Clawback amount process for Zeek Rewards net-winners approved
Following a proposal submitted last month by the Receiver, an order has established how much Zeek’s Rewards’ net-winner class will have to pay back.
The order makes no amendments to the Zeek Receiver’s initial proposal, which had already been signed off on by attorneys representing the 9000 strong net-winner class.
As written in the order granting the proposed process, here’s how the amount Zeek Rewards’ net-winners will have to return to their victims will be calculated:
The amount of net winnings received by each Net Winner Class member shall be calculated in the same manner as the Final Judgments entered against the named Net Winners in this action.
Specifically, Net Winnings shall be calculated as total cash paid-out by RVG less outside cash (excluding reinvested funds generated as part of the ZeekRewards Program) used to purchase VIP bids, retail bids, and subscriptions (VIP bids + Retail bids + Subscriptions).
Each Net Winner Class member’s net winnings shall be the total amount of the net winnings associated with their respective usernames, aggregated first by matching usernames with the same valid nine-digit Social Security numbers (SSN) in the ZeekRewards database and then including additional usernames associated with the same class member based upon
the “Payee” field in the ZeekRewards database.On or before January 31, 2017, the Receiver shall notify each Net Winner Class member of the amount of their ZeekRewards Net Winnings as reflected in the available books and records of the RVG Receivership.
The Receiver shall notify each member of the Net Winner Class of the amount of their Net Winnings by email to the email address provided by the net winner in connection with any account included in determining the amount of Net Winnings as well as any other email address that has been provided by the net winner following the appointment of the Receiver.
The Receiver shall also post a link on the Receivership website that allows class members to receive notification of the amount of their Net Winnings.
In the event that the notice cannot be delivered to any email address provided by the Net Winner, the Receiver shall send a letter to the last known physical address of the Net Winner informing the Net Winner of the proceedings and the availability of the amount of his or her Net Winnings on the Receivership website.
Class Counsel for the Net Winner Class shall (i) post a notice on the Net Winner Class website describing the process set forth herein and (ii) communicate to the Net Winner Class the availability from the Receiver of the Net Winnings amount for each class member.
Class Counsel shall not be required to provide the amount of Net Winnings to each class member or otherwise communicate with class members.
The Court finds these multiple means of notice to be fair, appropriate and the best notice that is practicable under the circumstances.
On or before March 31, 2017 (or at least 60 days following the initial email transmittal of the Net Winning amounts to class members if the Receiver’s email notice occurs after January 31, 2017), each class member shall, if they choose to do so, respond to the calculation of their Net Winnings from the RVG records.
The response must be in writing (sent to the Receiver either electronically or by mail to the email and mail addresses designated in the Receiver’s notice of the Net Winner Class member’s net winnings) and must include:
1) The Net Winner Class member’s specific proposed alternative calculation (in US$) of Net Winnings; and
2) Evidence supporting the alternative calculation, including, without limitation, independent documentation (such as bank records).
3) In responding to the Receiver’s calculation of their Net Winnings, Net Winner Class members must “set forth specific facts that go beyond the mere existence of a scintilla of evidence.”
They cannot “solely rely on mere denials . . . .”
In calculating any alternate amount of Net Winnings, a Net Winner Class member may only include money paid into RVG / ZeekRewards and received from ZeekRewards for the particular class member’s usernames (as defined above).
No “expenses” or other “setoffs” are permitted to be deducted from this amount, including but not limited to, expenses alleged to have been incurred in participating, promoting, recruiting other participants, paying for the accounts of others or loaning money to other participants.
Final Judgment shall be entered against any Net Winner Class member who does not respond to the Receiver’s calculation of their Net Winnings on or before the response deadline in the amount of their Net Winnings as calculated by the Receiver plus prejudgment interest, calculated at the North Carolina statutory rate of 8% per annum from August 17, 2012, which is on or after the date of the last fraudulent transfer payment to each Defendant, to November 29, 2016, the date of the Summary Judgment Order in this action.
For all Net Winner Class members who timely provide alternate Net Winnings calculations to the Receiver, on or before May 15, 2017 (or 45 days after the deadline for submission of responses if not March 31, 2017), the Receiver shall respond to the alternate calculation, indicating agreement or disagreement with the alternate calculation.
If the Receiver agrees with the alternate calculation then a final Judgment shall be entered against that class member in the amount of Net Winnings calculated by the class member plus prejudgment interest, calculated at the North Carolina statutory rate of 8% per annum from August 17, 2012, which is on or after the date of the last fraudulent transfer payment to each Defendant, to November 29, 2016, the date of the Summary Judgment Order in this action.
In the event that the Receiver does not agree to the Net Winner’s alternate calculation, the Receiver shall attempt on or before May 15, 2017 (or 45 days after the deadline for submission of responses if not March 31, 2017) to resolve the amount of Net Winnings through negotiations with that Net Winner.
If the amount of a Net Winner Class member’s amount of Net Winnings has not been resolved during the negotiation period, the matter may, at the request of the Receiver or the Net Winner and contingent upon acceptance of the terms of referral described below, be referred to Retired Judge Frank W. Bullock, Jr. of the United States District Court for the Middle District of North Carolina, who was previously Appointed as a Special Master to resolve Claim Determinations in the related matter of Securities and Exchange Commission v. Rex Venture Group, LLC d/b/a ZeekRewards.com and Paul Burks, Civil Action and is hereby appointed a Special Master in this action.
The Court finds that an exceptional condition warranting a Special Master exists in this Case in regard to the issues on which Judge Bullock will preside as a Special Master.
The Special Master process is needed to provide a simple, efficient and expeditious process for the Receiver and the thousands of members of the Net Winner Class to resolve any disputes over the individual Net Winnings calculations.
Also, here, as in the Claims Determination process in the SEC Action, the members of the Net Winner Class hold no jury trial right with respect to the determination of whether a disputed issue of material fact exists as to the amount of their Net Winnings or as to a voluntarily binding or required non-binding determination of the amount of those Net Winnings.
The Special Master shall file the affidavit required byRule 53(b)(3)(A) within ten (10) days after the entry of this Order.
Further, the duties and powers of the Special Master shall be limited to those duties and powers described herein. The Special Master shall not have the power to issue any orders or impose any sanctions.
Net Winners may refer matters to the Special Master (through a “Request for Intervention”) on or before June 15, 2017 (or 30 days after the negotiation period described in paragraph 8 ends if later).
The Receiver may make referrals to the Special Master at any time on or before July 15, 2017. The Request for Intervention must be made in writing by the deadline date and served via electronic mail to the opposing person or entity and the Special Master.
Net Winners may hire counsel at their own expense to represent them with respect to the Request for Intervention and subsequent proceedings before the Special Master without making an appearance in this action.
If a party chooses to take advantage of the opportunity to refer the decision on the amount of a Net Winner’s Net Winnings to the Special Master then that party must voluntarily agree to accept the Special Master’s decision as binding if the other party similarly agrees to accept the Special Master’s decision.
The Request for Intervention must include the following:
a. A statement requesting the referral of the sole question of the amount of the Net Winner’s Net Winnings to the Special Master;
b. A statement specifically stating the referring party’s voluntary agreement that the Special Master’s decision will be binding if the other party agrees to accept the Special Master’s decision; and
c. A statement of no more than five (5) pages in length setting forth the Net Winner’s or the Receiver’s position, as the case may be, with respect to the amount of the Net Winnings received by the Net Winner and the evidence and argument in support of that position (the “Position Statement”).
