Power Lead System Review: Accelerated leverage?
The Power Lead System went into pre-launch in late July and is set to officially launch in late September 2013. The company’s website domain (“plsfunnel.com”) was registered on the 9th of June 2013 and provides a company address in the US state of Washington.
On a marketing video featured on the Power Lead System Website, it is revealed that the Power Lead System was created by Neil Guess. The video goes on to state that the Power Lead System “runs through” the Priceless Possibilities Marketing Platform, which was founded by Michael Price.
Both Price and Guess appear to be co-founders of the Power Lead System MLM income opportunity.
Simply described in a Power Lead System marketing video as being ‘men with integrity who love god’, both Guess and Price have experience within the MLM industry.
Neil Guess’ MLM experience appears to be limited to the front-end of things, primarily as an affiliate over at Solavei (mobile communications):
Michael Price (right) on the otherhand has been running his Priceless Possibilities business since 1996.
Hello, my name is Michael Price the owner of Priceless Possibilities. My company has invested over 2 Million Dollars since 1996 to create a VERY Powerful Recruiting & Training System that we can Customize to Truly Transform Your Business.
I have also invested approximately $200,000 to learn from people who are the best in their fields such as Tony Robbins, Les Brown, Brian Tracy, Zig Ziglar, and many top Internet Marketing Experts by purchasing their Live Seminars, Books, CDs, and joining Mastermind Groups with the world’s top marketers.
As per the Priceless Possibilities customer testimonial below, at some point Neil Guess was a customer of Price’s business:
Putting two and two together, I’d suggest Guess has come up with the compensation plan behind Power Lead System with Price providing the service backend through Priceless Possibilities.
Read on for a full review of the Power Lead System MLM business opportunity.
The Power Lead System Product Line
So, what exactly is the product?
Think of it like being behind the controls of a space shuttle, only it’s ground-control for building your home based business.
Power Lead System market an ‘all in one marketing system’ that enables users to create custom Google Hangout pages, lead capture pages, video sales pages and video postcards.
There also appears to be an email management component and the ability for users to design custom sales funnels.
Power Lead System charge $29.99 a month for access to their marketing system.
The Power Lead System Compensation Plan
The Power Lead System compensation plan revolves around the sale of the company’s marketing system, paying out commissions via a perpetual 1-up compensation structure.
A typical 1-up compensation structure requires an affiliate to pass up either their first or second sale to the affiliate who recruited them. Thereafter an affiliate keeps the commissions earnt on all additional sales.
Power Lead System require affiliates to pass up the commission generated on their second sale, however this extends out to the 4th, 6th, 8th and 10th sales, continuing on every 5th sale thereafter perpetually (10th, 15th, 20th etc).
In turn, the same numbered sales commissions an affiliates recruited downline generates are passed up to them. With the perpetual fifth sale passed after the first five, the idea is that those who recruit large amounts of affiliates and build large downlines have a large number of monthly subscription commissioned passed up to them over time.
In addition to the perpetual 1-up commissions, Power Lead System also offer a 50% matching bonus on any commissions paid out on commissions earnt by affiliates who are passed up.
Joining Power Lead System
Affiliate membership to Power Lead System is $23.97 a month. In addition to the $29.99 monthly marketing system subscription required of every affiliate, this brings the total monthly cost of all affiliates to $53.96.
Conclusion
Is the PLS a MLM?
Answer: Absolutely NOT … the PLS is a Viral Affiliate program and is not a MLM. You get paid for people on your Front Line (or PAYLine) as well as the people you pass up.
However, due to the Pass Up component of the PLS, you can have viral growth of people passing up people to your frontline which is where you get paid (and very nicely) because you get paid $20 out of the $30 from everyone on your front line.
There’s NO MLM that I’ve ever seen that pays out that percentage of income from your sales.
To Your Success,
Power Lead System Support
I don’t know what the Power Lead Support are smoking but with “front line” just being another word for personally recruited downline, and pass-ups clearly being passed up from a downline, Power Lead System is most definitely an MLM company.
As for never seeing an MLM company that pays out a percentage of income from your sales, guess nobody over at Power Lead System has ever heard of a pass-up compensation plan.
The “accelerated leverage” matching bonus was a noteworthy addition, however it’s not like Power Lead System brings with it some sort of new revolutionary compensation plan. Typically matching bonuses in pass-up plans are paid out on sales that are not passed up, all Power Lead System are doing is paying out the bonus in reverse.
Seriously, you’ve never seen any system like this, ever. The income potential here is staggering, thanks to a breakthrough in commissions called “accelerated leverage”.
Practically speaking I don’t see how it’s much different in the long-run to a kept sale matching bonus. All it means is affiliates earn a little less from sales passed up to them rather than more from those they keep. Overhyped much?
On the compensation side of things, as is typical with the pass-up plans that have started to pop up and gain traction after the revenue-sharing MLM bubble burst, there’s little to nothing differentiating Power Lead System from your typical “pay to play” cash gifting scheme.
Taken from Power Lead System support,
Do you pay out 100% commissions?
Yes, however, not to one person. For example: If you were making a 50% matching bonus on Bob’s payline commission total, then any sale that falls on Bob’s payline, Bob would make $20/mth, and you would make a 50% match, totaling a 100% payout (all commissions are monthly).
