info…the whole ball of wax, really. The ‘auto-ship’ is there!
When you buy token packages ‘they’ distinguish between tokens for ‘beta’ and live games….. and ‘stress’ the discounts you will receive right now ‘buying beta’ tokens.
You will be billed, immediately… and that is ‘stressed’, also. You can ‘transfer’ tokens that you ‘buy’ to other Affiliates at any time as an ‘enticement’ to get them to ‘download and play’ the game…..this is beyond beautiful!
Never, and I mean never and am no novice in this ‘arena’, have I ever seen a con so well-conceived….. it is a work of art and should go down as the internet equivalent of the movie….. The Sting!
The ‘auto-ship’ is there once you ‘buy’ a token package’ if you do not take the necessary steps to remove it or change it.
Amazing!
I was being silly with the beating thing. I don’t take pleasure in the misery of others. But it is anticlimacitc the way this has played out, particularly given the sensational build up and the fervor it generated.
Just seems like there should be an epic ending instead of people quietly exiting.
yes, so true. I will blame a backache for my toneless reading of your humor.
I’m confused. Could you please clarify your current position on UG? Are you a believer and a willing participant?
Unfortunately, anyone in UG is one of these three: greedy scammer, ignorant, and/or naive. None are good.
Btw, all along I’ve been checking news feeds on this dealeo and not once has there ever been any news coverage on this other than a few PR Newswire feeds from UGM themselves.
It wasn’t newsworthy and still isn’t. Not even a bump in the road so it seems.
Some people will be willing to take a chance that the game will go viral by virtue of it being promoted by a large group of affiliates (I’d love to know how many of the 238,000 remain.) So, they may end up being proven wrong and you may call that ignorant or naive but I don’t think it’s that simple.
And there are many affiliates that did not take part in recruiting and got involved with the idea of making a commission from sharing the app. Different people got involved at different times due to different pitches. That’s a big part of why it’s a big mess.
I got involved early through family and just about every reason I was willing to consider it at the beginning has evaporated. I don’t like mlm… I allowed myself to believe that it was not mlm. But even if I quit, I’m still in…family. Anyway, I haven’t paid so …
There is no news coverage because it’s just another shitty app that will not exceed 100K downloads at a maximum.
95% of the UGM income is going to come from affiliates and their stupid token subscriptions. No one in their right mind is going to spend money to play this game when you can’t win anything. Please keep in mind that this game was sold on the principal that you can win prizes – not some crappy loyalty rewards program.
There is no reason for anyone to play the game unless they are a delusional affiliate that thinks they will make some money off this. Once the first $0.50 commission payments come in even the most delusional will realize that this is pointless and drop out.
I can only assume that in a few months UGM will collapse but only after milking 20 or so million from their affiliate base.
20M minus 4-5Million max in costs and the upper brass walks away with a nice 14M profit. Not bad for 9 months of “work”.
Very true. Savvy journalists are more in tune with what will be newsworthy apps and what won’t be now that 2 million of them have been released.
Some recent examples have been the likes of Pokemon2 and many many developers are attaching their own app to that one in particular that the very mention “as big as Pokemon” creates an instant allergic reaction. Same happened following the flappy birds scene.
The days of apps like Shazam and Spotify being revolutionary are long gone.
I really can’t think they believed their own hype and that makes it fraudulent in my eyes as it is an investment and covered by different rules and obligations.
I am still in as well. But I was never on the “Rah Rah” side. I can not be like that, unless I see and truly believe in what I am “cheering” for, which wasn’t and honestly still isn’t the case here.
It was all talk and the product was under wrap, so I was hesitant to do much. But through virtually no work of my own my team has grown to 400, mainly because I have an affiliate under me who is a “rah rah” guy.
I have paid my fees and given out tax info. I will not do a token subscription, instead, I will watch ads to get free tokens or buy them a la cart if the ads never surface.
They are also giving two free tokens for each player that you get to try out the app. I will only use the tokens in games where I will make more money than what I put into the game.
I also feel pretty protected with the credit card I have on file, and the limit it has and I don’t take these people for outright thieves, as some of you are portraying them to be.
If they were, why would they bring on multi million dollar athletes with complete law teams, some of which are even on television shows that can publicly shame them to an audience of millions? Why not just go after the lemmings?
They have also put themselves out there publicly. They have traveled around the US meeting people and training them. If they have the guts to travel around the US, meet personally with the lemmings, give them hugs, take photos with them, and then steal their money than they are on a WHOLE other level of sinister.
To personally come in contact with people and swindle them would be adding the risk of a lemming taking it personally, no ? It seems to me a swindler would be much more hidden from the people that they are trying to steal from, but JMO.
So, I am just as lookieloo described. I am risking 9.99 per month to see if having famous NFL/NBA and boxing stars on board and a sales force of a couple hundred thousand people who are all financially motivated to try and make this succeed can end up helping me earn more than 9.99 per month from my group of 400.
For every investment I have ever made there is a risk and a reward. You decide if the risk is more or less than the reward.
I have made my decision after careful consideration. I have zero affiliation with any MLM’s in the past so I admit to being naive in their practices. But, I will still argue that as long as corporate isn’t doing all of this to try to steal the identity of all affiliates that it is worth my 9.99 per month for a few months to see how it turns out.
BTW – The last line that lookieloo says, “every reason I was willing to consider this has evaporated, I find to mostly be true with me as well”.
Other than my team grew out of sheer luck. The app has no reward for winning, is not well written, was not well rolled out, etc. I realize all of that, but that doesn’t end my belief that the idea of the product can be a success, and I will give them a little time to try and make it work (I’m not sold on the people they have either, maybe they need to hire a new programmer).
The last thing I will say is that I do believe that most people will not make money on this, and that the income opportunity was sold through the lens of rose colored glasses, but IMO isn’t a con, any more than any fitness device seller telling you, that you can look like Arnold by using their equipment.
Only 1% of people will ever use said equipment to transform their physique but it is possible. Go ahead and have fun at my expense, call me names, whatever. I wish you all the best, regardless.
@Malone
I agree they are not thieves but the difference between 99% of people not getting super bodies because they don’t use the equipment is far from the same as the claims made by UG.
There is no way they can believe that all affiliates can get rich if they are successful in recruiting. The numbers don’t add up. Therein lies the deception.
Were people sold the idea of getting rich? What is rich?
I’m with Malone in his assessment of the entire process.
@ Malone @CoCtDe @lookiloo
Naïve is putting it mildly for all of you. Malone’s analysis says…..I have no clue how this all works, period. He should read some earlier comments.
A 400 team is peanuts by the way. That is neither here nor there but shows he is ‘clueless’ on how it all works, again.
Identity theft is always a possibility, anywhere. Data mining is the ‘major’ concern for your information going everywhere and it will and UGA makes a nice buck or two from giving out your info, also. On top of that, it will make identity theft that much easier.
@Tiernan
You are being very very gracious say it is not thievery…. it is about as close as it comes if it is not.
Very fine line between deception and thievery and in this case……it is a very very very very fine line. We shall see how it all plays out.
I want to see the comments from the ‘proponents’ in a month or two. Oh, the sports figures actually could give a rat’s ass and I have a feeling you will be hearing from them after the so-called ‘beta’ stage, when they find out that ‘there ain’t no money, honey’!,which is a ‘shield’ for UGM at the moment! Cheers, all!
That’s fortunate for you. I guess that’s what one hopes for – referring a keener. Seasoned mlmr’s probably divide everyone into two categories – few keeners and then everyone else. It’s just too bad that everyone else gets to waste so much time for so little!
I’m wondering if you have taken a look to see how many of your 400 have paid their fees? I’m so curious what the drop-off rate is these days.
Some of you still have the sequence of events confused.
1. Top pyramid scammers call a meeting.
2. They concoct a product/service often similar to one that is currently gaining mainstream popularity – or just make one up that sounds good.
3. They phone their fellow scammers who have large teams already in place, bring them in and compensate them.
4. Then all these liars start recruiting suckers by pretending that it’s about this “phenomenal new product” they’ve developed that’s “going to take the internet by storm and explode”. They will claim it’s the best “opportunity” they’ve ever seen.
Yes. Didn’t even corporate illustrate how one could potentially make 20,000/m by getting 10 people to play and share…. to which a reasonable person might say, well that sounds like a lot but I bet I can get 2000/m by sharing with 100 players.
You’re really new to all this, aren’t you ???
Do a quick Google on Andy Bowdoin, Paul Burks, Bernie Madoff and Alan Stanford and you’ll soon find your reasoning is way off track.
Interesting so you think people are in this strictly for the payout? I read where someone was worried about ID theft.
Im pretty well insulated in general. Would you like my ssn a whirl? I hope this scam runs for a year or two with only the top people making money, I’ll still be giving them money.
Don’t worry about how much money it’s “possible” to make.
How many levels of “ten finding ten” before you have exceeded to entire population of the planet ???
HINT: ten people who all find ten = 100
One hundred who all find ten = 1000
One thousand who all find ten = 10,000
Ten thousand who all find ten = 100,000
Get the picture ???
It’s even better than that as “if only 100” was the formula they used…
Interesting comments, lately. Defining and on point.
Denial is a strange ‘bedfellow’. Con artists ‘feed’ on that as ‘hope and promise’ is eternal with those that are in ‘denial’.
Point in reference…. I ‘finished’ with over 700 on my team and did not pay the fees and was called numerous times on my mobile when my ‘card’ could not be accessed.
To Malone…. I had an Affiliate with over 400 on his team…… his Affiliates ‘downloading the app’ was 4 including himself. Not much ‘math’ to do there.
Check your ‘locker room’, Malone. An ‘educated’ guess is that you under 10 that have ‘actually’ downloaded the app.
Net/Net is that you will make much less than your monthly 9.99 dues….. say .99… if you are lucky. You can figure out the ‘cons’ net profit from there.
You have played right into their hands.
This would’ve been discussed in the initial meeting of the scamming minds when they were deciding their strategy and type of scheme.
The advantage of the small fee scam is that people will just forget about it, not care, or take a chance.
200,000 x $10 is 2 MILLION DOLLARS for them!!!! That’s per month!!!!
You’ve heard of credit card scammers only charging a few dollars here and there so they don’t stand out on the statement and get caught haven’t you? Same concept here AND BY DESIGN.
They have added a ‘past due’ status to affiliate accounts. This suggests that affiliates can hedge for a possible six months.
I expect they will again open up slots for affiliates once again as new leagues are added.
@char
Am following this because I think there will be ‘grave’ repercussions down the line for UGM and ‘cronies’. Affiliates made a decision to ‘buy’ into this con/scam and done is done. They have no recourse now to dispute as complicit in this con.
This is part in parcel of the scam/con as ‘they’ have ‘partners’ in Affiliates other than those that ‘they’ had arranged beforehand when the con started.
‘They’ hardly traveled around the ‘nation’ if one would bother to check. “They’ have no where close to 200,000 paid Affiliates….not remotely as that was by design, also.
My educated ‘guess’ with this is that they have 25,000 tops. What is ‘their’ irony at this point is ‘collecting’ money from themselves…that would be hilarious! When they do the ‘condensing’ to the scammers at the top…. whoops!
Prediction…. we have ‘opened’ up Affiliate recruiting!
The NBA is every day and it beautiful to watch! Unfortunately, no one gives a crap about the NBA and haven’t for years! Hasn’t been basketball for a couple decades!
Sure…when nothing is certain, anything is possible!
I thought the concern about data mining was due to UG’s refusal to cancel accounts outright, instead wanting to only convert affiliates into players…not sure if they changed this policy. And UG has removed the contact info of personally pre-registered players from the referring affiliates account. Probably reasonable but this info is a big asset for UG.