Within 30 days after receiving or making the Request for Intervention, the Receiver shall make available to the Special Master the information supporting the parties’ respective positions previously provided pursuant to the Notice and response obligations described above (i.e., the information in the ZeekRewards database relating to the calculation of the relevant Net Winnings, the amount the Net Winner asserts he or she paid in to ZeekRewards, the amount of payments the Net Winner claims he or she was paid by ZeekRewards and any backup submitted).
Further, the party who did not file the Request for Intervention shall provide to the Special Master and serve on the opposing person or entity by electronic mail a written statement of no more than five (5) pages in response to the referring party’s Position Statement (“Reply Statement).
In response to the referring party’s request that the Special Master’s decision be binding, the Reply Statement must state whether or not the replying party agrees that the decision will be binding.
In the event that a Net Winner fails to timely serve a Reply Statement then the Special Master shall issue a decision against that class member in the amount of Net Winnings calculated by the Receiver plus prejudgment interest, calculated at the North Carolina statutory rate of 8% per annum from August 17, 2012, which is on or after the date of the last fraudulent transfer payment to each Defendant, to November 29, 2016, the date of the Summary Judgment Order in this action.
In the event that the Receiver fails to provide the required information or a Reply Statement then the Special Master shall issue a decision in favor of the Net Winner.
Upon receipt of the Position Statement, the Reply Statement and the supporting information, the Special Master shall review this information and, at his discretion, hold a hearing lasting no more than 2 hours (unless otherwise agreed by the Special Master and all parties) where the Receiver and/or the Claimant may produce additional evidence regarding the Net Winner’s amount of Net Winnings.
Attendance at such hearing shall not be required. Entities may attend the hearing by telephone or other electronic means.
After the conclusion of such hearing, the Special Master will serve, via electronic mail, a written decision (the “Decision”) setting forth his findings regarding whether there are any disputed issues of material facts related to the amount of the Net Winner’s Net Winnings and his finding as to the amount of those Net Winnings.
If both the Receiver and Net Winner have voluntarily agreed that the Special Master’s determination is binding, then the Court shall enter a final Judgment against that class member in the amount of Net Winnings calculated by the Special Master plus prejudgment interest, calculated at the North Carolina statutory rate of 8% per annum from August 17, 2012, which is on or after the date of the last fraudulent transfer payment to each Defendant, to November 29, 2016, the date of the Summary Judgment
Order in this action.If the parties did not agree that the Special Master’s decision would be binding, then both the Receiver and Net Winner Class member shall have 30 days from the date of service of the Decision via electronic mail to file an appeal of the Decision with this Court.
Following Appeal, this Court shall, after providing appropriate notice and an opportunity to be heard, exercise its judgment and discretion to either accept the Decision and enter the appropriate Final Judgment (if the Special Master finds that there is no disputed issues of material fact regarding the amount of Net Winnings) or hold further proceedings to resolve the amount of the class member’s Net Winnings, which shall include, if appropriate, the opportunity for either party to request a trial by jury of all issues properly triable by jury.
The Special Master may engage in ex parte communications with the Court concerning all matters related to his appointment and service other than the merits of the particular Requests for Intervention and related proceedings.
The Special Master shall engage in ex parte communications with the Claimant only for the purposes of discussing scheduling and logistical issues regarding the review of the Claim Data.
The Special Master shall engage in ex parte communications with the Receivership Team only for the purposes of discussing scheduling, logistical issues and administrative matters, including, but not limited to, the payment of the Special Master’s fees.
The Special Master shall be paid $450 per hour for the work he performs in his capacity as Special Master in this matter.
The Special Master shall submit his bills to the Receiver for payment.
Imposing the expenses of the Special Master on the Estate is fair and reasonable.
Class Counsel shall continue to serve until further order of the Court, but shall only be responsible for providing collective notice of the process for determining the Net Winnings of individual class members as described above.
Class Counsel is authorized to communicate with the Net Winner Class by email as such means are the most efficient and cost-effective to accomplish his responsibilities.
The Receiver has agreed to allow Garden City Group to assist Class Counsel and to pay the Garden City Group, subject to this Court’s approval, for the reasonable costs of necessary class communications.
In the event there is a dispute regarding the reasonableness or cost of any Class Counsel communication that cannot be resolved between the Receiver and Class Counsel then the matter shall be submitted to the Court for decision prior to the communication being made.
The Receiver remains willing to consider voluntary settlements with Net Winner Class members and others against whom the Receiver has claims.
To date, there have been numerous settlements approved by the Court in which net winners and the Receiver agreed on an amount to be repaid, often with payment terms that allowed the net winner to repay the agreed amount over a number of months.
Notwithstanding the entry of summary judgment and the process described above, members of the Net Winner Class and the Receiver are still permitted to discuss settlement of the Receiver’s claims against them while the above-described process is pending.
Looks pretty solid to me.
No doubt there’s going to be some net-winners who dispute the amounts they owe. They still have the option to pursue the matter to a jury trial, but given everything that’s happened so far it isn’t likely to result in an adjustment in their favor.
We’re far gone into Zeek Rewards litigation at this point and none of the top net-winners have been able to get off the hook (despite spending tens of thousand of dollars in legal fees trying to do so).
Meanwhile whether you’re pro-Ponzi or not, appreciate the mammoth task of coordinating clawback litigation against over nine thousand net-winners.
With Burks’ sentencing on February 13th we’re approaching the end game now. It’ll certainly be interesting to keep watch how much of what was stolen by affiliates is ultimately recovered.
Footnote: Our thanks to Don@ASDUpdates for providing a copy of Judge Mullen’s January 27th order.
Anybody: is this action only taken against USA ZeekRewards Net Winners or is it world wide?
The procedure applies to net winners, wherever situated.
Not long now (Receivership website):
Do I really have to give that money back? I received an email this morning but I only earned like 10k and then i quit.
what if i dont pay that back. This was like 4 years ago and i never joined any mlm after that
actually i put in 8k and only earned 10k. I aint paying that back. anyone knows if i don’t?
@tom
Contact the Receivership. Ignoring it isn’t going to make it go away.
You’ll have to prove you “put in 8k and only earned 10k”.
They told me that I can’t appeal because the appeal date has already passed and if I don’t pay the 10k then they will get the money in some way.
Will they like freeze my bank account? Take my email and stuff like that?
They said I can’t even appeal in court which sounds bs to me.
Not only did I never got the email until now, I can’t even appeal. My other accounts made no money and I actually lost money. I’m not paying for something that I never received or made, but in fact lost.
Why are they emailing me and not mailing me the notice anyways?
Any advice? They’re basically forcing me to pay because I’m not allowed to appeal. I never even got their emails until today
Mate see a lawyer. Or at least get in contact with the Receiver.
You’re clearly fishing for a “yeah, don’t pay anything!” response, which you’re not going to get.
I have 3 accounts who are net losers and they told me that I can’t request my money back because that deadline has passed too.
Again, they never even notified me and never received a notification regarding this.
Final judgement is next month. And they said nothing I can do but pay “what I owe”.
I did get in contact with the receiver. That was what they told me. They’re forcing me to pay for something that I don’t owe with no options.
Is a receiver, those debt collectors? Is that who they are?
Welp, this is what happens when you ignore emails and think you can slip between the cracks.
You got the latest email so it was obviously correct on file. Thousands of others didn’t ignore the emails so, uh… good luck with that?
I didn’t ignore their emails. They never sent me an email.
But what’s the worse case senario if I don’t pay?
Can they freeze my bank account?