With the exclusion of retail subscribers (who cannot be matched on), 100% of the money subscribers are supposedly paying for Power Lead System’s marketing system is in actuality just being shuffled around amongst affiliates.
Taking a step back and looking at the revenue flow into the company, the only money they make is on the $23.97 they charge affiliates each month. A fee that does no more than grant an affiliate permission to earn of those they convince to pay Power Lead System $29.99 a month.
Ultimately the legitimacy of Power Lead System will depend on its affiliates ability to market the company’s marketing system as a stand-alone service, versus simply running around telling people if they pay Power Lead System $53.96 a month they can make money convincing others to do the same.
From a marketing standpoint the counter to this is pushing the viability of Power Lead System on the back of Michael Price’s Priceless Possibilities platform. This however makes little sense as Priceless Possibilities never had an MLM compensation plan attached to it.
As a prospective Power Lead System affiliate the easiest way to ascertain the retail viability of the company’s marketing system would be a quick check of your potential upline’s retail customers versus affiliates.
Too little retail and it’s a safe bet you’re going to find yourself marketing the income opportunity with an attached marketing platform versus the other way around.
The fact that retail sales offer no chance of a matching bonus only increases the chance that Power Lead System will wind up being a company full of affiliates paying eachother.
Why waste your time passing up retail sales when the recruitment of an affiliate you pass up still generates you 50% of their take-home earnings (33% of their sales volume)?
Without the accelerated leverage matching bonus I’d still count affiliate recruitment focus as a red flag to be concerned about, with it and I see little to no incentive for affiliates to focus on retail vs. the recruitment of affiliates.
Especially when you consider the massive emphasis Power Lead System place on the matching bonus.
When coupled with a $23.97 pay to play fee, long-term I’m just not seeing the viability of retail in the Power Lead System.
Once those at the bottom of the pass-up chain can’t recruit they’ll stop paying their monthly fees, this kills the residual pass-up commissions of those above them. They stop paying their monthly commissions (pass-ups commissions are not replaceable once fees stop getting paid), and before you know it you’ve your typical recruitment-dependent scheme collapse.
Priceless Possibilities has most certainly demonstrated value in their marketing system, but with affiliates likely to focus on affiliate recruitment over retail due to the accelerated leverage matching bonus, I believe the Power Lead System’s compensation plan will result in an overwhelmingly affiliate-heavy opportunity.
A minor correction …
“Michael Force” should be corrected to “Michael Price”, 2/3 into the “Conclusion” section.
Thanks for the pickup M_Norway, article updated.
Interesting article…
You’re great with words and do a great job!
With that said.. I’d love to speak to you to hopefully clear up some of your discrepancies
and misconceptions.
For example…
Why do you assume we haven’t added tremendous value to the affiliate fee? (do you know what a person gets as an affiliate that they don’t get as a customer?)
Do you realize that we DO pay a 50% match on your frontline?
You haven’t mentioned anything about the free lead system… are you aware of what that is or does?
We have a track record of almost 2 decades of people paying to use this platform, and you are suggesting that by adding a compensation plan to it, we’ll now just have affiliates chasing affiliates… I’m still scratching my head on that one??
Anyway, are you open for an interview?
I’d love to shed some light on your understanding (or lack thereof) of what we’re all about.
Let me know.
Neil
P.S.
Again, great job.. just a little misguided.
Tell us more about it, the factual parts of it rather than marketing BS?
“Free Lead System” can be a description for many different things, from a system organized fully by you to a stand alone program people can use in ANY business.
My idea of a “Free Lead System” is simply some replicated websites, with a “honey pot” or different types of “honey pots” (something you can offer for free, so people will leave their e-mail addresses and names). I can add more details about it, but it doesn’t make much sense if your system is something completeely different.
Here’s a couple of questions to help get you started …
* Is it retailable = can it be separated from the membership itself and be sold in retail, e.g. to external customers?
* What is it / what does it do for the user (a few short descriptions)?
* Can you estimate a retail price, if it had been sold in retail?
Those were just examples to show you the IDEA = “add some factual info about it rather than marketing BS”. You have already started to answer them, in the statement “We have a track record of almost 2 decades of people paying to use this platform”. I have simply REPEATED your own statement and question.
I will not ask any questions about the early years or the track record, but you will need to give people an IDEA about how this has been sold in retail (or as subscription), separated from a compensation plan.
I will accept ANY types of retail methods, but I may ask a few questions to help me identify it better (e.g. compare the sales method to other programs).
I will potentially ask questions about TYPE of customers, but not any detailed questions. That’s simply about helping me to ask better questions. The TYPE of questions will probably be something like “Was it TYPICALLY sold to …?”.
I will most likely ask a few questions about “What does it do for the user?”, e.g. about specific functions.
@Neil
I didn’t assume anything. Your website mentions nothing. If you’re withholding information from prospective affiliates that on you.
Quite obviously it’s not “tremendous value” otherwise you’d have made the information available to prospective affiliates.
On your passups, sure. This was covered in the review.
As I understood it sales kept = 100% of the payout and passups = 50% of $20 (~33%)
Didn’t seem to serve any purpose within the compensation plan and commissions structure. It just looked to be a feeder component of the business to get prospective affiliates/customers in the door.
And all that is entirely irrelevant now that you’ve attached an MLM compensation plan to said platform. Now you have to balance out commissions with value of the product. If people feel they earn more focusing on recruitment you have a problem (with your compensation plan).