You are getting the ‘drift’, now. Looks like the ‘3 amigos’ are catching on, now.
Data mining is not other than what it is and MLM’s do this all the time. It is ‘free’ money for them and is all ‘part’ of the con. All this had been ‘arranged’, beforehand.
Char laid it out for you. Grow up, CoDecT and lookiloo….. you are now ‘accomplices’ in a con as having paid your fees and there is nothing that you can do… period.
I don’t believe lookliloo (in not paying) nor Malone and think CoDecT is having have hard time getting it, period.
Data mining is the initial step to identity theft…. and, given that that the ‘cons’ have your tax info….. you figure it out.
Let me premise this by saying that i am not actively communicating or pushing anything with my down line affiliates.
I originally joined to just play and share a sports app because I’m a sports fan. Like I mentioned above my team grew out of sheer luck, and no work on my part. But your ‘educated’ guess is egregiously wrong in my case. 84% of my affiliates have downloaded the app. More than 10x the number of your ‘educated guess’.
I have a league that has over 75 in it now. I get about 10-20 people per game to play in it. About 5 of which I actually invited. I have only used my free tokens.
I happen to be pretty good in social media circles (I have thousands of twitter followers and firefan followers), so my league grows with little input from me to this point.
I will ‘anxiously’ await your response which will no doubt say how clueless I am and how those numbers are “peanuts”. Although, at no point in time do i claim that they are anything else.
I only post the numbers because you asked, and because I have done virtually zero work but yet they have grown.
I have asked maybe 5 of my 130 tier 1 players to download the app because it isn’t ready, and quite frankly isn’t fun yet either, IMO.
I am still willing to risk my 9.99 per M (which by the way is “peanuts” IMO, as I spend 6.01 on a flat white from Starbucks every day on my way into my office) to see if it grows.
I am skeptical that it will unless they hire a developer that can make it better.
If it is a ‘shell’ of what it will be I am happy to stay. If this is the end product, then I have no doubt that I have lost out on my 39.98 investment. Life will go on for me, as I have a pretty comfortable 9-5.
I forgot to mention that I have 6 sports bars as affiliates in my downline, two of which are actively promoting and adding players daily, affiliates in 5 different countries/3 continents, a former NFL player, a sports radio show host, and an executive of a big 3 pro sports team that may or may not use this as a fundraiser for their foundation.
Again, all this to say, I will give it a chance.
(Ozedit: Offtopic derail attempts removed)
Well, I wish you the best, Malone. If anyone can make something from the app, I think it will be those who are social and into inviting players to a league, etc. That’s not my strength.
By the way, you can also check whether your affiliates have paid fees, purchased or played tokens.
Couldn’t have said it better myself Malone. Thank you
Site was down for awhile.. Stopped browsing and come back to the same people bashing it with the same posts and thoughts over and over.
It’s amazing that some of you who have no interest in this continue to read the emails sent by UG, post here and talk to your past affiliates. ” I wanna see the train wreck” is the reason. Right.
Denny said he was out a month ago and is the most active poster here. Comical
Denial, Con, Data mining, Clueless.. Every post contains one of those words. Yawn.
Fact is it launched when some said it wouldn’t, Major celebrities are playing when some said they wouldn’t. Every mistake that’s been made they have owned up to.
Like i have said from the beginning. IF the app is fun it will work.. If not it wont. But the app to this point is pretty much what they sold us from day 1.
What each individual does with it is up to them. For the record Denny, Your “educated” guess isn’t even close as it pertains to me.
You said “I had an Affiliate with over 400 on his team…… his Affiliates ‘downloading the app’ was 4 including himself. Not much ‘math’ to do there.
Is he your affiliate or are you his? Get your story straight. Haha.
(Ozedit: Dummy spit removed)
Keep it civil guys. Discuss United Games Marketing, not eachother.
Just chiming in because i understand what could be going on. In my life i like to think how the criminal would.
Maybe i’ll play in a game tonight to see if glitches have been resolved. I think the smarter people are waiting for the ads to come into the game. There is no reason to pay more into this system
Yeah, not bad at all. As much as it chaps my ass that these legal swindles can exist, I gotta say that’s one helluva payday.
You know, one philosophy says that the conned get what they deserved ala the “Sting Camp”. I mean, it’s not like they weren’t warned. Heck, more than that even. Slapped upside the head and their noses stuffed in logic and facts.
From that perspective, admiring the sting isn’t too far off the mark.
Fact is the app is rubbish. Launched is not good enough and neither is the fact that celebrities say they use it.
This is a business investment and the hype was ALL BS. It needs so much more than just to be fun to succeed for all the affilaites that have sunk their time and money in to it.
Sure, some affilaites don’t care about $9.99 a month, others will make some money, but taken as a whole, this is, has been and always will be a con and as long as you keep defending it with these fallacies I will keep bashing it. Hopefully others will too.
I’m not sure how many recruits have access to balanced information. You can’t express concerns with your referrer or co-affiliates, especially publicly without being piled-on with shaming positivity.
It is not a critique-friendly environment. It took some looking to sort through the fake-reviews sites to find this thread.
That’s right, BUT you forgot about Trolls, like me for example in Good Troll mode.
I posted on ? 100 maybe more. Essay pastes with a catchy intros and point by point logic and evidence that it was indeed too good to be true. And made it a point to repost to the big recuiters new posts with updated information. I now for sure I that it steered at least a few away.
But yeah, a comment after a team call with sharp guys who tell you right you right up front that they are not selling anything or promoting or even affiliated with the company, just passing information along like a good neighbor, it just comes like a malcontent.
I should have gotten on the calls and stirred the pot, I could have done more, we could have done more.
They’re organized and we aren’t. But we could have been. I’m up for providing financial analysis and business case analysis services.
Write edit research opine and stratagize for tjhis or other campaigns. Advocacy is higher purpose stuff and I want help. Although this is not my usual target market. A little easier helping those who want it.
I nominate Tiernan as Campaign _________________ ([pick your own title). He’s got activist, tactician, coordinator and leader written all through his posts.
I like his logic, his tact, and resolve. All those in favor say Aye! Well, there it is. Let’s get stated.
Tiernan, just an idea to entertain but I have a friend who has a similar role with Red Cross and she says the best approach on campaign type projects with all volunteer help is to start with a stirring speech to kick things off. The more grandiose the better.
The sort of talk that normally ends “NOW GET OUT THERE AND SELL SOME DAMN VACUUM CLEANERS!” and men flush with motivation literally leap from cheap plastic seats and bolt for the nearest exit and stream from the building as superhumans, gtrimacing with determination and resolve that will get them to lunchtime at least.
“There;s only room for two types of people in this effort: Those who win and those who refuse to lose” AAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH! Yeah, something like that.
Tiernan still has that one property in dispute with me and that might present a problem. It could present a ‘conflict’ of interest somewhere along the line.
I would ‘nominate’ you, Marvin. Marvin for Campaign ‘Sting’ the ‘Buzz’. Positives and negatives. He has a sense of humor and sense of the ‘sting’, beforehand.
Long live ‘Sting’ and may he rule with no logical rules, defined. I vote, Marvin.
So I guess this is it… huh… this was just a boring old pyramid scheme that will slowly fade away….
My entertainment is gone, lol. The firefan fb comments are boring. They don’t even talk about the app any more.
The co. just posts random questions and completely take the attention off of the app. And into oblivion it goes; well done United, well done…
Wow was this ever an education in MLM!
In summary MLM consists of mediocre products jammed down the throats of “independent contractors” via some sort of auto-ship. They accept it because they think
All that changed here is how it was packaged.
Look…. I am as amazed as anyone with all this. I just viewed an email from United Games found in my email ‘promotions’ box.
Never, and I mean absolutely never, have I watched on video in a Christmas message to Affiliates anything like this from any ‘vendor’ in promotions….. it defies the laws of ‘gravity’ in any business. UGM is now going beyond anything I thought possible in promotion.
The video is on utube ….. this is ‘The Sting’ and Natalyn delivers like water off a ‘ducks back’. She couldn’t possibly have made all this up… no. Or, did she pick a spot to do ’emotional’ and ‘survive’ this failing application…. regardless, it was ‘unclear’ when all this happened and I did catch that and you have to listen, closely.
She is the ‘Goddess’ of con and has been and knows the time and the place and has the con. It appears to me that the whole ‘family’ is internet/scam/con savvy. Their ‘footprints’ are all over multiple internet …. opportunities.
Robert Redford and Paul Neumann…. are going …. this is beautiful! But, one thing you all forget….you must have an ‘escape’ plan that cannot be traced.
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!
And no doubt presenting as successful network marketers, but…..
The word “successful” can trick us and denote a positive thought.
People need to watch out for “successful network marketers” just as they would “successful drug dealers” and “successful bank robbers”.
See what I mean?!
Ho…ly….crap…. 14 min for that video?! I clicked through quickly as I could not bare to watch all of it… I just caught the tail end where she is in tears…and quotes “It doesn’t matter if it’s and app or not, or if it works or not…” haha, just wow.
Even though I’m no longer an affiliate I still get their emails. I just watched the video and I can’t believe it.
It’s not about and app and it’s not about wheather it works or not? It’s about the holiday season. What the fuck? You have to be kidding me.
Tiernan’s first assignment as campaign manager???!!!!
My daughter, a college graduate and professional gamer, who is also educated about the scam of MLM, just told me of a new game. She doesn’t seem to think it’s MLM but neither did the UG affiliates. I don’t want to name it here just yet as I wouldn’t want to inadvertently advertise it.
What little detail I got, I have concerns. Leopards don’t change their spots and one of the creators was a MAJOR MLM recruiter for a juice scam. Also, the “studio” developing the game was only created last year as far as I can tell. Hmmm…
She spoke of recruiting at least enough to get the game for free, and/or $2.50 (I think) for sign ups. Red flag. I of course asked about retail only. Something, something about mmos. Our conversation will continue after I get more info. Maybe you guys can find out more?
I asked her if she had to pay as she is the one with thousands of followers – they should pay her! She said games require subscriptions and it’s hard to gain popularity. And so the story goes…. and it’s ONLY $15 a month! Ei yi yi.
I told her that things HAVE to sound legit otherwise you wouldn’t be a successful scammer. Apparently, they’ve spent millions of dollars on development.
I fear “gaming” is the new juice, crypto, vitamin MLM, as seen with UG.
Tiernan, Denny, etc.., with your knowledge of both now, MLM and gaming, I’d love to have an assessment.
Oz are you interested?
@Char oh do tell !! 🙂
@Char
MMO games can require a monthly subscription to play. The “new player” market is pretty limited though as they’re usually a time-sink (and it’s a well-established niche).
Send it in via the contact form if they have a website and business model I can go over.
Gaming and MLM has been a thing since Rippln, and we all know how that turned out.
@Oz
Don’t think I posted yet unless you could see my draft? Bugger, just lost my whole post, or was it nuked? Here’s the trail if allowed. If this one goes, I’ll understand.
Xango –
phoenixnewtimes.com/news/notorious-gold-fraudster-is-hit-with-a-54-million-rico-suit-6657583
Above article refers to Sherman Unkefer (not Steven Sharif but..)
Steven Sharif – Xango top earner
10incomes.com/page/top-250-life-time-earners-in-mlm-1 (#169 Steven Sharif 7 million Xango)
mmorpg.com/ashes-of-creation/interviews/intrepid-studios-aims-to-breathe-new-life-into-the-mmorpg-1000011398
To be fair, I don’t have enough info to judge other than “the company you keep”. I don’t have a comp plan so I don’t know if it’s MLM yet. I only have hearsay.
@Char
I didn’t nuke it. Spam filter might have rejected it as promotion but.