There have been so many emails sent to Zeek affiliates to date. Numerous communications from the Receiver with status updates. The victim claim emails, the portal emails, the distribution emails, the net-winner clawback emails, the summary judgement emails, the Paul Burks is going to jail emails…
And you’re gunna pretend you haven’t received an email from the Receiver until now?
Pull the other one sunshine.
Go and see a lawyer.
(Ozedit: This isn’t the place to ask for legal advice)
Believe it or not but I received no email. All I know is that they got shut down and o didn’t care because I had quit
Well at the end of the day if you come up with a story and don’t have the proof to back it up, as a net-winner you pay back what you stole.
It comes down to the Receiver being able to prove what you stole in court via forensic accounting, versus you saying “but I didn’t, ‘onest!”.
They told me I can’t even appeal in court…
And I can prove that I don’t owe them any money and that they owe me money if they want to play that game.
Summary judgement has come and gone. The courts have already approved the net-winner determination process and signed off on the amounts owed (net-winners were given plenty of time to dispute).
Oh really? Because this is what you sent me via email 8 hours ago:
Look, you tried to get out of repayment by ignoring legal proceedings and now it’s crunch time.
Pay up or lawyer up. Those are your options.
What about the net losers? I have 3 accounts that lost money and made $0.
The victim claim deadline has long-since come and gone. Victims who filed approved claims have received up to 75% of losses.
If you can’t even remember your made up logins with bogus details you wouldn’t have been able to file victim claims anyway.
You obviously didn’t open up three Zeek Rewards accounts in your name, so you only have greed to blame for your losses.
I have the usernames.
So there’s no way to do the claims in losses?
There was a few years back. Not now.
isn’t it not official if they don’t send a letter to my home? They emailed me. or does it not matter if it’s digital or not.
I believe the court already approved electronic communication way back when.
You mean for just this zeekrewards case? or electronic communication is a valid form of communication in any case?
The Receiver submitted claims, distribution and clawback processes a few years back. The court signed off on all of them and all permitted electronic communication.
How many winners were there? I believe it said somewhere 9k? And then the email says only hundreds pay back. So there are thousands that haven’t pay back?
Is my info correct?
Here is a list of net winners of more than $1k. zeekrewardsreceivership.com/pdf/Net_Winners%203.25.14.pdf If that link doesn’t work, just Google zeek rewards list of net winners.
It wouldn’t make financial sense to pursue small net winners, so the receiver only went after those he felt he could recover more than it would cost to pursue.
If the receiver’s records had shown you only netted $2k, they probably wouldn’t pursue it, but if they’re showing $10k, they might feel they can recover more than the expense of going after you.
Thanks for the info.
So I’m caught up with the situation now. So I had 4 accounts. 3 of them were all losers. One of them was a winner that netted 8k. And they been giving me interest for 5 years so now it’s a total of almost 11k.thats going to be the final judgement against me. Will they go after me?
Oh wow, I see my name on there. It looks like the receiver only got a couple hundred net winners to pay back.
Do you think 8K is enough to pursue against me? I’ve made up my mind that I won’t be paying due to the lack of communication and option to appeal. Also, it saids it “may” be passed onto a debt collector. Who in the world communicates through emails anyway. I’m absolutely not paying.
I will still be talking to some lawyers in regards to this though…
As you probably should.
Nobody here can tell you with any certainty what the receiver will do.
Thanks again for the info and the list
I saw that there’s 9k people on the list so there’s at least 8k people who probably made way more than I did who didn’t pay back.
Some which probably never saw the emails like me and didn’t make claims or appeal. They gonna sue 8k people. Hope they dropit
You’re welcome.
I guess you’ll know in the not too distant future what the receiver’s plans are.
You may be learning an expensive life lesson.
Just one more reason why I have no problem with scammmers and their promoters receiving long jail sentences.
These scammers ruining my life. I wished I was never referred into this thing in the first place.
5 years!!!! I thought this was long gone and it’s back!
Joining none of these similar program ever again!!!
Some net-winners settled without waiting to get the email you received.
The rest have only just received the email, like you. It’s too early to determine whether they’re going to drag this out or not.
The latest Receive report suggests he’s looking to sell the debts to a collection company.
Does this end until all the claimed net losers received 100% of their funds. It looks like almost everyone got 75% of their investment back.
I’m sure a lot of people didn’t claim their losses, so is everything settle after all net losers receives all 100% and then they will get off my tail?
Do you think they’ll ever open up the appeal again for those unaware of the situation?
Those who settled must be the “hundreds” they mentioned. But there’s atleast 9k net winners on the list, so I’m pretty certain there’s still atleast 8k net winners that haven’t paid yet or receive the emails.
Some information for everyone.
If you didn’t receive an email or subpoena, that doesn’t mean you are exempt from the litigation. This is the common claim on the MLM forums where a few Zeek refugees still hang out.
This was a class action, meaning only the named defendants representing the class need the official service of process. The rest of the net winners will just get a judgment around June 5, 2017.
If you were notified by the Receiver, or if you reached out to the Receiver separately, you have the opportunity to settle for less than the net amount you won. This is really advantageous because:
(1) you can state your case, such as you had X accounts or purchased Y bids to inflate your points, therefore your net gain is Z.
(2) you can settle for less than the full amount.
(3) you won’t pay pre-judgment interest, compounded.
(4) there won’t be a judgment on your record, including credit report
(5) you won’t have to deal with collections which could include lawsuits depending on who is doing the collecting and the amount.
The Receiver only needs your username to give you access to your data, including what you paid for and what Zeek paid you.
If you had multiple accounts that lost money, it’s too late to make a claim. I know some Zeek promoters who had several accounts (one for every family member). Only the account at the top of their pyramid made money, but they feared giving the Receiver “extra information” if filing a claim for the accounts that lost money.
Now they realize that the Receiver has all of their information, including email, street address, tax ID, and every check/bank transaction. It’s common sense – the Receiver has the entire Zeek database and related banking and payment processor data.
If you are on the list of Net Winners, it means you are among the ~9400 people who made $1k or more. Any thoughts of “they won’t come after me for my small amount” is wishful thinking, unless you made less than $1k. If you made more than $1k, you should be on the list (unless you already settled).
If your name was masked behind business tax id or some other obfuscation, intentional or accidental, you likely are not going to “get away with it.” The Receiver has a lot of data on you, and it doesn’t take much work to line up names, addresses, tax id, bank records, etc.
If you are in the net winner class, you should have received an email around Feb 10, 2017 with subject “ZeekRewards – Notice of Proposed Amount of Judgment against Net Winner Class Member” from do-not-reply[at]tgcginc[dot]com.
It may have gone to spam. It would have gone to the email you used for Zeek account. Search for that email address or search for “disner” and you should find it. Some received TWO emails (one on Feb 9 and one on Feb 10, 2017) with different “control numbers” but for the same account/amounts (mailmerge issue with the Receiver?).
You had until Apr 10, 2017 to respond to the notice by either disputing the amount claimed (at which point there would be some follow-up and verification to determine the correct amount), and/or to offer a settlement.
Some claim they never received an email. If you are on the list, there will be a judgment.
Some claim they made more than $1k but are somehow not on the list of net winner class. No idea here… maybe you lucked out if there was some database issue on the Receiver side.
You have some things wrong Jimmy.
1. You can’t state your case. They don’t care. Tried it. You pay or you get judgement, only options. Because they claim it’s too late to appeal. You argue, they hang up on you.