It’s a possibility yes. From your tone you sound as if you haven’t taken this into consideration.
I hope that is not the case.
I don’t see the point in taking this discussion offsite. Others will be searching for the information (the Power Lead System website provides no information at all to non-referral link visitors) and find it of benefit.
And of course more eyes = more chance of someone catching something both of us might have missed.
Feel free to point out any additional issues you have with the analysis and we can go from there.
I haven’t checked it, but the typical reason for only vaguely mentioning something is because it was vaguely presented by the original source (in this case your own website).
Marketing is very often vague, and marketing of income opportunities are even worse. And “capture systems” are the worst of them all, e.g. people will often need to post their name and e-mail several times to find all the details about it.
Did that answer your questions?
You were rather vague here too, so I decided to ask some questions about it.
He has already mentioned it, but you can of course add something about it. It’s posted under the “Compensation Plan” part where it belongs.
It was a little vague. “Commissions paid out on commissions”. Your descripton was better. I’m sure you and Oz can come to a clear description of it, better than the “affiliates who are passed up”. 🙂
Try to be more specific and factual? “Tremendous value” is neither specific nor factual. You can use expressions like that in general marketing targeting specific types of potential buyers, but you can’t use it in a person to person dialogue without sounding like marketing BS.
“Tremendous value” is typically about something like “It’s simply a money generator. You can plug it into the internet, and it will do all the work for you 24/7, while you’re asleep or are at the beach or are out playing golf with your business friends. It will attract the customers, sort them into different groups to filter out the tyre kickers and let the entrepreneurial types pass through, and then it will close the sale for you and provide for a payment solution. All you need to do is to plug it into the internet to harvest ‘the Power of the Internet’, and of course collect your paychecks.”
We already know what “tremendous value” typically is about. That’s why I tried to ask more specific questions.
I had some difficulties visualising the “Affiliates being passed up” for the Matching Bonus. 🙂
Yeah too me some time go work it out. I initially thought it was just affiliates passed up then realised it was both customers and affiliates. The 50% was a bit misleading too, as it’s 50% of what is passed up, which is 66% of the total commission meaning you really only get 33%.
Technically correct but misleading nonetheless as it reads like 50% of what is passed up.
I’m confused, is this a lead system to capture peeps to sell them the lead system in order for them to capture leads to sell the lead system to others who do the same?
It can be used as such, however due to the uncomfortable scenario such an approach invites you’re far more likely to see emphasis on external opportunity lead generation.
It wasn’t about that, but about “object/subject confusion”. If affiliates can be passed up, they will eventually also be paid out. Most people will prefer to have COMMISSIONS passed up and paid out rather than AFFILIATES.
My suggestion:
“Matching bonus derives from the commissions paid out to your personally recruited downline, after passups [of commissions].”
Your version goes like this:
“Matching bonus derives from commissions paid out on commissions, earnt by affiliates who are passed up.”
It’s a bit tricky to explain, as the percentage is paid out on the passed up affiliate’s earnings, subject to what they earn themselves and later from passups to them (assuming they recruit affiliates who in turn recruit).
Either way an affiliate prospect is going to have to scratch their heads a few times before they get it.
Our whole goal is to help people succeed with their online business by giving them the proper tools and training to do so.
For example, our Free Lead System is designed to help any person, generate leads for their OWN business. It’s free forever to them.
When I mentioned we give tremendous value for becoming an affiliate, we’re offering Max Steingart’s ‘Endless Free Leads 8.0’ (which is scheduled to be released next month) to ALL (and only) affiliates. This is the entire course, nothing is held back, and will not be available anywhere else for less than $299.00.
maxsteingart.com/freeleads
Of course people may choose to attend Max’s live seminar, but that will be completely optional. Let me add, that we are not making a dime off of anyone’s option to pursue any additional training from Max, and whether someone does or not, the value they are getting from the 8.0 product is tremendous all by itself, with no other obligation to spend any more money.
We were very careful to make sure this wasn’t some way for people to get SOME training, and then feel obligated to spend more money to get the rest… instead, we are delivering ‘the goods’ JUST for becoming an affiliate. (a ‘customer only’ does not receive this training package)
We still however, anticipate a fair percentage of ‘customer’s only’. After all, we’ve already proven our product is customer driven. Over the years, the focus of PP has been creating tools designed to help people become more successful in ANY business. (and will CONTINUE to be the focus)
Sure we are adding some content that will allow you to promote PLS specifically, but that is just a small part of what we offer.
Lastly, we give people a 7 day trial to try everything out.
If you feel our tools are not to your liking or satisfaction, then you can easily cancel and you will never be charged.
(we don’t hide the cancel button)
Yeah, but this is irrespective of the compensation plan and MLM business model.
This is not a shameless PR marketing article, it’s a review of the Power Lead System MLM business opportunity.
So you’re currently not offering it right now? Right now all you’re doing is charging affiliates money to earn commissions.
In any case, bundling third-party products hardly justifies you charging an ongoing monthly affiliate fee. Unless this “course” carries on for infinity months, quite obviously an affiliate’s monthly membership fee does not pay for it, it’s merely bundled (group discount on your end?).
That brings us back to the affiliate fee being pay-to-play.
