Nazifuddin “doesn’t know” if Sagajuta executives are in uFun
The controversy surrounding Mohd Nazifuddin and uFun Club continues to get stranger, with the latest seeing the Prime Ministers son muddle dates and attempt to divert attention onto Sagajuta management.
Speaking in what appears to be an exclusive interview with The Malaysian Reserve, Nazifuddin (right) finally acknowledged his presence at the uFun Club sponsored Miss Wilayah Kebaya beauty pageant.
Nazifuddin said he was invited by a mutual friend, Datuk Warren Eu, to attend a uFun event in 2012.
“The event was a kebaya beauty contest. I had no idea uFun was a Ponzi scheme!” he said.
Not only was the event actually held in October of 2013, but Nazifuddin’s new claims conflict with statements he’d previously made.
Last week Nazifuddin claimed to have only first learned about uFun Club after he was invited to the signing agreement with Bina Puri, held the following month in November.
Nazifuddin also claimed to have never met several uFun Club executives, who attended the Miss Wilayah Kebaya pageant he attended.
Furthermore Nazifuddin’s “mutual friend”, Warren Eu, is a Founder of uFun Club. As a guest of Eu, Nazifuddin was seated at the uFun Club VIP table with several uFun Club executives.
Probably realizing he’s only digging himself into a deeper hole with conflicting explanations, Nazifuddin now appears to be attempting to divert attention onto Sagajuta’s Managing Director, Raymond Chan.
Nazifuddin said he resigned from the group on May 21, 2012, after the company seemingly diverted its interest from property development to “playing around” with shares (read: getting into bed with Ponzi schemes), and maintains he has no knowledge of uFun’s activities.
“I don’t know if Datuk Raymond Tan is involved in uFun”, he said.
That Raymond Chan is also likely neck-deep in uFun Club’s Ponzi fraud is a given, but that doesn’t excuse Nazifuddin’s own connection to the $1.17 billion dollar fraud.
Furthermore Nazifuddin might have resigned from Sagajuta management, but he remains to this day a major shareholder in the firm.
Nazifuddin, through personal shares and those owned to another company he holds shares in, is tied to more shares in Sagajuta than the rest of the company’s shareholders combined.
But uh, Nazifuddin doesn’t know what Sagajuta management are up to, has no idea about the Ponzi scheme “investing in” the firm… but conveniently is getting invited to uFun Club galas on the side where he’s seated with and chatting merrily to uFun Club executives?
Exactly how stupid does Nazifuddin think everybody is?
And why didn’t the Malaysian Reserve press Nazifuddin over his Sagajuta shares?
That Nazifuddin is a major shareholder in the construction firm and likely profited from uFun Club investment, is not mentioned once in the article.
Instead Nazifuddin constructs a paranoid narrative in which he is the victim.
I’m trying to find out who got these people from Thailand todo this video about me, and then accused me, and then converted it into mobile format, and then spread it around Malaysia.
What is the intention of dragging me into it?
Evidently Nazifuddin would prefer his shareholder status in Sagajuta kept quiet. And rather than explain the shares and how he obviously knew what Sagajuta was up to, is upset that whatever political clout is keeping it from being widely reported and further investigated in Malaysia, has not extended over into other countries.
The allegations come at the wrong time for the Najib family.
Nazifuddin’s father, Datuk Seri Mohd Najib Razak, is batting negative perceptions surrounding the nation’s economy and his capacity as head of the nation and finance minister.
Keep chasing those video phantoms Nazifuddin, we’ll still be here waiting for an adequate explanation when you’re done.
He sounds so clueless. This happens when you are stupidly agreeing to receive Director’s Fees without knowing what business are doing. All for money. Now he has to bear the consequences.
Strangely, I believe him when he claimed he had no idea what UFUN was, having never met the guy, that is. But people around him, esp. one of this PR guys, should have known enough to brought it to his attention.
Seems he had too many sycophants around him to tell him the bad news.
Scammers do that a lot: hang around important people and bask in someone else’s halo. Phil Ming Xu of WCM777 did that quite a bit with Steve Wozniak and CFO of Tesla, among others. He may have gotten selfies with Al Gore too but that didn’t happen.
Nazifuddin now needs to draw his line in the sand, so to speak: not only I didn’t know who they are, I am putting a bounty on hunting these guys down who damaged my name. THAT… may sooth the cry for his blood.
That would be the appropriate response.
This “I didn’t know nothing!” garbage while Malaysian regulators and authorities sit on their hands is nonsensical.
He isn’t a major shareholder? He MAY be, if he owns shares in some other companies not mentioned earlier.