2. You have to pay pre-judgement interest. And the lowest they would go is 50% off.
Oh and also, they can’t look you up using your username. I requested data from accounts that I lost and they can’t look me up using the usernames.
So I looked through the list. My name isn’t on the list but I received an email and they sent me my data. So what that means? The data seems accurate but I’m not on that list… Hmmm.
The list of net winners.
Pretty much, the receivers aren’t giving any wiggle room for failing to properly communicate with the people they’re trying to reach. And still expects the 8k remaining net winners to pay. I can’t believe the court approved email communication, unbelievable.
And I know I said before that I saw my name there, but it isn’t me because someone else had the same name as me but in a different city.
I know oz gonna try to catch me up on that one since he likes to do stuff like that.
Any info would be greatly appreciated.
You can’t argue your case now, because this has been going for years. It’s not like the Receivership started net-winner clawback litigation yesterday and decided to send you an email.
But I can argue after a judgement is made against me.
I’m sure there’s plenty of people unaware of the situation and once they get their judgement, they gonna get a letter in the mail and that’s when they fight back or settle or ignore.
Can’t specifically remember but a lot of the Ponzi judgements are “final judgements”. Not sure if you can fight them.
Tom- you can’t vacate judgment after the fact here because even if you weren’t served a complaint in the traditional manner, you are a member of a class and the class representstives were properly served.
Vacating default judgment as debt fighting technique only works for *default judgments* (usually when the debtor ignores the lawsuit). This is a final judgment, meaning the litigation process has completed. All you can do is appeal, but you would have to convince one of the class representatives to make the appeal.
As to why you can no longer settle, the deadline has passed. You might be able to negotiate post-judgment payment (so the Receiver doesn’t have to go to collections or
sue you individually to collect on judgment), but the sweetheart deals for settling prior to judgment is no longer available.
Tom- if you want to dispute your net winnings calculation and missed the Receiver online submission deadline, you can still ask for a “Request for Intervention” and have the court-appointed Special Master arbitrate.
You have until June 15 to do this, and you have to agree to accept the determination of the Special Master. You can hire an attorney to represent you before the Special Master.
Have in the pass with the other Ponzi scheme, were the receivers were able to get their money they wanted?
I thought this was a default judgment because I wasn’t aware of the issue. Are they really 100% on a final judgement?
Also if I were to go to court, I would have to go to a NC court and my attorney would have to represent me in NC… That cost money.
Or I can pay the 5k and have it settle. But then there’s more issue on this account which I’m not sure if the receiver is willing to research since they don’t listen.
The issue with my account is that I clearly remember registering this net winners account under my name but I later gave this account to one of my family members which has her name and SSN on the account.
When you look at the net winners list, my name is not on there but hers is.
Yet I am the one receiving the email. So if I pay, will she have to pay in future
And lastly, I can’t check the emails of the other 3 net loser accounts because I don’t remember the emails and only the usernames. And the receivers won’t approve my request of obtaining the data by giving them the usernames.
Then there’s the mix up if I decide to pay for the main net winners account. What should I do? If I decide to pay and settle
Jimmy, your laugh paragraph, little confused, what’s the difference if I settle now than settling before? Before I would be able to appeal and if I settle now, I got to pay?
And very sorry for the multiple comments, oz. Your website won’t let me add comments if it’s too long. Using Mobile to reply
So you’re saying, I can still appeal if the receiver is willing to process my appeal? I tried that but they won’t comply.
They said they “may” pass to a debt collector, is that very likely?
You are referring to “appeal” in the colloquial sense, where you are asking the Receiver whether they are willing to consider a different judgment amount.
I am referring to “appeal” in the legal sense, meaning after final judgment is ordered on or about June 5, you cannot file motion to vacate judgment (which is what you would do in the case of a default judgment that you “didn’t know about” and hence didn’t respond). Your only legal relief after final judgment is to appeal to an appellate court.
That said, the Receiver is still willing to negotiate payment amounts right up to June 5th when the expected final judgment will be rendered.
You won’t be able to dispute the amount (that time has passed per court mandated deadlines), but the Receiver is willing to negotiate to guarantee recovery of money now. You just won’t be able to dispute the amount that you won, only the % you can settle.
You can also request arbitration via the Special Master until June 15th, if you previously disputed the amount of your net winnings, and didn’t accept the Receiver’s response. But if you never submitted a dispute, then the Special Master arbitration is not available to you.
It is *possible* if you request the Special Master “Request for Intervention” you might get that request granted even if you didn’t submit a dispute to the net winning amount, just because the Receiver might defer to letting the process go through arbitration to recover money directly rather than post-judgment collections. If you use the Special Master, you agree in advance to his determination.
No one knows for sure. Just because it goes to a debt collector doesn’t mean there won’t be further litigation. In my past experience, I’ve seen under $5k generally go to collections whereas over $5k you might expect litigation to collect a debt.
In the case of collections, you might be able to ignore the debt collector long enough for the judgment to drop off your credit report. Debt collectors tend to sell off the debt or “license” several agencies to collect – so expect lots of annoying phone calls and letters.
In the case of a lawsuit, realize that you will now be the named defendant rather than being a member of a class. So you will receive a complaint/summons and will have to respond.
You might be able to fight the collections litigation pro se and win (I have many times during years when I had a lot of debt and crap happened).
Debt collections attorneys often don’t expect resistance and don’t have the proper foundation to win in court. You would want to be ready to go to court – the amounts probably aren’t high enough to warrant a lawyer, so you’d want to study up on representing yourself pro se and be ready for a bench trial.
Google search doesn’t give you the most current list of net winners. See if your name is on this list: http://bit.ly/2pfC3Wf
Note that you should have received emails from the Receiver throughout the last 4 years if you have the same email as you used for your Zeek account.
1.
What’s the difference between vacating judgement versus appealing after final judgement? In both cases, you’re appealing because you don’t owe that amount?
In the end if you won, wouldn’t both end result be the same? if you won, you don’t pay. If you lose, you pay.
2. If I was to appeal in court regardless before or after or even against the debt collector, would I have to appeal in NC western district court since this is a NC case in the western district?
3.
What do you mean i can only the % you can settle? So do you mean I am expected to pay 100% but if I can’t pay 100% immediately, they will give me a monthly payment plan?
4.
If I choose to do this, I would need to be in NC to represent myself or have someone represent me in NC, right?
5.
Wait, so a debt can be dropped off if you ignore it for a long time? I thought if you don’t pay off your debt, it follows you forever until you pay it off.
6.
So if I was summon, I would have to be present in NC if I choose to represent myself right? Since this is a NC case.
7. Doesn’t it cost money for the receiver to have final judgement or any type of judgement made against all net winners? So if there’s 8k net winners that haven’t pay, wouldn’t the receiver have to pay to have judgement made against every single net winner that hasn’t paid?
8. With all the ponzi schemes in the past that entered final judgement against the net winners, were those net winners ever ended up passed to a collection agency after the final judgement? And were it serious for people who didn’t end up paying?
9. Okay, so your link that you gave me. My name is on the list. But my name wasn’t on the other list.
My situation is that (99% certain), I registered this net winning account under my name but later gave it to another person. The account info was changed under her name and it has her SSN on file with that account.
I received $0 from that account and the amount the receiver wants were withdraw under her name via checks and what other digital methods. There is no history or transaction that I have related to zeekrewards in my bank account.
Could you or anyone advise on this situation? If I were to explain that the account isn’t mine, would the receiver be willing to look at my appeal and maybe drop it off? I have no zeekrewards transaction.