And finally, why on Earth are you bundling another “how to generate leads” course with your own lead generating marketing system? Is the Power Lead System deficient in a particular area?
That’d be like Herbalife bundling recipes to weight-loss shakes made by some other company with their affiliate membership, or Mary Kay passing out make-up guides that only work with make-up from other brands.
Makes no sense from a business perspective.
Not with an attached income opportunity, however. This is a big difference and claiming it’s already proven is misleading.
How big a part it is of what you offer is irrelevant. If affiliates latch onto it and as a result the bulk of your company revenue is generated via recruitment using that small part, you’ve got a problem. One part of a compensation plan does not negate another.
I also couldn’t help but notice you’re selling the affiliate side of things. I know the value of being an affiliate other than compensation plan participation was called into question, but thus far all you’ve come up with is the bundling of other people’s products to said membership.
Other people’s products have little to no bearing on your own. You as a company offer the same backend to customers as you do affiliates at the same price, relegating the affiliate fee to a financial barrier to earning commissions that affiliates must pay to overcome.
Oz, we are not offering Max’s product yet because we are not launched yet… didn’t you know that?
Are you charging anyone monthly fees yet?
I see from the website it’s a “notification list” (email harvester), I take it Max’s product will be bundled with membership come launch?
Meanwhile the problem of what are you as a company providing affiliates other than charging them to earn commissions remains.
You’ve obviously worked out an affiliate deal with Max, so let’s not pretend each affiliate is separately paying for the course over x number of months. Whatever the cost you’ve worked out, clearly an ongoing monthly fee isn’t paying for it (after a certain point). Where does the rest of the money go? Back into the comp plan? The company?
Offering nothing additional yourselves you’ve still got pay to play issues that need to be addressed.
OZ,
I realize your job is to be a critic, and it’s kind fun chatting with you, but at the same time kind of pointless.
You could find fault in ANYTHING if you’re clever enough, and believe me you ARE.
All of your ‘WHAT IF THIS’s leave out the other side you’re not mentioning. (I realize that’s how it’s done)
For example,
You said…” (I’m paraphrasing)
“If affiliates latch onto only promoting PLS (recruiting affiliates) as the bulk of how your company is generating revenue, then you’ve got a problem”.
What you could of said instead is this…
Claiming that fault can be found with anything is a cop out. You want to talk about pointless? Waffling on about how everything can be criticised is pretty spot on, offering nothing to the discussion.
Like I said this isn’t a shameless PR marketing exercise, it’s a critical review of your business opportunity.
Why on Earth would I say any of that when that’s not what I think?
You can bundle all the third-party tools you want to affiliate membership, you as a company are still only charging affiliates to pay unless you as a company make your affiliate fee stand for something other than “pay = get commissions”.
Instead of having a cry about how I say what I do (because it doesn’t jive with your little book of MLM marketing 101) and telling me what I’m saying (when it’s not), why not stop wasting everybody’s time and y’know… actually address what has been said?
And please don’t waste my time with derail attempts about jobs and obligations – you only further highlight your evident inability to have a targeted on-topic discussion absent of adhominem tangents.
Are you aware of some law against charging an affiliate fee that I’m not aware of?
Charging affiliates for nothing more than participation in an income opportunity renders your opportunity indistinguishable from a pyramid scheme.
It’s commonly referred to in the MLM industry as “pay to play”.
Power Lead System as a company currently provides nothing more to an affiliate other than the ability to earn commissions for a monthly fee.
Any third-party services and products you bundle with this fee is irrelevant. You’re charging affiliates so you need to deliver something (other than commissions) to justify the expense.
This would be less of an issue with an annual fee (you could write it off as access to the backoffice), but given it’s a monthly subscription fee you need to clarify what exactly affiliates are actually paying for. Right now it appears to be just commissions.
I don’t agree with what you’re saying… what are you basing this off of.
Common-sense.
You’re welcome to disagree with it without explaining why, but that’s only marginally better than crapping on about jobs and obligations.
If you can’t explain what affiliates are actually paying for beyond paying to earn commissions, then we have a confirmed problem in your business model that you need to address.
By the way, we offer monthly LIVE marketing training to ONLY affiliates in ADDITION to the 8.0 product.
(it’s mentioned in our affiliate terms AND our FAQ)
This might make things clearer for you.
MLM Pyramid scheme: Charge affiliates monthly fee to participate in compensation plan, bundle a bunch of third-party ebook crap with affiliate membership, offer a retail level product but revenue wise practically all the money comes from affiliates signing up affiliates who are paying affiliate fees and the monthly product subscription fee.
Power Lead System: Charge affiliates monthly fee to participate in compensation plan, bundle some guys lead generation course with affiliate membership, offer a retail level product (the marketing platform) but revenue wise practically all the money comes from affiliates signing up affiliates who are paying affiliate fees and the monthly marketing platform fee.
Can you tell me why an affiliate in Power Lead System would sign up a retail customer over an affiliate, especially when things like the matching bonus are taken into consideration?
That’s a great start. What do you teach them to market? (Please don’t say Power Lead System).
Would you say this training justifies a $23.97 a month pricetag? Who is behind the training?
The reason a person would want to be a customer in our program is because we offer value for that $30/mth… they get an autoresponder, lead capture page creator, sales page creator, hosting space, 30K email list space per month, post card creation, floating capture form, Free Lead System., unlimited sub-domain creation, contact management system, etc, etc.
People have been paying $30/mth to get access to these tools for over 15 years.
But you offer the same thing to affiliates at exactly the same price (sans affiliate fee, which has nothing to do with the platform) plus commissions.
Your compensation plan rewards me much more for recruiting affiliates (customers don’t pass up sales, customers don’t generate matchable income etc.), so why as a Power Lead System affiliate would I waste my time trying to generate retail sales?
Affiliates are paid to market remember. What they market and how will have a sizeable effect on your retail/affiliate revenue ratio. Right now I’m at a loss as to why anyone would bother signing up retail customers (from an income opportunity perspective).
Yes but will they still remain retail customers when there’s an attached income opportunity? I’m failing to see how a lead generation platform and compensation plan that favours affiliate recruitment translates into an abundance of retail activity.
We are lining up different trainers every month. They will be teaching everything from lead generation to traffic conversion, to facebook marketing… we’re also looking into increasing the email monthly list space and hosting space for affiliates.
The trainers are again bundled third-party products and services, list space and hosting however would be adequate.
The question however of whether additional list and hosting space would justify a $23.97 ongoing monthly subscription is still there though. You already offer list and hosting space with the regular $29.99 subscription so these are merely add-ons. Add-ons priced at just under 80% of the product they add onto.
We’ll make sure the value is there… We’ll give people an overwhelming value for their $23.97 or at least die trying.
Glad to hear it.
While you’re here, affiliates have to subscribe to the marketing platform right?
We’re currently working that out… we don’t launch until the end of the month.
Cool. Well I’ll say it anyway, be aware that by forcing affiliates to subscribe to the product you bring into question the motivation behind their monthly product subscription.
If you truly believe in the value behind the marketing platform, let affiliates subscribe to it of their own accord. If they think it’s worth it they’ll subscribe, if not then I suggest you investigate why and look at improving your offering.
Optionally an alternative is to have affiliates substitute their own subscription volume with that of a retail subscription. Gives them some incentive. I’d also look at upping the retail commission percentage (or some other incentive) as right now retail subscription commissions don’t compete with the 50% matching bonus on earnings of recruited affiliates.
Thanks, great feedback… I appreciate it.
Hopefully you now have a greater appreciation of what BehindMLM is all about.
HAHAHA, then why not just retail the marketing system and teach people how to use it effectively, Jeez, the smoke is soooo thick in the in this industry.
I am sure the developer of the program would offer you a nice cut for bringing in some volume, lose the mlm and you have a real business.
Your making the developer of the marketing system look bad look bad, as his motives are now on display.
Real answer is your looking to rake in cash!
Oz, I have to say, you are the REAL BaddAss of this Industry.
Keep on reviewing!
Jan, you’ve just described how we’ve operated our business for the last 17 years… is it OK with you if we try something a little different?
Sure,
if what you’re trying to do is attract get-rich-quickers and frighten away legitimate MLMers prepared to build a sustainable long term relationship with your company, go for it.
HAHAHA, then why not just MLM the marketing system and teach a LOT MORE people how to use it effectively in a SHORTER TIME ?
Jeez,the SCARE is sooooo big with the traditionalists in any industry .
Huh?
“Huh?” is Anjali’s middle name. Apparently people generate leads faster if an MLM opportunity is attached… or something.
How can this lead system benefit my existing (non MLM) business? I have several products I sell online such as hand made art sculptures and original paintings, I would like clarification on how this lead system can help my business.
If someone searches for a certain product online to purchase and come across a capture page VS a page with listings and prices, how could this advantage me in making any sales?
I do not see why anyone would bother putting in their information on my capture page when they can simply click and purchase the product listed on my competitions site where the item is clearly shown.
I have to wonder if the lead system is only good for those involved into the mlm arena and really pointless for anyone involved in general product sales.
How can this lead system help anyone who has a product for sale? Mr.Guess you mentioned that your system has been proven, but I find your word “proven” to be very confusing, “proven” “how”?
Our system has a floating capture form feature that will float down over your website… it is an option for your visitors to leave you their contact info to possibly get updates on future discounts or whatever you decide.
Many non-MLM business folks use this feature to increase future sales and their bottom line.
I can’t stand those stupid things. I scramble for the “x” button whenever one interrupts me. Don’t even bother reading what the message in the box is.
(and oh how MLM marketers love to infest their websites with them…)
Great logic.
Its a plague.
Show me two of them? Don’t link to them, use “website.ext” or tell me what TYPE of business it is about. It should preferrably be about something other than coaching programs, because I already know about that type.
I have seen floating contact forms on a few websites, but they have typically been about coaching or opportunities. Most people will consider them to be an annoyance if they’re not clearly legitimized by something.
I use the search method “site:website.ext” to avoid other types of contact forms, so contact forms in general are less popular than what you like to believe in. They can be used as “filters”, some people will simply look for other sources than your site.
I have also seen examples where people have used contact forms AGAINST internet marketers, e.g. as a method to publish the marketer’s own auto responder e-mails in forums, completely ruining the marketing method by making a well planned marketing strategy look rather stupid.
I can’t show you any examples, but someone used that strategy against Lena Bjorna / CarbonCopyPRO in 2010 in a Norwegian forum, and made her look like the opposite of an experienced internet marketer.