Sagajuta (Sabah) Sdn Bhd 10 million shares
→ Mohd Nazifuddin Bin Mohd Najib 270,400 shares
→ Generasi Cipta Sdn Bhd 6,000,000 shares
– – – – – –
Generasi Cipta Sdn Bhd 10,000 shares
→ Mohd Nazifuddin Bin Mohd Najib 289 shares = 2.89%
→ Anchor White Sdn Bhd 6,965 shares
→ CanaxCorp Sdn Bhd 1,100 shares
→ Bumivvesa Sdn Bhd 940 shares
→ Chen Siew Kim 592 shares
→ Tan Tiang Lai 296 shares
→ Foo Ngee Kee 107 shares
– – – – – –
Nazifuddin’s calculated ownership in Sagajuta:
270,400 shares owned directly
173,400 shares owned through Generasi Cipta (2.89% of 6 million)
= 443,800 shares = 4.4% = minority owner
You can’t go by the total number of shares in a company. You have to go by the number of shares owned.
He very well may be a majority shareholder compared to the total number of shares owned by each sharelholder. Not all 10 million shares are owned. My guess is there are a lot of shares outstanding.
why would a Prime Ministers son attend a State Level Beauty Contest? [unless he has a personal relationship with the organizers]
how does nazifuddin know warren eu and why has he called him ‘friend’.
malaysian politicians are no strangers to ponzi schemes. the predecessor of prime minister najib, mahathir mohammad, was a patron of a huge ponzi called genneva gold.
nafizuddin is clearly lying, but i’m worrying that no paper trail will lead to his door.
now that nafizuddin has hung raymond chan of sagajuta out to dry, the politics around this will explode, because raymond chan is also a big corporate personality in malaysia.
nafizuddin and raymond chan have previously partnered in a company called ‘harvest’ whose penny stock they popped, and made millions in a single day.
this ‘i’m just an innocent child’ act of nafizuddin is a complete facade.
Nazifuddin’s schmoozing with uFun management, Daniel Eu being a “mutual friend”, shares directly owned in Sagajuta and through the other company, he’s second only to his buddy Raymond Siew.
And that’s only assuming there’s no shenanigans going on in Generasi Cipta Sdn Bhd (mathematically exact percentages not plot out, given we know next to nothing about Generasi Cipta).
I’m not willing to give Nazifuddin the benefit of the doubt there, and believe he only left his Sagajuta post to continue raking in uFun Club funds on the backend (shares).
Instead of clarifying the situation regarding the shares, Nazifuddin’s stories are all over the place. I don’t even think he’s publicly acknowledged the shares yet.
Generasi Cipta was founded in 2008 and is a subsidiary of Anchor White Sdn Bhd.
There the trail goes cold.
Well, not entirely – according to this document Nazifuddin has an 11.03% share stake in Generasi Cipta, second only to Anchor White (of which the company is a subsidiary of):
announcements.bursamalaysia.com/edms/edmswebh.nsf/all/5911357D986C1481482579AF005EA4AB/$File/Ann-Heads%20of%20Agreement%20(10022012).pdf
Generasi Cipta own 60% of Sagajuta according to the doc, with Nazifuddin owning shares in both. He’s obviously best friends with Raymond Chan, who runs Sagajuta and has been accepting uFun Club investment funds since at least 2013.
Don’t forget the two worked together side by side in Sagajuta executive management before Nazifuddin decided being on the frontend of Sagajuta was too much of a risk (Sagajuta began “playing around with (Ponzi) shares”).
What’s the bet Nazifuddin has invested in Anchor White or is otherwise somehow connected to it?
Where there’s smoke, there’s fire… but point taken, I’ve amended “majority” to “major” till more information surfaces.
There isn’t any cry for his blood. I’m simply not interested in wasting more time.
The most major problem was that UFun’s organizers seemed to have found a “safe harbour” in Malaysia where they openly could market UFun to other countries. That situation has now changed.
They can probably clean up the mess themselves.
I didn’t bother to list all shareholders i Sagajuta, but the total number of shares owned by named shareholders was 10 million shares. The total number for Generasi Cipta was 10,000 shares.
sarawakreport.org/2015/05/najibs-son-is-still-a-significant-shareholder-of-ufun-linked-company-exclusive/
Based on current knowledge, Nazifuddin owns 4.4% of Sagajuta directly or indirectly. He MAY own more than that, e.g. he may have ownership in some of the other companies. But I have based it on current knowledge.
the fact of the matter is that, nafizuddin has been caught flat out lying.
he said he ‘heard’ of ufun only when he was invited to the ufun/binapuri signing.
once the photo of him attending the ufun kebaya gala became public, he changed his tune immediately.
how can you believe anything else this fellow says after this.
a few days ago i did a search for that company anchor white which owns generasi cipta. i found Nothing. its obviously a shell company for transferring funds here and there.
according to the bursa malaysia announcement, oz has provided in post#8, anchor white is the main owner of generasi cipta. anchor white is owned by raymond chan:
nafizuddin holds 11.03% of generasi cipta shares.