I do have another account under my name though, but i only have the username and it has my SSN, but its a net loser.
How recent is that list, jimmy? Because my name is on that one but not the other list. But that person that I gave account to isn’t on this list you provided but is on the list that Chris provided.
10. I am having a hard time locating any emails from zeekrewards. THis is my only email I have. I may have deleted them if i received them since I do like to keep my inbox clean.
I don’t recall receiving them and if I did, i must not have pay attention because no one is going to expect a court case sent to you through email. What if I was hacked? or my email account got disabled which happened to me many times in the past.
The difference is tremendous. Vacating default judgment (because you didn’t answer the original complaint, i.e. never showed up to defend your case), just means you are asking the court to undo the default and proceed with the trial.
This is where most Zeeksters have the entire class action case wrong. They think “I wasn’t notified, therefore I’ll just do nothing,” but doing nothing means you will receive a final judgment.
Appealing the final judgment means you are asking a higher court (an appellate court) to rule that there was some legal defect in the case.
This is a much higher standard to win after the district court already ruled against you, you would need to find actual defaults in the legal reasoning or process, and you would need one of the representatives of the class to appeal. Plus the cost would be much higher.
You need to get the class representative in the case to appeal. And it would have to be filed with the Court of Appeals of North Carolina. *YOU* cannot appeal the judgment.
All you can do at this point is negotiate with the Receiver on payment – hopefully before June 5, 2017 so there isn’t a judgment entered against you. Also, if you are talking less than $10k owed, the cost to appeal will be significantly more than that.
Until the final judgment is entered, i.e. before June 5, you have a chance to negotiate a lesser payment than what the judgment will be against you. You need to contact the Receiver – the contact info is on the website and in the emails you received.
The Receiver always has an incentive to find a way to recover money NOW rather than go through further collection efforts post-judgment. This means you have some leverage in negotiations to pay less than the judgment amount. However, the longer you wait, the less that leverage will be.
If you started this process earlier, you could have negotiated ~30% of the net winning amount, without the pre-judgment compounded interest. And yes, payment plans are possible. Contact the email address in the notices.
I’ll reply to the other questions in a separate comment. Please re-read this thread and the other ones on BehindMLM. I like helping with information but a lot of this stuff Oz has reported on or has been addressed in the comments.
By this, you mean, I could have paid 30% back of my net winnings or 30% off of the total i netted? This wasn’t an option to me as I had no idea about this case ongoing but I’m curious.
When a final judgement is entered against me, what exactly does that mean? I know its a final decision by the court of the total amount that I owe. Does this go on my public records and on my credit history?
“The Receiver” who exactly are they? I know that they got shutdown by the government and I’m assuming that “the receiver” are the people who wants to receive the money, the middleman handling the situation in getting everyone money back. But who exactly are they?
Do they work for the government or are they a 3rd party company handling the case?
If you were in my situation — where you owe money in the amount of 10k+ including interest. But you actually netted $0, because you gave the account to someone and the receiver thinks that the account belongs to me.
What would you do? Would you pay even if they don’t let you appeal and say that the account belongs to you?
The account that the receiver is referring to in my case, yes, it was a net winner and it did net the amount they stated, but I did not net this amount because i gave the account to someone and it was changed to the other person’s name but the receiver thinks its me because I’m assuming they’re confused due to me registering and i guess the system never updated it.
In this case, would I be able to appeal that there’s an error in their system?
Let’s say that I do decide to pay… Does the net winning ACCOUNT settle? Even if there’s an error in the system? They won’t late go and say that the other name on the account didn’t pay, would they?
Because in the most recent list you provided Jimmy, my name is on that list. However, in the older list where Chris provided, my name is not on the list, but the person I gave my account to was on the list, but isn’t on this current list you provided to me Jimmy.
Anyone is welcome to share their expereince or response if anyone like to advise.
Also, I have been looking around here on BehindMLM related to Zeekrewards, I was reading the comments but I don’t seem to see comments related to my question. Maybe you can direct me to those comments or maybe in that year? Maybe im looking too recent.
Also patienly waiting for your other reply to my questions.
Thanks for the help Jimmy. I’m starting to understand things better now, even though I don’t believe its fair but i guess there’s nothing I can do as the court have more power than I do. My words means nothing i guess.
This is not an option for you. YOU cannot appeal the case – it can only be appealed by the class representative. Even if you could appeal the case, you would have very little hope of finding a legal defect in the first place, plus representing yourself in appellate court is next to impossible with no experience.
Even the best attorney would have an almost impossible task appealing this case. And why would pay for such costs when you owe, what, less than $10k?
If you really need to know more to convince yourself this isn’t even an available path for you, here are the rules of appellate procedure for NC: bit.ly/2pmzCSl
If you’re not familiar with debt collections process, there’s a ton of research availbale online. It will take weeks to read everything. A couple highlights for you.
1. Judgments stay on your credit report for 7 years.
2. You can minimize the impact of the judgment on your credit rating by satisfying it (pay the debt) or discharing it in bankruptcy (but then the bankrupcty shows up on your credit report). The judgment will still appear on your credit report, but a satisfied judgment doesn’t hurt your score as much.
Impact to your credit score will decrease over time (i.e. a 5yr old judgment may only ding your credit score 70 pts whereas a 1yr old judgment will ding it 100 pts, a paid judgment would ding your score by 1/3 to 1/2 of an unpaid judgment).
3. You can pay a judgment and ask the debt collector to have it removed from the 3 credit bureaus as part of the terms of your settlement. This is called “pay for deletes.”
If you have a judgment against you and you want to get rid of it from your credit report, other than waiting 7 years, this is the only way (pay and negotiate “pay for delete”).
4. Usually, a judgment that is 7 years old gets ignored by debt collectors because the probability of collection is so low, but in NC, the judgment can be renewed within 10 years.
So the owner of the judgment can extend it, which means it will reset the 7-yr credit report reporting clock. Usually, only large judgments ($25k or more) get extended, but it just depends on how owns the judgment.
No. If the owner of the debt against you wanted to litigate, they would file a lawsuit in the county in which you reside. You would be served with a summons and have to file a response in your local county superior court.
The litigation could result in you needing to prove your income and assets. If you don’t pay, the owner of the debt could garnish your wages or put liens on your property.
The actual litigation that occurs depends on whether the Receiver decides to file a lawsuit to enforce the judgment, or if a debt collector buys the judgment and files a lawsuit.
In either case, your only defense is that the person named in the lawsuit isn’t you. If you can’t prove that, be prepared to produce documents of your income and assets, past tax returns, bank statements, etc.
The Receiver is paid by the Court as part of his role as Receiver. So part of the money collected and distributed to net losers is used to pay the Receiver.
I don’t think you understand how class action lawsuits work. With one stroke of the pen, the judge will order a judgment against all ~8k net winners. Those judgments will get entered.
There is no significant cost other than notification and clerical fees that are covered by the money recovered. The Receiver gets paid for his time, regardless of whether there was 1 defendant or 8k.
Even if we had all of this information, it wouldn’t make a difference. Your reality is that unless you negotiate with the Receiver by June 5, 2017, you will have a judgment filed against you.
That judgment might result in further litigation (at worse) or annoying debt collection (at best) and the impact on your credit score.
The receiver updated the list a few times. I posted the latest one. It took the Receiver several months to extract data from RVG databases and cross-reference with banking data.
You need to log into the Receiver portal using the email address and control number you were given in your notice. The portal shows all the names and payments made. If the payment was made to someone that wasn’t you, you need to prove that to the Receiver.