A few simple tricks is all it takes to make marketing look stupid, and make other marketers want to avoid methods like that. And it also needs a place to publish it where people can find it.
E-mail harvesting CAN potentially ruin a whole market for a single internet marketer or for a whole group of them, so the method has a relatively limited value.
This is NOT my link NOR do I make any money from this… I would never normally post a link in this type of forum but since you are asking, here you go:
telescopeandbinoculars.com/likes/webcasterwp
(moderator, I apologize if this is against the rules)
Hopefully THIS might make things clearer for YOU…
It’s obvious from your many responses concerning MLM law, rules about affiliates, and even your opinion about floating capture forms, that you are pretty ignorant in Internet marketing and MLM law.
You even managed to insinuate Max’s Steingart’s product as 3rd party e-book crap. (even though you didn’t directly say this, it comes across this way as you use that phrase right after I mention his product).
I gotta hand it to you though, when I asked you to show me the law that backed up what you were saying, you never did… you simply came back with a cleverly worded response to appear as if you were quoting from some MLM manuscript.
Here’s something you need to know about me… I care about people and their success. If I see a change that needs to be made, I’ll do it.
I believe you are a very smart person in many areas, and I don’t mean any disrespect calling you ignorant, it’s
just overwhelmingly apparent you’ve never been in the trenches of this fine industry. You seem to be a ‘snorkler’ who never goes too deep and just looks from the surface.
I’ve been in the trenches of this industry my friend, and until you’ve been there yourself, you and I might as well be speaking different languages.
I won’t be responding or coming back to this site after this, and choose not to read any more of the ‘Word according to Oz’…. I’ve got a business to run!
Thank you for allowing me to share on your site.
P.S.
God is spelled with a capitol G!
1] mlm IS real business
2]the developer of xyz can choose any method to sell his stuff, his motive is to use the best way to SELL, in his judgement.
3]of course he looking to rake in cash – which business isn’t ?
He (the webhost) was really annoying. 🙂
@Oz
Disable that link (don’t delete it, I might want to use it as an example later in the discussion). I only asked for an example for the TYPE of businesses using popups / floating contact forms, to identify it more closely.
Methods like that can be used as “filters”. I decided to leave his website rather quickly, I didn’t even bother to look for what I asked about (floating contact forms).
I scrolled fast through the page and closed it within 30-60 seconds. Half of the time was spent on looking for methods to shut down the annoying webhost completely, not just the sound.
For a method like that to work as it is intended to do, people must first be looking for it / be interested in it. Or else it may potentially cause more harm than good. “People must first WANT IT before you should try to SELL IT”. Ignoring that rule may lead to unwanted results.
He started his sales monologue immediately, before he had checked whether I was interested or not.
He’s selling the system itself, so it can partly be justified. People can accept it logically that he’s showing the system “in action” rather than writing about it.
But other than that, he could be very vulnerable to people making jokes about it, just like people did with CCPro / Lena Bjorna’s automated sales monologues. Her enthusiastic presentations sounded completely ridiculous when they were addressed to “Lettlurt Idiot” (“Easyfooled Sucker”).
It can actually ruin a business / ruin the method itself if people start to make jokes about it.
I’m familiar with business laws and marketing laws, but not specialised.
Consumer Protection Laws are generally about …
* Misleading Trade Practices
–> Misleading actions
–> Misleading omissions
* Aggressive Trade Practices
Misleading Trade Practices are generally about methods that heavily can distort a consumer’s financial decisions, e.g. make him buy something he normally wouldn’t have bought. But it has to be about something real (something really misleading), not about constructed law theories.
It’s also about some definitions and exceptions, e.g. the definition for “consumer”. Exceptions will normally be about anything protected by other laws, or anything that is generally accepted in the society.
That type of brief overview is normally better than deep insight into detailed rules. I don’t know the detailed rules either.
You asked the wrong type of question, something about a law against charging affiliates. There’s probably no law against charging affiliates, but that doesn’t mean anything. Laws won’t regulate each and every detail, but you will find general rules covering them all.
It can be protected by “fair trade rules” or “generally accepted practices”, and it can also be illegal. People will avoid answering wrong types of questions, e.g. when the question itself is misleading.
Charging the affiliates is part of something else, a business model and a trade method. Focusing on the details is simply misleading. I won’t recommend a method like that.
In a 100% recruitment driven system, only a very few have any realistic chance of making any money. Why did you add an income opportunity to it when you could have sold it in retail?
The logic goes like this:
If I recruit 2, the 3 of us will have recruited 2.
If they recruit 2 each (2*2=4), the 7 will have recruited 6.
If they recruit 2 each (4*2=8), the 15 will have recruited 14.
At any given time, the average recruiter will have only 1 personally recruited, no matter how many each and everyone recruit. The income opportunity will simply not work for the average participant, it will work for a very few. Your system also makes it worse by pushing recruits upwards in the system.
In my example:
I will have 2+4+8=14 in downline
My 2 directs will have 2+4=6 each in downline
My 4 indirects will have 2 each in downline
The 8 third levels will have 0 in downline
It works for 3 of us, but not for the 12 others. And you can’t MAKE IT WORK either if the system is about chain recruitment, neither logically nor mathematically nor in reality.
