MOBE shut down by the FTC?
This morning I received intel that two days ago top earners, Michael Williams and Michael Giannulis, informed their MOBE downline they were leaving the company.
The cited reason for Williams’ and Giannulis’ departure was an FTC investigation into MOBE.
Currently every MOBE corporate website is down.
Here’s what we know.
Last month Founder and CEO Matt Lloyd celebrated Michael Williams (aka Mike Williams) and Michael Giannulis (aka Mike Antoni) earning over $23 million dollars as MOBE affiliates.
Lloyd presented the pair with a Rolex watch and platinum ring each for their achievement.
On June 7th, the following message was sent out to Williams’ and Giannulis’ MOBE downline;
This is a bitter sweet moment for BPO that we must inform you of. As of now, we are no longer affiliated with MOBE at all.
As we move forward onto bigger and better things we want to let you know where we are with MOBE.
Any members that you were working with to sell them MOBE must stop immediately.
This also means that any sales that we have made that are not paid will have to stay that way.
The FTC has brought the hammer down upon MOBE and we have to cut ties with them 100%.
If we do not we could also find ourselves stuck in a sticky situation.
We know the loss of sales hurts, it hurts all of us as a whole, but we know that BPO is going in a great direction and is making this move to protect us.
Thank you for your understand in this moment and thank you for making BPO great.
“BPO” refers to BPO USA LLC, a company set up by Giannulis in Florida.
Around twenty-four hours ago MOBE’s corporate website went down and the domains are now parked.
The MOBE domain registration details are private but we can tell you the registration was last updated on June 6th, 2018.
Other MOBE corporate website domain registrations were also updated, some within seconds of each other – all on June 6th.
- mobe.tv was modified at 17:16:27
- askmattlloyd.com was modified at 18:10:50
- mobe.com was modified at 18:11:35
- homebusinesssummit.com is completely unresponsive and was modified at 18:11:41
- mobeaffiliatesupport.com was modified at 18:11:14
- mobetrack.com was modified at 18:12:00
- mobemarketplace.com was modified at 18:12:12
- mattlloydsblog.com was modified at 18:14:02
- imfreedomworkshop.com was modified at 18:14:21
Matt Lloyd’s MOBE spin-off, the Turnkey Business System, is also offline (18:14:39).
On social media MOBE corporate has acknowledged their website is down.
When asked about it, MOBE corporate responded “tech is working on it”.
As of yet there’s been no official confirmation by the FTC. If a sealed lawsuit and an injunction has been granted, it’s yet to show up on Pacer.
I have seen some MOBE affiliates claiming this is a data migration issue (WordPress to some other platform), however this makes little sense.
First thing you do with a migration is take a backup to revert to if it screws up. And for a business you’re going to want to stage a migration before applying it to your live site.
Not withstanding MOBE corporate websites have been down for almost 24 hours now.
MOBE had scheduled a Home Business Summit event in Seattle across June 8th to 10th, which I’m hearing was abruptly cancelled.
Note that at this time an FTC investigation and shutdown of MOBE is unconfirmed.
Normally I’d wait for deeper confirmation but top earners leaving, citing an FTC investigation and the corporate websites going down – all within the last 48 hours was pretty significant.
We’ll keep you posted of any updates. Stay tuned…
Update 10th June 2018 – Following announcements by the tech team, top earners and social media admins, we can now confirm an FTC investigation into MOBE.
Hello, my name is Ralph Joseph and you have my name and info in a screenshot in this article that I want removed NOW or I will file a lawsuit because I did not give consent to use my name or screenshot in this article.
This article is completely speculation and I do not think MOBE has been shut down by anyone.
REMOVE THE SCREENSHOT WITH MY NAME IMMEDIATELY. You have until tomorrow morning to remove it.
Oh shutup.
Public post + news = fair use.
Umm yeah … nice try RALPHIE!!!
Maybe you should think about NOT USING a PUBLIC SOCIAL MEDIA platform then..
Come on Bro… Are you really …..FOR REAL????
Why not at least tell us some info on as to why all the links are not up and running and why everyone else is saying that MOBE IS DONE!!!
Instead of some SILLY THREAT about YOU SPENDING money you DONT HAVE to file a silly lawsuit.
Good luck OLD RALPHIE!!!
What a joke you are.
I have been waiting for this for over 4 years! A-flipping-men. Yes I earn a living online, selling products goods and services, so to you MOBE believers… don’t hate the player, hate the game!
I have 2 YouTube videos that have gotten a lot of attention sharing the horrid experience I had with MOBE in 2014. The positive comments are awesome but the negative are laughable.
The video has serve as a public service announcement that has allowed me to help several 100 people make an informed decision when considering joining MOBE.
Additionally filed I a complaints with the FTC, the SEC, the attorney general and my states attorney’s office and was contacted by the Feds over a year ago.
MOBE is the absolute definition of a pyramid scheme. There are no products to sell, your goal as a MOBE affiliate is to recruit…period.
So Ralph…yeah I’m thinking the company is being shut down, finally!! So sad that it took this long for it to happen. I know people, like myself, that lost thousands.
Are we stupid? Maybe. Naive? Yes!
It was an expensive lesson. One that made me stronger, made me life, long friends who went through the same thing at the same time and one that taught me what to look for when deciding to partner with an online opportunity.
I look forward to finding confirmation of it’s closure. I’m certain Matt will fight it to the bitter end, so pompous.
Good thing he and his millions are safe in Kuala Lumpur.