Your deadline to do this was April 10, 2017. You *might* still have a chance to negotiate with the Receiver before June 5, but time is really running out. Don’t post on forums and contact the Receiver.
It is likely the Receiver will say you still owe the $ if it is tied to your SSN and address. If you were using someone else’s name, SSN and bank account, but your email, then whoever was named will have the judgment entered against them.
CONTACT THE RECEIVER. No amount of wishful thinking will change the reality. The Receiver has all of your information down to the penny and transaction date.
They will share with you all of this information. It is a very transparent process. The Receiver isn’t your enemy but an intermediary that is trying to obtain the best outcome – this outcome usually gives you some leverage in negotiating a lesser amount than you won – but time is running out to act.
This happens all the time for class action lawsuits. You are lucky you even have an opportunity to dispute and negotiate the amount. Most class action cases the class members who aren’t representatives have no ability to affect the outcome against them.
Yes. Net winnings = total you netted. Your costs/expenses don’t matter. It’s the total amount Zeek paid out to you minus your autoship. Any other costs/expenses aren’t included in the net winnings determination.
You can negotiate a lower amount if your costs included buying bids with Zeekler, but you have to prove it, and the deadline has passed.
Yes and yes.
Start here:
zeeknetwinnerclass.com/faq
zeeknetwinnerclass.com/
Then, CONTACT THE RECEIVER. Don’t ignore your emails and notices. Any other second guessing won’t change the reality that a judgment will be ordered on or around June 5, 2017.
Oh I see now, the receiver is working for the court. In other words, the court wants me to pay back all the net losers since they claimed that I was a net winner.
Where exactly did you find that list. I was trying to find it via google and found the old one. Then i manually looked for a while on the site and wasnt able to find it. I also noticed that the one you provided is from 2014.
I want to see the list because the old list doesn’t show my name, and shows the real owner of the account, whereas, the list you provided shows my name and doesn’t show the real owner of the account.
I’ll do this very soon. I just want to gather all the information that I need before I communicate with them as they seem to hang up on me if I don’t pay. They only want to talk about payment.
I also want to speak to my lawyer on Monday before I send the necessary information. I don’t want to make things worse than they already are.
The person who actually netted is my friend, I’m willing to help her settle, but if I ended up paying and settle, then all the information on that account or mismatched, wrong info, everything will be settled right? Regardless what mistakes the receiver made, correct?
I’m assuming this is the portal? cert.gardencitygroup.com/zrwdet/fs/home
How do I log in? I have the control number. However, I’ve also tried resetting the login with the email they sent the control number me to and it said that the email address doesn’t exist. Am I on the wrong site?
Check the date in the file name. The Receiver filed for class certification in July 2014, so the list of net winners was from around that timeframe.
The name on the list is the account owner. If you had any other private arrangements on who claimed what income or used a business tax id instead of an SSN, none of that matters. If it’s your name/address on the account, expect to have a judgment ifled against you.
Read the May statement here: zeeknetwinnerclass.com/
There is an email there. CONTACT THEM. Negotiate a payment amount or you will have a judgment entered against you.
No other theory crafting will make a difference. You have two options:
1. Contact NetWinningsResponse[at]zeeknetwinnerclass[dot]com ASAP and negotiate.
2. Do nothing, and on or about June 5, 2017, you will be listed as one of the net winner class members with a judgment against you for the net winning amount that was sent to you in email + pre-judgment interest compounded annually.
Jimmy, thanks soooooooooooo much for all the information. I’m convinced now and very likely will pay. Just doing a few more research and speak to my lawyer once more before i move forward.
My only concern is since this net winning account seems to have some errors. It seems to be under my name and my friend’s name.
I just want to make sure that if I pay to settle, it won’t effect my friend too. I don’t think she should pay again. That’s why I want to make sure that if I pay and settle, it means she settles too. But I will contact them regarding the error and see what happens.
IDK about the money order, all of this sounds so non legit. Email communication and now they only accept money order… Don’t accept credit cards or paypal… Crazy.
I found the email address of my zeekrewards net losers account. I think those were the email. I noticed that I received only 1 email from the receivers and 2 nxpay email. Is this correct? Did the receiver send more than 1 email to the net losers?
The email say that you may be able to make a claim back in 2013.
I wish to contact with the receiver directly, is this the email address? (Ozedit: email addresses should be available on the Zeek Receivership website.)
Please don’t publish random email addresses here (not good for spam).
Can a final judgement be entered against me if the receiver made a mistake in that I don’t owe money and someone else does?
If your name is on the account you owe the money.
The account just has my name and email address that I used to registered I guess but it don’t have my SSN so I’m wondering how they going to give me judgement if they can’t find me. Through the other name that withdrew the money?
They’ve already found you. You’re aware of the litigation.
Your time to dispute the Receiver’s determination of net winnings has passed. All you can do is negotiate a settlement before the court grants summary judgment on the net winner class (on or about June 5, 2017).
If it’s your name & address on the account, OR if it’s your SSN on the account, you are at risk of having judgment entered against you for the net winnings the Receiver determined (amount revealed to you in the email you received in Feb 2017) plus pre-judgment interest.
If your situation is unique, and someone else truly received the checks and not you, and you can prove it, you *might* get lucky if the Receiver decides to allow you to dispute your net winnings even though the court-ordered deadline has passed. The only way to know is to contact the email or phone number in your notice.
But time is running out. I think the closer you get to June 5, the less chance you have of negotiating a settlement.
Update, Update, Update!
Thanks to the MVP Jimmy and the big ego (in a nice way, otherwise we wouldn’t get the awesome analysis news) OZ, I’ve contacted the receiver and negotiated something that I can afford to pay.
For anyone who does not understand, lost or is just aware of the situation:
1. The court wants all Zeek Net Winner to pay what they netted.
2. They don’t care if you read their emails or not because the court already made up their mind that they want you to pay.
3. They are forcing you to pay. If you don’t pay, you get final judgement.
4. It’d be better for you to pay because if you can even fight it, you would have to be presented in NC. So you would have to find a lawyer in NC or represent yourself in NC. Which is a hassle and there’s no gurantee you would win and probably cost more to fight it.
5. The receiver are very reasonable and nice.
Now for some 3rd party receiver:
1. The reciver is giving the tasks to some 3rd party company to handle the situation in collecting the money or making a deal or whatever.
2. There’s only 3 people who work there. I’ve called like 10 times.
3. Jen, James, and some girl.
4. Jen is a bitch, she is the one that says “how may I help you.” If you give any hint that you won’t pay or isn’t talking about paying, she WILL hang up on you real quick. And if you ask her questions, she will laugh because shes annoyed and hate her job and because shes going through middle age depression because shes like in her 40s. But she can give you a good deal.
5. James, is the nice guy and probably wont hang up on you and will answer all your questions. He won’t charge you interest.
6. The girl seems nice but she wants as much commisson she can pull out of you, she will charge you 50% interest and net. She’s also a bitch because if you decline to pay and ask too much questions then she will hang up on you. Shes a bitch inside, not outside.
If you can’t find anyone to help you and is in contact with the 3rd party adminstrator, then I’d go with either James or Jen. But IDK how’s James negoitating is.
Since my case is a little complicated. I didnt make a deal with any one of them.
I am so glad, I communicated with them otherwise I’d be going through with so much trouble. THANK YOU SO MUCH JIMMY AND OZ!!!!!!!!!