Typically MMO’s charge a subscription and/or sell stuff with an in-game currency (purchasable with real world cash). That could be what your daughter was referencing.
Anyway keep an eye on it I guess.
That was generous of you…and helpful that your posts were reasonable, logical, not the typical troll at least. You helped me out. Saved me a lot of time that I get to spend here.
Thank you both for watching the video so that I don’t have to. I couldn’t get through 14 sec. It might have been worth it to hear those words though.
I need to watch the 14 min video. Will fo
Whats the link for that 14 min video? I’m the executive director of a non-profit and I passed on the “opportunity” to add my organization as an affiliate.
I’ve been silently following this thread for a while and I’m glad I didn’t get myself or anyone else involved in this mess.
I have been in on this app since May. And its been nothing but a disappointing joke! Its been nothing but lies and more lies!!
The sad part is there are still affiliates who honestly think they are going to profit from this fiasco. There are people who have spent thousands on this scam! And seeing how brainwashed these people are is beyond belief!!!
The only people spending money on this boring app are affilliates. And all of the money from buying tokens goes right to you know who, the ones behind this scam! What’s most troubling is the fact you really can’t get out of this mess.
Affiliates can’t just leave, you can only downsize to being a player with all of your information still tied to these people!??! And the hostility towards affiliates who speak out with concerns on “secret” affiliate groups on Facebook is unbelievable, it really is!!! Its almost like a cult!
Another thing, there has been no mention of how people will be paid? Just mentioning it gets deleted after a bunch off gung ho affiliates jump all over who mentioned it.
This whole thing is a sad joke! And my guess is it will totally collapse within the next month?
on the official firefan facebook page, there was a post yesterday saying: Playing FireFan on Christmas Eve with your family? We want to see it! Post a picture of you & your crew..
of course, no affiliate posted any photos of playing firefan with their family, because the truth appears to be that a few desperate affiliates are trying hard to play the game, and trying harder to appreciate it.
however, to egg affiliates on, UGM corporate posted a couple of pics of groups of people apparently having a blast playing firefan.
the problem? the pics were fake. they were stolen from somewhere and posted on the firefan FB page to create the impression that firefan was fun! the immediate giveaway was that the people in the photos were not holding phones, so they couldn’t be playing firefan at all!
affiliates caught on to the fib pretty quickly:
moral of the story: an app that has to resort to fake photos to show it’s fun, must be seriously unfun!
I saw it and all I could do was laugh! Its getting to the point now that’s all I can do, laugh!!
The whole thing is over. I don’t believe for one second that anyone will continue once the NFL season ends.
I also believe the most of the brain washed will bail after the first commission cheques.
They have already begun prepping affiliates to not be worried, your first check will be small… Have patience and don’t give up or be discouraged!!!!
Lol But i agree, when people see that they have only made 65 cents they will be bailing out left and right!
I kicked off the “campaign” with a tweet linking to here. Easiest way to get visibility as they are removing posts on Facebook.
We got our 1st app review request from an affiliate the other day. In typical style there was no mention that they didn’t own the app, just “Please review and include this code in the review”. It’s that underhand approach that annoys me.
Seems they asked people to post photos but didn’t change the page settings to allow them too…. Hilarious… An amateur app run by amateurs.
i suppose these posts will get deleted soon, so i’ll record them here:
meanwhile, dustin mitchell has announced on facebook that he is in the process of writing a motion for immediate injunctive relief against UGM, and is inviting disappointed affiliates to join his class action suit.
I’m quite sure there will be many lawsuits! Especially when January 5th rolls around and all of these affiliates who have dropped out are charged again, undoubtedly they will be charged again!!!
This is a comment on an affiliate page on Facebook last night… These people truly are brainwashed!!! It’s unbelievable… Wow!
This was the comment he was replying back to.. This is what happens every time someone with a “NEGATIVE?” comment says something!!!
These people arent just drinking the kool aid they have already downed the whole pitcher! I’ve never seen anything like this three ring circus of idiots!!!
I’m not an affiliate. The success or lack of does not affect me in the least.
The only thing I will say is that I am an acquaintance of a FireFan employee (I worked with this person prior to them taking the job at FireFan and enjoyed a good working relationship with this individual). Take it with a grain of salt if you like, but I am commenting without any bias either way.
From a pure end-user perspective, I find the app very fun. All the marketing crap aside, there is a lot of potential for FireFan to be successful.
I’ve only played one NFL week over this last weekend, so I can’t attest to how launch went, but, for the most part, the app performed well.
Sure, there were a couple of “hiccups” in the form of slow response times here and there, but nothing that affected my games. Nothing more than I currently experience when I’m waiting for my points to update in my fantasy leagues while tracking live scoring.
I will say that, for me, the game is addictingly fun. The app feels surprisingly rich and polished for having just been released.
I don’t know how things will work for the other sports they plan to support, but I will be a heavy user during the football season. I really hope they get NCAAF going for next year.
My point to this is don’t assume nobody but affiliates are going to play this game. If the other sports they plan to support are as fun as the NFL games have been, they’ll have a solid user base.
Well, reading the updated comments…. not surprised in the least.
Yes, it is so ‘staggering’ in comprehension that some Affiliates ‘still’ believe that this app will ‘survive’ and there are ‘still’ a couple on this site that believe this and it a ‘wonderment’ to me!
I have read a few comments on other ‘evaluative’ sites of this ilk and what is posted by the ‘believers’ is simply not fact and those ‘proponents’ past have ‘disappeared’.
They have ‘essentially’ done the same thing, here. They post ‘disclaimers’ as a couple have and ‘forthrightly’ say I am leaving and I am out and accuse others of being trolls, etc. They edit content of a post that ‘devalues’ their opinion so as to appear more positive than negative.
For those Affiliates that ‘think’ they are ‘locked’ in with the billing….. simply ‘cancel’ your card with ‘them’ (your cc or debit card provider) and have them send you a new card…. unauthorized use…. it is that simple.
This application will only survive with the introduction of ‘The New Approach’…. ‘We’ (UGM) have learned from past mistakes and ‘we’ intend’ to make this a “New Year” and with your continued ‘support’ (money) we will not fail! It is coming!
In my opinion there is no hope for United Games at this point!? I have all ready told all of my affiliates to get the hell out!!!
Once it went live on Thanksgiving I knew that this was nothing but an absolute joke!!! That’s when I told my guys and girls, I’m sorry for getting you into this, it’s a joke!
And after repeated attempts “deactivate” their accounts with no luck they switched to players and were still chargers $40 on December 10…?? Yeah imagine that, pitiful! And none of them could get through and get the charges reversed until last week.
Here’s another weird coincidence… lol The “marketing center” on the United Games site disappeared about the same time the “token store” arrived?
Just a couple of days ago an affiliate posted one of the affiliate sites that he hadn’t received his marketing materials yet? Sure enough, PATIENCE was the word that kept being used.
One guy even commented, forget about it! The guy responded back… I SPENT $600 and I ordered it in October!!!!!! It’s sad how people are being ripped off, beyond sad it’s pathetic!
I’m excited to see what UG roles out next!
Reopening affiliate signups?
Nah, they’d need to add another sport first. Basketball’s all star game is in February, what’s the over/under on UG launching their NBA app by then?
Just getting this off my chest I enjoy firefan but I have lost at least half my players hopefully not for good but hoping they don’t forget about the app.
Due to them running out of tokens. I bought the subscription for a 100 tokens and had to buy 100 more to give out to my players to keep them engaged but I’m not or can’t keep spending money to keep others playing.
I really hope these ads come like yesterday I was hoping the ads would have been first before anything else once we released the beta tag.
I understand we want people to spend money in the app but I don’t see anyone getting hooked after playing 3 games for free at least not enough to spend money.
At least if they had the ads they can play and then if they get hooked they spend money on tokens instead of watching ads
This guy is getting raked over the coals for posting this tonight on Facebook!
Sad, thing is… the ads aren’t coming, there is no way that will happen. And if the ads ever do show up the app will constantly crash like when they first launched it!
@GlimDropper… I don’t think it will ever happen!
@Rico Which facebook page? I don’t see it on their offical one.
It is posted on a closed group page for affiliates. This was the next comment posted, this thing is starting to implode for a lot of affiliates…….,.
You have a point about the tokens. From my understanding, only 4% of players would purchase tokens for the convenience of it while the rest would generate tokens through ads.
So the push to purchase tokens on a monthly basis especially while in beta mode seems odd to me. the launch has been a crash course compared to what it was expected to be. And even though i like the idea of the gameplay, it hasn’t been that fun to me either and should be a lot farther ahead of where it’s at.
Hopefully the app starts to meet expectations it was designed to here soon.
I feel sorry for these people, I’ve gotten to know almost all of them. And I know how much money they have given to the crooks in charge of this fiasco!
Some of these people have spent over $3,000 on marketing material and tokens in the past two months! Do you have any idea how long it would take these people to make that much when they are only getting ONE PENNY PER TAKEN AQUIRED AND HALF A PENNY ON TOKENS PLAYED????
It would take years, and most of these people have teams less than half the size that I had with no heavyweights or Facebook NFL fan page guys in!!!
I am so glad I got out of this mess and it only cost me a TON OF MAN HOURS contacting people! I truly feel sorry for these guys, and there is no way they will get any of that money back!
@ Rico
I can ‘ditto’ your last paragraph. As I watched all this ‘unfold’ with UGM…..I ‘knew’ I had been had by ‘pros’ and ‘gone’ was my ‘time spent’ and ‘monies’ in ‘marketing’ over a few months. The ‘finale’ was when UGM came out with the ‘dime’ per token and as you stated with the commissions possible @ the 10%…or a penny or a penny and a half.
Their initial parameters were between 1 dollar and a dollar and a half per token @ the 10% for played and acquired. I knew all along that the app was way too sophisticated for other than ‘avid’ sports fans…..and, it ‘still’ might have worked for many Affiliates ‘given’ that ‘potential’.
Obviously, that was ‘never’ the true intent from the beginning. Now, that is more than obvious and we ‘did’ get conned/scammed… right from the ‘start’.
I was being ‘entirely’ sarcastic with the last statement in my last post.
@Tiernan….@glimdropper…..this will be ‘proposed’ with the NBA and has been but it will all depend on how much money UGM believes they can ‘suck’ in from the ‘believers’, remaining.
And, we had a ‘recent’ entry here with a nice ‘story’ that is that obvious to me as entirely nonsense.
In reality the football was the best chance to make a success of this.
It was a success.
@Char How was it a success? Players hate the game, the only ones playing are affiliates!!!
This thing is going to collapse, you can’t try to make money when you are the one spending the money… And the beautiful part is, United Games is laughing all the way to the bank….
This will go down as the greatest con ever, and those responsible for it will walk away laughing with all of those affiliates money and personal info to sell!!!!! Brilliantly done… BRAVO!!!!!
You answered your own question
In what universe was this a success? or are you being sarcastic? Please tell me so as there is nothing about this app or scheme that says anything close to that.
I’m pretty sure Char meant it was a success for UG. lol.
and by UG I mean the folks in charge, like the owners and Natalyn…
Look, I’m sure UGM wanted this to work as it would generate more money in the long run, but they have zero tech experience so it’s a flop. The best they could get is jesse and in my opinion the guy is clueless.
Their back up plan was milk the Affiliates and make a couple of million each before moving on to something else.
I love how the later videos were all recorded form natalyns big ass house. I wonder how she paid for that – lol.
Mlm is a scam period. I’m sure 50 years ago it was a legit means of marketing a product but today it’s all scumbgs getting rich of people that either are too naive or stupid to know any better.
Well, we must remember the ‘background’ of these ‘con artists’ in MLM and/or affiliate marketing/both.
It is ‘extensive’ to say the least. Now that I have put all the pieces together….this was all arranged from the beginning and they had ‘complete’ control of the whole ‘gambit’.
What these ‘con artists’ did is put together the ‘ultimate’ scheme. I have put together all the ‘components’ and it is truly fascinating. It is highly doubtful that we will ever see anything like this again.
What ‘they’ have done is welcomed ‘themselves’ to a ‘scrutiny’ that is such ‘they’ are finished in the internet business opportunity world. I do expect there will be more than a few lawsuits and they will not get away ‘free’ with this con.
‘The Sting’ will get ‘Stung’ and if I don’t miss my guess… UGM is scrambling right now to ‘cover their asses’. Have a nice new Year, all.
Some of the latest FB posts.
This train wreck just keeps getting better and better…. Yesterday I was sent an email by the guy who signed me in as an affiliate, he’s trying like hell for me to take a drink of the kool aid that has him completely brainwashed! Lol
Starting this Sunday there will be a promotional event kicking off for affiliates, cash awarded to the top three affiliates who manage to get all of their affiliates and pre registered players to download the app and play it, and also to whoever can sign up the most new players!!! YAY, count me back in.. lol
And how long will this event take place? Until the Super Bowl in February!
No mention of free ads, no mention of prizes, no mention of how affiliates will be paid… etc! What does that tell you?
It tells me these people are desperate and NO ONE is playing the app!!!!! Just another distraction, and more bullshit!!!
Sure enough, on the few Facebook pages that I am not banned from, the brainwashed affiliates were hooting and hollering about how great this “event” is??? Lol And plus buying tokens so you can share them to players to get them “hooked” was also mentioned, imagine that!?!
“Now if you haven’t already, BE SURE TO GET YOUR TOKEN SUBSCRIPTIONS!!!!! If you have one buy MORE!!!!!… They are our most important tool”!!!!!! I can only imagine how much money United Games has raked in from affiliates on the tokens!????!
These idiots are spending hundreds of dollars a week on them, and yet affiliates are still the only ones playing the app! It’s sad… it’s pitiful! Another thing, check out any post that FireFan puts on Facebook.
Click on someone who comments and scroll through their timeline, 9 out of 10 will be affiliates with FireFan banners and promo codes posted on their timeline, this whole thing is a revolving door of brainwashed affiliates keeping the app and Facebook page going, without them no one would check out either of them!!!! Lol
@Rico
Ah, The “Ponzi” component that also was there from the ‘beginning’. You have to admit that this whole con/scam is sheer brilliance.
I am no longer getting ‘their’ promotion emails. No doubt ‘they’ are checking out the evaluative boards and/or have been told by one of ‘kool aid’ drinkers here about negative posts/publicity.
If it is researched further or could be….. you will find that those facebook posters are part of the topglobal/VIP ‘organization’ which is UGM with ‘few’ exceptions. I have a ‘thought’ that it might be ‘exit’ stage left for UGM in the very near future.
They are ‘stockpiling’ money right now from Affiliates that are ‘blind’ to the fact that they have been totally ‘taken’…. mentioned it before and not going to beat a ‘dead’ horse with those ‘types’, anymore.
Stupid is as stupid does…. have a nice New Year!
A comment posted on the FireFan Facebook page last night, lol! Yep, I’m sure quite a few affiliates are wondering the same thing.
There has been NO MENTION OF IT!??! Oh damn this thing just keeps getting better and better…. lol.
The Fire Fan App is so awesome, in my opinion. So I suggest anyone who is not sure to come play it and see for yourself.
Its fun and interactive with live sport games. That’s all that matters to most people like myself who can careless about the why and how of the app itself because I personally don’t know any other sportsapp that is this fun to play along with live sports.
So just download the app and set up a cool league you could even call it the “BehindMlm League” or whatever then invite your “likeminded” sport fans to play along with you and have fun. See who has the most calls and who can lead the league.
I have a few leagues set up myself and with me not being a big sports fan I still have tons of fun. Just play for yourself and see how fun it is.
@Brother Roy Lee Campbell were right on that.
Sure that’s all you care about?
“Roy Lee Campbell Entrepreneurship Team Building” – Facebook
@Char
“Entrepreneurship Team Building,” lol! Good old MLM speak for, “I’m a broke, unskilled doofus, who knows nothing about actual business, or what the word entrepreneur really means. I’m just a delusional wannabe, enamored with the sound of my own voice, and filled with unearned confidence, who aspires to someday fulfill my fantasy of becoming effortlessly wealthy as a professional bullshitter.”
E,plain how you know hes broke or unskilled?
You can pretend I wrote that and passed judgement on me.
@CoDecT How has the experience been so far for you?
@Char
Have you tried WinView? It’s a REAL INTERACTIVE APP!!! Unlike FireFan, you can actually try to make the call on an upcoming play in real time! I’m addicted to it!!!
United Games dropped the ball, and then some… If the amateur hour bunch of idiots behind FireFan would have delivered on what they promised the app would have been a hit!
That’s why I was involved, the concept was there but it’s been nothing but bullshit since they launched their boring app!!! Quit throwing away your money and RUN!!!
By the way, WinView is FREE…. no being forced to buy tokens to play!!! Plus you can win CASH! I’ve already made more playing 4 games then I would have in a year with that bullshit scam of an app FireFan… that’s the truth!
CoDecT:
“Entrepreneurship” is NOT a job title. Self employed, skilled tradespeople and professionals generally don’t refer to themselves as entrepreneurs (or even more laughably, “professional motivators” or “lifestyle coaches,” etc.) when describing what they do for a living.
Those are bullshit terms used by posers, wannabes, and scammers in the MLM world.
Salon owner, plumbing contractor, interior designer, software consultant, chef/restaurant owner, caterer, physical therapist, attorney, and certified financial planner are the titles of a few of my self-employed friends. All successful business owners, and yet, not one of them lists “entrepreneur” as their job description on their fb profile.
When I googled, I noticed that “Brother Roy” has a number of different fb profiles and websites tied to him. All with the same nonsensical BS. He also seems to be a prolific re-poster of “motivational” and “inspirational” quotes and memes – which I have observed to be something that less successful people tend to do the most.
There was also a picture of him from about a month ago on one of his many fb profiles, in uniform, working at a Bob Evans restaurant.
Would you keep a day job at Bob Evans if you were highly skilled and financially secure? Hell, even a manager’s salary isn’t that great in a chain restaurant like that.
I’m reasonably confident he’s not exactly crushing it and making bank. Just sayin’.
Oh, but wait! The Playoff Push is on! Natalyn and ‘cronies’ in a vimeo ‘promo’!
UGM is giving away a car and cash and prizes and autographed stuff from the ‘celebs’ if certain criterion are met! The vimeo is over 18 minutes in length and is a thing of beauty!
You ‘must’ listen closely to the ‘criteria’, necessary….which is ‘outlined’ throughout the vimeo.
Don’t ask me why I am still get these promos other than I had a very extensive team….. still trying to entice, maybe? You think?
vimeo.com/198380327/29fbfa4e5e
Hmmmm, wonder who is really paying for this car and the cash prizes? Couldn’t be the Affiliates now could it?
Of course not…. the affiliates aren’t the ones paying for any prizes or cash giveaways!!! LOL
Prize giveaways can easily be faked.
I remember program called Alladvantage doing weekly or monthly giveaways.
Oddly enough the winner was always a new account.
That was not enough to save it from dying.
It’s been fine. Nothing good, nothing bad. I’m sitting back watching it grow, maybe stagnate, and continue to see this through.
I agree with what you have said. I know I want to make a batch of business cards saying Solutions Consultant. However, for the real professional cards – it would be Software Consultant. However as i prepare to set up a consulting/staffing/recruiting firm i prob. won’t say entrepreneur.
I don’t know who Roy is, but maybe he likes Bob Evans…
I find it funny that no signed jerseys or prizes have been given out from any of the “MVPS” that FireFan was promoting on Facebook??? Lol….
What a joke, I’m surprised this “app” hasn’t been removed from the App Store and google play?
Thanks for the thought.
My interest is really about exposing MLMers and anything brewing in their pots.
Urlacher has given awy signed mini-helmets
Manny Pacquiao is playing?! That is sooo awesome. I heard Pope Francis is playing too and giving away signed Mitres!
I want umbro.
Commissions have been posted – I am happy with my totals. Still a couple more days to see if I can withdraw the money.
Cheers.
Has anyone see the negative comments on FB with the announcement of college football?
Lots of people complaining about broken promises. All but the dumbest are beginning to catch on to this scam
This has to be on the verge of an implosion. Their latest MVP and car give away crap is just to cover their ass on the loyalty points for prizes that was promised and will never happen.
@ CoCtDe
I am assuming that you ‘then’ have paid the 3 buck fee thru an outfit called ‘PayQuicker’ which is required by UGM to access and get paid on your commissions? And, you must have over 5 bucks in total commissions to get paid…..so, I surmise that you made more than 5 bucks?
Would you mind sharing? That will not happen now will it?
My congrats if your commissions exceeded 10 bucks and I mean that. At a penny and/or a penny and a half……you must have an ‘unbelievable’ downline! Cheers!
@TimeToMoveOn
The NCAA will ‘never’ allow this and I mentioned that, previously….if UGM goes this route they will be in more deep crappola than they are in now.
My prediction is that there will be an ‘exodus’ of Affiliates in the next few weeks….. and, remember this is still ‘beta stage’….. certainly, the video I posted and this ‘Playoff Push’ and the ‘giveaways’ you mentioned are part of this incredibly well-conceived ‘con’ and the way UGM ‘conceived’ it through the ‘evolutions’ of the con…..
it has legs that can go on and on for now….. until it collapses for a variety of reasons.
@Denny – .50 cent per transfer to checking account
I will not state figures. I have enough reason to ride this out now. The proof is in MY pudding. Others on my team i will probably have convince a little more. Hopefully they talk to me first.
Download numbers were good, actual play(token spend) not so much. And that is something that worried me from the beginning.
@Time – what happened with college football?
I just went to firefan website for the first time and this was posted by them:
Explain the lies?
I’ve been following this exchange for quite a while, mostly due to the fact that I was hit up to be an affiliate and decided against it, pretty much determining that this was a glorified pyramid scheme.
I’m attached to a Facebook Group for a team of affiliates, and just today someone posted that they made approx. $4 from tier one, but didn’t mention anything else.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but they had to pay a $29.99 entry,. plus $9.99 per month. NFL season will be over in a few weeks, NCAA FB is done, there is no NBA, MLB, Soccer, etc. with this app as of yet. Exactly what will they be generating any cash from without a sport?
And there were a ton of complaints about not being able to answer questions/predictions before the next play. How is that going to work for a sport like basketball that is so fluid?
It’s just dumb. And the release date couldn’t make any less sense.
Just an update because I said I would. Not here to flame or argue. Just provide info.
1. I received payment. I’m happy with it at this point and its above “$10” as one poster questioned.
2. NBA will be available by Tues at the latest.
3. Looking at my “stats” from tokens etc.. The token volume has grown tremendously in comparison to Dec . I’ve almost matched my December totals in the first week of January from 1 NFL playoff weekend. Can those #’s be sustained after the NFL is over? Time will tell
4. The app has run smoothly 95% of the time the last 2-3 weeks. 1 exception was late in GB/NYG game which was issue with the stats provider (that SI uses) not the app itself.
5. My concern right now is they have no ads for free tokens. Told its in process.. Although if you share the app you get 2 free tokens so its not mandatory to buy them to play.
6. I played in Urlachers league.. He promotes it constantly on twitter etc. By far the best experience i have had while playing. Largely because thousands are playing at the same time, constant chat about the NFL game. He interacts. If that was the “goal” of the FF experience.. his games nail it. Problem is not many like his.
Any other legit questions ill be happy to respond to.
NCAA football will not be allowed as UGM must submit documentation to the NCAA and the chances of approval are slim to none ….. do not care what the FireFan page says or does not say. UGM has more than ‘fudged’ on quite a few things, period.
Someone ‘actually’ made at least 10 bucks ….. fantastic!
There is no possible way this app can keep up with the NBA….it is absolutely to ‘fluid’ as someone mentioned. You will have pre-game/halftime and between quarters and that is that.
I have no idea what a ‘legit’ question is on an opinion board.
Would you say that the time, effort and financial investment is paying off over a 12 month period?
@Tiernan
Great question but the answer, if answered honestly, will be an entire embarrassment… and, of course ‘they’ who answer will refer only to the ‘launch to now’ and not the ‘expenditures over time’ to the ‘income derived to this time’.
What is even adding more ‘insult to injury’ in a profit/loss scenario is that during this ‘beta stage’ only your tier one Affiliates are eligible to participate. So all the work and time put in prior building a team if ‘bumpkus’…. just as planned.
A little ‘typo’ there. ‘is’ not ‘if’. I said all the work and time….. I neglected to add money. Venturing a guess with ‘marketing costs in ads and on CL i.e. and the ‘various’ fees charged by UGM that the profit to expenditure percentile is in the tens of thousands to one.
I ‘know’ what I spent in advertisement and what the fees are as a basis for my conclusion. Now, I know what the initial checks were, also.
Virtually all did not make enough to get a check…. so under 5 bucks in their ‘holding’ tank. Draw your own conclusions.
I’d say the payoff is similar to my 8 years off undergraduate and graduate schooling. Without doing a thorough analysis – at this time i’d even say UG is better.
@CoCtDe
Me too. My work composed of sending texts and social media posts from my couch while watching baseball. And I believe I will be in the black by month 2.
If they add a little more guts to the game, like a Double Jeopardy style multiplier for questions (i.e I risk 10,50,100 points) I really think it could take off. Especially after ads and rewards are added.
Good luck to you and Joe on your future.
@Tiernan Dont know how you measure that?
Financial.. I will make more than my monthly fees and its not close so i would say yes.
Time/Effort.. Sending out some texts, Social media etc while laying in bed. That’s all I did. Followed up with some people occasionally.
At this point for me its just hosting games and invites.
Other than the UG fees.. I have not spent one penny promoting this.
@Tiernan
I ‘still’ have that ‘property’ as the ‘sale’ fell through thanks to your ‘interference’.
Want to ‘co-op’ a real ‘deal’ this time. I will get the ‘watering’ rights and you can have ‘all’ the sand. Heck of a deal…. don’t you think?
@Joe For the people who are doing this full time, the return on investment ( Time spent plus outlay) would need to be $2,000 a month or higher. In that zone?
@Denny The tide in our out?
@Tiernan
It ‘snowed’ 2 days ago in the Sahara so the ‘tide’ has been interrupted and I have used my 8 years of graduate and post graduate ‘meteorological’ interpretation in ‘tides’ coming and going and have determined that I will have to ‘enhance’/’increase’ the value of the ‘sand’ property rights based on a ‘repeat’ of the snow and an increased volume in water incoming from the tides.
I know that you ‘understand’ that this is a one time ‘deal’, Tiernan. I await your offer with ‘baited’ breath.
@Tiernan
Full disclosure…..I ‘did’ have to move from my bed to the couch and then back into one or the other ‘thinking’. You will not be charged a commission for this. Fair is fair!
Is tiernan’s offer exclusive to him?
I have had more than a few calls on my mobile phone since 1/3/….this year. I have no voice service as I never use the phone. Used when traveling, only. All the calls were from United Games.
This is another ‘promo’ received today and am certain this will continue from them.
I am curious how ‘far’ they can take this is the only reason I don’t ‘unsubscribe’…. they know I am no longer an Affiliate and will never be.
Only 1 of my over 225 Affiliates made any money. It was in the single digits.
If the download was at least ‘partially’ successfully they would not need be concerned about ‘promos’ and phone calls to ‘vacated’ Affiliates. Have a nice weekend and ‘enjoy’ the games!
Just received this and if this does not ‘appear’ to be a little desperate in ‘invitation’ then don’t know what can possibly be.
Make your own decisions, obviously. However, if ‘things’ were going as well as UG leads to you to believe all this is unnecessary.
Personally, I do not believe that they have 25,000 Affiliates left and their total downloads for the app are less than 75,000….. we shall see.
I have no way of knowing how many affiliates are left. Only they do.
What i do know is at least 100k have downloaded in google store. Not sure on apple because I do not have an iphone but im sure at least another 100k. No clue where you are getting the 75k #. Google nor Apple have any reason to inflate numbers.
Also Natalyn has over 1.2 Million followers.. I”m going to assume that is a rough estimate of how many are in the database downloaded or not. Although you can un-follow her so the # is larger than that.
@Joe
I was clearly talking ‘Affiliates’ of which you have no idea of the ‘number’ of Affiliates remaining nor ‘their’ downloads.
Natalyn’s ‘followers’ are entirely irrelevant…. could it be that is the ‘reason’ for the ‘download’ totals you ‘know’ about?
I do know that one Affiliate on my team ‘no longer’ my team as ‘gone’ from this but he is still in and who has an extensive team, has/had a total of ‘4’ Affiliate ‘downloads’ to date.
Not going to argue with you but your ‘promo’ is more than a bit off-base, Joe. Does that give you a better picture of this ‘scheme’?
Give it some thought, Joe. If UGM/topglobal/vip presentations working in ‘concert’ for the ‘scam’ had any damn brains… they would have left the ‘token’ value at a buck and not a penny.
Give it some thought, again… there, Joe.
@Joe These numbers are so way off. From data I can see, the downloads are in the 100k zone so far for iOS ( iPhone and iPad). Allowing some error in their favor, the total downloads is roughly the same as their claimed number of affiliates – 238,000.
This implies that, as predicted. it’s mostly affiliates playing the game, presuming that all users are still active, which they would not be.
We can’t use Natalyns followers as a guide to the downloads as the numbers are pretty much zeroed in on circa 238,000.
It’s from now on that the lies will start to catch up with UG and I predict a crash and burn very soon in the real world. There’s fall off in affiliates and in users and the number of games available for participation.
I guess the right world is “implosion” as commissions fall flat and even the limited effort needed to maintain any interest in leagues etc gets tiresome.
When the real users disappear, what will be left is affiliates realizing they are the ones holding the parcel. Music ends, game stops.
@Tiernan
Not bad, Tiernan.
Your ability to ‘cipher’ evaluations/opinions given is impressive. Latest have received is this below. There are no commissions other than what I have stated prior with the ‘connect’ with UGM and topglobal and vip presentations as that was and is the plan from the get go.
The Affiliates, other than the ‘3’ mentioned in concert above have made virtually ‘no’ money given time and expenses. This is and was all pre-arranged.
The ‘glitter’ and the ‘hype’ were all a well-conceived ‘camouflage’ and it will continue as this is the part of the operation that was set up from the start.
Remember, the so-called ‘celebrities have their own deal so stated by Nataly in a vimeo. Now, what might that be, huh?
Something like this, maybe. You ‘entice’ all the Affiliates to play and buy tokens in your ‘game’ and we ‘cut’ you a ‘piece’ of the pie….deal? Again, beautifully conceived!
(Ozedit: Marketing material removed)
I understand how you got your #’s but dont think its accurate. I have 100x more players that have downloaded the App than affiliates. In fact more than half of the affiliates still have not even downloaded it.
I get about 5 new “players” that download it a day. Of those 5 1-2 are still playing after the initial free tokens.
How it progresses after the NFL is over no one knows. We can all just predict.
In my opinion this app will continue to grow as long as athletes/celebrities are playing it.. Go look at twitter feeds of the former athletes playing.. they promote it often. People flock to them. Fans just want to talk and be involved with them. Signed memorabilia etc.
Urlacher has over 2k people playing in his NFL games. His #’s grow by the hundreds daily. Those are not “new” affiliates wanting to play with him. Those are new players signing in. He’s only 1 guy. Many others are similar.
When I speak to people about it.. I dont say play with me.. I say play with them and piggy back off their games and send invites.
You are correct in saying when the “real” users go away it will crash and burn. In my opinion though as long as new athlete/celeb types are playing and promoting it the “real” users will stand by them.
Also to add.. When my Feb/Mar commission comes in I will have a clear idea of the growth or decline of the app as a whole.
Guys rather than post the marketing emails in their entirety, either quote the relevant part or a summary.
Nobody wants to read lengthy marketing emails that go on and on.
@Joe but the download numbers are pretty accurate, the issue is what number of them are affiliates and what number are real players. If there were ever 238,000 affilates then they all are affiliates but if 1/100th are affiliates then the rest are players.
My guess is 23,800 affiliates and 9 players per affiliate totaling 238,000.
My point really is that the numbers aren’t adding up.
It seems you have the method to maximize revenue pretty much sorted but even with celebreties endorsing this, what exactly will they be playing after Superbowl?
Those Numbers seems fair as far as what is available for all to see (google,apple downloads).
Legit question you ask which is why I think March will be the best guess to look at commissions. The March commissions will be entirely made up of NBA games during Feb.
If at that point the “celebrities” lose interest post NFL then i think its going to fade fast.
@Tiernan @Joe
You are correct in your ‘estimation’ of the numbers according to what I know from feedback from Affiliates. In fact, you are over-estimating the Players by some 50% of those the ‘actually’ stay and play.
All this emphasis on the ‘celebrities’ to organize the games and have ‘Affiliates’ feed off that ‘organization’ is doomed to fail as that is confining and reliant right from the get go. That was not the original intent in the least.
The NBA is probably the absolute ‘worst’ venue that UGM could have done following the NFL. The app will be a ‘failure’ because the game is too fluid as some have mentioned, here. And, there is no ‘audience’…. the NBA has an ‘extremely ‘niche’ audience.
It seems to me that some Affiliates have forgotten that this is a business opportunity to make money and not just ‘follow’ the ‘stars’ and have fun. A better word than ‘follow’ is probably ‘duped’.
After the initial commission checks….. you can take that 23,000 Affiliates and flush it down the toiler from what I have heard…..
I still keep up with this fiasco, I’m still in a closed group afffiliate page on Facebook and still have the FireFan app downloaded. It is beyond sad how this is being played out!
Now the ones behind this scam are resorting to sharing charity groups on their official Facebook page with pulling at your heart strings descriptions of each!
They even have a twitter account, FireFan Cares that is for the sole purpose of promoting non profits, how desperate is that!!!!
The only people still playing the app are affiliates, every comment on their social media sites are made by affiliates!
Except for on twitter, there are a couple of guys constantly posting that it’s a scam and they don’t even delete their comments???
Oh yeah I love the Facebook FireFan MVP page also, they promote to come play against so and so for signed gear and most of the guys haven’t played the first game or set up a league to play in!?!
This whole thing has been nothing but a pathetic money grab, absolutely pathetic that it is still going on!!!
Putting your own personal feelings aside for just 1 second.. Helping a non-profit organization make money is in no way a bad thing. Don’t care how it’s spun.
Sharing a story about drunk driver awareness or a Police Officer being shot in the line of duty and helping raise money is in no way a negative.
Flame away at other things but put yourself in check on that.
@Joe
You missed Rico’s point entirely, Joe. Not you nor anyone else know the ‘motives’ behind this latest ‘politically correct’ approach being used by UGM in these latest promos.
Personally, I find it appalling and it speaks volumes to me about how desperate UGM is, period. Supporting ‘charities’ is something we can all opt to do but not ‘under’ the ‘guise’ of a business opportunity….. that presents a real problem for me.
Ditto here.
It’s right out of the MLM/Ponzi playbook. OneCoin, the biggest crypto scam going right now, comes to mind with it’s One World Foundation. Makes me sick.
I am no longer a particularly religious individual but I still find wisdom in the following:
Sad thing is, unless UG pulls a sharp 180′ they aren’t going to receive much of a reward in this world either.
@Denny The point I was trying to make flew right over Joe’s head, my guess is he is still an affiliate and clinging onto hope that he will become rich from this scam! Lol
Well, don’t hold your breathe on how UG has fared with the NBA and ‘play’ from Affiliates and Players and involved celebrities…. as there is/was little to no interest.
This is what was told me and not surprised in the least. The ‘Super Bowl’ will be their last ‘ditch’ effort to ‘slam’ the existing Affiliates and Players and ‘celebs’ to get out the ‘vote’ so to speak.
The ‘promos’ will be coming out very soon…like carnival ‘barkers’….get your ‘tokens’ here and invite your friends and family to have ‘fun’ with us as a ‘big family’ with half the proceeds going to ‘our’ favorite charity….us! Couldn’t resist! This will happen!
Right on schedule. Actually, have received a few more ‘promos’ from UGM ‘highlighting’ the ‘celebrities’ and there ‘presence’ and these are the ‘carnival barkers’ mentioned.
This is from an Affiliate that obviously has no ‘MBA’…. found that rather humorous.
I have talked to a couple of people who are in on this mess who constantly get alerts on their phones of threats being detected, and each one of them have said the same thing, it’s the FireFan app that is the guilty party….
They remove the app and no more threat, they have said this only started happening once the ads went live for free tokens!
Lol Plus everyone I got involved with this has been receiving spam email like they never have before! At least 25-50 a day!!!
Myself included, I am no longer an affiliate but I get the same crap sent to my email everyday too! THANK YOU UNITED GAMES…. THANK YOU!!!!
Interesting – I just received a text saying unusual activity from my bank. I get those when i go out of town, and always go to my banks app.
There may be some validity if what you are saying. However, i have not received any spam email AND the email account i use is my own domain that i’ve only given out sparingly.
I haven’t played in a NBA game and MAY play in the super bowl. I’m still riding this out. They will have to go defunct before i cancel. I spent more money gambling in Nevada this past weekend, for me to care about losing money.
@Rico
For myself, my spam email has increased 3 fold in the last month. I have had a ‘virus’ that required me to ‘restore’ and ‘reboot’ my entire system two days ago. It took hours for this process.
Whether or not this can be attributed to UGM….I will not go that far to blame them. Just seemed a bit odd. Have not had the problem before.
@CoCtDe
Equating this to gaming in Vegas or Reno or wherever…. is a bit ludicrous in my mind but to each his own. You are the ‘perfect’ Affiliate for UGM. When I gamble it for one ‘purpose’ and one only. I am not gambling to lose money and take it quite seriously.
This ‘venture’ is a pittance to you and would be to virtually anyone. The one factor that are seemingly failing to realize is ‘time’ invested in watching the games if and when you do as you seem to have little concern for a ‘pittance’ a month paid to make pennies a month.
Evidently, time for you has little to no value and I find that rather amusing. More power to you….
I actually do not watch the games. I’ve never cared to watch other people play sports (living vicariously through them). And 2 hours of my time (post tax) covers my yearly expenses for this “venture”.
And yes when i lived in CT i moved next to Mohegan/Foxwoods for last 6 months because gambling/playing was a to earn money, a structured system. Vacation trips, i build in my losses to the overall expense.
I have learned not to base my likes into what other people like to do when running a business. Stop thinking that everyone thinks the same way as I do.
@CoCtDe
Talking to the wrong person. There is no ‘structure’ in definition for gambling. None….nada….zero. Unless, you have a ‘genius’ in money management in gambling that all hear about and not one person has found the ‘key’ and that is ‘over’ since the beginning of ‘gaming/gambling.
I am not going to argue with you as that is pointless because you believe that your ‘system’ works. You, my friend, are in for a nightmare and wouldn’t wish it upon anyone.
You are ‘living’ vicariously through yourself and hope to hell it works out that you break even…. most do not even come close and “Lady Luck” is that next attempt and “She” wins every time.
Just know this as you will learn the ‘hard’ way. Good luck to you!
I’ve been following this fiasco for some time now. I’m not an affiliate and never was one but witnessed the hype train this money grab produced.
Tried the app upon launch and as many have mentioned above, it did not work at all. I’ve reloaded the app a couple times since to see if they’ve made any changes.
I’m amused at the little to no progress that has happened within the app itself. Sure, the server issues seem to have improved but the user interface is still a clunky POS and still riddled with glitches.
It’s quite apparent that the only remaining people hyping the app, playing the app, and leaving positive social media reviews or positive ratings in app stores, are the affiliates themselves.
1) I have iOS. Anytime a developer updates the app, the reviews/rating system start over for the new version. I am hoping that the plethora of people that gave an honest review with no affiliation to UG return and repost their feedback for the latest version.
As a consumer, I can’t stand when ratings are overinflated by a large group of people that share the same common non-consumer interest/investment.
If all affiliate reviews were removed from both the google play and Apple Store, what would firefan rating look like? I’m guessing a 2.5 star AT BEST!!
2) UG claimed to have the first app of it kind. Lies… another app with a similar concept was released well before UG even started their hype train.
3) i would be interested to see an affiliate anonymously post what their recent “commission” was. The NFL is a lot more popular than the NBA. Come 2/6/17, when football season is officially over, I foresee an incredible drop off in players, that is if non-affiliate players still exist.
4) The ad feature is just as misleading as everything else UG has put forward. They have Nissan listed as a sponsor under the ad section when it’s really just linking the webpage of the local Nissan car dealership that is supposedly giving away a car. If a company like Nissan actually partnered with UG I would be impressed/shocked.
Hopefully people start seeing the writing on the wall instead of continuing to flush their money away into the pockets of these top level MLM schemsters
Not an argument. My spreadsheet shows my days(back in the day) in the red and days in the black. Structure – Meaning i stuck to a system that wasn’t tied to winning or losing.
With that said and going back to the ‘Hard’ way and UG. Are you saying i am going to get an overwhelming amount of spam email and that is the Hard way?
Everyone’s tolerance is different. if one man is willing/can afford to loss 10 and another 1000. Where does the hard way begin?
@RTG
I liked an ad for some socks. I may purchase them. I need to go back and see what brand they are.
@CoCtDe
You are getting a bit strange there, my man. We ‘all’ appreciate your ‘tolerance’ and obviously you have more money to spend than most of ‘us’ peons, here.
‘We’ entertained a business opportunity to make money and not to ‘donate’ to high level MLM/Ponzi con artists and make them rich at our expense which is any expense given to ‘con’ artists of this ilk. Why are you so ‘insistent’ is perpetuating this con/scheme?
Insofar as spam emails…it is what I said but you seem to be ‘untouched’ and that is rather interesting. Hope your good fortune in that respect remains.
One of my first jobs was parking cars for Harrah’s Club when Bill Harrah was married to Bobbie Gentry and was their personal chauffeur when they went to Tahoe. Harold Smith would come in and play blackjack until he won or lost 30 grand almost every night. I think I know a bit about gambling.
I have an idea about ‘systems’…..back in the day.
Was his goal 30k up or down and that was his exit strategy? Not up 30 and try to push to 45….
Couldn’t help myself but to come back here and see what was going on. Couple observations and one bit of advice for CoCtDe.
First for CoCtDe – i worked for gambling establishments for many years. They love people who think they have a system. Systems sometimes (rarely) work for longer than one would think possible. They almost always crash and burn in the end.
We didn’t make billions every year because the people who wagered had a winning “system”. Though many thought they did because thye chose to ignore losses to some degree or another and always remembered their wins.
We tracked all bettors. Virtually no one made money over the long haul. There were a few very rare exceptions now and then, guess what, they get blacklistd from all sports books. They then try to use strawmen and women to place their bets for them. A real cat and mouse game.
If you have beaten the odds for years on end, congratulations you are truly one in a million. I would be careful you go down the rathole when your system stops working.
If you truly are better at odds setting then the big boy sports books, look at getting a job or start a betting information service. You will make serious coin if you really consistently win. Given that why waste your time on this penny ante game?
Regarding the mlm scam known as Firefan / United Games- i feel sorry for all the people who poured money they didn’t have to lose and hours that would have generated a better return working at burger king into this pathetic game.
The blindness to major lies as to revenue potential early on in this scam is only accomplished by sucking in people who are chasing the get rich quick scheme.
“First of its kind”, “will be bigger than pokemon go”, Mark whatever his name was, was the brains behind Madden Football, Nascar, etc., huge lies by Natalyn, documented on youtube, about how much revenue angry birds genertes, etc, etc.
Then launch a “beta” to the public. Does anyone associated with this company know the meaning of “beta”??
Then get affiliates to sign up for monthly token packages to get them further invested and praying and hoping that this obvious scam is still going to pay off.
Use charities and other heart pulling strings and other typical scam methods to keep people in. The site itself is built on ancient code…Guess Apple and Google have no morals eitheras long as they get their cut.
The phony reviews by Affiliates are so obvious it is ridiculous. All in all it is nithing more than another way to scam people based on a get rich quick scheme that fizzled from day one. It will stay alive as long as Affiliates keep paying and new players can be churned through the system. Sad.
What amazes me is that no one starts a class action against these types of companies. Maybe the ambulance chaser attorneys know that these types hide their money immediately and there is no way anyone ever recovers thefraud induced expenditures.
Won’t be surprised if this goes on until next football season and beyond… chasing the end of the elusive rainbow while the owners have already found theirs.
@Sportsjunkie
What you posted is accurate. It will fall on deaf ears insofar as concerns gambling and individuals that ‘believe’ they have a ‘defined’ system that works for ‘them’ because they had a ‘run’ of ‘luck’….. it is all ‘luck’ but that does not get through their skulls until…. it ends and it will end, quickly.
It ‘always’ does and without ‘exception’. I know many ‘ol time pros that will tell you the exact same thing.
I played ‘professionally’ for many years in the ‘backrooms’ on a bar circuit that was essentially 5 and 7 stud. Slept in my car quite a bit…. more than I like to recall. Living high one day and damn near broke the next.
Yes, you will get ‘blacklisted’ at a casino if the ‘pit boss’ has any suspicion that you are ‘gaming’ the game. You will be asked to leave and not come back using the same ‘system’.
Many, old timers could count cards with a single deck but that is no longer possible….now, the shoe. You cannot wear glasses…. sun glasses….. others…. you will be asked to remove them.
Craps is the best odds game if you know how to play it. There is one way still…. that will make you a winner, consistently. You will be asked to leave, politely. Yep, they can track your play to the penny.
I was ‘comped’ virtually every time with a room and all the amenities. I’ll stop there as have a ton of stories since this was brought up.
UG is probably the most well-conceived con that I have ever witnessed. There will be ‘lawsuits’ in my estimation/opinion and have a thought they are already in process.
With the ‘remaining’ Affiliates…. they are like the gentlemen mentioned in your post and/or are part of the scam as in vippresentations/topglobal….. this will not go down well for UG as the shit is probably about ready to hit the fan if I don’t miss my ‘guess’.
One thing is certain…. you will never see Jeff Henderson or Natalyn Woods or the rest of bunch in ‘inviting’ a con/scam business opportunity again.
‘They’ are dead in the water for that to ever happen. They know it and ‘they’ are looking to ‘cash’ in and probably have their money stashed….. but, not safe other than in their ‘minds’. They will get caught if it is as I see it.
@sportsjunkie – yea, the phony reviews are pretty comical and easy to spot. There were 300+ 5 star reviews in the Apple Store on the apps launch on thanksgiving.
Odd how there were so many reviews on a day that the app didn’t work and had zero functionality. Apple and Google really need to start flagging instances like that.
Dishonest promotion. I’m sorry, but if invested in a dud or in this case a dud that is a scam, I would not positively rep it.
The kool aid drinkers are all probably starting to look like fools to the family, friends and colleagues they continually promote this to…
@sportsjunkie @denny
Guys, I know there is no system to win. Some of us are luckier than others at times. As i said this was in the past. I moved next to the casino for 6 months and had a good run.
MY SYSTEM was drive 30 min, play an hour return home in 30 min. No matter what happened i was in and out. I kept a spread sheet tallying my gas spent and my winning losses for each trip.
I’ve placed 4000 bets in an effort to chase a loss and won. I could have been in a worse place if it weren’t for luck.
Currently if i go to a casino i have a amount i’m ready to loss. I won back half of my losses sunday and was fine with the loss.
Anyhow, about this mlm and sharing with friends. I’ve sat on the sideline, and not pressing anyone into downloading and trying to get tokens.
I do agree the captains of this ship will be on this last hoorah, If the numbers are right they each leave with 3 million. For the average person that is 30 years of working.
CoCtDe…If You made $100.000 a year. You would take home maybe $60,000. It would take you 50 years go get your hands $3 million.
All their money is coming from the affiliates. Good for them. They taught all the affiliates there is no honest get rich quick.
Go and make money the old fashion way. Get a job and go to work. Lesson learned.
Thanks for your Vegas stories.. Lived in LV for 20 years. Heard or lived em all.
Rundown of FACTS for the lurkers.
1. Ads are live. Watch em, get tokens. 6 per day limit.
2. Rewards are live. Tickets you earn from playing can be redeemed for prizes.
Sample of prizes
Gift Cards from Amazon, Airfare, AMC etc.
The next month should be telling with NBA only.
One thing I do find comical still with all the detractors is they will spin everything into a negative and complain about this great con,scam etc because Natalyn and friends will leave with 3 million each. Well up to this point they have deliverd eveything they have said just not at the pace some wanted.
Yet, most seem to be ok with spending hundreds at a game and filling up athletes million dollar bank accounts and owners billion dollar pockets. The kick back for that has no reward.
All in perspective.
@Joe
Vegas ‘stories’ must be a metaphor for all gambling joints I gather. I never played there and was well advised not to by a pro when young. Neither here nor there.
The rest of what you said insofar as the ‘promo’ stuff. Yep, got all the same info even though I have tried ‘unsubscribing’ for months with no success.
I have not ‘spun’ a thing, Joe. It is what it is and how I see it, period. Please, they have not done (delivered) everything that they said they (UG) would.
You know that is bullshit, Joe. I am not going to go back to the beginning of this scam to make my points. It is all already here in different post…. mine and others.
Your last paragraph is ridiculous….. what the hell type of analogy is this!
NBA….. 28 teams lost money last season and that is a fact. If not for the TV contracts they would not survive. Viewer ship is down on the ‘tube’, also…..way way down.
The NFL got destroyed in the ratings this year and all know that…. I predict it will continue for one reason that I will be censored for by OZ. I will just say it has been coming for decades and is now here.
Good luck to you, Joe. However, I have a feeling there are few ‘lurkers’ here that have an interest other than to ‘enjoy’ what is left of this con/scam/failed business opportunity coming or whatever one wants to call this disaster.
Also update on my token volume
January was 1/3 higher than December…
As of now my Feb is on pace to double my January.. Much of that was helped by the SB so see where it goes from here.
You cannot ‘unsubscribe’ from this….. I will ‘absolutely’ call it a con, now.
I received a new ‘promo’ about awarding the car to some guy in Ohio with his ‘moniker’ in the award and name. I will bet anyone here that it is all part of this in con.
Quell that as I know that ‘betting’ is illegal. You get my drift.
Now, new bullshit in con with a new promo in ’15’ days of bullshit. This will not stop as long as the ‘con’ stays in ‘promos’…… this has ‘legs’ forever as long as the remaining Affiliates and carnival barkers (celebrities) promote it.
Joe, you actually can do this on your ‘couch’ as long as you may want to if the ‘time’ is there….. Call it someone with too much time and that is you.
I get it, Joe. As if I did not before. 1/3 higher…..
This is about as ‘unbelievable’ as it gets! You be the ‘judge’ as the ‘heat’ is being turned up! If this is not ‘desperation’ knowing the end is near then I don’t know what is.
This ‘outfit’ is the king of cons and just got this and their second promo of the day giving you ‘children’ Affiliates direction. Amazing!
(Ozedit: Cliffnotes please, marketing spam removed)
Please ‘Denny’ cut ‘this’ out!
Denny, Word of advice for you. If you do not want the emails.. Change your email address in your profile. Genius thought I know.
For a guy that comes across as a know it all you sure do seem to always overlook the most simple things.
@Joe
Now, you sound like a baby that lost his ‘rattle’. You giving anyone advice is beyond comical.
Focus on all that money that you are making and it isn’t costing you a penny!
Change my email direction because an ‘outfit’ of cons keeps emailing me ‘promos’ I have ‘unsubscribed’ from numerous times and then inform all my contacts that I have a new email direction? Ludicrous, Joe.
They keep sending and I will keep posting and much to your chagrin I am certain.
Have a nice day, Joe.
No Genius, Change your email address in your firefan profile account. Redirect them to a dummy email account. Takes 1 minute. I’m sure though you would rather come here and post every detail you get from a company you don’t care about.
You can post all day if you feel the need. Makes no diff to me.
Facts are my team and revenue are growing daily and all im doing is playing the app at this point. I make $$ off of it which is more than I can say for the other 20 or so apps I have downloaded and played in the past few years.
Ill have a GREAT day.. You do the same
Can you withdraw any of it?
Just wondering if you hyping up gains that are pocket change?
So did this app really work during the super bowl or not?
It goes to an account that you can either load on a card or you can transfer directly to your checking account. I believe it was $.50 to transfer to bank and like $2.50 to load on card.
One mans trash is another mans gold. Im not trying to “hype” anything. Am I going to retire or quit my job.. 0 chance.
Whether you or anyone lurking sign up is of no real benefit for me. It’s much easier to post on any social media and drive interest that way. I’m just giving my input of Facts and personal opinion on it. A ying to Dennys yang.
I played on SB and it worked without a hitch. Everyone gets the same feed from whomever loads stats into Sports Illusrated gamecast. Cant recall the name. So if anyone had problems it was because of each owns internet/cell.
@Joe
I have not had an account for months, genius. Can’t your read that in my posts!
Moot point in any event…why should I have to do a thing! When you are sent multiple ‘promos’ and they have a ‘link’ to ‘unsubscribe’ and you can’t…then UG is at fault and that is pure and simple. SB absolutely did not go off “without a hitch”!
I have been told that ‘multiple’ times by my ‘past’ Affiliates. You are not trying to ‘hype’ anything? Who in the hell are you kidding, Joe?
Your post was hype and recruitment with a cute little disclaimer attached about you not giving a crap. Really!
Futile and pointless to talk to you, Joe….. it would be for anyone! You are funny as hell, however!
Further, you are the only person I have ‘heard’ of that is making any money other than maximum 8$ on last check…. no one is going to make more than pennies off this app other than UG and cronies in VIPpresentation/topglobal and that is how this was all arranged from the onset! topglobal
@Joe,
So have you received your card, or have you received a deposit of the unbelievable commission you made?
My guess is it’s only a couple of dollars if that? And you mention that the Super Bowl went off without a hitch?
Funny, all I heard was how the app kept freezing up and acting like it has since November, LIKE SHIT!!!
Another thing, I read on an affiliate page on Facebook today that the tokens played have been no where near what affiliates should be getting, when they complained to United Games all they heard was more bullshit?
Do you honestly think they are going to accurately keep track of who deserves what? Of course not, they are just going to keep throwing crumbs to you idiot affiliates, and keep feeding you bullshit!!!
Another thing Joe, you mentioned the live feed for the app is the same one used by other sources of live feed data during games. (Ozedit: marketing spam removed)
@ Rico
Believe it or not! I just got paid and have no account and have not for months. You wonder where the money is going, huh? Have an idea, now? That ‘stash’ for UG is growing!
How many Affiliates that have ‘vacated’ ‘just got paid’ or not, also. Check out the ‘stats’ and know I had a large team…so any arguments saying that Affiliates are making money other than a penny / dollar here and there are ‘debunked’.
Now, you have an idea of what the Affiliates have been used for and this is amazing! I will delete some of the email as probably OZ requires. This is absolutely the best con/scam in the history of cons/scams that I personally have ever witnessed. I have an idea but will forego that for now.
payment received from United Games LLC
United Games LLC
4:25 PM (21 minutes ago)
to me
Welcome!
You received a payment of $14.42 USD from United Games LLC
To access your payment(s), please set up your United Games LLC account using the following link.
Create New User Account
Transaction Details
Transaction Date: 2017-02-10T23:25:36Z
Amount: $14.42 USD
Expiration Date: —
Message: Amount funded is your commission less a $.50 processing fee. Your commission detail for this period is:Tokens Purchased: $11.09. Tokens Played: $0.00. Checkmatch Purchased: $3.81. Checkmatch Played: $0.03.
Totally, amazing…..sure, I got ‘snookered’ by myself to get into this and learned one hell of a lot! So, can’t give ‘grief’ to others as they were as clueless as I ‘was’ but they remain so and so be it.
Some here once hinted Apple/Google may not allow Firefan for various reasons.. Well it launched so those of you were wrong.
And above from Denny, Well Denny… Jessie Merl just said NCAA Basketball will be available soon and it will be a full go for March Madness. Im sure he is lying though because of the slim to no chance UG has with the NCAA. Right?
Spin away… con, scam, joke, fools!!!
@ Joe
Joe, then I will stand corrected if ‘true’. Once they find out about this (NCAA) and knowing the ‘problem’ that college ‘kids’ have with ‘gambling’ on campus…. and, they will…… it will be another nail in the coffin for UG one way or the other.
If allowed…. UG will be tracked so closely to fulfill their ‘payment’ types in obligation it will be ‘fun’ to watch this ‘unfold’. Do you ‘think’ for a moment that ‘college kids’ and their parents won’t be able to track this? Get a clue!
It will go right back to the NCAA and all hell will hit the fan. You wanted “FireFan’ then UG has just ‘fueled the fire!
Jessie Merle is funny and not to be taken seriously, other. Same cronies and same deal with topglobal/vippresentations in concert/same with UG, as the masters of spin and disguise.
I do see you did not confront or respond to my ‘stats’ given in payments right here posted…. Joe.
Why is that, Joe?
Denny, Where to begin with you.. I’m starting to realize you just are trolling at this point but i’ll play along.
You do realize it is legal to gamble on the NCAA right? So even if this was gambling which it isn’t you think parents are going to sue the NCAA because they signed off on allowing an app to use its name?Little Johnny spent $200 on tokens.. Lawsuit!
Most campuses across America are within a 3 hour drive to a casino. Some even have them within 15-30 minutes. UNLV campus is behind the Strip .
Any legal age college student can walk to the MGM.. Drop 2k on UNLV and then walk to the arena and watch it. Why doesnt the NCAA stop it?
As far as your stats I could care less. Everything is con/scam to you. Until your proven wrong over and over again. Then you get a new angle..Con/scam. Rinse repeat.
This app should have been stopped months ago but the NBA, NFL, Apple, Google, NCAA etc all keep letting it continue i guess.
Quite honestly I enjoyed the banter with you for awile but now i’m bored with you and your predictable, stale retorts. “con”! “scam”!
Have a Wonderful day.
I think it’s important to remember that UG has no form of partnership with the NCAA or the NBA any more than they had any sort of relationship with the NFL. They buy their live game data feed from SportRadar (dot com) on a subscription basis.
They could have launched NHL or Premier League football for example but for what ever reason made a business decision not to. SportRadar scale prices to number of API hits but there is a base price for their services. Perhaps UG didn’t think those offerings would pay for themselves.
One thing I salute UG for, they have not yet reopened affiliate signups. Their monthly token subscriptions function like a traditional MLM autoship but for as long as they don’t allow affiliate recruitment existing affiliates have little choice other than to try and find genuine customers. This is a good thing.
How long this lasts however is anyone’s guess.
@Joe
You are old news, Joe. The ban on gambling ‘same city’ residents/visitors as home team was lifted some 15 years ago or so in Nevada (anywhere). So, what’s your point?
You ‘hit’ the problem ‘button’ when you mentioned ‘tokens’ whether it be tokens = money or prizes. I ‘said’ …. if they don’t get paid and this is so important because it is ‘legal’….. shit will hit the fan, Joe.
It is you that just is not getting it, Joe. I don’t have to ‘wonder’ as I know that you are so obviously such a proponent that you will die promoting somethin (app) that is damn near dead already!
I have not been proven wrong as to the business opportunity as a money-making venture by you nor anyone else. This is a scam and you have said not one thing to debunk that. “Show me the money”……you can’t and I did show the ‘money for 2 months that is posted.
No one else “can show me the money”, period. Beginning to wonder if you are not missing some grey matter upstairs. You are a ‘hoot’, Joe.
@GlimDropper
Thanks for the info, Glim. That is something I did not know.
The ‘hits’ thing is of interest to me and as a ‘business decision’ for UG it is a ‘cost factor’….gathering that more ‘hits’ would be far better volume-based dollar-wise expenditure.
So, they chose not to go volume-based but paid more for lesser hits ‘right now’? Bottom line is that they are paying a ‘base’ price + an amount per hit, then? That tells me that the ‘hits’ are not worth getting a volume price?
My prediction….. UG will open Affiliate enrollment, again. They ‘never’ said they wouldn’t ‘definitively’.
Yes, I have talked to them months ago. My account has been cancelled months ago and yet I continue to receive promos and latest a commission statement posted.
UG stated that all Affiliates with accounts ‘closed’ (which seems to be an impossibility) would be condensed to those on the upper rung of their ‘upline’…. obviously, this has not been done and I know why.
It is called being between a rock and a very hard place. For me to ‘activate’ my account it would be 29.99 or 39.99 + 5 + 5 + 5 Do the math and that is a nice chunk of change from every Affiliate they continue to ‘badger’.
Right now and this is a fact….. there are only Affiliates playing the games and sharing their token purchases….. very few ‘real’ Players.
Thanks for the insight, Glim.
The app in the store is not the app that was touted before.
Please elaborate.
Have you ever launched an application?
Do you realize that all businesses go through iterations or versions. Think Windows 95 2000 XP etc.
Yes, several.
I do realize.
I would think more like 4Square became Swarm as a good example of iterations, versions and to add, pivots.
However, @Joe uses the launch of the app as proof that the naysayers were wrong but the original iteration had cash and prizes as a main hook and that’s not the case now. Premiership football was also used as a follow up to NFL and that too is no longer the case.
My token volume for Feb has already surpassed Jan. This could be happening for a couple of reasons.
1. Free tokens has made it easier for current affiliate/players to play daily without spending money
2. More players have joined so its natural progression
Mixture of both?
@Tiernan
They are giving prizes for playing…Points plus activity equal tickets which can be redeemed for prizes listed in the app. As far as the “cash” goes.. Honestly don’t recall that being in the pitch but could be wrong.
Fact is based on my #’s and volume of play it has grown the last 3 months. Now with addition of NCAA hoops i expect it to continue for now.
Like i’ve said from the start.. Dont expect to get rich but it is not slowing down thus far at all.
@Tiernan
It was only a matter of time until the ‘fishes’ got hooked by ‘themselves’. I was patiently waiting until someone actually ‘bothered’ that had any intelligence of all this MLM/Ponzi scheme ‘shit’ that has totally destroyed the ‘word’ business opportunity.
“Iterations’ is code for bullshit in “progress’ and that I do know. I have known….now, these ‘pawns’ in this have ‘defined’ and ‘devised’, themselves.
They have ‘defined’ themselves in being ‘pawns’. What now….elaborate more? Give me 5 more years to prove this to you. You have just won a car! Oh, I have more tokens for you, “free”…..Sorry, tokens actually played last month=zero.
You will do better next month! We are sending the “prizes” out in the next couple days by “pony express” or you have the ‘option’ of taking your ‘prize’ in tokens. We must “inform’ you that cash is no longer an option, sorry!
You did not reach ‘our’ quota in new Player recruitments and our Affiliate members are “leaving us”. Your new monthly fee will be 9.99 a month and we are ‘opening’ the enrollment for ‘new’ Affiliates…. and, are inviting the “few’ real Players we have to become Affiliates and give “us’ more “money” for doing absolutely nothing….
You all can donate to the charity of your choice, of course….. this is in lieu of the money you will receive… which is none!
God bless you and ‘we’ (UG) wish you remain as loyal as you are!
@denny please stop with the ‘quotes’ it really makes it hard to ‘read’ what you write.
I agree with the last paragraph. The bill of sale is not as written. I happen to be an under promise over deliver type person. It sucks to go back on your word and then need to make corrections
“not’ sure ‘what” you “mean’ “?”
I refer ‘you’ to the “Dick and Jane” books. Begin with “See Spot Run”…..then, when you have grasped the content, go to “See Spot Jump”.
Then, go to “See Puff Run and Jump”. It will take some time and I understand. Rather a ‘curious’ analogy, there. Too damn funny! I know the analogy is way beyond, Joe.
NCAA Mens Hoops is now available and I played last night. I guess i’ll wait for that nail in the coffin now from the NCAA.
They probably backdoored the NCAA.
No, Since UG is making hundreds of Millions of dollars off of this they paid off the NCAA and cut them a slice of the pie.
Or, the most obvious answer is the NCAA is an affiliate of course.
@joe
UG is not making hundred of millions of dollars. The game is terrible period. The user interface is so clunky that is has not hope in hell of ever achieving what was promised in terms of popularity. I don’t care how many sports they get in there.
They delivered the bare minimum on what they said they would deliver. The game never went viral nor will it because it’s shit. Wheather this was intentional or just over enthusiasm on their part, who knows.
The entire revenue stream is driven by the affiliate base and that’s what makes this a scam.
Turn on your sarcasm meter
@joe I should have caught. Lol, clearly I was having an off day.
Update on Feb #’s..My token volume for Feb just fell short of doubling Jan but saw a 37% increase overall from the previous month.
What token ‘volume’ are you talking? Affiliates playing with themselves? Hell, by the end of next year, maybe….you make some money from your ‘couch’ doing nothing!
How many hours have you put into ‘watching’ games, Joe? I know flat out the NBA is a disaster and the NCAA is the same.
Go ahead and buy more tokens and ‘play on’ and ‘share’ with the other Affiliates and ‘no’ Player commissionable token play.
Have a nice St. Patrick’s Day and the ‘luck of the Irish’ this app needs as is on “Affiliate life support” right now.
@Denny
What do you mean the NBA is a disaster? I’ve played a game and even without watching my guesses were good.
I do question if it’s all affiliates playing, still trying to get traction?
Paid today.. Money increased for the 3rd month in a row… My token volume for March has already surpassed my January numbers.
This isn’t slowing down any time soon. For me it’s become play in a few games.. Chat with people in the games about random b.s… Rinse repeat.. If that’s not your thing then this isn’t for you.
They are paying $2 for every new player that plays. $1 for every existing player on your team that plays thru the end of the basketball tournament as a promotion.
Do the math for the people that have hundreds or thousands of players.
Oh and I have already cashed in multiple $50 gift cards and am now just focusing on the 7 day vacation.
Those are available to anyone that plays though.. Don’t need to be an affiliate.
Have a good weekend guys.
I check in on this still, and after tonight I had to! I played the app tonight, trying to help out an affiliate I got into this mess who still thinks he will make money!
THE APP IS AS BORING AS EVER!!!! No live prediction calls of upcoming plays? I had heard that was now in the app?
And I recognized almost all of the names of people who were playing!!! The only ones playing the app are affiliates, it is a full blown pyramid scheme!!!!
1. Based off playing one night..You know every affiliate in the data base by name? How did you come to that conclusion exactly?
2. If this is the case.. How is it that my numbers continue to grow as does my new player base?
What do you mean by live prediction calls?
Why is it that no one has posted their commissions here other than myself? Is it some deep dark secret?
Darn certain that I want to get some gift cards for playing that have coming to my mailbox every few days for doing nothing. And, a trip paid for…. well, by golly count me in!
There are not commissionable token Players other than a very few, period. Affiliate names are easily recognizable, also. Affiliates are entirely supporting this application with their token purchases and that is just a fact that I know and have been told.
Yeah, rinse and repeat and it costs me nothing to win these prizes and a possible trip and maybe an autographed min-helmet of some other ‘celebrity’ prize which I am just dying to get!
UGM loves it’s Affiliates! Keep buying them tokens….. and, rinse and repeat and just get those fantastic prizes and UGM thanks you for your gift that just keeps on giving us money! Totally, a Ponzi scheme.
You want trinkets?
@CoCtDe
What an inane and ridiculous comment. It is impossible to know where your head is other than embracing stupidity at this point.
If you have no educated and responsible comment then just do not bother. You are the usual troll and it is now that obvious. Get a new line of work as responding to you will never be done by me on any venue as concerns business opportunities.
Any credibility you have is gone and done and am certain that am not alone. Have a nice day and put on a smiley face.
HELLO….HELlo….Hlllo……helllo…hel.. ANYBODY HERE….HEre…..here…….her…..
Just popped in to get an update on this dealeo. Feels like I’ve entered a masoleum.
Weird…
What more needs to be said, other than the fact United Games Marketing visitor member numbers peaked in December 2016 and have been on a steady decline since then, falling 67,205 places on the Alexa rankings in the past 90 days.
Bounce rate is up 31%, Pageviews down 14.83% and average time on site down 22% for the same period.
IOW, anyone who invests money now is guaranteed to lose it.
@Marvin @littleroundman
Mausoleum, that is putting it mildly, Marvin. Where are all those fanatical proponents of this con, now? What an embarrassment for them any way you look at it. Do not think that you will hear from the ‘Lewis brigade’ in the future in business opportunities.
Hell, they made out like the ‘bandits’ they are. Next stop for them is the Cayman Islands or a courthouse or both. Just surmising and only an opinion.
Thanks for the stats, littleroundman.
Still around – Thanks for the ALexa rankings.
LOL, this thing is still limping along. Just stumbled across this craigslist spam for them.
Kuvera is reporting the two companies merging.
So…its official? Stick a fork in it?
Hey Oz, I’ve been lurking for awhile (found you via mention on Pink Truth) and I’ve been reading back through many of your reviews.
I read through this United Games review and its entire comments and decided to search it now to see where it stands. I went to the BBB reviews and discovered that it apparently shut down without warning in August. Per one affiliate’s complaint:
Maybe it’s worth making a quick post about this apparent official shutdown? There are other complaints on the site with similar issues. And UG did respond to many of them…with more BS.
Sold off to Kuvera Global last year – https://behindmlm.com/companies/united-games-marketing-acquired-by-investview-kuvera-global/