I believe you will find minimum 2 other government officials there, e.g. the 2 ladies 1:28 into the video. Since they have been placed at the XVIP table, they’re probably “officials”.
behindmlm.com/companies/ufun-club/plotting-the-mohd-nazifuddin-ufun-club-timeline/#comment-338415
The Malaysia Kebaya 2013 was supported by 4 ministries. You can be pretty sure at least some of them sent representatives to the Grand Final.
1. Ministry of Tourism Malaysia
2. Ministry of Information, Communication & Culture
3. Ministry of Youth & Sport
4. Ministry of Women, Family & Community Development
Information was found on Facebook earlier when I googled for sponsors.
facebook.com/BryanMissionLee/posts/552289598115209
according to the bursa malaysia announcement, generasi cipta owns 60% in sagajuta.
later this deal was cancelled and did not go through.
thats quite allright if various ministries send their representatives to a state level contest.
the prime minister of malaysia is the head of state. his son could be probably found attending the Miss Malaysia national finals, but not a state level beauty contest, unless he has some personal interest.
there is an article in chinese, talking about warren eu’s past, and alleging he has changed his name from Yang Xing Choi to warren eu.
the translation is confusing, maybe chang can help make sense of it:
the article addresses umatrin also.
if warren eu is a past ponzi arrestee who has changed his name and awarded himself false pahang datuk honorifics, then how does nafizuddin claim him as a ‘friend’?
now if nafizuddin says ‘he didn’t know’ warren eu’s past somebody should just kick his ass. nobody can be allowed to play dumb continuously.
translate.google.co.in/translate?hl=en&sl=zh-CN&u=http://www.daliulian.org/cat54/node304127&prev=search
I used sarawakreport.org as a source.
sarawakreport.org/2015/05/najibs-son-is-still-a-significant-shareholder-of-ufun-linked-company-exclusive/
SR is probably a newer source than the pdf-document in post #8.
Anchor White’s owners were identified in post #12, so there’s no “mystery owner”.
So he has actually reduced his ownership in Sagajuta from an estimated “under negotiation” 9.3% down to 4.4%, based on current information.
I could have swore this was one of JusticeAlwaysLate’s posts. It’s got the same style. 😀
Yep, it was originally by JusticeAlwaysLate. 🙂
facebook.com/JusticeAlwaysLate/photos/a.420469021465307.1073741835.419828431529366/419938251518384/?type=1&hc_location=ufi
More search warrants out in Thailand, total wanted now is 20, of which 11 was apprehended and 9 remain at large.
Two houses raided by Thai police, both top level UFUN leaders each with 1000+ downlines. Seems Thai police is going off the membership rosters.
Like I said, where there’s smoke there’s fire.
Yup, Nazifuddin is truly “untouchable”.
But wait, it gets better:
Give Nazifuddin the benefit of the doubt over his involvement in uFun Club? You’ve got to be kidding…
In other news a Malaysian investigation into uFun Club is expected to begin sometime in 2020. Police said they hope to arrest those involved by 2050.
themalaysianinsider.com/malaysia/article/dap-want-answers-on-probe-of-insider-trading-at-company-linked-to-najibs-so
but one can’t say they didn’t know it was a ponzi, then say they resigned because it was a ponzi.
well done chang, 🙂 but can you tell us, is the translation correct in saying warren eu was originally yang xing choi and was arrested in china for the angel fund ponzi?
because if it is true that he has a ponzi past and has changed his name and has a fake datuk title, then nazifuddin should give another ‘interview’ explaining how and when warren eu became his ‘friend’.
I got a similar impression from the pdf document in post #8. “Stock manipulation or something similar”. The information in that document could clearly confuse investors and affect stock prices.
But those stock manipulations I have looked at in e.g. Viral Angels, Cellpoint Connect AB and Trig Social Media AB had a different pattern, with a printing of new shares (plus some other factors). Here the number of shares didn’t change, and neither did the ownership positions.
Didn’t say he was arrested, just that he was in trouble.
And no, there’s no evidence backing up these claims. I can verify that MC Angels and another scam AIPost and Unwall exists, but I can’t verify that Eu/Yang was involved, or even if Eu / Yang was the same person.
People closer to the scene would have more context than we do by remote.
Sagajuta isn’t a Ponzi scheme, AFAIK. He resigned from the position in Sagajuta (Sabah) Sdn Bhd in 2012 (according to his not so precise memory).
Sagajuta is the company behind Gateway Klang and other property development projects. It also seem to have some ownership positions in companies that may have been useful in marketing of projects, e.g. Sagajuta Creative & Communications Sdn Bhd, 40%, Provision of advertisement and event organising services.
From my understanding of it, UFun may have bought some professional services from Sagajuta related companies. Sagajuta seems to have provided both believable investment projects, marketing material and other services, directly or indirectly.