I will be forever grateful to you forever JIMMY AND OZ. ESPECIALLY YOU JIMMY!!! Because you put it in words that I can understand. But you too OZ, because you only answer if my question is serious. And you too JIMMY, you answer all my important questions too.
Just pay it off guys, they been fighting against this for 5 years, its most likely that they will keep following you for many years after. 5 years… is insane, so most likely they will keep going.
Time to pay this off.
Also, for those who don’t understand or is lost like I was, its a very simple situation. I’ll make it simple for you.
YOU HAVE 2 OPTIONS:
1. YOU PAY WHAT YOU NETTED AND WON’T GET FINAL JUDGEMENT.
OR
2. YOU DON’T PAY AND GET FINAL JUDGEMENT (which debt goes on your public record and credit history)
Those are your only 2 options. Don’t ask any questions. It’ll get more complicated and there will be more questions. But if you must answer those questions, I suggest you read the comments above and read the articles after Zeek got shutdown by the SEC.
Jimmy and OZ answered most of the question in this artcile in the comments and Jimmy explained it in great detail to make people understand that don’t understand and is completely lost.
If you owe like 100K, then IDK. If you gave them your SSN, you’re screw at least in the USA. So pay it off.
Thanks for the everyone. And thanks for that list Chris.
They don’t care what’s fair or not. And the court don’t care either. You have 2 options.
You listen to the court or you get final judgement. Simple as that. They don’t care what you consider fair or not. Just like the court don’t care you didn’t mean to kill someone but you still gotta be locked up. Just an analogy
Good luck everyone.
Hindsight is 20-20 but if you responded earlier you could pay 30-40% of what you netted, no interest.
Glad to hear it worked out.
I’m just glad I was going through my inbox and found the email in my spam otherwise I would had been in biggggg trouble.
And without you guys helping me understand the situation, I would had been still in biggggg trouble. So thanks guys.
Oz: Is there a p.m. you with a question?
Contact form link is on the top right of every page. Please be advised I don’t give out legal or personal investment advice.
Me and my wife were just looking for a living. We knew about the potential rsik oflosing our money. We came to be lucky enough to net a $200000. However, this money is gone.
We did not kow the zeekrewards owners, emploeyes or thern offices. We were taking our chances like anyone else. They can not tell us that we steal.
We made an investment into the wrong company. How about many other times we have lost and had nobody to complain about. We would ever do that because we know it is always about risk if the money is not placed in a saving account.
Now, we can not afford to pay at all this aount, Not even 25% of it. The greedy receiever should nt pay outside usa client in order to get enough money in hands to oay the USA clients. They did not have to go back to people who had also risk their hard earned money.
I am litteraly broke and I fel life is worthless.
It is all about big powerful scammers eating smaller ones. It is unjuste and unfair.
The money was gone ebfore it came. Life had taken a new turn as well after zeekreards closed. All dreams died.
Now, I am fighting to pay my bills. How will I get $40000 to pay back?.
Give me a gun and a bullet, I will have long time peace in mind. It does not make any sense.
My question is: what will come next after they go to judgement?
Will they send you to collections or they will seize your asset and income?
You stole $200,000 from victims of Zeek Rewards and now it’s time to reverse whatever you pumped almost a quarter of a million in illgotten gains and pay up.
It’s really that simple.
Oz, stealing is when you do something voluntarely. I was not a founder, an emploeey or anything close of zeerrewards, I am a risk taker.
I love paasive income. I love investing. Zeekreards happeared to be a great company with great lawyers on their behalf. How come you dare call me stealing and I have to pay back. It is only in America.
People who take money off their bak acocunt should know there is a potential rsik of loosing money while an open door to make unlimited income.
Never call one stealing since I did not force anyone. It is just the american system. Now, my liefe will be messed up with that judgement in my credit report and it will be tougher to me who is completely innocent.
They are not saying you “stole”
They are saying Zeek Rewards was a fraudulent scheme and the only fair way to compensate victims is for “winners” to return their “winnings” into a pool, so that those who didn’t make more than their initial deposit can at least recoup some of their losses.
@Barthelemy
so you nett 200k and its “gone before it came” ? How the hell did you managed that?
And yes you stole money from other ppl, if you hide behind its “an investment” you didn´t do your due dillgence, and you should own up to that = and pay back the money you stole.
there was plenty of information regarding zeek being a scam more our less from day 1.
There was plenty of warning and redflags. If it feelt good ignoring those and “living the high life” whit stolen money, you shouldent have a problem whit afew tough years working your ass of paying it back?
blaming recivers, lawyers and the ppl you stole from is shameful on your part.
Regarding what will happen now? well its not realy up to you? ,if it were me in your shoes, i would liqvidate and payoff as much as possible (do you own a house? car? boat? nice tv? random shit you aquired whit stolen money?), get a cheap rental flat/trailer and work 4x jobs (you and your wife).
A few years of labour should be the solution, not suicide, that wont help the ppl you stole from, and it wont help you and your wife.
And remember, if it sounds to good to be true, it is to good to be true.
You voluntarily withdrew others people’s money in a Ponzi scheme. To the tune of $200,000.
Own your thievery and stop making excuses for yourself.
Yet you crying about paying money you knew you could lose?
Am I the only one reading this bunk?
You rolled the dice and didn’t do your research on the company and rode the wave as long as it paid you.
Now instead of saying yes it was bad the whole while and you should pay it back. You cry about it – what sort of risk taker are you?
Interestingly enough with $200,000 stolen you were not smart enough to invest that so it would generate some sort of return.
A true risk taker does not rely on just “being lucky” to get paid.
You ruined your own life with your own greed.
Lesson learned and it cost you more than $200,000
So, you took a risk and it didn’t work out the way you wanted.
What are you complaining about then ???
The risk wasn’t with your money. The risk was participating in a fraudulent scheme which you did voluntarily btw – and then got caught.
One look at this site and it’s thousands of MLM/Ponzi exposures should be enough for anyone to consider all MLMing activity a red flag warning with deserved consequences if busted.
The reason I tend to harp on the action instead of the brand, product, or tool is to help lessen the confusion.
To answer the question above, assuming you are in FL (from public records), there are several ways the debt owner can collect a final judgment against you. You can expect some or all of these.
1. You will have a final judgment recorded against you. This will go on your credit report.
2. Since it is already a final judgment, the collections firm will act much faster than the usual collections attempts you get for credit card debt. The final judgment allows them to do one of the following:
2A. Garnish your wages
If you receive a paycheck, your wages can be garnished in the amount of 25% of your wages or up to $30 times the minimum wage ($8.10/hr in FL), whichever is less. If you owe child support payments, then whatever is considered “disposable income” after payments can be garnished up to 50% *every paycheck*.
How this works is the debt owner (either the Receiver or a collections firm he assigns the debt to) will serve *your employer* a Writ of Garnishment for future wages.
2B. Garnish your liquid financial accounts (checking, savings, stocks)
The debt owner will serve a Write of Garnishment to your bank/financial institution to take money from your bank/stock account. Whatever balance is available is up for garnishment. You have a very short period of time to respond assuming your financial institution notifies you in time.
2C. Seizing your real estate property
In FL, the debt owner can’t levy your home, but any other property can be seized. The property must be owned by the same person on the final judgment. If it is owned jointly (say husband & wife), then it can only be levied if the judgment was against both.
How this works is the debt owner will file a judgment lien, then get a writ of execution, then ask the county sheriff to seize your property.
If all your property seized is worth more than the amount owed after the auction, you will get some of it back minus interest and fees and payments to any other lien holders (e.g. you have some equity in a vehicle or boat, the lien holders get $ from the auction first). Also, note the notice of auction has to be advertised in the local paper.
2D. Seizing your personal assets
This is everything not mentioned above, so it can include cars, boats, jewelry, memorabilia collection, antiques, etc. Anything of value is at risk of being seized.
What happens is you are served with a lawsuit and have to answer interrogatories (written Q&A) under oath and likely have to attend a deposition (in person Q&A) where you are asked questions about what property you own.
This will be a deep dive into your entire asset profile requiring you to produce all your bank accounts, credit card statements, receipts, etc.
The purpose is to 1) get you to identify what assets you have available for levy and 2) in case you didn’t provide an accurate picture (maybe you forgot about something you purchased), the deep dive on your financial documents will identify purchases. The lawyers who do this are experts.
For example, if you purchased horse food with a credit card, do you own any horses that you didn’t disclose? If you paid insurance or maintenance fees for something, that is a clue that you own something of value.
You can exempt only $2000 total from personal asset seizure in FL ($1k for a motor vehicle and $1k for all other personal property).
The debt owner will file a judgment lien, then ask the court for writ of execution, then have the sheriff seize the asset. This also goes to auction with public notice.
How about they have nothing to seize?
How about they can not find you?
How about you fie nabkruptcy?
How about you die?
For those who were blaming me for taking hte risk with my own money while they were doing the same and their lost at their own risk. Now, they have the goverment, the hackers, the powers or SEC stand for them to get back what they have voluntary chosen to do.
Remember, I did not come to your door to ask you for money. I did not beg anyone for their money. Red flag for you did not have to be a red flag to me.
They were all over on youtube people who were promoting those types of companies. Rules are different from one country to another.
Blame me on or not, you are the one crying for putting your money in a schemme and cry not.
How about you stop making excuses and pay back the people you stole from?
Oz, you keep repeating the work stolen. You are definetely out of either mind or context.You have no clue about stealing?
I have no plan on putting my money where I know in advance they were scams. Zeek was all over. All over the news and had big lawyers promoting it.
If you lose money, blame it on zeek or the system. I was just making a way to make money. I love investing and I will walways. You may be out of money; that is not my fault.
I am sorry for your lost,; you should be brave to know that is a part of all investment.
Indeed they are:
forbes.com/sites/walterpavlo/2012/04/12/financial-frauds-lead-to-death-row-in-china/#77bae68365b9
As concerns “rules are different”, I’m not aware of any country where financial fraud, e.g. a ponzi scheme, is legal.
At any rate, be grateful that all you need to do is pay back the fruits you received from the fraudulent scheme in which you chose to become involved … as opposed to occupying a cell on death row in some other nation.
Perhaps you can deduct the repayment on your tax return, assuming of course that you reported your ill-gotten gains on your tax return for the year in which gains were received.
@Barthelemy
Was Zeek your first recruitment based opportunity?
So again why are you here crying about it then?
Seems to me you might need to be looking for a job instead of investments as it is clear you can’t pick safe ones or use your gains to grow your wealth.
It’s your job as an investor to investigate fully before you invest – Else you are not investing but GAMBLING.
You have lost and or accepted stolen money. I am sure the people you stole from would like their money back.
You telling me its fair that you get to keep it for any logical reason?
Your claim of not knowing is not nearly a good enough excuse.
Investing is not for you. You are probably safer playing the casinos and buying lotto tickets.
(Ozedit: This is not the place to as for investment advice)
You saying you never got any money? If so then I guess you won’t have to pay a dime back.
You “earned” money under a fraud ponzi scheme. Which means everyone should be made whole not just you.
So the only thing you deserve is your original spend. All the rest needs to be returned as in this cash $200,000
So you better figure out your next “JOB” or place you plan to steal it from?
Either you are “Rich” or plain stupid to think you stole nothing from anyone.
Since you are a “creator” of wealth I see no reason you can’t return the money in a decent amount of time do you?
That would be investing in yourself. Education is the key to avoiding being scammed and using scams.
Then coming here with excuses like you never stole. You can no longer cry and play dumb that scams like these exist for people that don’t know or don’t try to learn about them first.
Trying to get rich from schemes and get rich quick “investments” is not for you or anyone else.
So if you won’t learn I guess we can look forward to you losing a lot more and possible jail time for you as well.
The fact that you cannot afford to pay back the amount owed is not an excuse.
What if you took out a loan from a bank and couldn’t pay it back? The bank will attempt to seize your assets via the legal system.
“Hiding” won’t make a difference. They can find you.
“Dying” can result in one of two outcomes: if you have assets that will go through probate, the debt owner will petition the probate court and they will get your assets before your heirs do. If you don’t have any assets and are insolvent, there is nothing to distribute, so there will be no probate. The debt owner eats the debt as a loss.
Bottom line, as the situation stands, here are your options:
1. Do nothing. Expect collections to garnish your wages, levy your bank accounts, and seize your property & assets to sell at auction. It will likely happen within the next 12 months. This will also land on your credit report (the judgment and the collections) so you won’t be able to get a loan or a credit card for many years.
2. File bankruptcy after the judgment is recorded. You might be able to discharge the judgment. It’s a gray area around “financial fraud.” The debt owner will have to file an objection during your bankruptcy proceeding.
If the debt owner attaches a lien to any of your property before you file bankruptcy, you might not be able to get a lien avoidance unless it’s your primary home (or some other exempt asset).
If you do get the judgment discharged, you won’t have to pay it back, but any assets you owned that isn’t exempt from bankruptcy is also now gone and you will have a hard time getting credit, a lease, potentially even be rejected for a job as it will show up on your background check.
3. Settle, if not too late. If you can’t make the payments then you won’t be able to arrive at a settlement.
Just as you should take being pursued by a receiver as part of your risk when you get yourself involved in a ponzi scheme.
You want a double standard that benefits you. Too bad.
If you blew through $200K, it seems like you might want to work on acquiring some skills that serve you a little bit better.
You’ve had several years to work out a deal with the receiver make sure all the numbers were right, etc.. If you didn’t, that’s on you.
The things that creditors can do described earlier may or may not happen to you. If you don’t work out some sort of payment arrangement, that’s just another “risk” you will be choosing to take.
Your whining and excuses are old hat and none of us have anything to do with the receivership, so complaining here accomplishes nothing for you.
Gotta love the sense of entitlement Ponzi scammers have.
Judge: What do you have to say for yourself?
Thief: The money is mine! Bank customers knew there was a risk when they deposited their money!
Only in MLM Ponzi lala land.
Can you imagine the chaos which would result should ponzi players like “Barthelemy be allowed to retain their earnings / winnings ???
@Char
If it is I’ll eat my hat. The excuses / cognitive dissonance / self-serving bollocks sounds too well practised. “I love paasive income. I love investing” translates as “I love scamming people and getting free money from them”.
This is the true face of the Ponzi “victim” – no contrition, no self-awareness, only a desperate conviction that if they can just keep deluding the world – and themselves – that they deserve money for nothing, they can keep it.
“All over the news”… Ponzi news? No national news or even local news covered it until near the end, and only quite by accident. You must mean Facebook feeds of “like minded individuals” you subscribe to…
As for “big lawyers”, that’s like what? 3 total? Nehra, his partner Waak, and Grimes? All three are paying through the nose to the receivership, but they have malpractice insurance for that.
Heck, Grimes got tossed from his firm and ended up as staff attorney at Thompson-Burton