Hello Ralph – and now your name is also here in the comment section in the text form (and thus searchable via the search engines). Your public shame is accomplished – completely by you. 😉
P.S. Comments made here are not removed unless there is a good reason for the removal.
P.P.S. I wonder how quickly you found the use of your facebook post here.
It’s called the “Streisand Effect” and by making his idiotic threat, Mr Joseph just magnified its’ effect.
Good job, Ralph.
MOBE is a truly great company. Matt Lloyd is one of the most brilliant entrepreneurs I have ever met. He and his company will pull out of this and be victorious.
I hate all the talk from the naysayers. Being an entrepreneur in today’s world is more difficult than ever.
All you have to do is study the lives of the greatest entrepreneurs who ever lived and you’ll see that they faced trials and tribulations that would have destroyed other people. But they were not defeated.
Matt Lloyd will not be, either. He is one of the great entrepreneurs of our time and those of us who are involved with his company are fortunate.
I hope you will think about Matt and the challenges he is facing and do whatever you can to support him and discourage all of the reckless negativity from small-minded people who only want to gossip and spread their negativity.
I hope everyone reads this – this article is purely speculative.
Matt Llyod is one of the hardest workers out there and his company has given hope to so many humans.
Hope for entrepreneurs to start a business that works, Jobs to hundreds of employees and of course a community that is amazing. The workshop retreats have been so incredible.
I’ve learned more than any education system including top universities out there to actually make money and create a freedom lifestyle.
The Top affiliate Mike and Mike have left because they are the scummiest of scam.
Their CPA traffic leads to purely shady marketing compared to what MOBE teaches everyone not to do. They are pure BIZ opp hoppers. Watch where they will go next – onto the next company to promote.
Jennifer Crouch – So sad that you would file a complaint about something that you didn’t put in work to achieve success.
There are so many products to sell. You say you sell information marketing yet you probably are the true scammer not giving value.
The way you use a corporate name that actually works to try and make yourself look good. so sad.
To all the mobe communnity – believe Matt will pull through.
Gawwwwd, here come the shills.
What is it about MOBE you think that attracted these “scummiest of scam” individuals in the first place?
If the FTC truly have shut MOBE down, its affiliates would do well to study the My Digital Altitude shutdown.
The regulatory shut down of MOBE is not some minor challenge the company will just get over. It’ll include fraud charges against Matt Lloyd and be the end of the business.
I’ve reviewed MOBE and find it hard to believe the company has a sizeable retail customer-base.
“High ticket” opportunities like MOBE typically wind up being chain-recruitment schemes, where affiliates are convinced to pay thousands – which is recouped only when they recruit new affiliates who pay thousands etc. etc.
Again, that’s if the FTC has indeed shut down MOBE. Which is looking increasingly likely in the face of deafening silence.
OZ. Keep digging on this story. This is a very significant company and many excellent people are involved…worldwide.
I would hope its just a tech issue…if you can find proof that its more than that…
I hope to have an update within the next 12 hours.
I have put thousands in this business. I refuse to believe negatively about speculation.
I will reach for my dream and continue to believe in Matt Lloyd, his dreams and his team.
If it is true that the FTC is driving this, I am disgusted. But not for the reasons you might think.
I am disgusted by all those disgruntled greviance hustlers and frankly online marketing competitors who grieved online and filed complaints with the FTC. They just cost a ton of good people their retirement money…for no good reason.
They felt hurt, so everyone else needs to pay too. Good people don’t need protection from you.
As always your good intentions lead to horrible results. This time, devastating results.
The business education is valuable, legitimate, and fully open to market pricing – if people don’t feel the education is worth the money, they won’t pay for it.
Nobody’s arms are twisted.. There is no high pressure sales. Everything in the programs is fully disclosed.
what about top affiliates like: john chow and shaqir ?
john chow brags on how much he earns from MOBE.
and shaqir charges $25k for the MOBE system.
both their sites are still up?
pls pls look into this! thank you.
Jennifer Couch… what do you mean there is no product?I have received the products that I have paid for.
The products consist of small business trainings, coaching sessions, books, and seminars.
Yes…you make money in commissions because others buy the products such as the 21 step program, the master class trainings, etc. But to say there is no product is false.
In a true, fraudulant ponzi or pyramid scheme there is no product of any kind – it is just money exchanging hands between people with the promise of product to invest in that doesn’t exist.
Therefore MOBE is not a fraudulent pyramid scheme.
Hi i purchased the mobe sikver license for 2k years ago and it was definately worth the money in terms of the info it contained.
I feel it was worth the money, they should let people still access that side of things as i think the ftc problem is with their affiliate side not the actual product itself
There are no real products with MOBE..It is all about getting new people to spend money and that money goes to the upline… plain and simple as stated above by a few comments…
Finally they get what they deserve…
Well, Jason McRiffle, to say there are no products with MOBE shows ignorance to the business. I would question whether that person has attended a Platinum Mastermind or all other events.
I have been to several MOBE events, I have done 21 Steps and the Silver and Gold Masterclass courses. They are all excellent content and products to me.
Whether you agree is your opinion but I want to at least be clear others like myself feel different.
MOBE also included a coach with your 21 Steps and many of those coaches have excellent value and advice. Some may not be as good as others but most do try hard to help the new marketer.
I am at least now about to continue marketing online thanks to what MOBE has taught. I have my own online business to work on and I can help other people and businesses do the same.
Maybe I could have learned things elsewhere too but MOBE have a very structured approach that everyone could follow, much like going to University but with the inclusion of real world business in the process as it should be.