But Nazifuddin’s story seems to be correct in the major details about his own personal involvment, e.g. he isn’t any majority stock owner of Sagajuta and he doesn’t have knowledge about the other stock owners’ involvment.
yeah??
how do YOU know that nazifuddin didn’t have any knowledge about the other stock owners involvement.
nazifuddin has worked together with raymond chan of sagajuta, in harvest court, where they made a killing on a pop in the stock.
then he becomes a partner in sagajuta amidst speculation, that sagajuta got the gateway klang deal due to his political power.
then he attends ufun state level beauty pageant and pretends not to know anything about ufun.
then he lies about his association with ufun saying ‘i dint know’
then he saves his ass, by saying he doesn’t know what sagajuta may know about ufun.
this is copybook political ‘denial’ game play.
ask yourself why malaysian media has not covered the ufun story except to publish nazifuddins ‘denials’.
ask yourself why the malaysian police has not acted, except to issue a ‘not guilty’ verdict for nazifuddin.
i mean, norway, your’e generally not stupid so what’s bitten you now??
Sagajuta wasn’t a Ponzi. UFUN was. The actual relationship between Sagajuta and UFUN is unclear. Conflating the two would not be accurate.
Given UFUN’s modus operandi, what they did was signed a MOU with one of Sagajuta’s projects, then try to fly Sagajuta (and Nazifuddin) name for their own nefariious purposes.
The question here is how much Nazifuddin really know, and his late “clarification” and only doing so in dribbles is making people feel he’s hiding something.
Basically, Nazifuddin’s involvement can be
1) I don’t know anything! I am just as much victim as anyone! My good name is ruined! Blame… somebody! (Raymond Chan?)
2) I… should have paid more attention, I should have actively went after the perps rather than just file a police report.
3) I got a big chunk of money under the table to look the other way! I didn’t know this would come back and bite me!
4) I am actively involved and obviously I’m going to deny everything!
I’m going to guess he does a combo of 1) and 2) but he needs to get ahead of the “nasty rumors” if he cares about his public image. Time to give UFUN a real hard shove, kid.
nazifuddin has Only Said he resigned from the sagajuta ‘management post’.
he has made no comment, so far, about his share ownership in sagajuta. in spite of this fact being all over the net, he is not addressing it.
ask yourself , why is he not coming clean??
My impression is that he isn’t very “street smart”, the type of intelligence you only can get from experience. People can acquire some of it from other sources too, but it will usually require experience to know what to look for.
BINA PURI
Bina Puri showed some street smartness when they published factual info, “To whom it may concern”, on their website in October 2014.
They realized that the problem could affect other people than themselves, that they shouldn’t focus solely on the most current problem, but they would also need to offer some transparency.
BP OIL SPILL
In the Deepwater Horizon disaster (BP oil spill), BP’s spokesperson Tony Hayward didn’t show much street smartness when he focused on how he personally had been affected by the disaster.
How his previously so comfortable life had been affected and all the sacrifices he had been forced to make (vacations, etc.) had very little relevance to the general public. They were much more concerned about how other people (or they themselves) had been affected.
STREET SMARTNESS
Nazifuddin should probably try to learn something from those two and other examples.
Bina Puri showed some degree of street smartness. It was too little and too late but it was correct from a business perspective (businesses have other rules). It only saved them from some additional trouble, e.g. media pressure (but for most people that may have some value).
BP’s Tony Hayward showed a complete lack of street smartness. He didn’t identify his own role as a public spokes person correctly. He simply “didn’t have it” (wrong ideas, wrong perspective, etc.).
“Office skills” / “board room skills” and similar types of skills may not be the right types of skills in a disaster area. Street smartness may be about being able to rapidly adjust oneself to a new situation, and about doing it correctly. There’s no step-by-step guides for it.
DPA
DPA wasn’t very street smart when it published its press release about “Malaysian government should file a formal complaint to Thai authorities about Now 26’s allegations”. I’m experienced enough to detect that they focus on the wrong part of the problem (the same type of lack of street smartness Tony Hayward had).
DPA is after political clout by forcing Nazifuddin and the PM into making statements knowing nothing they say will completely absolve them of the mess and they can only limit the damage.
People are already forming negative opinions of the PM as not all of his policies are popular. DPA is looking for public sentiment/sympathy and future talking points when election comes, not necessarily the truth.
I detected something similar when I analysed the press release in a different thread. That’s why it ended up among some “street smartness” examples as “focused on the wrong part of the problem”.
I stole some test methods from Buddha’s “Eightfold Path” in 2012. Only the first rules had some relevance.
1. Right view
2. Right intention
3. Right speech
“Right view” is a flexible method. It doesn’t have any predefined values like “truth” or “correctness”, i.e it doesn’t specifically say that the truth always will be the right view.
DAP has most likely looked at the situation from their own perspective. From the press release …
I can use the “Right view” principle to identify that a factor like “logical correctness” may be relevant, e.g. to see if they have come to the right conclusion. Logical correctness isn’t a core issue here, but it might be relevant anyway.