A 1+4+16+64 system will show similar results:
I will have 4+16+64=84 in downline
My 4 directs will have 4+16=20 each (80 total)
My 16 indirects will have 4 each in downline (64 total)
The 64 will have 0 people in downline
Your method will push sale 2 and 4 upwards. That will make me lose half of my entire downline to my upline, but I will get a few more directs. I will have (2+4)+(4+8)+(8+16)=42 left of my initial 84 people downline, if I have calculated it correctly? That will be rather unattractive for people who already have a downline several levels deep.
Your system doesn’t make it more “fair” or anything like that, so we can simply ignore arguments like that. It doesn’t make it more “legal” either. Passup systems are considered to be more misleading than most other systems.
If we can establish what the system doesn’t do, we can probably identify what it actually does. It will reward people near the top, and it will reward personal recruitment. It will also reward helping directs to recruit (to get the passup sales from them), and help the passup sales to recruit (to get passup sales from them).
You can simply ignore lower parts of your downline, having a huge downline in itself doesn’t pay any extra rewards (I haven’t found any).
Oh dear. After some now obvious forced pleasantries I see Neil Guess has spat the dummy.
You need cited law to explain to you why an affiliate-heavy company or recruitment commissions or charging affiliates to simply participate in an MLM income opportunity is going to land you in trouble?
Good grief, start by researching every MLM company shut down over the past decade. I would have thought common-sense was enough but you seem to be one of those “I’ll see how far I can push the grey” types. Next you’ll be telling me you’re legal because you haven’t been shut down…
This is neither here nor there. It’s a derail attempt. You don’t need trenches to analyse an MLM company’s business model, only their compensation plan.
And that’s part of the problem. You come from the affiliate side of things and seem to think running a company with the same mindset as you’ve built donwlines is going to work. Apples and oranges chief.
Poor diddums, here’s a tissue. Good luck with the launch.
Actually, it’s probably a good idea in itself = “limit the discussion to a few areas”. I will normally use the same strategy in a few forums, e.g. when people completely derail from one specific topic into their own favorite topics.
I have used the same strategy here too, e.g. when people have been too eager to discuss hypothetical scenarios where something could have been different.
He has delivered the information he felt was okay to deliver, and he has actually delivered some factual information about the program. You can’t expect people to deliver more than that.
He has actually “played by the rules” = mostly factual and relatively neutral, rather than marketing BS. “Tremendous value” and similar expressions are simply “colorful language”, something most people use from time to time.
What amused me was the “thanks for the info” turning into “lawl I did my own e-research and talked to my peeps and they said pay-to-play is legitz yo so f… you’ just a few days later.
One would hope Guess runs Power Lead System in somewhat of a less erratic manner.
I am also scratching my head Mr. Guess, your product can really only be used by marketers trying to recruit others. Having real customers purchase your product seems to be a highly unlikely scenario.
I have trouble understanding why people like you say that your systems are good for any business, when in reality by saying “any business” you really mean any pyramid type of business.
Seriously, who should be scratching who’s head Neil, do you really think people are that ignorant?
It’s actually an “acceptable strategy”. If you want people to post comments, you must allow them to limit the scope. You will limit it too, e.g. by deleting different stuff (recruitment attempts, derail attempts, etc.).
I prefer to meet people either on “neutral ground” or at their own “home field”, places where they feel more relaxed and feel they may have an advantage. I will get DIFFERENT information from places like that (or at least it may be easier to get it if I ask about the right things).
The best idea is simply to respect the method. People will normally try to avoid being caught up in a detailed discussion outside their own “field of expertise” / topics they feel comfortable discussing (e.g. avoid topics where they feel they’re about to be caught in a trap).
I asked him to bring in more facts about his own program, and he did. If I had wanted him to engage in a detailed pyramid scheme discussion, I should have listed that in my first post among the other things listed there.
Michael Price, tried to sell me his PLS (Free Lead System Forever) for $3,000.00
Here’s an copy of the email:
Customers my A$$!
Larry, that awesome. I’m a CT myself and nearly every one of my customers told me they’d be switching over to the PLS platform because they really wanted the updated version of the free lead system.
Most of them have informed me they plan to keep on being just ‘customers only’. (they don’t really care about referring others, they just love the product).
Uh, MLM marketers using a lead generation platform “don’t really care about referring others”?
Say what?
Ya, my customers are mainly in more traditional type of businesses (Real Estate, Insurance, etc. and wish to use the lead system for their own businesses).
More power to you then.
@gary how do they use it?
Sounds strange, don’t your customers in real estate etc… Already have websites?
Hi all,
I would like to point out power leads system is absolutely brilliant and has excellent training and products.
It is great for setting up sales funnels and has great support stuff.
So can we stop with all this negativity about power leads system.
Thanks.
Hey OZ, 5 years later and we’re still going strong.
As I predicted, I was right and you were wrong!
So please take your biased, ignorant ‘comments & review’ of me and PLS and SHOVE IT, as it’s obvious you’re utterly CLUELESS!
Neil
The original “plsfunnel.com” domain as reviewed here is parked.
Power Lead System as reviewed here collapsed how many years ago?
Legitimate companies don’t need to constantly reboot themselves. Better luck next time.
OZ, Wow, I cant believe you posted my post. I was heading here to delete it and you had already posted it.
Thank you, I give you credit for that, respect.
Anyway, we change URL’s a lot because we supply one free to the member when they join. (members will get 4 free URL’s very soon/referral links’ below the getting starting video)
These URL’s change whenever we feel they’ve been overused.
Thank you again.
Neil
That makes no sense. You can’t ‘overuse’ a URL. Subdomains are an infinite resource.
I wonder when Google.com becomes “overused”.
“overused” = everyone knows it’s a waste of time visiting and to keep away.
or blacklisted.
These URL’s change whenever we feel they’ve been abused.
Ok I fixed that for you.
Some of you people need to get a life. What you are saying about PLS is totally wrong. Makes me laugh! I actually read this whole thread and am amazed at the misinformation provided on this site.
PLS is not a pyramid, it is not a scam. It is a very good online business that MANY do very well with. Even those that do not try so hard make money with PLS and use the tools.
The tools can be used to promote literally ANY business on the planet.
I think Neil has done a good job of answering and showing professionalism while the author of the PLS review has basically shown he is clueless. Seriously clueless.
Yeah, still insignificant retail activity. And how many “overused URLs” are you up to now?
Why is it always the scammers that run around insisting everybody else is clueless?
Oz, considering you present yourself as an authority on programs like PLS, perhaps you should stop revealing your complete ignorance about this program.
(Ozedit: Unsubstantiated claims removed)
@Neil
If you don’t want to provide evidence of your claims, you don’t get to publish your claims. Simple as that.
The basis that PLS has little to no true retail activity is based on the product, pricing and compensation plan.
Oz, you removed over half of my post (which I figured you would) so here is my request…
Either let me show you the evidence of our domain service as well as our retail customer count, or remove your misleading post.
Mate it’s not hard to provide figures.
Here, I’ll even stop what I’m doing and write up a template for you:
PLS retail customers (never been an affiliate, have no access to the compensation plan whatsoever): XX% of current active members paying for services
PLS affiliates (signed up as affiliates and have access to the compensation plan, irrespective of whether they’re earning commissions or not): XX% of current active members paying for services
Ratio of PLS affiliates (since day 1) over paid customers (never been an affiliate, have no access to the compensation plan whatsoever): XX%
Domains I couldn’t care less. There’s no such thing as “overuse”. You’re triggering abuse at a provider level and/or getting blocked to the extent you have to set up new domains.
Made it simple for you mate. Either put up or shut up.
A compensation plan that lends itself to recruitment over retail isn’t likely to generate substantial retail activity.
This was clearly pointed out and discussed in the review. Retail numbers or spam-bin. Stop wasting my time.
And to anyone reading this, have a think why Neil refuses to provide the retail percentages.
Oz,
We have more retail customers than we have affiliates.
You have to remember that PLS’s exact tools have been selling in the marketplace for over 2 decades with ZERO compensation plan tied to it.
PLS simply gives those that want to, the opportunity to capitalize on selling the same tools that we’ve already been selling for over 20 years.
Percentages please, using the strict template criteria I provided.
What you have and haven’t been doing for 20 years is irrelevant. The MLM side of the business is what we’re interested in.
OK fine,
But in the meantime, I’d appreciate you amending your comment about us having no retail customers… that comment is blatantly false, and you keeping it up, puts a bad mark on your credibility, not ours.
Nothing is blatantly false without evidence to the contrary.
You’ve had ample time to provide retail percentages. I stand by a compensation plan that favors recruitment over retail not likely to generate significant retail sales activity.
It’s not rocket science.
If you’re hung up on “no retail customers”, I’ll change it to “insignificant retail activity”. The point still stands.
I have certainly not had ‘ample time’ to get the percentages. I’ll need to access our database which is not something I will be able to do this evening.
And changing your comment to ‘insignificant retail activity’ would still not be accurate.
As I’ve stated above, we have more retail customers than we have affiliates, but as far as more detail, I’ll need to access our database.
(you don’t stay in business over 20 years if your tools aren’t sustainable in the retail market)
You can’t claim to have significant retail activity without the actual figures.
And what is the MLM opportunity website currently?
But yet YOU get to claim that we have insignificant retail activity even though you haven’t seen our actual figures either.
Yep, because
One assertion is based on the fact above. The other is based on nothing.
Yes you are correct OZ, so thank goodness OUR compensation does not do that.
Reasons why it does are in the review. You stating otherwise doesn’t change the facts.
I’m sorry, but I don’t trust your review because it’s full of factual errors.
Are you willing to amend/correct the ones that I can prove are blatantly false?
Review is date-stamped and based on Power Lead Systems’ compensation plan at the time.
I’d check for an update myself but can’t verify PLS’s actual website. Is it the domain with an Alexa ranking of 1 mill or is it the 5 mill one?
Or are they both just affiliate funnels?
Great question OZ, and I’ll be glad to answer.
We have several funnels… 1/2 are retail and 1/2 are affiliate.
If you want our website, it’s not hard to find… it’s simply our full company name with a dot com on the end.
I will be compiling and providing you a list of your many factual errors shortly.
Alexa ranking of 2 million? That’s not so much “staying in business” as it is “hanging on for dear life”.
You couldn’t be further from the truth… We’ve never been stronger and we are growing everyday.
In fact, last month was are biggest month to date since our launch… So forgive me if I believe my ‘lying eyes’ over what Alexa is saying.
Correction…
In fact, last month was (‘our’ not ‘are’) … biggest month