MOBE and Matt will push on to deal with this temporary regulatory restriction. There is no certainty in business but there is still an option for the MOBE business to continue in the future and regardless there is a future online still for those who joined MOBE. Don’t ever give that up!
Haha. Is this Ralph guy serious?
When I talk about MOBE and what can happen to them, people don’t take me seriously.
Now I’m just waiting to see how the other MOBE clones will react. Keep a close eye on Digital Altitude and the others.
@Robert
In that case I’m sure MOBE will have no problem providing the FTC with evidence of the majority of company revenue being derived from retail sales?
@Brenda
False. Every MLM Ponzi and/or pyramid scheme has some product or service attached to it.
I am so glad that unethical garbage disguised as a “business” is shut down!… Matt Lloyd will get his just desserts now.. 🙂
Perhaps interestingly, a very large percentage of the customers who purchased products from MOBE did not become affiliates.
I know at least 30-50% of those who purchased the Silver Masterclass and above did not ever promote as affiliates or even register to become an affiliate. That would make them largely retail customers.
If you look at the numbers, 90% who purchased the 21 Steps did not become affiliates either and from what I observed, Matt and MOBE directly appeared to make more sales than all other affiliates combined.
Sadly, I suspect this is another case of an uninformed regulator taking destructive action without adequately investigating complaints by inquiry directly with the company.
If MOBE were properly advised of legitimate cases where people had paid and been denied the products and services they paid for, this would have been addressed promptly.
Those who had justifiable grounds to refund were often refunded accordingly, even many who probably should not have been were too.
When a person demanded refunds without valid grounds that was generally denied as it should have been.
To me, the party most at fault here now is the FTC who have done immense damage to MOBE and hundreds of other businesses without having conducted a comprehensive investigation.
The fact that they never contacted myself or numerous other parties involved with MOBE prior to their action, when they certainly could and should have, speaks volumes.
Hopefully this will all play out favorably for MOBE and Matt in due course, but regardless, fortunately there are ample opportunities for the MOBE business effectively to continue in future, so this is far from a final outcome. Wait and see!
1. How do you know this?
2. Was the Silver Masterclass the primary source of revenue for MOBE? What’s happening in their entry level products doesn’t matter if the big money at the top is revenue primarily generated by recruited affiliates.
Again, how do you know this? Smells like anecdotal evidence to me.
After the FTC went after digital altitide,I definitely saw a difference in the way Mobe operated, that ruling spooked Mr lloyd and he tried changing things but it was too little too late.
The only people this will effect are 1% who are making all the money, the rest will be saved from any more of their deceptive advertising.
CPA; You provide a great Analysis of “SPIN”, anyway you want to discuss MOBE, it’s a classic Ponzi Scheme.
Now you want to desperately place fault at the FTC because of the fraudualent practices behind MOBE.
The reality is, MOBE will be shut down by the FTC due to running a Ponzi Scheme, no matter how you spin it, the foundation of this platform is a Ponzi.
You know it’s a Ponzi, you just don’t want to admit it……
I certainly have no problems at all running my legitimate business. but then again, I provide a real service.
you wouldn’t need to be here defending him if it wasn’t the scam that it is. you would ignore it and go about your day as it would carry itself regardless.
but you ‘put thousands’ into speculation. lol!
the ‘negative’ is you lost your ‘thousands’.
San Antonio had a 3 day seminar set for friday, Saturday and sunday.
When we came back from lunch on Friday, there was no one around and a sign on door “Seminar cancelled, for refunds please call xxx”.
Not a single MOBE person around to tell us what happened.
Thanks for the update Jesse. Sounds like all the events this weekend were cancelled then.
A TRO or injunction doesn’t prevent MOBE management from communicating with affiliates. They’re intentionally hiding behind a blackout.
I am expressing what I know from what I have been able to see first hand, facts. I am also expressing my opinion on this matter, as this website and others here do too. FTC is not acting in a reasonable way in my view, they are just doing what they do and it is destructive and unreasonable (again, my opinion).
If MOBE was a Ponzi, then so is (Ozedit: Offtopic derail attempt removed)
The term Ponzi should be applied in cases where they are what that means and this is not such a case.
Payouts from MOBE were commissions on sales made of legitimate and valuable products/services. I don’t believe you are using or applying the terminology correctly in this case, again my opinion.
Oz, by far there were more Silver Masterclass sales being made than any other product volume wise. I would deduce this is probably one of the most significant sales value and profit contributing products for MOBE.
Mastermind Sales were certainly high value, but very low volume and a large amount is paid in costs to fulfil those events too.
I wouldn’t claim to be an expert on the significance of all these figures, will leave that to the lawyers and courts. I am an expert in the financial aspects nonetheless.
I know what these figures are because this information was available to me. Matt plainly and openly stated how many people reached which point in the 21 Steps and I personally know what percentage reached various points based on a relatively large number of participants.
I will continue to defend a company I have a firm belief in the legitimacy of their activities and a vested interest in too.
Again I don’t believe the FTC has acted reasonably or correctly in the case of how they have dealt with MOBE. My view is that the FTC has caused undue harm without due process.
I am not yet aware of what court case the FTC won with MOBE being represented by its own legal counsel and being given a reasonable opportunity to submit their own defense.
My belief is the FTC did not consult MOBE directly but rather took action without getting all the facts first too. I don’t feel that is at all reasonable.
Thankyou for confirming your MOBE retail sales statistics and “facts” are nothing more than anecdotal evidence.
This diminishes your credibility as a source to that of “ignore”.
And for the record, MOBE generating the majority of revenue via recruited affiliates would make it a pyramid scheme – not a Ponzi scheme.
I’ve yet to see an FTC complaint filed against an MLM company that wasn’t followed up by a memorandum that completely destroyed any claims of legitimacy with respect to retail sales.
Jason. I am sorry to hear that. My experience has been very different.
The training and course-ware have been very valuable, motivating and even life changing. The value is in the mindset of the participant.
My personal business coaches have been superb. I have 3 decades of experience in direct sales, marketing and business consulting and I have no problem with the value received so far. I cannot be up-sold.
Perhaps that is the fundamental issue. An aggressive company often runs into troubles, no matter what industry. Especially when a company runs into the challenge of fast growth. But I believe in this case, the intent was and remains good.
But the critics…well…I will let OZ sort this out for us.
Sorry Oz clearly you are mistaken. I would say my evidence is far from anecdotal coming largely from first hand data and statistics sourced within MOBE itself.
But go on saying what you can to mislead everyone here. Not understanding what you’d aim to gain from that though.
Oz, I am surely not going to sway your views. As with Herbalife, the FTC finally came to their senses and accepted the reality that they are not a pyramid scheme or ponzi, and I would argue MOBE is a very similar model and case.
Unfortunately, after the FTC does the reckless and careless damage they do, there is little chance of any company fighting back; which is exactly why they do it that way.
I know, from my first-hand experience, the regulators will often disseminate complete lies or fabrications of truth, so I am sure their official statements will reflect such unreliable content, allegations and accusations there too.
Ironically in a case I once faced, the lead representative of the regulatory agency was the one eventually sentenced to a long term behind bars.
All in Government are not necessarily good people or well intentioned despite what we may like to expect. I certainly have learned not to believe all they say.
At best it is their side of the story and never presents any favorable facts.
Prove it. Where is the evidence?
Um, no.
Herbalife settled with the FTC instead of going to trial. As part of that settlement they agreed, in not so many words, to stop running a pyramid scheme in the US.
Please do not attempt to rewrite history.
Please provide evidence within an MLM context.
Please provide evidence.
And as I can see this being an ongoing theme with you, any further claims/stories without cited evidence will be marked as spam.
Chill, Guys. No one knows the truth….YET. I know for a fact that Matt was transitioning towards a new education based business model. He said so.
Whatever the heck is going on with his critics and former top earners…. and their real motivations, we just do not know.
We do know that he has the resources to defend… and many fans like me willing to support his mission and vision. Keep it civil, folks.
I’ve always wondered why the FTC and others claim that “information products’ are not real products.
To me that’s like saying if I paid Steve Jobs $5,000 to sit down and talk with him for an hour so he could give me “information” on how I should start up a company and run it, that its fake and not valuable.
Isn’t education one of the most valuable products?
I personally went to college for 6 years to get information and learn from other professionals so I could better myself.
I’m not in MOBE but i’m sure the content they provide about marketing, advertising, entrepreneurship etc is of high caliber.
They don’t. The issue with respect to FTC regulation of “high ticket” product or service MLM companies is retail viability.
An MLM company primarily generating revenue via sales to recruited affiliates is a pyramid scheme.
You can’t to be providing product or service value when nobody outside of your income opportunity is paying for your product and/or service.
Nice attempt to introduce a strawman but.
Facts are facts with Herbalife; they are not a Pyramid or Ponzi or it would be held and stated by the FTC that they are. MOBE is not significantly any different.
cnbc.com/2016/07/15/ftc-determines-herbalife-is-not-a-pyramid-scheme-dj.html
Herbalife paid fines due to misrepresentation issues and to end a battle that costs more to fight than pay up and move on. The Federal Mafia stuck again; pay up or we shut you down. If the FTC had a certain case, they wouldn’t have settled. No history rewrite required.
I have presented my position on MOBE, using my first-hand knowledge, my experience and my professional expertise and personal views. I didn’t expect that would be considered ‘SPAM’. You’re always free to ignore it.
“Effectively”, meaning Herbalife didn’t fight the charges in court, lose and be shut down for being a fraudulent pyramid scheme.
Yeah, don’t argue with me on this. I spent years extensively going over every court filing and painstakingly reporting on each significant development.
An MLM company without significant retail acitvity is a pyramid scheme. If Herbalife could have proven to the FTC they had significant retail activity they would have.
Herbalife paid $200 million to not lose in court, ie. they settled with the FTC because they couldn’t prove they weren’t a pyramid scheme.
The sole concession Herbalife seemed to have wrangled from the FTC was the deliberate non-use of the term “pyramid scheme” in the settlement agreement.
A mistake IMO but it is what it is – and doesn’t change the fact that the FTC described Herbalife as a pyramid scheme in their filings.
If you read the court docs you’ll find plentiful references to a lack of retail sales, the hallmark of an MLM pyramid scheme.
Please don’t state you have facts pertaining to MOBE retail sales figures if all you have is meaningless anecdotal evidence.
Chris. Exactly how I felt and still feel. I do not have years for traditional education and I am happy to pay successful professionals for the info.
I paid Mobe $50 bucks for 25 hours of courses, challenges, accountability, knowledge and personal business coaching which was superb.
Make sense…yes. It was my choice to join as a consultant. I felt and still feel it was one of the best steps I ever made.
Thanks for adding some clarity to the conversation.
OZ…spend $50 USD and find out. (If they were online today, I would front you 50 bucks.) See if you could pass the 21 Steps…(I know you would) Dig deeper. I respect your work, so I make that offer freely.
Online Business Education is one of the most valuable products you will ever see. Moving forward, I want my sons to get this.
if you need to pay to be fed horseshit in life, you’re a failure and no amount of ‘training’ will overcome that.
@Steve
I don’t need to. The FTC has presumably done their homework and concluded retail revenue in MOBE is insignificant.
It doesn’t take a dumbass to figure out people aren’t paying $30,000 to $60,000 for marketing courses outside of the income opportunity.
Not all education is equal. If MOBE’s courses and training were actually valuable, they should have no problems providing the FTC with documented evidence of significant retail revenue.
Steve Brown: I know for a fact that Matt was transitioning towards a new education based business model.
And here is your first problem. if this is true and he was legit, why did he have to change at all?
The problem is once one starts an illegal enterprise, it can not be changed to appear legit as it was illegal to begin with.
How can anyone determine people are buying the income opportunity rather than the products when a customer gets both. You pay the fee, get access to the products and the opportunity.
I’m not understanding how the FTC or anyone can say people are just paying to then recruit others to pay and the products are null and void.
Most of these programs you pay. Get access to the products and able to resell them. So wouldn’t the money for someone becoming an affiliate also be considered a product sale since the customer gains access to the products at that point?
As for digital products I’m sure at one point even owners of this site looked up or paid for info on how to build a blog site, how to use seo, etc.
Because the determining factor of an MLM pyramid scheme isn’t “customers”, it’s retail customers (non affiliates).
If an MLM company’s products offer value, they’ll have no trouble establishing and maintaining a retail market.
If there’s insignificant retail activity then it’s the income opportunity that is actually being marketed, which differentiates a pyramid scheme from a legitimate MLM company.
This is true irrespective of what products or services an MLM company markets.
Whip. When you are growing a global company, attracting very competent professionals, you listen to them. Change and adjustments are common in business.
We call them course corrections. Especially when you need to comply with the myriad of different regulators and laws in so many countries. I would have advised him to do the same.
My experience proves that in the face of so many scams… the environment is negative. The FTC…well go figure that out for yourself.
Change is inevitable and real entrepreneurs know it. Call it…. evolution.
Well I got to step 7 of the 21 steos where I was asked to pay 2.5k (ish) to become an affiliate and get the training.
This enabled me to sell the product I bought. There was a bunch of small products I could sell, but why would I spend time and effort to sell a product for $7 – $100 comission when that same time and energy could be used to sell the 21 steps givimg $2k commish.
So basically the product is the product you bought which gives you access to earn commish on the product.
I would guess to ne able to earn commission on the other products like platinum, you’d have to buy them too.
Needless to say, I didn’t join as whilst I thought it clever that I’d paid to listen to 7 hours of a sales pitch by Matt on why his product was better, and could see thst if I got other ppl introduced to the program many would buy thus I’d earn my money back, it just didn’t sit right with my moral compass.
I want to make money online, this felt a bit scammy to me.
Do you think MOBE offers valuable digital products?
For “retail” activity how can that be determined when it’s a 2 for 1 deal. Buy the product package you also get a resell license to the opportunity.
Or are you saying a company must sell the products alone without the opportunity attached?
If so, that’s pretty shitty standards. Why would someone buy the products alone vs buying the products and getting the opportunity attached?
Chris, you usually initially pay only for the product; the cost for the affiliate opportunity is a separate option/cost. That is probably one way it can be shown.
Surprisingly, I found (Ozedit: Unsubstantiated claims removed)
MOBE has the data and the FTC likely does not; they usually couldn’t get it being outside US jurisdiction. They do however force the process now by shutting down the domains and websites.
@Chris
Would I personally cough up $30,000 to $60,000 for MOBE products? Hell no. But I’m not their target demographic so it’s a loaded question.
Simple, either you have retail customers paying for products and services or you don’t.
Not exclusively but the majority of company-wide revenue should be derived from the sale of products and services to retail customers.
Oh I don’t know, somehow the rest of the business world outside of MLM manages.
Personally I’ve never felt the inclination to add a $500,000 McDonalds franchise to my $5 Big Mac order.
@CPA
No Judge in the US would have granted the FTC a TRO without documented evidence.
OZ…what can I say other than I felt and feel value in my purchase.
It is nobody’s fault that some people NEVER take action in anything and then COMPLAIN. No more Caps, sorry.
I am a professional Journalist. Trained by great, experienced mentors. Maybe Mobe reminded me of my 22 year career in Broadcast Journalism.
(Ozedit: Offtopic derail attempts removed)
You a MOBE affiliate? If so whether you felt value or not is irrelevant if next to no sales were being made to retail customers.
See how easy it is to fool some people by misdirection ???
So, we have four or five MOBE members offering anecdotal evidence of THEIR sales activities being representative of the majority of MOBE participants and THEIR perceived value for money of the MOBE product, when neither affect the FTC decision.
In multi level marketing if a participant can or does make the greatest part of his or her income from (endless chain) recruitment, then that program is operating illegally.
Posters can offer all sorts of anecdotal evidence, strawman arguments, uninformed legal opinions and Ebil gubmint stories – the fact remains, in MULTI LEVEL MARKETING allow a non retail focused or endless chain recruitment focused environment to exist and you run the risk of FTC prosecution.
Oz, you know (Ozedit: Unsubstantiated claims removed)
Often this is not company endorsed/sponsored misconduct but that of ‘rogue’ affiliates. Sometimes the company does make a mistake and that is where damages arise that need to be settled. Doesn’t make the company bad, just not infallible.
FTC’s action so far is unlikely due to the retail sales data because they don’t have access to all that outside USA. They may however have some misconduct complaints that need to and can still be settled.
My data of retail sales comes from being a coach and over 1,000 people who paid $49/$97/$497/$2,497 and up to be trained. I had visibility of company sales data.
Many clients had businesses and were given valuable advice on how to market online. They got their products/services and coaching; and well under 10% became affiliates.
A large percentage (30%+) of clients who paid $2,497+ did not become affiliates. That to me was a lot of purely retail sales. This will not be difficult for MOBE to show.
After matters are worked out with the FTC/courts, then MOBE can likely resume its activities and implement any necessary changes to avoid further problems, just like Herbalife did.
You are correct. So, lets forget about being entrepreneurs and spend the rest of our lives worrying about FTC. I repeat. Change is expected in real business. Truth will arrive shortly on Mobe.
I will not further comment on the value of bureaucracies. Peace.
And by the way, in law, prove intent. Otherwise, it is simply a misdemeanor offense for being sloppy. Which most of us can relate to.
@CPA
Well, I’m sure MOBE will have no problem demonstrating significant retail sales to the FTC.
As you go up that percentage no doubt drops, with generated revenue increasing exponentially. This is where company-wide retail revenue as percentage of total revenue becomes critical.
Resume what activities? Herbalife only survived because they make most of their money pyramid scamming people elsewhere in the world.
Last I heard they were desperately bussing affiliates around to buy from other affiliates in an attempt to circumvent the FTC settlement.
Look at Vemma. Last I checked Bode Pro isn’t doing so well.
Can MOBE survive a pyramid scheme settlement (2-5 years) after Matt Lloyd and top affiliates are sued for disgorgement?
If you being an entrepreneur means operating a business illegally, you’re doing it wrong.
The FTC can’t obtain an injunction without providing a judge with evidence. Intent is neither here nor there.
FTC = CIVIL agency.
FTC charges = administrative / civil
Intention = irrelevant.
Try filing an inaccurate tax return and claim “lack of intent” and see how far it gets you
It’s a simple equation – if you want to be seen as a legitimate MLM company don’t flirt with danger.
If you want to push it, then don’t complain if you get it wrong enough that the normally reluctant to prosecute FTC or SEC come after you.
Thanks CPA. Excellent and clear post.
Its funny how the Authorities are always wrong and people believe the opportunity will come back!
Come on people use that common-sense that doesn’t seem to be that common. Matt Lloyd is toast, unfortunately or fortunately, whichever way you want to see it.
Even the owners of pyramid schemes seem to be brain dead, they try to convince themselves that their business is legal.
We will move on. Watch the space.
You need a serious course correction. Opinions are BS without facts. You have no idea who we are.
You do know the irony in that statement, don’t you ???
Because getting people into a shady income stream with “coaching” is a RETAIL business.
You are not fooling anyone with that claim.
The whole idea was the keep the funnel full of prospects seeking the easy money.
The money they were promised would not come unless they paid EVEN MORE MONEY.
Ask anyone recruited could they as an affiliate Earn the big money promised by promoting without further spending.
This is indeed the problem you are not talking about.
Muahahahaha.
If it’s just “rogue members” the real leaders would have already stepped forward and identified the rogues and kicked them out.
Instead, they’re sitting with head ducked like turtles, on the advice of their attorneys no doubt, leaving you clueless members trying to defend them with mere SPECULATIONS!
Who are you REALLY trying to convince? Yourselves perhaps? That you could not POSSIBLY bet on the wrong horse?
We’ve seen all these excuses and denials after the collapse of Zeek and TelexFree and other scams. It’s the government. It’s the hackers. It’s the rogue members. It’s the critics. It’s the competitors. Blah blah blah.
You’re not saying anything new.
Yep. Couldn’t have said it better myself.
Thanks for pointing out the inherent flaw in multi-level marketing which defaults it to a pyramid scheme.
This is what trips people up.
Why does proven value vs. affiliates claiming value matter?
Here’s why:
I could raid the dog park garbage cans and MLM dog chit for 2k per bag.
If you are buying for the opportunity to make commission on selling the opportunity to sell to others for the opportunity to make commissions, who cares about the chit? (Education, digital service, soap, diet shakes, etc)
Try selling bags of dog chit for 2k without the opportunity attached to the general public.
The only way to establish real value is by selling to people OUTSIDE the opportunity.
But as Chris so kindly noted, in MLM it’s a 2 for1 deal available to all.
MLM companies sales growth is derived from recruiting and attaching the opportunity.
Products aren’t on store shelves. Ask yourself why!!!
The founders know recruitment is paramount in MLM, so the pricing and quality reflect the income opportunity – not market value of the product.
I assert that founders first focus on the money game, and then find some product with the attempt to “look” legitimate.
This, to dupe people, mask the money game, and avoid regulatory action.
Ultimately, an education course might appear more legitimate than my dog chit, but it doesn’t matter if the retail public isn’t buying either one. Null and void. See MLM business model.
Round and round we go. INHERENTLY FLAWED!
One might even conclude that the MLM founders know this and are actually con men.
One could also argue that the best con men never present as one; and have everyone convinced they are the good guy helping others.
Anyone come to mind?
Regardless of how wonderful the training is, the real question is whether people are buying the program for the training or the opportunity.
When the only way to earn commissions is to purchase the high-ticket item, and the way to do that is to convince the buyers that they can make big money by selling it to others, then you have a pyramid scheme.
If someone could pay a small amount to be an affiliate and earn commissions selling the big ticket item, then the opportunity would have been legit. But in that case, the sales of the training would have been much lower.
The main reason given to buy the higher priced offers was that it included the ability to earn commissions from selling those products.
If you feel that the value of the product itself was worth what you paid for it, then you shouldn’t care if the ‘opportunity’ is shut down. You got what you paid for.
Basically, the “2 for 1” deal/package with no option to just buy the product by itself with no income/business opportunity attached is where the rubber meets the road.
The question should be… Can the product stand on it’s own amongst the myriad other similar products on the market and still make a good profit?
Can it compete on price? People do shop around especially with easy access to the internet.
A simple example is that of Amazon dot com and other big name brands. They distribute items at retail, many at a lower cost than your local, retail store bought items.
The customer has the “option” to become an affilate at no extra charge nor as part of a “deal”, offering them the opportunity to sell the same or similar items in the entire Amazon inventory for a small profit.
Nobody gets hurt and everyone is happy.
Matt may have had good intentions by combining an educational product(s) with an income producing opportunity to help others become finacially independent.
But by offering no other options to purchase said education without the income opportunity attached and with little to no control over those making oulandish income claims, only attracts the attention of the big boys.
This has happened many times with well-intentioned companies over the years.
Since no new information has been put out and since none of us actually work for the FTC (Ozedit: MOBE admins have confirmed the FTC investigation. Whinging removed.)
Very well put. And you cannot get very far in the 21 Steps without paying for MLR for $2.5K.
Just the other day, someone asked me about my MOBE experience.
My exact words were, “It’s for people who want online education, selling to people who want online education, selling to people who want online education.
And the bigger you play, the more you can make. But most people have no idea what they’re doing, and they are misled to think that 1) it’s easy, or 2) they will receive help. Which it isn’t and they won’t.”
Surely if the training courses were any good there’d be no need for students to resell them because they’d have become internet experts/entrepreneurs in their own right capable of successfully selling their own product?
And of course that would mean Matt Lloyd and his associates selling the courses directly to the public without the need to attach an MLM ‘opportunity’ given that the vast majority of MLM participants in any sector of the industry lose money.
I registered for a workshop in Liverpool (UK) on Tuesday and I received an email last night saying it’s been cancelled ‘due to unforeseen circumstances’.
I bought into the dream!! SMH! I had some “conversions” but never received any money for my effort and could never got an answer for my inquiries.
Another bernie – but I also think most of these situations are MLM. If there is a chain of us selling someone else’s product, what do you get??
We can call it what we want, but sadly it is what it is.
I wonder where is carolina and chow now. What about the MOBE Car deals? I guess they have to pay for their own car now!
I want my money back – the product didn’t produce!!
I signed up with MOBE in early May. I definitely got the pyramid scheme vibe from them. It’s a shame because I actually got a lot of educational value from their products.
I am very thankful that, through some divine intervention, my “funding solution” was delayed a month and I didn’t get myself tens of thousands of dollars in debt. I’ve put a freeze on my credit just in case.
Man I feel like an idiot. I knew deep inside something was rotten, but they very expertly manipulated me. But, one good thing that came out of my experience with MOBE is a fresh desire to start my own legitimate business and find genuine training to help me succeed. It’s too bad they take advantage of the mindset that comes with starting a business.
To those still defending MOBE… consider that one of the first steps of the grieving process is denial.
I’m sure some of these testimonials are encentivized where they get paid a referral fee. I never joined that part of the business. I never promoted or referred anyone to the MOBE.
However, I have an online store (now has grown to six) where MOBE taught me how to market them online & how to grow them. Seven years ago, I knew ZERO about online marketing and felt the $20K was well worth the master’s degree that I know now.
I think people miss the point with “how to create an online business’. You pick a niche that you love whether it be stock trading, dog training, MMA fighting, Kung Fu, game playing, cosplaying… whatever that niche is and then, you apply the training to that.
That’s how you grow a real business (not by referring others to refer others to refer others).
And that’s the shame here. The content actually was good! I think they just got too greedy with their affiliate program.
I was thinking about joining 4%. I would love to see a review. What do you guys think? Is it just another MOBE spin off?
MOBE is AWESOME!!!! They totally taught me everything they said they were going to teach me! And I am looking forward to the day they WIN this stupid case!!! Because I was looking forward t a LONG working relationship with MOBE!!!
Yes, I am doing so much work, because I don’t have the funds to pay to have everything done for me … yet. And it is an onion worth of work… you are continually peeling the layers away to find something else you need to do. But Once you do it… it’s done, you don’t have to do it again!
No I haven’t made a dime yet, I am still working on the foundations of my business… 8 months later. But the lessons I was taught about what I needed to do and how I can do it, have shown me the way to do EVERYTHING I wanted to achieve… and I have been steadily working towards that goal.
And for the record… I am on Social Security Disability and I don’t have much extra to spend on anything, and I STILL think the was the BEST purchase I have ever made!!!
I am convinced it is my way to GET OFF Social Security Disability… Permanently!!
Now just because someone didn’t want to do the work involved with growing a business, and yes it is as I said a TON of work … they have taken it upon themselves to sever MY connection with the organization that I paid good money to join, MOBE.
I am TOTALLY happy with what I am receiving… with the training and the coaching that MOBE has given me.
I have 4 college degrees… and NONE of them have given me the information I wanted to learn… the information the MOBE has given me.
The Investment I made in myself to join MOBE was WELL WORTH IT!!!
I will go to court and testify to this as well!!! I want to be reconnected with the organization I have come to LOVE!!!
^^ Sounds like they did a solid number on you.
I hope the eventual realisation you’ve been scammed isn’t too crushing.
Advise not to join 4%.
Vick Strizheus was convicted of grand theft in 2007 for faking life insurance applications with information of people who didn’t even exist.
The con man is still there but camouflaged. He is very, very charismatic and disarming, but whenever someone keeps saying “Trust Me”……. BEWARE!!
All I know is, I felt as though I had gotten $49 worth of education by step 3 of the 21-step training, and when compared to the cost of university classes, it’s quite a bargain indeed.
I’m extremely disappointed that I cannot finish it now because I felt it was really going to help me help my mother with the online aspect of her business, which she is weak in being that she’s 78 years old.
Now I suppose I’ll have to go spend exoponentially more money for the same type of training elsewhere.
Matt was offering a very valuable service/product for an incredibly reasonable price. So much for us “little guys” getting ahead financially.
I’d elaborate more but I have to go back to my job that never gets me anywhere in my life.
I have also been through 21 steps and let me tell you,it is not worth $49, hell it’s not worth $7.
You can get better material for free on sites like Blackhat World, Best blackhat forum, Digital point, Wicked fire etc.
What people like Matt do,is make you believe that the 21 steps is all that you require for online success. That’s what I was led to believe when first got deceived into signing up for the program.
Shouldn’t be “Our legals”? Lies, as usually.
All top earners in MOBE need to be held accountable for their actions. They can’t be led of the hook simply by leaving because they were instrumental in this scam.
They knew what they were doing. Now they want to play the victim card.
There is products for sure, (Ozedit: The FTC complaint didn’t allege MOBE had no products. Strawman arguments removed.)
Hi ,does anyone know what has happened to one of mobe’s top affiliate’s Steven bransfield?
The guy behind the “rookie profit system (21 steps]” , he was removed from the mobes top earners list a couple of months before the FTC issue, something does not seem right about that?
@Jeremy
Those two top earners bailed immediately before the FTC shutdown. There’s a chance some of them knew about the investigation.
Or it could just be a coincidence. No real way to know unfortunately.
Good god the cognitive disonnance on people here. That these idiots would defend mobe in any way whatsoever is mind blowing.
I hope Matt loses every bit of ill gotten gains from scamming so many people. Those saying he sells products are out of your minds! No one is using those to sell other things and make money.
The entire premise of mobe is to sell to others exactly what you just bought, you split the take at higher levels, its nothing more than that.
Selling selling to sellers with nothing to sell. Its not as though any of you had a business idea and you used the “mobe produtcts” to make that business better.
Really how delusional are most of you defending this dolt?
I know losing the money hurts and especially if you blew some serious change on this idiot, but thats all this is.
I’ll be nice. Matt did not have a grip on the company as it expanded into North America. Our rules are different, are they not? BIG error.
But he and his supporters will fight. I knew the plan was flawed for the US environment.
The MasterMind idea however is valid. Even exciting. A relatively cheap franchise at it’s worst. A chance to play with other entrepreneurs…priceless. Just my opinion.
Make sense?
Pyramid schemes like MOBE are illegal the world over. The US just happens to be one of the few countries that has the resources to go after (some of the) scammers.
I’m curious how people can say ‘they owe me’ or ‘they took $___ from me’ or ‘they scammed me”…
Are we not each responsible for our own actions, decisions, buying decisions, lives?! When you pay to go to University to get an Education, training, learning on a Subject, you are learning new skills to go out into the world & use to make your way in the world.
Is the University blamed or a ‘fraud/scam’ if you can’t get a job in your industry? Of course not! It’s up to YOU what you do with what you learn!
There’s a reason less than 3% of our population are successful as Entrepreneurs. They are the ones that take personal responsibility & do not give up! If more people did that, none of this would even be happening!
I used the training from MOBE to build 2 successful businesses & it has been worth every penny. The only difference between myself & the rest of people who are calling themselves victims is that I went out & used what I learned to achieve Success!
It was not overnight, I had to work for it, but I couldn’t have done it without MOBE!
Yep. Which is why the FTC are holding Matt Lloyd responsible for scamming people out of hundreds of millions of dollars through MOBE.
That doesn’t change the fact that MOBE is a pyramid scheme and pyramid schemes are illegal.
Sabrina, I call BS on your post, name your sites, lets see your url’s and what you sell thats not mobe. Put up or shut up.
Matt’s a major scammer and took advantage of people, otherwise he would just refund the dam money and let them go, if it was a real business, we would not even be having this discussion.
Chill people. I too received great information, resources and outstanding coaching from my Mobe experience. Sure, some uninformed idiot will call me out.
The FTC does what it does. Matt did what he did. You canot come into North America without world class lawyers.
He missed a very important step and it will cost him dearly. But he’s young, so he gets a pass from me. Expensive lesson for all. Let the law and the courts work it out.
But the other Steve has issues to post such a putrid attempt to humiliate a woman who found her motivation and mindset.
Sabrina, do not let the negatives affect ANYTHING in your world. Whether Matt survives this is anyone’s guess. Not in our control.
Most of us have taken what we learned and started new ventures, inspired by what we experienced. They do not teach entrepreneurial in school.
May I quote the great Jim Rohn? Critics are critics. