5 Star Signals Review: Recruitment and 3rd party forex
5 Star Signals operate in the forex MLM niche and appear to be based out of Ireland.
As per the 5 Star Signals Terms and Conditions:
Jurisdiction and venue of any matter not subject to arbitration shall reside in The Republic of Ireland.
Heading up 5 Star Signals is CEO Mariska van de Langenberg.
As per van de Langenberg’s 5 Star Signals corporate bio, she has
over 25 years in international Corporate management and over 5 years in network marketing.
Further research reveals van de Langenberg (right) was an affiliate of Global One and Bonofa in 2013.
Global One initially launched in 2012 as Ultimate Power Profits and sought to capitalize on the Zeek Rewards penny auction Ponzi craze at the time.
Following the SEC bust of Zeek Rewards in August 2012, Global One abandoned plans to launch their penny auction Ponzi.
The company limped along as a straight recruitment opportunity for another year or so, before collapsing entirely in mid 2013.
van de Langenberg stuck with the company till she left it for Bonofa in May 2013.
Bonofa affiliates pay a fee to join and then earn commissions by recruiting other affiliates who do the same.
The company also ran an unregistered securities points scheme, which was purportedly attached to an IPO offering.
Going by their Alexa statistics, Bonofa appears to have collapsed late last year.
Van de Langenberg appears to have gotten out as Bonofa went into decline, with 5 Star Signals launching in mid 2014.
According to van de Langenberg’s Facebook profile, she is based out of Amsterdam in the Netherlands. This suggests that 5 Star Signals is registered in Ireland in name only.
Read on for a full review of the 5 Star Signals MLM business opportunity.
The 5 Star Signals Product Line
5 Star Signals has no retailable products or services, with affiliates only able to market 5 Star Signals affiliate membership itself.
The 5 Star Signals Compensation Plan
The 5 Star Signals compensation plan sees affiliates pay a fee and then get paid to recruit others who do the same.
Residual commissions are payable if affiliates invest funds with third-party brokers 5 Star Signals have signed up for as affiliates themselves.
Residual Commissions
Residual commissions in 5 Star Signals are paid out via a 10×10 matrix compensation structure.
A 10×10 matrix places an affiliate at the top of the matrix, with ten positions directly under them.
These ten positions form the first level of the matrix, with the second level of the matrix generated by splitting each of the ten first level positions into another ten positions each (100 positions).
In this manner each subsequent level of the matrix is generated, for a total of 11.1 billion positions.
Given this is more than the population of Earth, 5 Star Signals readily disclose
Make yourself no illusions, you will never be able to fill that matrix.
That would require 10 billion people on your 10th level and that will never happen.
Why then 5 Star Signals are using a matrix structure they know affiliates cannot fill is unclear.
In any event, commissions are paid as a percentage of the fees affiliate pay when they sign up as follows:
- level 1 – 12%
- level 2 – 34%
- level 3 – 8%
- level 4 – 6%
- level 5 – 4%
- levels 6 and 7 – 2%
- level 8 – 3%
- level 9 – 4%
- level 10 – 5%
Note that as affiliates are charged fees monthly, the above commission payouts are also monthly recurring.
Broker Commissions
If 5 Star Signals trade, the company charges them a broker commission.
60% of that commission is paid out as commissions across two levels of recruitment (unilevel).
40% is paid on commissions generated by personally recruited affiliate’s trading, and 20% from their recruits (your level 2).
Automated Trading Commissions
Using the same unilevel compensation structure as used in broker commissions, 5 Star Signals affiliates can also earn third level commissions on automated trading earnings.
- funds invested by 3rd level affiliates is greater than $250,000 = 3% commission on third level automated trading earnings
- funds invested by 3rd level affiliates is greater than $500,000 = 5% commission on third level automated trading earnings
- funds invested by 3rd level affiliates is greater than $1,000,000 = 7% commission on third level automated trading earnings
Personal Global Pool
The Personal Global Pool is made up of 1% of the entire funds paid into 5 Star Signals by affiliates.
The pool is paid out quarterly, with affiliates able to qualify for shares in the pool by accumulating points:
- recruit a Copper affiliate = 1 point
- recruit a Bronze affiliate = 2 points
- recruit a Silver affiliate = 5 points
- recruit a Gold affiliate = 10 points
For every 100 points an affiliate generates, they are awarded one share in the Personal Global Pool.
Team Global Pool
The Team Global Pool is also made up of 1% of the entire funds paid into 5 Star Signals by affiliates.
The Team Global Pool is also paid out quarterly, with shares allocated based on the recruitment efforts of an affiliate’s downline:
- Copper affiliate recruited = 0.5 points
- Bronze affiliate recruited = 1 point
- Silver affiliate recruited = 3 points
- Gold affiliate recruited = 5 points
Again, for every 100 points accumulated one share is allocated in the Team Global Pool.
Joining 5 Star Signals
Affiliate membership with 5 Star Signals is $10 plus one of the following:
- Copper – $7 a month (non-MLM)
- Bronze – $27 a month
- Silver – $197 a month
- Gold – $497 a month
All 5 Star Signals affiliates are also charged $20 annually.
Conclusion
Trading Forex, actively or passively, now available for the masses!
The problem with anything passive in MLM is that it typically constitutes the offering of a security.
MLM companies don’t register themselves with the appropriate securities regulators (the SEC in the US for example), and thus engage in the offering of unregistered securities.
5 Star Signals appear to be guilty of this, as I was unable to find any indication they have registered with the SEC or any other securities regulator for that matter.
Breaking down the securities offering, 5 Star Signals solicit minimum investments of $500 into third-party brokers:
5 Star Strategy With No Multiplier – minimum Deposit of $1,000, additional deposits possible and aiming for approx. 3% gains on average per month.
5 Star Strategy With x3 Multiplier – minimum Deposit of $500, additional deposits possible and aiming for 9-10% gains on average per month.
5 Star Strategy With x5 Multiplier – minimum Deposit of $1,000, additional deposits possible and aiming for 15% gains on average per month.
Third-party brokers or no, that’s what is current advertised on the 5 Star Signals website.
And the ROI “aims” on the 5 Star Signals website appear to be pseudo-compliance baloney, with van de Langenberg openly advertising guaranteed ROIs on Facebook (August 27th, 2015):
Now what if that can change….where 100% of the members can make money with money making Forex products (without them even having to learn Forex in order to trade)….so the failure is taken out of the equasion (sic), cool isn’t it?
The rest of the 5 Star Signals compensation plan mirrors what Mariska van de Langenberg was participating in both Global One and Bonofa, that being chain-recruitment.
You sign up, pay a fee and then get paid to recruit others who do the same.
This alone constitutes a pyramid scheme, with the offer of unregistered securities an additional compliance red flag.
Ponzi fraud issues also arise upon consideration of how the advertised 3 to 15% “aimed” ROIs per month are generated.
On paper it’s purportedly through forex, but if newly invested funds are just being shuffled around to pay off existing investors, then all we’re looking at here is a Ponzi pyramid hybrid.
And given van de Langenberg’s MLM history, that wouldn’t at all surprise me.
As per a Facebook post by van de Langenberg dated September 30th, 2015:
I have promoted opportunities that turned to scam in the past and have been even a topleader in a product based pyramid scheme that still goes around.
It is so easy to point a finger and play the blame game to a leader, to an upline.
BUT……no one has forced you to sign up, you all have been able to do your own due diligence, to do a sanity check on a business plan. YOU joined and you joined voluntarily for reasons that only you know.
Take that responsability (sic) yourself and admit you did a poor job or maybe even no job at all in researching an opp and owners before joining. You are very much to blame as well!
With 5 Star Signals the culture of victim-blaming fraud will likely continue.
At best you’re looking at a pyramid scheme attached to questionable third-party brokers. At worst, a pyramid scheme attached to full-blown Ponzi fraud.
Approach with extreme caution.
Well yes it looks good on paper to see 10 levels you can earn from.
Yet you don’t have to fill them all to be paid from them.
The idea is you have room and a place for everyone they bring and their downlines too.
How nice of them.
Most can’t or won’t recruit and if it goes by averages most won’t find more than three.
From the article …
Amsterdam is in Netherland, the largest city in North Holland region of Netherland.
Thanks for catching that. Someone else emailed me about that too.
Not the first time I’ve mixed Netherlands and Norway up, apologies!
Probably not the only thing you’ve got things mixed up then Oz!
Not when it comes to compensation plans.
Hi Oz,
I am not sure how to quote from the article but;
I would presume you never looked into PAMM money management, the idea it would be a ponzi is a somewhat common misconception from people outside of Forex.
Please read this and then let me know if you’d like further explanation.
investopedia.com/articles/forex/010715/how-forex-pamm-accounts-work.asp
The clients funds are always held under their own name in licensed brokers and they allow them to be attached with a master account.
The targets “aimed” for are arithmetic averages (we also provide geometric averages which is what investors tend to look at but less experienced people have trouble understanding the geometric averaging) based upon previous results.
We are just about to launch a new brokerage partnership with a broker that has been cleared from the management of Superannuation funds by ASIC (whether you think this is questionable or not is subjective but ASIC are widely regarded as one of the hardest regulators to get a pass from and it shows the broker passed some due diligence).
Here are some of the live trading accounts where you can see each and every trade made – every single statistic is given.
These are third party published results from real trading.
(If you do not know what Myfxbook and FX Blue are, Google them)
fxblue.com/users/2089104052
fxblue.com/users/510100
These are two accounts that the strategy was running on before it was offered for money management.
Here are more aggressive versions running on investors money (Thus far over it’s whole portfolio 5SS has returned around 160% and every single trade that made up that return can be seen here, as will every trade in the future).
Let me know if once you have researched these things you agree it is impossible for this to be a ponzi (since 5SS never at any point takes a single dollar of investors money). Once we have established everyone understands the model used for managing money in FX, we can then move on to discuss the overall business.
(Please note, these links can be bookmarked so you can check up on the results every few months – they will always be published publicly):
myfxbook.com/members/5starsignalspamm/5-star-3-islamic/1334714
myfxbook.com/members/5starsignalspamm/5-star-strat-5-for/1386538
myfxbook.com/members/5starsignalspamm/5-star-strat-5-for/1386538
myfxbook.com/members/5starsignalspamm/5-start-strat-default/1386558
myfxbook.com/members/5starsignalspamm/5-star-strat-5-risk/1274276
The above links cover all the funds invested into the 5SS retail PAMMs.
They account for every dollar of investment.
Hi there Craig.
1. Do you accept funds from US investors?
2. Are you thus registered with the SEC?
3. If not, why not?
4. What about the pyramid scheme chain-recruitment component of the business?
Also I wan’t suggesting PAMM was a Ponzi scheme, I was suggesting newly invested funds were being used to pay off existing investors to the tune of 15% ROIs each month.
And please spare me the “we don’t accept investments” rubbish.
5 Star Signals are providing this link and therefore 5 Star Signals are soliciting investment. Where you stash the money is irrelevant.
Hi.
1,2 3 and are all covered by us not accepting investment directly from anyone.
It would be illegal and also would be unnecessary headaches when it comes to us having to safeguard the funds.
We’d have to set up our own segregated bank accounts to hold clients funds in and such. All the infrastructure is already in place and PAMM is used to manage billions in the FX markets.
4 – As I understand a pyramid scheme, and please correct me if I am wrong, I am a Forex guy not a MLM guy, the scheme collapses under its own weight since unless you bring in new people you are not able to get paid.
This is not a requirement for PAMM, people can join and invest and make money, they’d have made 20-30% over the last quarter (please see the verified trading results for proof of this)
See comment #8.
What you understand a pyramid scheme to be is irrelevant.
5 Star Signals affiliates pay a fee and are then paid to recruit others who do the same. This is chain-recruitment and qualifies as a pyramid scheme.
Within that specific context, PAMM is neither here nor there.
And yes, you can just go to the brokers website and open a PAMM with one of very many PAMM managers.
To be linked with the traders we have made available you need a membership with us.
Opening a PAMM is easy though, 1,000s of people will do it every day.
Not if you wish to participate in the 5 Star Signals MLM opportunity.
Affiliate participation requires investing through links provided by 5 Star Signals.
5 Star Signals are thus soliciting investment from their affiliates.
So I’ll ask again, do you accept US funds? If so, are you registered with the SEC? If not, why not?
I couldn’t care less about PAMM in general, this is within the specific context of what is offered through 5 Star Signals’ MLM business opportunity.
Can we define “investment” here please?
Buying a membership is not an investment.
The returns are not paid on memberships.
5 Star Signals making an offer that if funds are invested through the company monthly ROIs of up to 15% are advertised.
I have to invest through an account created through 5 Star Signals, ergo the company is soliciting investments on the expectation of advertised ROIs.
This constitutes a securities offering, which in the US requires SEC registration.
The 5 Star Signals affiliate fees are part of the chain-recruitment pyramid scheme, nobody said they were invested funds.
No, you open your own brokerage account, created through you.
It is your account and held under your name.
You then have the option of linking it with our master account so the trades we make are also allocated to your investors account.
At no point in time do 5SS ever have access to clients funds or take investment from them.
No you don’t.
As per the 5 Star Signals FAQ:
If you wish to participate in the 5 Star Signals MLM opportunity, you need to go through 5 Star Signals. Thus 5 Star Signals are soliciting investments from their affiliates.
These solicitations are made on the promise of projected monthly ROIs, constituting a securities offering. Where you stash the money is irrelevant, with 5 Star Signals clearly the party soliciting investment.
And given the dance we’re doing, I’ll just go ahead and call it:
5 Star Signals are not registered with the SEC and are therefore engaged in the offering of unregistered securities.
On the side you also have a chain-recruitment pyramid scheme.
Thankyou for your time.
I will leave someone else to discuss this since we are just going to go around in circles.
My main purpose was to identify clearly and beyond any shadow of doubt that it is not a Ponzi scheme and that all the trading results can be tracked and verified.
One final point worth making though;
You quoted the memberships as;
Copper – $7 (non-MLM)
Bronze – $27
Silver – $197
Gold – $497
This is actually;
Copper – $7 (non-MLM)
Bronze – $27
Silver – $197 (non-MLM)
Gold – $497 (non-MLM)
Only the bronze membership has any benefit to affiliates. The other memberships are selling purely retail products and services.
When we quote our potential returns we always do so along with the historic drawdowns, so people know what they are getting into.
Since you never alluded to risks in trading I should add that.
On our current strategy we offer multipliers that have the following statistics;
Normal . 5.2% maximum drawdown, 2 year gain of 97%.
*3 multiplier . 25% maximum drawdown, 2 year gain of 250%.
*5 multiplier . 37% maximum drawdown, 2 year gain of 650%.
*7 multiplier . 50% maximum drawdown, 2 year gain of 1,440%
So Silver and Gold members do not earn commissions under any circumstances?
I’ll update the review if that’s the case, but first can you explain why the 5 Star Signals compensation plan states (with respect to matrix commissons):
That certainly sounds like Silver and Gold affiliates earn commissions to me.
The very fact that potential returns are advertised constitutes a securities offering (ROIs are passive, all an affiliate does is invest funds).
That’s one of the problems here, considering 5 Star Signals are not registered with the SEC (or any other securities regulator for that matter).
If you could kindly update the review to add the drawdown risks and the links to the verified trading strategies results and substitute this for references of ponzi or purportedly forex trading that would make things better.
Alluding to ponzi schemes when we provide verified Myfxbook links various places undermines your review to be honest mate.
I believe I raised legitimate concerns.
Who’s to say these 15% a month ROI traders aren’t shuffling newly invested funds to pay off existing investors? You yourself certainly cannot guarantee as much. Neither can 5 Star Signals from the sound of things.
And so what, you were lying about Silver and Gold affiliates not earning commissions?
Between that and the pyramid scheme, there’s not an awful lot to be confident about here.
I agree your concerns are completely legitimate and something I discuss with people often.
Since then though, I have provided a link to the model of PAMM and links to verified third party trading results all from authority sites 5SS has nothing to do with.
Simple due diligence from here proves it absolutely impossible for us to shuffle clients funds about – we can never access a single dollar.
It is always held under the client’s name.
5SS never takes clients investment funds.
Please look into this model so we can clear up this misunderstanding and move on to other points.
Whether or not this is a ponzi is nonobjective.
You and 5 Star Signals might be willing to stake your credibility on third-party claims, I’m not.
If 5 Star Signals personally verified the alleged trades themselves, or better yet conducted them – I’d be willing to hold the company at its word.
Third parties though that have nothing to do with the MLM opportunity? Not a chance.
You’re the only one who keeps bringing it up.
I’ve identified unregistered securities and pyramid scheme concerns, both of which remain unaddressed.
So all I am asking is that you update the review to be accurate.
Saying 5SS use a PAMM model and here are the links to the verified results.
The review is accurate. PAMM results can be fudged, and I’m not about to claim otherwise given you yourself nor 5 Star Signals can verify this is not happening.
This is one of the downfalls of relying on third-parties within an MLM opportunity. And when 15% a month ROIs are being touted – to ignore potential Ponzi issues, or not even acknowledge them is irresponsible.
Are any of these third-party brokers registered with the SEC? (min 12 months)
Oz, please look up Myfxbook and see what it is mate.
I understand you’re used to dealing with shams and may not understand the steps taken by Myfxbook to verify a trading account, nor will you be aware of how widely used they are, a household name or sorts between people in the industry.
You are asking 5SS to verify the results themselves, this is precisely what Myfxbook does, it provides the results in a form that can not be manipulated.
See here – myfxbook.com/help#help_34
I’m not interested in Myfxbook (another 3rd party).
5 Star Signals cannot guarantee the third parties they deal with are not using newly invested funds to pay off existing investors, to the tune of advertised 15% ROIs each month.
Are any of the third-party brokers 5 Star Signals use registered with the SEC? (min 12 months)
(Ozedit: Stop link dumping. Third parties verifying third-parties isn’t convincing anybody.
And I take it nobody is registered with the SEC.
Bloody hell within the context of an MLM opportunity, what a compliance nightmare this all is.)
To put the third-party verification issue in context. You’ve got investments dumped onto a third party, who claim to be legit, with the only evidence as such being yet another third party. Who claim so based on information provided to them by the first bunch of third-partys.
And of course despite securities offerings being made left, right and center – nobody is registered with the SEC.
But uh yeah, absolutely no chance of 15% a month ROI Ponzi shenanigans going on here. Riiiiiiiiiiight.
And did I mention there’s pyramid scheme chain-recruitment going on too? Nothing suss!
these ^^ are monthly payments.
so, 5 star signals is nothing but a pyramid scheme selling memberships, with some unrelated third party product.
this is no different from all those ‘travel MLMs’ and ‘binary options trading MLMs’ that sell memberships and/or ‘education’ tagged to a third party product.
affiliates in 5 star signals can keep paying in their ‘personal qualifying’ autoship every month, and keep getting commissions in a chain recruitment system. the forex trading may not exist for all they care!
it strange that the CEO Langenberg has mentioned ‘vemma’ in her ebook about MLM compliance, because she is employing the same self qualifying autoship system as vemma and Then proposing that 5SS is ‘compliant’.
and hello craig, what retail? where is the retail margin for retail?
also, on FB, langenberg is promoting 5SS as an MLM opportunity so it is obvious that that the lower three membership levels are all MLM.
either craig is bullshitting or doesn’t understand the MLM side of the business.
i dont know much about forex trading but is it possible for any trading opportunity to be able to promise 15% ROI’s per month? if trading was so risk free and could promise such high returns, the whole world would be doing it right? something stinks here.
The “link dumps” where to a investopedia, would you prefer wikipedia?
Anyone who Googled “MYfxbook” is convinced.
And to clarify, I, along with many other investors watch the trades in real time. Wins and losses.
I am starting to wonder if you are looking to do a factual and objective review here.
I have always been a fan of your work but it concerns me that you are still talking very bullishly about the chances of it being a ponzi.
The segregation of funds makes this impossible.
I’d like to also point out the numbers you quote are averages over a couple years.
The “15% a month” ranges from -20% on the worst month to +67% on the best month.
Anything close to a steady flow of results like 15% is unlikely in the extreme.
It is a geometric average.
Blah blah blah, unregistered securities offerings, 15% advertised monthly ROIs offered by third parties, CEO of the company making guaranteed income claims on Facebook and pyramid scheme issues.
Did I miss anything?
Yeah, everybody is a fan of BehindMLM until we review your opportunity.
I’m not saying for sure 5 Star Signals’ brokers are engaging in Ponzi fraud, never did.
Just to keep the possibility in mind as the company relies on third-party verification. 5 Star Signals themselves do not trade, they only solicit investments into third-party brokers – none of which appear to be registered with the SEC (nor are 5 Star Signals themselves).
And there’s a blatant pyramid scheme backend nobody seems willing to address…
Some results from the low risk strategy, for illustration.
The average here is 2.6% a month but it is based on an average over wins and losses.
gyazo.com/54fff9b195156025d82c711f88a68829
Real trades.
Real win and losses.
gyazo.com/a3032409eb963fba3d821a6738410ab2
This PAMM thing started off as a simple prejudice based on too much time looking at Ponzis.
It is something that is common.
To still be alluding to that possibility now is just choosing to not do due diligence on what you report on.
As per the 5 Star Signals website:
There’s nothing about 2.6% a month or “average wins and losses”.
because you mentioned it, and continue to use it to divert attention away from 5 Star Signals unregistered securities and pyramid scheme compliance issues.
“PAMM” was not mentioned once in the review.
so, losses over say three months, could wipe out most of the capital invested by an investor affiliate in PAMM, which means they will have to reinvest ‘more funds’ to hopefully earn 15% average over two years or so.
this^^ is how people lose money in trading, they do not have extra funds to reinvest in the hope for future gains. they drop out with their losses.
The review didn’t say anything about monthly payments?
it does not matter whether the trades are real or not. these trades are not performed by 5SS.
take a deep breath craig, and address the ‘pyramid’ issue.
the 5SS website mentions ‘monthly payments’:
Membership $27/month
Membership $197/month
Membership $497/month
The compensation plan does mention “passive monthly residual income”, I missed it. Review updated.
Anjali, thank you. We are now talking about relative points.
You are also absolutely correct.
Most people lose money if the drawdowns are too high and if the accounts don’t get back to high water mark.
On our highest risk strategy the maximum loss we have seen so far is 50% and it is now at record highs.
We capped it at 50% since after that you start to get into losers arithmetic where 100% is needed just to get back to level.
The average given is geometric so it accounts for the losses as well.
I don’t want Oz to think I am link dumping again but to learn about geometric averaging against arithmetic averaging just google both words along with “investopedia”.
If I was to do it by arithmetic averaging (which would become misleading since it does not account for a 50% DD) the average would be about 68% a month. (1,440% gain divided by 21 months of trading)
5 Star is a membership scheme where you pay a monthly fee to get access to their trading strategies, Pammm accs and education. That’s their product If you choose to refer it then you you get paid on the people you bring in who buy the memberships too.
The money you put in for trading is in segregated brokers funds. You can withdraw the capital and profits at anytime. Why is this a pyramid or ponzi?
I am breathing 🙂
As soon as can all agree that there are real trades being made, investors money is held under their name and there is no way we can manipulate the funds in a Ponzi like fashion we can discuss other things.
Surely, whether or not there is a profitable trading strategy at the base of everything is the first thing to address.
Referring back again to the “losses over 3 months” part, because this is really a great point.
A metric we use to track results is the maximum historic drawdown (hereon referred to as “DD”) vrs the average monthly gain.
This gives us an expectation based on averages how long it will take to recover from a maximum drawdown.
Technical terms used for this is calculating risk of ruin.
You can see the risk of ruin stats on our *3 strategy here.
gyazo.com/3b392dfd930f6b5de61f28f4f5cda066
@Poppy
Affiliates paying a fee and getting paid to recruit affiliates = pyramid scheme.
Whatever is attached to said fee is irrelevant when affiliates are required to pay said fee to qualify for commissions.
It’s chain-recruitment any way you look at it, and in MLM that’s a pyramid scheme.
it is not imperative to have ‘agreement’.
it is enough that everyone has placed their viewpoint on record.
now move along and address the ‘pyramid’ part.
if 5SS is providing the ‘profitable trading strategy’ then investors are putting funds in PAMM on your ‘expertise’. 5SS is thus responsible for the returns investors make, whether or not the money is directly invested with 5SS.
this in turn, means 5SS needs to be registered with the SEC in the US or their equivalent in other countries.
I disagree with you here.
The model used has a significant effect on the conflict or alignment of interests and thus should be clarified.
If 5SS was indeed just sweet talking Peter to pay Paul then there would cynical foreplanning to rip people off at some point.
If it is based on real trading results (strategies 5SS also has its own money in) then all interests are aligned with it being in 5SS’s best self interest to have stability and longevity in its offerings.
Which one of these is the case determines if the tone used in this article is correct.
This article has set up Mariska as a baddie due to her previous businesses and goes on to say “With 5 Star Signals the culture of victim-blaming fraud will likely continue.”
Under the PAMM model where funds security and transparency of trading results is very much in the forefront it tells a tale of Mariska learning from mistakes she made and looking to bring a viable alternative based on real results.
Very fundamental thing to clear up to make sure at the very least, the review is factual.
Investment = When you pay money to a third party, and your primary motive is that you expect to get your money back plus a profit after some time or event. “Expected profits on capital based on the efforts of others”, just to make it simple.
A pyramid scheme will require payment for the eligibility to earn commissions, rewards or bonuses that derive primarily from introduction of other participants — from THEIR payments rather than from external sources.
It doesn’t mean that the rewards will need to be directly tied to the act of recruiting other people into the scheme. It doesn’t mean that everyone will need to pay either, or that “free re-entries into the matrix” are excluded.
Ponzi schemes are fraudulent investment schemes. They will require misrepresentation of the profit source. It doesn’t really matter whether it’s about promises of future profits, about “phantom profits” or about actual profits paid to SOME investors.
It means that the Ponzi scheme won’t really need to “steal from Peter to pay Paul”, even if that method is a very common one.
the pyramid recruitment side of 5SS is doing just that, it is sweet talking Peter to pay Paul, so the ‘rip off’ element is very much present even if you expect us to ignore the probability of 5SS being a ‘ponzi’.
who are your brokers and are they registered with the SEC? as 5SS has been around for an year what is the average ROI earned by investors? what proof can you offer for this?
you cannot expect everyone to take your ‘word’ on unproved statistics. so, you shall have to accept that the ponzi ‘probability’ is a real concern of reviewers, and only time will prove which is what.
however, the pyramid recruitment scam is obvious from the compensation plan itself, and we can have some ‘finality’ about the ‘pyramid issue’ without reliance on third party trading stats.
so, how about addressing the pyramid issue?
I think This discussion makes very clear now that the average ROI’s like 3-15% per month 5SS aims at, are purely possible result from the personal trading accounts of members and can in not be a ponzi, just like trading in the stock market with personal accounts that retail customers have can not.
Oz, I think your pain is in the part that when a bronze member recruits another member, a commission of 12% of the membership fee is payed monthly, in the case of a recruited copper member (who is not an MLM affiliate but only a retail customer that wants to open an account to be able to connect to the strategies of 5SS) around 70 cents.
I always learned mlms are only defined as ponzi or pyramid if most of the cash flow results out of the recruitment part, so the initial money or monthly money members pay and is given to other members.
But if members “recruit” far more customers than affiliates, because the product itself is a very wanted value added thing in the market, without the mlm part also very interesting, it is legal. Correct me if I am wrong.
Thank you.
“promises of future profits”
None are made.
Please visit 5starsignals.com/risk-disclaimer for full infomation.
Exactly. All I am trying to do is have some very basic due diligence done to verify that the chances of us being able to do this when we present results via Myfxbook is extremely slim.
Given that investors can watch their trades in real time and have their funds stored under their own name and never accessible for anything other than placing trades renders this impossible.
with the monthly payments of 27$/197$/497$, investors will have to make much larger investments than a 1000$ to be profitable.
for instance an investment of 3000$ at an average return of 15% pm, will not even fully cover the monthly autoship of 497$.
to make any meaningful returns, investors will have to invest much more than 3000$ and live with the risk of consecutive monthly losses.
but, recruitment commissions will be a ‘no loss’ method of earning money in 5SS.
so, would i choose to take the 497$ package and recruit like hell, or would i invest upwards of 6000$ and hope to make money from forex trading over a period of 2 years?
Because, one thing I am very sure we can all agree on, to manipulate clients funds in a Ponzi fashion requires access in some degree to the funds.
Under a PAMM model both Peter and Paul are sitting with their hands firmly in their pockets and no one is getting robbed.
There may be profits, there may be losses but there is never misrepresentation of such.
@Craig
I have the same question Oz asked you in post #27.
Are any of them registered with the SEC or any other relevant authority (e.g. FINRA)?
Most of your other arguments will make very little sense if 5SS use an unlicensed broker. If the broker can’t legally operate in the market, neither can 5SS. “Segregated accounts” won’t change that.
In any event segregated accounts protect clients funds.
If 5SS, any brokerage partners or any of the trading team was to go out of business clients funds would still be held securely and never be used for anything other than trading.
Until we clear up that is is beyond any reasonable doubt that this is legitimate trading results there is no point discussing anything else.
All I’d like is a factual review.
I just asked a group of 11,000 traders if what we do is remotely possible to be a Ponzi by the way, I will get back to you with the results of that.
The only reason will be if the information is meaningless without some other information.
I can post a link to Wikipedia for you …
So segregated accounts clearly have some limitations.
That’s why we have asked about whether those brokers are registered with and licensed by relevant financial authorities, e.g. SEC or FINRA (or European versions).
You have indirectly brought up that question yourself in post #6.
We can clearly accept ASIC Australian Securities and Investment Commission.
It’s more difficult to accept “about to launch a new brokerage partnership”. You should normally have told about existing brokers rather than about vague plans.
Thank you for paying attention to 5 Star Signals Oz, it is appreciated.
I will not repeat what has already been extensively pointed out, that a PAMM model through licensed brokers is impossible for anyone to manipulate.
(Ozedit: Offtopic derail attempts removed, BehindMLM is not an MLM forex opportunity.)
It only is possible to trade with these funds. Traders cannot withdraw any funds, only the account holder can, which is the member.
As for my past, it didn’t require a lot of research as I’ve always been very open about that. Unfortunately your article didn’t mention my reasons for leaving them.
I still have the email (in German) to the CEO’s of Bonofa explaining them exactly why I wouldn’t connect my name any longer to their company.
If you would have researched a little further you would have found that on a regular basis I point out to my Facebook friends why certain (often hyping) opportunities cannot be legit nor sustainable.
I tell them not to blindly believe what marketers are claiming about Forex or investment opportunities. Marketers know marketing and most of the times do not understand Forex and related risks.
It is because of all the lessons learned that 5 Star Signals was started, to have a real alternative for people.
You also seem to assume that any member joining us automatically joins the earning model through our compensation plan. That is a misconception.
About half of the people who are joining do not join the partner program, which requires a separate registration.
What you call a required auto ship to ‘earn’ is a membership in which way more value is given than paid for. No forex knowledge is required to start a PAMM account, however we think and recommend everyone to acquire at least basic understanding of Forex trading in order to understand the trades on their accounts.
The bronze membership gives access to this part of our education, including weekly analyses on currency pairs. We have traders who opened a PAMM and are quite pleased with the educational part while they know their money is working for them.
If you do want to introduce others to 5 Star Signals, having a basic understanding does help, wouldn’t you agree?
No one is paid commissions on the one time only affiliate fees of $10, that would be illegal.
The memberships give value AND access to the PAMM strategies we enable our members to participate in. Memberships thus can be seen as self-consumption, which is fully legitimate.
You may not be aware, but even our information calls don’t go into the partner program, only talk about the product/service/education side of our business. Feel free to join one, we have them every Monday night.
It also seems you have completely missed our compliance page on the website, which would have answered quite a few of your questions or might have given you some understanding how the business is generating revenues.
The biggest revenue stream is paid to us by the broker, not by the members.
It is revenue the broker is generating on all trading accounts, PAMM accounts and individual accounts. We have simply negotiated to get a part of THEIR revenues, which we happily share with our partners.
Every day the broker is sending the member an overview of all transactions on their account, wins and losses, all transparent.
Now, we only operate through licensed broker partners. If asked by authorities we can also show the accounts are traded by fully licensed traders.
Stating it all is third party and thus cannot be trusted is a little uneducated statement Oz.
We don’t collect names, we don’t open accounts in the names of our members, we don’t take their investment funds, we are not forcing them to start a PAMM, we almost force them to understand all risks involved in order for them to make an educated decision on what risk level (and the historical aimed games ON AVERAGE) would best suit them.
If we would collect their names, or would take their investment money, or we would open the account for them, then we would need registration with authorities. We do none of that all.
They have full access to their funds, their money is not stuck.
If you’d wanna see the inside of the membership area, drop me a message. We’ll do a Skype and I’ll be happy to screen share with you and give you the grand tour, also through all education, so you can see for yourself it’s not third party education, it is our very own.
Back to our comp plan. I’d like to take the opportunity to emphasize we don’t pay out most on personal referrals, but on the 2nd level of the matrix. This is to encourage people to work with partners they have personally signed up to ensure they will have proper support in talking with their own contacts.
We have chosen for the 10×10 matrix to enforce spillover, which will help less experienced people to benefit from the activities of people who joined before them.
In our video about the partner program we tell people exactly why we have chosen this shape. With full research (and a little less assumptions, though understandable) you wouldn’t have asked why the 10×10 has been chosen.
The fact that it can never be filled doesn’t make it unrealistic.
Since you keep repeating yourself all through this thread, let’s get back on the registration with SEC.
Did you know there is a world outside of the US? Sure, there is Norway, and Ireland…and the Netherlands too (sorry, couldn’t resist).
This is one area where the reviewer clearly demonstrates that he has not studied 5SS in any depth. Anyone who does so will realize that 5 Star Signals’ entire business model is carefully built around three absolutely critical pillars of Compliance:
a) At no time does 5 Star Signals invest ANY money on behalf of its members! 100% of member investing is done between members and their brokers. 5 Star Signals simply provides access to these brokers, who ARE licensed to trade and give investment advice.
b) 5 Star Signals does not give any investment advice and trains all of its partners to follow that same prohibition. 5SS provides access to educational resources that allow people to study and make up their own minds about what is appropriate for them.
c) Similarly, 5 Star Signals does not make any income claims or guarantees, regarding participation either in our Partner program (networking) OR in investments. The reviewer’s reference to the Aug. 27 Facebook post is misleading.
I have said that 100% of members CAN make money with this program. Not “WILL.” That is an important distinction.
What I’ve meant is that, unlike many companies, 5SS has set up a simple, realistic system that lets members make money promoting Forex products (NOT promoting the investments themselves; let’s be clear!) , no matter where they may fall in the matrix. So the word “can” reflects that realistic possibility.
NOT a CERTAINTY—no such guarantee is ever mentioned.
Compliance training for all our partners is mandatory, as we do take that very seriously. As a matter of fact, we had a training call on that topic just last night.
(Ozedit: attempt to take discussion offsite removed)
A final word: it might be good to understand the difference between binary broker platforms and solid forex brokers. It’s a world of difference between the two types.
How many of you people would trust a known drug dealer who tells you their new batch isn’t illegal?
Ok, now read this again:
“Further research reveals van de Langenberg (right) was an affiliate of Global One and Bonofa in 2013.
Global One initially launched in 2012 as Ultimate Power Profits and sought to capitalize on the Zeek Rewards penny auction Ponzi craze at the time.
Following the SEC bust of Zeek Rewards in August 2012, Global One abandoned plans to launch their penny auction Ponzi.
The company limped along as a straight recruitment opportunity for another year or so, before collapsing entirely in mid 2013.
van de Langenberg stuck with the company till she left it for Bonofa in May 2013.
Bonofa affiliates pay a fee to join and then earn commissions by recruiting other affiliates who do the same.
The company also ran an unregistered securities points scheme, which was purportedly attached to an IPO offering.
Going by their Alexa statistics, Bonofa appears to have collapsed late last year.
Van de Langenberg appears to have gotten out as Bonofa went into decline, with 5 Star Signals launching in mid 2014.”
WHAT MORE DO YOU PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW? Geesh
@Dutchie
If the majority of Bronze+ members are affiliates (and it’s obvious they are, nobody has yet talked about retail sales and the comp plan requires affiliates to purchase Bronze+ membership to qualify for commissions), then separating the affiliate fee from Bronze+ membership is pseudo-compliance.
Hi Anjali
Thank you for again making a terrific point.
To invest the only membership required is $7 a month or $70 for the year.
Profitable (based on historic results) on $500.
Your point about costs outweighing profits was something we addressed recently when it was non viable with our current investors memberships to make a profit on our lowest investment account size (on low risk).
We then slashed the price of this membership 75% to make it viable.
To clarify one more time, $197 and $497 levels are training products where we teach people how to trade themselves.
This is a retail product with no additional benefits at this membership level for affiliates.
Maximum cost for an investor only membership is $84 a year.
Under 20% on $500.
Hope that clears that up.
@Craig
As per the 5 Star Signals website:
Minimum Deposit of $1,000
Additional deposits possible
Aiming for approx. 3% gains on average per month
Minimum Deposit of $500
Additional deposits possible
Aiming for 9-10% gains on average per month
Minimum Deposit of $1,000
Additional deposits possible
Aiming for 15% gains on average per month
That’s clearly the solicitation of investment on the promise of future profits.
Good morning Oz, could you please explain why you have not published my comments regarding funds security in seg accounts or the post of people who are involved in the Forex markets unanimously agreeing that it is impossible (not improbable, impossible) for a Ponzi model to be run.
These seem to be points you should address to maintain the credibility of your claims here.
Or, just admit it is real trading results and correct the post.
@Craig
“Segregated accounts” and “forex PAMM accounts” have probably been explained clearly enough. I quoted almost the whole Wikipedia article for “segregated account” in a post.
What people have asked questions about is the brokers. Are they registered and licensed by relevant authorities?
“Relevant authorities” seems to be …
* ASIC in Australia
* SEC in the U.S.
* FINRA in the U.S. (delegated authority, supervised by SEC)
* FCA in the UK
* FSA in Japan
* etc., I will only list a few examples.
WIKIPEDIA AS A SOURCE
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broker-dealer
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Securities_regulation_in_the_United_States
[SEC]
[Exams]
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_securities_examinations#United_States_of_America
Furthermore, we provide a month by month breakdown of the results.
As I explain various times, it is a geometric average (stand industry use).
We can deal with this once the post has been corrected to be accurate.
I did already reference that one of the brokers we use is used to manage Superannuation funds (ASIC approved for pension funds)
seems you hit another home run since scammers need to run to defend it fast and furious.
Hi Mariska, thanks for stopping by.
It’s easy to leave a scam once you’ve made your money. Why on Earth did join multiple shady business opportunities in the first place?
How many non-affiliates are paying $197 or $497 a month? What is the ratio of Silver and Gold affiliate memberships in terms of membership revenue entering the company each month?
You can have a 50/50 split in memberships but if affiliate revenue (by way of Silver and Gold memberships) dwarfs that of non-affiliates, you have a problem.
You solicit $500-$1000 investments from your members by advertising up to 15% ROIs on your website.
See above.
So that’s a no on regulatory registration. And in particular you’re soliciting US invested funds with an offer of securities, and are not registered with the SEC.
I figured as much when Craig danced around the issue ad infinitum.
No, it isn’t. It’s called pseudo-compliance and still constitutes an income guarantee.
Sadly it appears that while you might have left some scams over the years, you’ve retained the marketing tactics typically used to promote them.
@Craig
Income disclaimers mean nothing when you are soliciting investments on the promise of up to 15% ROIs each month.
Having a disclaimer (of any kind) doesn’t negate the solicitation of investment on the promise of “aimed” ROIs.
“Promise”.
You imagine promises and ignore real trading results haha.
You are making this look silly now mate.
Just making up new things and ignoring clear facts.
You cannot verify what third parties are doing.
Trades might be made but if a broker is running Ponzi on the backend with the majority of funds invested, a trade log on yet another third-party website isn’t going to disclose that.
Furthermore with none of this registered with the SEC, within the context of MLM and investments this is a huge compliance red flag that should not be ignored.
The only facts relevant here are that 5 Star Signals are soliciting investments from affiliates based on advertised future money predictions of up to 15% a month ROIs.
That’s an investment promise and a securities offering, and 5 Star Signals nor any of their brokers are registered with the SEC.
By all means conduct this PAMM stuff outside of MLM.
But if you’ve paired it with an MLM business opportunity – mate crapping on about PAMM and Investopedia doesn’t matter.
MLM has it’s own set of regulations and, just as you claim I have no idea about PAMM (which is fair enough), you appear to have little appreciation of MLM regulatory requirements.
Seeing as this isn’t a review about PAMM, but rather an MLM business opportunity, readers can make up their own mind as to who is actually relevant here.
@Craig
Continued offtopic derail attempts will be marked as spam. Stay on topic discussing the 5 Star Signals MLM business opportunity.
Nobody cares what you and your forex buddies think on some random forex site. Leave that shit over there, we’re discussing the MLM opportunity here.
Not predictions.
Giving the average historical monthly results and also giving the risk on that risk level.
Stop making stuff up mate. You are clearly choosing the words to put in peoples mouths here with “promises” and such.
We make it explicitly clear nothing is assured.
There can be wins and losses.
(Ozedit: Offtopic derail attempt removed)
If we begin to talk about the real business model and the post is made accurate I can then address your other points.
If you are just going to continue with “Screw your facts, I have an opinion” then I will discontinue this conversation.
More than enough evidence has been provided to make an accurate assessment and do due diligence.
What?
Those are totally monthly ROI predictions, cut the crap.
In MLM you cannot run around making ROI claims and wipe it away with a disclaimer. This isn’t the world of shady unregistered forex brokers, this is MLM because 5 Star Signals is an MLM business opportunity.
Bloody hell, it’s not hard to get your head around…
Like I said, neither you nor 5 Star Signals can guarantee third-party brokers are not running a Ponzi scheme backend while they post a trade log on yet another third-party website.
You might be comfortable swallowing what is claimed, but that’s a weak position to take on due-diligence.
Remember, this is all unregulated by design. Why doesn’t 5 Star Signals engage brokers who are registered with the SEC?
You tell me.
That is all I have pointed out. You insist this is not possible, which I assert is an extremely naive position to take.
Rather what you’ve read is “ZOMG, BEHINDMLM SAID WE ARE A PONZI SCHEME!”, which was never stated.
I don’t pull the Ponzi trigger unless I’m sure of it. It was simply raised here as a possibility.
Which I maintain is perfect reasonable, given the level of third-party reliance 5 Star Signals have and that neither 5 Star Signals nor the third-party brokers involved appear to be registered with the SEC.
Please provide one shred of proof for your theory.
I presented Myfxbook verified via investor login password and real results.
What have you got?
Proof Oz, not stabs in the dark opinions.
Proof.
Otherwise you are just here spouting about something you are showing everyone know understands what we are doing you have no idea what you are talking about.
(Ozedit: Offtopic forex waffle removed)
Like I said, posting a trade log on yet another third-party website doesn’t really have anything to do with running a Ponzi backend.
And with none of this regulated, dismissing the potential for Ponzi fraud is irresponsible.
You might be comfortable with that, I’m not and the potential for fraud needs to be pointed out. Especially when you’re talking about automated pooled trading accounts and when none of this is regulated!
Why is it I can accept your point of view but you’re having such trouble with the reverse?
Without registration with the SEC, soliciting investments on advertised monthly ROI predictions is a huge compliance red flag in MLM.
I could not and do not give a stuff about what it means in the world of shady unregistered forex brokers.
And on that note, your first reaction to this MLM review was to run off to a forex site and solicit opinion from forex investors.
Run the solicitation of investment on the promise of up to 15% monthly ROIs, lack of regulatory registration and chain-recruitment issues past an MLM attorney?
Didn’t think so.
And I’ve even reduce that to running it by someone familiar with the MLM industry but, well here we are.
(And by MLM attorney I don’t mean some random law firm in the Netherlands nobody has ever heard of)
You didn’t say that in post #6. “We are just about to launch a new brokerage partnership” normally means that it hasn’t been launched yet.
So my question was relevant enough. Are the current broker-dealers registered with or licensed by relevant authorities, e.g. SEC or FINRA?
In case they are licensed — in which country or countries?
You won’t need to answer the question if you don’t know the answer. I’m only trying to clarify something here.
Hi again M.
Unfortunately Oz is stubbornly sticking to what amounts to a wild conspiracy theory that would involve at 5SS and at least 3 other brokers colluding to present fake results and also duping Myfxbook into presenting these fake results.
Until this is cleared up it does not warrant moving onto the next points.
One point of clarification though, my comment referring to ASIC in the near future did not mean we use unregulated brokers now.
(Ozedit: Offtopic derail attempt removed)
On that new broker we will be launching another trader that makes this one we have now look average.
I will be sure to post the verifiable results going forward when we launch it – as we always do.
^^ TLDR: Despite the offering of securities, neither 5 Star Signals or the brokers they use are registered with the SEC.
Numbers on a screen don’t have to correlate to purported trades. Ditto the actual flow of money on the backend.
That’s a risk you take when you dump funds into unregistered and unregulated blackhole brokers. Failing to acknowledge that is irresponsible due-diligence.
And we have asked about those brokers. 🙂
You can probably tell us which countries those brokers are licensed in?
We have asked specifically about broker-dealer license from SEC, FINRA or any other relevant authority. 5 Star Signals is clearly trying to promote itself and the related forex service in the U.S., e.g. you have specific rules indicating that.
From the Terms And Conditions … SECTION 3 — OPERATING A 5SS© BUSINESS … 3.2.7
Can you tell me the names of the brokers we use that you have determined are “unregistered and unregulated blackhole brokers.” please Oz?
Since you talk about due diligence in the same breath.
The names are irrelevant, only that the brokers 5 Star Signals are affiliated with are not registered with the SEC is of significance.
If they were, you’d have provided the relevant information 88 comments ago.
(Ozedit: Unless you’re going to provide information pertaining to the brokers 5 Star Signals uses being registered with the SEC, stop posting spammy comments.)
We have 3 brokers, all from different parts of the world, all under different regulations and all displaying the exact same results.
Care to explain how this would be remotely possible under your theory of Ponzi play?
Which regulations? Which regulatory agencies are these brokers registered with?
None of them appear to be registered with the SEC, or you’d have readily provided the information.
Not until you transition from vague marketing statements to actual regulatory registration details, see above.
(Ozedit: Right. Anything further from you that does not disclose the requested regulatory registration details will be marked as spam.)
Craig is wasting my time dancing around the fact that neither 5 Star Signals or their brokers are registered with the SEC (or any other securities regulator for that matter).
This is an issue because both 5 Star Signals and the brokers they use are offering securities to 5 Star Signals affiliates. It also opens the door for fraud (Ponzi or otherwise), because shady brokers operating in unregulated environments is a recipe for disaster.
Failure to acknowledge that is failure in adequate due-diligence, which within the context of today’s MLM business opportunity landscape, is not an option.
Especially when this particular opportunity is advertising monthly ROIs of up to 15% on its website.
Pending regulatory registration details from Craig (or 5 Star Signals), that’s that.
Just forget it. You don’t seem to be able to answer it anyway. Mariska can probably try to answer it.
Both of you claim the brokers are licensed, but both of you have been very vague about details.
From Mariska’s post #61 …
I’m not sure what you’re talking about there? I haven’t had time to focus on any theories yet.
To clarify something here, I’m looking into this 5 Star Signals topic for the first time, so I have mostly asked questions. But I have also added some sources to look at.
Oz,
I am into forex for about 6 years now. Forex is a difficult market to earn money unless you have the education to do this in a proper way.
I am making money in forex and I can live from that money but to earn my money it takes a lot of my time. I was always looking for a way to make it easier for me and stumbled upon Pamm accounts.
5StarSignals presented their strategies and I started my own investigation on them.
Myfxbook is a fully respected and independent, company where people who manage forex accounts can attach their accounts to and then show the real results to the world.
This is what 5StarSIgnals did and to be honest, I am really impressed. I allready know who the brokers are that they are dealing with as that is not such a big secret when you do a little investigation and must say that those brokers are topnotch, so I don’t really see what your problem is with 5StarSignals.
They offer people the possibility to join for only $ 7 a month (a normal bankaccount costs more a month!) and people can get access to all their strategies. If people want to built a business (and get access to the pamms) they can look for other interested people. People that want to learn more about how to trade for themselves can join a higher level (silver or gold).
As a forex trader for 6 years I don’t understand the fuzz you are making about this company, in my opinion it is fully legal and thanks to this complete story I am going to start with an account with them
@John
With all due respect, dumping funds in 5 Star Signals on the expectation of advertised monthly ROI projections is not “education”. Nor is it a “strategy”.
It’s a securities offering that should be regulated by appropriate securities regulators, namely the SEC in the US.
not a securities regulator and are thus irrelevant.
Are any of them registered with the SEC or at the very least a securities regulator in any jurisdiction?
Of course not. You’re making money and you’re here to defend that.
People with vested financial interests typically make the worst reviewers.
Best of luck. We provide information and what you do with it is up to you. Nothing more, nothing less.
Myfxbook is independant and is highly respected in the forex world, ghis is more relevant than people sitting behind a desk thinking they know what they are talking about
Yes they are, SEC is not relevant,that’s only US. But they have regulations like SEC from many countries
People with vested financial interests typically make the worst reviewers.
Again you are a bad reader. I don’t have an account with 5StarSignals yet, but am impressed by their results, so I am going to open an account with them
Untill now I was making money myself but that takes a lot of time, for only $ 7 a month this is heaven for all traders
Thank You!
not a securities regulator and are therefore irrelevant.
Who is registered with who then?
Why is obtaining this information from 5 Star Signals and their affiliates akin to drawing blood from a stone?
1. Has 5 Star Signals accepted funds from US investors? If so the SEC are entirely relevant.
2. What regulators? Which countries?
And in doing so demonstrate a lack of regard for proper regulatory registrations. Like I said, you make money this way and are defending it. That’s fine, but let’s not pretend you’re being objective about it.
You’re here to defend making money in unregistered securities.
one of the brokers 5SS uses is Tallinex. on oct 3rd,2015 mariska langenberg commented on FB:
from tallinex FAQ:
but here is what the FSA of ‘st vincent and the gredadines’ has to say about IBC’s [international business companies] which are engaging in forex trading and brokerage:
ding ding.
no wonder craig and mariska are taking everyone for a wild ride around and round the mulberry bush. they can hadly tell you about their ‘brokers’ and their ‘shifty’ registrations.
tallinex is a scammy broker with no registration for forex trading, and on top of that it provides accounts to US citizens.
good luck to 5SS investors trying to get their investments or earnings back from tallinex.
hey mariska and craig, i think we should all write to the svgfsa [FSA of stvincent&grenadine] asking for clarification on tallinex’ registration there for forex trading. they have a ‘contact us’ link.
what say you?
svgfsa.com/warn.html
I haven’t got any meaningful answers either. 🙂
5 Star Signals doesn’t seem to be very active. The so called “educational videos” on Youtube had up to 673 views (in one year). The account had 795 subscribers.
youtube.com/channel/UC2NOIM87qob7wkOoNP0UFzg/videos?sort=p&view=0&flow=grid
Example 1:
18:50
“5 Star Signals Attraction Marketing – Facebook”
69 views in one month (not very active)
Here’s one example for your Ponzi theory:
10:56
5 Year 5 Star Strategy – Passive Automated!
217 views since April 13 2015
youtube.com/watch?v=HBADkKvg-eA
That last video should remove any doubts about “passive investment scheme” for that part of the program.
Two videos out of 85 were in Dutch (Netherland), as far as I could see. I only had a quick look at the video titles.
Wikipedia — Foreign exchange fraud.
The forex trading component here doesn’t need to be a Ponzi scheme.
SEC Consumer warning — binary options (including forex). I believe it’s originally from 2013. I’m only quoting a fraction of it.
Most of my posts were “necessary research”.
It’s the first time I’m looking into a forex based MLM. I tried first to get some answers from Craig about broker-dealer licenses (countries), but I only got vague answers.
“Pyramid scheme”
In the U.S., the opportunity part of 5SS will probably be seen as a pyramid scheme — not even a product based one.
It doesn’t really matter that 5SS have some “customers”, since the product (forex) can’t legally be sold in the U.S. — if I interpreted the SEC warning correctly.
“Ponzi scheme?”
I haven’t come to any conclusion about Ponzi scheme. They do exist in forex trading, but they are not the most common solution if organizers want to make a profit — there’s many other methods available there.
“Marketing videos”
Some of the videos targeted specific groups of people, e.g. 5SS was presented as a solution to save up a retirement fund or to finance college education — “plan for the future” marketing.
That’s relatively “predatory marketing”. 5 Stars Signals use methods that are more common in frauds than in normal business.
CONCLUSION?
There’s simply too many red flags here.
I’m not very eager to reflect some “forex world ideas”, e.g. the idea that “the other ones are worse”. I’m pretty sure there’s many bad forex programs out there, but it doesn’t make this one any better.
– – – –
BTW, here’s another link, “Binary Option Scams”. The website seems to be promotional, but it does offer some relevant information about how investors can be tricked.
binaryex.com/binary-option-scams/
well, we found one broker called tallinex, who is not registered for forex trading anywhere. then we’re waiting patiently for langenberg and craig to explain themselves.
but, langenberg and craig have conveniently run away.
running away like this will not inspire any confidence in their investors.
with a caribbean island business like tallinex, which is not registered as a forex trader anywhere, which is investing the money of US citizens without [US] SEC registration, there are solid grounds for suspecting a ‘ponzi scheme’ in 5SS.
langenberg and craig are no longer in a position to Insist that we all concur with them, about 5SS Definitely Not being a ponzi scheme.
now langenberg and craig must come back here and provide answers for the ‘pyramid scheme’ they are also running in 5SS.
they barged in here with the loud confidence of liars, and promptly ran away when we turned on the heat.
do people really want to invest any money with 5SS who’s CEO mariska langenberg and trade analyst craig, cannot stand their ground and complete the discussion?
Any news you’d like to share with us from your Skype call with them?
There was no Skype call. No point, a Skype call isn’t going to fix compliance issues.
in response to the butt kicks 5SS is receiving here, and on FB, craig walters started an FB conversation with 5SS affiliates, about their experience with the company.
has the company misrepresented anything? have you been forced to recruit? do you think 5SS is a ponzi? do you hate 5SS even though you had losses?
in short, meaningless questions^^, with a handful of faithfuls going gaga.
no serious questions about who the brokers of 5SS are, and their registration. no clarification on the recruitment commissions paid out on the monthly autoship.
a commentator on craig walters FB, mentioned the name of hotforex, who claim to be forex traders registered with the FSC mauritius.
hotforex claims it is registered under the name of HF markets limited with the FSC mauritius under section 2-1B:
static.hotforex.com/assets/hotforex/images/hotforex-fsc-certificate.jpg
well, i tried searching for ‘HF Markets Limited’and ‘HF Markets LTD’ in the FSC mauritius public registry and it did not show up.
can someone else also try looking for the registration of HF Markets Limited with the FSC mauritius, to ensure i have not made an error?
we have already established that one broker of 5SS ie ‘tallinex’ is not registered to do forex trading in the caribbean island of st vincent&grenadine.
lets check hotforex out!
Do people in the Matrix know they’re in the Matrix? Is asking potential victims of a fraud “are you a victim” even logical?
It showed a license from April 20 2010. So it doesn’t really mean anything.
It doesn’t even meet the requirements in the Conditions.
looks like mariska made an explanation about it:
5starsignals.com/rebuke-to-behindmlm-review-on-5-star-signals/
That article wasn’t written by van de Langenberg:
It’s Craig Walters who I spam-binned him here because he couldn’t provide details about 5 Star Signals regulatory registrations. Nor that of the third-party brokers they use.
After a hundred or so comments of him dodging the issue and providing strawman arguments about some forex website, enough was enough.
From the points raised in the article:
Mariska van de Langenberg joined various scams. These weren’t legit businesses that somehow turned scam, they were outright fraudulent businesses from the beginning – and van de Langenberg was attracted to them as an MLM marketer.
Leaving after she’d made money and they were in decline isn’t commendable. The least van de Langenberg can do is own her past, instead of trying to justify it as “it could have happened to anyone”.
Who is paying hundreds of dollars a month to access to a forum populated with third-party information, without the attached passive investment business opportunity?
Right… nothing scammy going on there. And what a pitch for retail customers…
It’s obvious only passive investor affiliates are going to cough up $450 a month to participate in what is obviously not compliant activity 5 Star Signals are pushing in their Gold forum.
Thus the majority of funds entering 5 Star Signals are affiliate-sourced, making it a pyramid scheme that pays on affiliate recruitment.
The rest of it is Craig Walters’ strawman arguments I marked as spam here. And rightly so, seeing as they don’t address the lack of regulatory registration (important because securities are offered to affiliates) and recruitment-centric compensation plan.
The red flags here are too numerous and it’s basically begging for a regulatory shutdown.
$497 a month for access to ‘*winkwinknudgenudge* nothing illegal going on here’ content, a CEO with a fraud-riddled past and securities being offered with no regulatory registration anywhere on the planet?
Welcome to the MLM underbelly.
may I suggest to have a call with her on Skype and have a look behind the screens.
You can go on and on and start repeating it while you can easily make a call, talk about it, get some more behind the screen information and hopefully get some real facts on table.
Stop making all kinds of accusations while blocking the people defending their business.
There is no reason to take the discussion offsite.
Either 5 Star Signals is registered with the SEC or they are offering unregistered securities to US citizens. It’s that simple.
And skirting the securities registration issue with nonsense about third-party forex websites isn’t “defending a business”, it’s wasting mine and my reader’s time.
Either cough up the SEC registration documents or stop posting spam. That’s pretty simple too.
Who is Craig Walters, anyway? I see no evidence of him existing on the internet aside from Facebook and a pinch of forex forums, and his trading background is sketchy at best.
No pictures of himself, no proof that he’s even real.
I think this guy might be cat fishing us, and maybe the company itself.
Just like the mysterious Marie Shaw probably was before she “passed” after losing a substantial amount of money in the PAMM accounts she was managing herself and deleting any trace of herself from the internet that she could.
I want to see a background check on this supposed forex expert next and maybe even a real name for a change.
Walters is some guy in Europe who’s new to the MLM industry and believes he’s above regulatory compliance.
That’s pretty much the impression I’m getting.
Seems to me he’s new to forex as well. It also might be worth looking into what kind of money the company is making off being a middle man between actual traders.
5 Star Signals is absolutely making money off the investments going into these PAMM accounts, or why else do it?
In the past they’ve also definitely offered investment advice based on “signals” to trade specific currency sets, as I’m sure they are still doing in these forums they are so mysterious about, hence the “Signals” part of the company name.
There’s no way this is legal.
WHY?
no one is asking for any ‘secret’ information that can only be divulged via ‘secrety’ skype calls.
why cannot mariska langenberg and craig walters provide clarifications right here?
this invitation for person to person skype chats is a scammers excuse, to deflect blame on another party – oh, we were ready to explain ourselves but oz didn’t cooperate!
c’mon buddy, explain yourself Here or the ‘scammer’ label sticks!
He’s the voice in some of the videos (post #103).
youtube.com/channel/UC2NOIM87qob7wkOoNP0UFzg/videos?sort=p&view=0&flow=grid
A voice does not make a person who he claims to be. My boyfriend can do a spot on Cher impression, but he doesn’t have the wigs to back it up if you catch my drift.
the above quote is by craig walters in his ‘rebuke-to-behindmlm-review-on-5-star-signals’ published on the 5SS website.
5SS may not be trading themselves, but they are soliciting investments under their management, advising clients to tie up to ‘particular’ forex traders they have selected, and are receiving commissions from the forex traders on their clients investments.
this makes 5SS a ‘investment advisor’ which the SEC [USA] defines as:
1] 5SS receives commissions from the brokers appointed by them:
as far as i understand, 5SS takes money from the brokers on trades, and also takes money on profitable trades of their clients. this is a ‘double dip’
so 5SS is receiving ‘compensation’, thus satisfying point 1] of the SEC definition of ‘investment adviser’.
2] is engaged in the business of…
5SS is clearly ‘engaged’ in the ‘business’ as evidenced by its interactive website soliciting clients to forex trade via third party forex traders ‘selected’ by themselves through ‘links’ provided by 5SS.
3] providing advice to others or issuing reports or analyses regarding securities.
this is how the SEC defined ‘advice’:
5SS discuses market trends, links it’s clients to particular brokers, provides strategies for trading [training], and provides ‘options’ [asset allocation] for investing by advising allocation of particular amounts of funds under different risk ratios – all this safely dumps 5SS in the ‘investment adviser’ category.
thus, craig walter’s arguments that 5SS is not obliged to be ‘regulated’ at all is bunkum.
further the SEC states:
5SS which is registered in ireland, cannot solicit US clients without an SEC registration.
further 5SS brokers cannot accept US clients without SEC registration.
at least two brokers of 5SS ‘tallinex’ and ‘hotforex’ are lying about their registrations for forex trading. their trade accounts are not audited by financial firms to ensure that the client PAMM accounts are secure.
who knows what goes on in these bottom of the barrel, blackhole, unregistered, unregulated forex traders?
craig walters refuses to answer questions about the legality of 5SS brokers. he asks people to depend on third party review sites and the clients own due diligence. so if clients lose their money via 5SS it will be ‘their own fault’.
i would like to further clarify the SEC’s stand on ‘compensation’ so that craig walters does not invent some wiggle room to misguide 5SS investors:
5SS sells memberships which enables clients to invest with forex traders. 5SS earns on these memberships. hence 5SS receives ‘some other fee relating to the total services rendered’.
further, 5SS receives compensation from the brokers it refers clients to via links, hence though clients may not directly pay 5SS, it is getting commissions ie ‘another person may pay the compensation’.
craig walters must explain all this to us.
@craig
it does not matter whether amsterdam is in norway or the netherlands. stay relevant.
aw, these 5SS people are laughing at us, ie oz and commentators on this thread, for not knowing enough about forex trading:
cut the crap walters, no one wants to discuss forex trading with you.
instead, explain:
-why 5SS is not registered with the SEC, but is still offering its services in the USA. if you guys are as honest as you claim to be, why not register?
-why 5SS brokers are not registered with the SEC or anywhere else in the world. also, name all your brokers, don’t be secretive.
-why 5SS is not a pyramid scheme.
lumping a product [forex training] with self qualifying monthly autoship and commissions is Illegal. dont give me the BS about people having to pay a onetime 10$ fee to become affiliates.
there is ONLY a one time 10$ difference in being a retail customer or an affiliate, and such psuedo compliance BS will never stand before the SEC or a court. 5SS has no retail margin to encourage retail.
if 5SS wants to indulge in MLM underbelly business and expect their clients to accept those risks, it’s fine, it’s your head on the chopping board.
but, do not claim legitimacy and misguide people. even scammers should scam honestly!
why cannot mariska langenberg and craig walters provide clarifications right here?
Yeah right! If you block them the case is closed I guess, end of discussion for them.
Walters refused to provide regulatory registration information for 5 Star Signals or their third-party brokers.
Rather than concede a lack of regulatory registration, he kept publishing offtopic information about third-party forex websites. This I marked as spam, along with any other derail attempt comments he left.
I don’t recall removing anything from Langenberg. She published the one comment and did a runner.
he had 31 chances and she had one and only chose to post a long winded scammer screed which is what they do instead of addressing the facts. they failed miserably.
All they had to do is answer one simple question and provide proof.
though i could not find hotforex registered with the mauritius FSC, it is registered with the cypriot SEC [CySEC].
hotforex was illegally providing accounts to US citizens, but was stopped from doing this in mid 2012. an email sent out by hotforex to US clients stated:
it appears the FSC mauritius was twisting hotforex’s arm:
^^this implies hotforex WAS registered with the mauritius FSC in the past. but, it does not show up in the mauritius FSC registry anymore?
now its time for the CFTC to stop tallinex from illegally accepting US clients.
There has been a lot of adverse comments here about 5 Star Signals, so to set the record straight I shall share some of my results.
I’ve not recruited or sponsored anyone, so I don’t get an income from there. However the trades that have been placed have overall made a profit for my account – 1.83% yesterday.
That’s far better than many UK banks offer savers for a year, and so I’m quite happy with the service I’m getting.
Yes some trades lose while others win. That’s the nature of forex. The trick is ensuring your winnings are greater than the losses. 5SS is doing that well.
Regards to comments about the brokers used being registered, I’m based in the UK so the SEC isn’t relevant to me. HF Markets is registered with the UK’s Financial Conduct Authority (FCA), and so I have the reassurance that all is above board.
If you want to attack something that is an all-out scam, then go for the binary option robot sellers. They ‘give’ people a free robot tool that has to link in with their chosen unregulated broker. The binary options they chose are a 50/50 toss of a coin, and the ‘robots’ have no risk management functions by and large.
It’s only a matter of time before your trading account has been drained, yet the people offering the scheme have been paid a commission by the broker.
I’m sufficiently clued up with trading to see that’s not happening at 5SS!
For a matter of balance I shall post my results here week in, week out and let the readers judge for themselves whether this is a scam or not.
@SteveT
You dumped funds in 5SS or through them, on the expectation of a passive ROI.
That’s a security and 5SS are not registered with a securities regulatory anywhere in the world (AFAIK).
Dean Black (Craig Walters doesn’t exist) and Mariska have both abandoned their Facebook accounts. Both were otherwise posting multiple times a week before the 5 Star Signals fraud was made public.
I’d be pretty ashamed too if I’d launched an MLM company built on lies.
SteveT seems like an honest type of guy. He even posts his real name and thus identifies himself for all to see.
There can’t be that many Steve T’s in the world, right?
Could SteveT be Mariska or Dean?
No……say it ain’t so! 🙂
I just checked and neither Dean nor Mariska has posted ANYTHING on their Facebook pages since they were BUSTED by Oz.
The truth will set you free. Well, maybe not for some. Right, SteveT?
the svgfsa [financial services authority of st vincent and grenadine] has finally responded to my email, CONFIRMING that tallinex is NOT regulated for its Forex Trade.
thus people trusting tallinex as their forex trader are Not Protected in any way, as no regulatory authority is keeping tabs on their forex business.
Thank you MLM Broken Model. I am an honest type of guy… the T stands for Thomas by the way. What’s your true name by the way?
As regards US law, which is where most of your securities arguments seem to originate, I’m not governed by them so as I said before the SEC has no bearing on me at all.
All I can see is that I have a forex trading account held with a regulated broker that’s making a profit. End of story.
BTW, Mariska and Dean/Craig are still very much active on FB.
mariska langenberg is back on FB showing off about 5SS forex broker tallinex, which is Not regulated for forex trading anywhere in the world.
dean/craig is understandably still absent. who knows what avatar he will appear in! right, steve T [T for thomas]?
it doesn’t matter if T stands for thomas or tinkerbell, as long as your’e not asking people to invest money based on your internet persona like dean/craig.
i recd a second mail [dt:5/nov/2015] from the svgfsa, further clarifying their position on tallinex forex traders, through which 5 star signals offers forex accounts to US citizens:
so, the svgfsa will soon carry a warning specifically addressing tallinex.
and, we know that tallinex is operating illegally, in at least the US and canada.
i wonder how many countries allow IBC’s registered in ‘st vincent and grenadines’ to collect money from their citizens for high risk forex trading.