False statements? DPA’s description doesn’t identify any specific statements. They have based the conclusion on the fact that Nazifuddin have denied having any connection with UFun Group.
If we look at the TV report, we will probably find something to criticise. It was part of a developing news story. It raised questions more than statements.
“Nazifuddin have no choice but …”? He obviously has many choices. They should probably have formulated it differently, e.g. “His best choice seems to be …” or “Our preferred choice will be if he can take legal action against the TV station (we would like to watch a drama like that)”. 🙂
– – – – – –
This was just a random example. “Logical correctness” isn’t the core issue here. The method produced some “interesting results”, e.g. the “our preferred choice” suggestion.
– – – – – –
The problem will need to be identified correctly.
DAP will not feel very comfortable if I extend its suggestion about “putting pressure on Thailand” to cover more than Nazifuddin. Dato’ Daniel Tay probably felt offended too. The Malaysian government should probably file a complaint on behalf of him too. 🙂
They should probably do it on a regular basis, e.g. anyone who feel offended by Thai TV stations should be offered the same type of service. There’s no need to limit it to certain families.
There’s no need to limit it to Thailand either, other countries probably have offending news too. And when they first have covered TV stations then they should probably include radio stations too.
you have to understand the timeline here.
ufun has been associated with sagajuta even before the introduction of utokens or even the gateway klang project.
the MOU signing with the sagajuta project gateway klang has come only recently.
inspite of the references to sagajuta on the internet for approx two years and the gateway klang ceremony being held recently and openly in kuala lumpur, sagajuta has never made any press statement that they have no relationship to ufun, and the public should not get misguided.
only after now26 TV outed the relationship between ufun/sagajuat/nafizuddin [based on the coverage here], have the ‘denials’ come. and both sagajuta and nafizuddin are Now claiming they have made police complaints last year.
sagajuta is a Big Construction Company awarded with a ‘national pride’ contract for gateway klang. alongwith the police complaint last year, why did they not release a press statement too?
binapuri made a press statement, and carried a message saying they have no relationship with ufun/utoken on their website.
how come sagajuta didn’t do that? with the malaysian police falling over itself to give nazifuddin a ‘clean chit’ one has to wonder about the veracity of their alleged ‘police complaints’ too!
i know all we have is circumstantial evidence, but it is ‘strong’ circumstantial evidence. even the UDBP bank officials were telling the thai police about ‘influential’ people backing them.
when you look at the picture in its entirety, sagajuta and nazifuddin claiming to not have anything to do with ufun, is just pfft.
so, nafizuddin claims he doesn’t know if raymond chan is involved with ufun.
this ^ inspite of being attached to the hip with raymond chan and playing the penny stock market on at least two occasions with him.
aaand he also owns co owns another company with raymond chan called 1 green enviro sdn bhd.
nafizuddin and raymond chan have done so much business together, that pretending not to know each others activities seems a bit foolish.
agreed that they have other partners too in their business holdings. BUT how many of these other shareholders went to ufun events, and had their names splashed across the internet as the patrons of ufun?
as oz said where there is smoke there is fire, and nafizuddin is skilfully using this smoke to create a political smoke and mirror magic act — i know nothing! the press and police are with ME, you can do Nothing!
“Partners in business” usually know what the other partners do, but you identified two different people to be the main partners (majority shareholders in Anchor White Sdn. Bhd).
Datuk Raymond Chan Boon Siew was one of the main shareholders, Chu Li Tan was the other one. They owned 69% of the shares in Generasi Cipta, which owns 60% of the shares in Sagajuta.
He doesn’t seem to have the required business skills himself, e.g. the “deeper knowledge” into how the company actually operates. He seems to have been hired to add “social credibility” and other factors to the company.
He appears to be just as unprepared for the current situation as BP’s Tony Hayward was for the BP oil spill, e.g. in that he focuses on the wrong part of the problem.
The question was about Nazifuddin’s knowledge about Datuk Raymond Chan’s or Chu Li Tan’s involvment in Ufun.
“They both own shares in a company called ‘1 Green Enviro’, Raymond Chan 20% and Nazifuddin 19%”. That piece of information doesn’t directly support that Nazifuddin had any knowledge about Chan’s or Tan’s potential involvment in Ufun.
“Completely normal relation”?
Property development projects seem to be profitable investments for the investors in most cases. Property developers will look for property investors to finance new projects, and they will usually ask the same investors over and over again.
It may be a “completely normal situation” if they both have invested in the same companies. It doesn’t mean they are “partners”.
of course this piece of information does not Directly Support that nazi knew about chan’s or tan’s involvement in ufun.
the only way we can know if nazi had knowledge of ufun is if he admits it itself. anything else will just be denied.
but the facts available do paint a picture of ‘knowledge and collusion’
– investing in the same companies as chan, and playing the stock market with him in a shady way, which requires’trust’ in each other.
– chan and nazi both having their names attached to ufun marketing for approx two years.
– nazi turning up for ufun event in casual clothes, with a relaxed demeanor which suggests ‘personal’ contact rather than official attendance at a beauty pageant. further, nazi not owning up to this attendance, and lying about his ufun association till the event ‘photo’ caught him out.
– ‘whispers’ than chan carries nazi with him, in his businesses, because nazi gets him project contracts which include gateway klang and other projects in sabah.
is all this ^^^ ‘proof’? nope. these ^^^ things show that it is ‘obvious’ that chan and nazi are close and it’s ‘obvious’ they have something to do with ufun.
BTW norway, why do you think the malaysian press and police are rushing and gushing to protect nazi’s fair name? i bet you think nazi has nothing to do with that either, because he’s just a poor little rich boy who’s not street smart?
this may just show that YOU are not street smart enough, to know how politicians have evolved corruption and lies to an art form.
They have probably been associated in some ways right from the start of Ufun Club in January 2013. Ufun Club sold various types of investments, e.g. online shopping mall investments. I linked to a couple of relevant sources in the initial review thread, e.g. in post #140 “origin of Ufun”.
behindmlm.com/mlm-reviews/ufunclub-review-utoken-digital-currency-investment/#comment-332720
Post #148 has some more details about “UFUN timeline”.
Nazifuddin seems to be mixing up dates from time to time, e.g. he may not remember exactly whether something happened in 2012 or 2013. That’s a very common memory problem, so you can’t draw any conclusions from it.
I didn’t find out exactly when Utoken was introduced as a digital currency, but it was probably in September / October 2013. They mentioned “Tokens” in a different context earlier, as names of the investment packages rather than as a currency.
yeah nazi is a little dodo.
he even ‘forgot’ he ‘Attended’ a ufun gala and sat with the management at the VIP table.
give yourself a break norway.
First mention of uToken on Twitter and FB is by a Selvy Chua/Fui in December 5th 2013.
NOLINK://www.facebook.com/selvyfui/posts/10151898365918402
NOLINK://twitter.com/selvychua/status/408816774524960768
Even showed off her transactions.
There’s a blog post (source unknown) that claims UToken was launched February 2013. Post is in March 2014 and claimed UToken had passed its 1 year anniversary.
NOLINK://roll.sohu.com/20140301/n395876425.shtml
Poster seems to reside in Shenzhen, China, and may be one of those swept up by the raids. 🙂
The relevant timeline for that seems to be April 24 → May 16.
Some Malaysian newspapers have probably picked up something about it relatively early, e.g. via the Now 26 interview with the Malaysian former reporter for “The Star” (April 24 or April 25). She had asked her colleagues about relevant facts, and they had asked the police.
The timeline here doesn’t support “rushing and gushing”, if you used that in the meaning of “without checking facts properly” (“eager to defend the PM’s son”). The Malaysian newspapers had almost 3 weeks to check facts.
The comments on the newspaper website doesn’t support “eagerness to defend the PM’s son” either. People have openly made critical comments.
what ‘facts’ did the malaysian newspapers check?
they were all just carrying nazifuddins ‘clarifications’.
even sarawak which made the expose about nazi still owning sagajuta shares, was quick to carry a clarification.
this is nazifuddins initial statement after the now26 tv expose:
then sarawak made the sagajuta shares expose:
once the fact that nazi still owned sagajuta shares was outed, somebody kicked sarawaks ass, and made them issue a clarification:
so, as nazi was exposed, the newspaper made a turn around to support nazi’s story.
i came across two news portals that were critical of nazi, ie sarawak and malaysiakini and both retracted their stand within a few days itself.
no news agency is questioning why ufun executives are openly in malaysia, why malaysian police have not taken action inspite of the PM’s son making a complaint against it last year, inspite of ufun being blacklisted by the malaysian central bank, inspite of the appeals from thailand, inspite of a 1.7 billion ponzi operating from within malaysia.
but, so many news agencies ‘sprang’ to life suddenly to carry the PM’s son’s denials. if this is not ‘eagerness’ to protect the PM’s son, i don’t know what is.
so, once nazi’s ufun connections were outed by behindmlm and then now26TV, he sat down with his coterie of advisors and made a plan, and got malaysian press to loudly carry his denials with full gusto.
I mistakenly claimed that Malaysia released a new law against raw ore export in January 2015. The correct date was January 2014.
People will simply correct the date. They will usually not make a big point out of it. Can you give me a rational explanation for why you suddenly have become highly suspicious to factors like that? 🙂
“M_Norway lied about the date. He can’t be trusted!”. 🙂
The truth is that the second time I tried to check that source, I was redirected to a “1 month trial subscription” for that online newspaper. So I simply wasn’t able to check the date.
My argument about that you can’t draw any conclusions from date mistakes was actually highly rational. Normally, the brain doesn’t store dates in long term memory. Most people use “tools” to help the brain remember dates.
People will usually remember events. But that doesn’t mean they will be able to recall the memory of an event in every situation. If he was asked about Ufun, a beauty contest may not have been high on his “internal list” of Ufun connections. It can have been stored in a different part of the brain than other Ufun connections.
you are not nazifuddin najib, son of the malaysian PM.
you were not alleged to have links to ufun.
you did not sit before the press to make a ‘public press statement’ to ‘clear’ your name.
you ‘misread’ a date on an document, you did not LIE.
nazi lied that he did not know anything about ufun, but had clearly attended their function .
nazi lied when he said he had ‘no involvement’ with sagajuta because it emerged he was still a shareholder.
IF his FIRST INITIAL statement had been : i resigned from sagajuta management but i am still a share holder…. i remember attending a ufun event once, but i had no idea who those guys were…
nazi has changed his story as facts have emerged, and i see a liar here.
it’s great you think he’s just a little fuddy duddy. send him a postcard or something.
yes yes, please spend your time unilaterally mapping the brain of nazifuddin najib, without any tools or evidence.
in which part of his brain does the big sneaky liar in him, store itself?
The “son of the malaysian PM” isn’t very relevant as an argument for why you see dates as important. The two other arguments had more relevance. But I will jump directly to the conclusion part …
One correction to that one …
Miss Wilayah Kebaya 2013 wasn’t a Ufun event. You may SEE it as a “Ufun event” because you have been heavily focused on Ufun for a long time. Most others will probably see it as some type of beauty contest. Only people focused on Ufun will see it as a Ufun event.
It’s not very rational to expect people to see it exactly as we see it ourselves, or expect people to remember it as we see it.
The same logic can also be applied to the “shareholder” argument. We don’t know anything about the questions he was asked, e.g. how relevant it was to add anything about shares.
“I had no idea who those guys were” may be absolutely correct, if he was presented for the Thai list of suspects (Tay Kim Leng, Lee Kuan Ming and Wong Ching Hua). None of us would have recognized those names either. They can be almost anyone with an asiatic look. 🙂
The Miss Kebaya Malaysia regional events were not UFUN events. UFUN just happen to be the chief sponsor for two (or more?) of them.
I think Nazifuddin has a good chance of convincing people he’s NOT involved, if he cared to throw his “friends” under the bus a bit more enthusiastically rather than trying to teflon ™ slick himself.
These repeated attempts to insist he’s not involved, not me, not me, so far has not convinced the critics and doubters, and may have even backfired.
People may even suspect that he didn’t dare to do a full denial because there’s SOME truth to it. His PR guy needs a hard kick in the behind.
so, miss kebaya was not a ufun event, and nazi did not sit at the table with ufun honchos, and it’s completely all right if he forgot about attending this event, because his brain stores stuff in different compartments and poor nazi is unable to connect the dots!
When his memory is jogged by the press, voila, he suddenly remembers everything and spins it again!
in another thread, you and chang have figured that warren eu most probably has a fake datuk seri title. his education is fake. yet nazi has spoken to the press, and addressed warren eu as a ‘friend’.
so norway, what happened to little nazi this time? was the poor child misguided? i can tell you what he will say in advance. he will say he never used the word ‘friend’and that the press misquoted him!
he can keep on and on bullshitting, as long as there are people willing to digest his BS, on the grounds that it is ‘plausible’.
the thing is, it’s Equally Plausible that he is neck deep in the ufun shit, and it becomes Even More Plausible when you see ‘his’ malaysian press and police falling at his feet and giving him clean chits.
It wasn’t. Ufun was the main sponsor, and it probably paid extra to get some sponsorship conditions adjusted.
The second main sponsor was the Concorde Hotel (where the event was held).
Primary organizer was one of Jason Hee’s businesses. He has probably registered Miss Malaysia Kebaya as a registered company, or he may even have divided it up into smaller units to reduce risks.
“The Concorde event” would have been just as meaningful as “Ufun event”, since that was the place where the event was held. You will probably not recall it as the “Concorde event” in a few months from now.
Why should he remember them more than a year after he met them? I’m talking about names here, not faces. Do you memorize the names of all the people you meet the first time you meet them?
It could have been relatively rational to expect him to remember them if he already knew them (if he already had close connections to those 3 Ufun leaders before the event). But we don’t know anything about that.
Your reasoning only makes sense if I add some factors to it, e.g. if I assume that he already had close connections to the Ufun leaders and knew them as Ufun leaders. But none of the sources have said anything about that?
I believe you should check the sources. Malaysian press seem to have reported the case as it is, right from “Fugitive Ufun ‘datuk’ rubs shoulders with politicians”, “Ufun – ‘Why Najib’s son not questioned?’ poser” up to the “This is a smear campaign, says Najib’s son”.
Behind a paywall:
malaysiakini.com/news/296968 (BehindMLM as source)
malaysiakini.com/news/298356 (Now 26 as source)
Source for one behindmlm article:
malaysiakini.com/news/298367 (interview with Nazifuddin)
You can’t complain about “media control” when you’re the one trying to control the media, when you only will accept your side of the story as the only reliable side of the story.
nazifuddin najib has clearly stated that he attended the kebaya contest on the invite of warren eu, who he called a ‘friend’. warren eu is the founder of both ufun and umatrin. he is nazi’s ‘friend’. warren eu is a guy with a ponzi past and fake degrees and honorofics.
nazi, was aware it was a ufun event. he claimed he did not know ufun was a ‘ponzi’ at that time.
nazi’s name was associated with ufun , for a long time Before he attended miss kebaya. warren eu is credited as the founder of ufun. and nazi said he attended the kebaya ufun event at the invite of a ‘friend’ warren eu.
when i take this information and process it from a ‘single’ part of my brain, it becomes obvious to Me that somethin’s been cooking.
it is entirely possible that if you put each fact in different sections of your brain and try to process the info, you may find disjointed ends.
malaysiakini which ran a couple of stories, about nazi’s involvement has also clarified that it ‘found no evidence’ of nazi’s ‘involvement’ in ufun.
as if such evidence will be lying around for everyone to see!
and the malaysian press and yourself, still wont say why they are not questioning ufuns sense of security in malaysia, and why there is no action.
obvious is Not evidence, but obvious is obvious.
I probably have some former criminals among my friends, but I don’t really see any problem in that. It looks like you’re focusing on your own ideas rather than the reality here.
If I remember correctly, the Mumbai police (EOW) tried to arrest Ashok Bahirwani several times in 2012. But you still seemed to accept him. 🙂
Nazifuddin haven’t convinced me. I have only looked at how solid the case is, and currently it isn’t very solid. So his version of the story is just as believable as ours.
He clearly has been linked to Ufun in many different ways, but that doesn’t need to mean that he has been involved in something illegal.
Nazifuddin seems to own 4.4% of Sagajuta (Sabah) Sdn Bhd. Sagajuta has probably been involved much more directly than he has, but there you must look at the people in charge of the business rather than him.
You must look at Raymond Chan and Chu Li Tan, the people you identified yourself in post #12. You can still keep Nazifuddin as your “favorite suspect”, you will only need to find the right thing first (suspicion will need to be based on some substance).
Oh snap, that’s a sulphuric-acid grade burn right there!
nah, the Supreme Court of India took care of that burn, right away. threw the EOW out court [even scolded them!!] 🙂
Not sure when that happened. Only SC action I was aware of was the Lahoti bullshit finally getting tossed.
(anyway this is offtopic, I just thought I’d acknowledge M_Norway’s class burn)
of course the case is not very solid.
we have just been able to identify a train of events linking nazi to ufun, which is circumstantial at best.
the case can be made solid only by investigation. but who will investigate? it is the press’s duty to ask the questions and dig, it’s the police’s duty to investigate, but nothing of that sort is happening in malaysia.
do you have a ‘plausible’ excuse for that too norway? maybe the ufun ponzi, is not a solid enough ‘case’? maybe nazi and his daddy have not given the green signal yet?
They have already done that, reported here on May 14 and May 16.
You can still keep Nazifuddin as your “favorite suspect”, there’s no need to let the available information ruin that for you. 🙂
you mean the sarawak and malaysiakini reports which were prompt to give nazi a clean chit, after their initial reports. just like the malaysian IGP of police, it barely took them any time to conclude that nazi was not guilty!
did these news portals follow up on what is ufun and why is danial tay prancing around kuala lumpur, and traveling in and out of malaysia, like he owns it? did they really investigate nazi’s ufun links? have they followed up on why the police is not investigating ufun, and how many victims there are in malaysia?
it is obvious ufun has some powerful patronage in malaysia. but neither the press or police is going to the bottom of that. this is because nazi and his daddy control the press and police.
till the malaysian press and police do not ‘act’, nazi is going to remain my ‘favorite suspect’. and if they act late, and let danial tay ‘slip away’ i will interpret that as ‘proof’ of nazi’s involvement.
The Malaysian newspapers (in general) had nearly 3 weeks to check relevant facts. I only checked Malaysiakini (in post #50). I haven’t seen your post about Sarawak-report (post #42) before now.
Newspapers should publish corrections if they get new relevant info. We used Sarawak-report as a partial source, e.g. I used it in post #4 and #17 for a list of shareholders / percentage ownership.
I haven’t used it as a source for corrections (they started already in post #4).
They don’t control me (AFAIK). I haven’t checked it carefully, so … 🙂
I have already suggested that. He fits the profile of a “favorite suspect” perfectly, so you should probably still have him on your list.
He hasn’t convinced me (I’m simply not a “expecting to be convinced” type of person). But there was more than enough “reasonable doubt”.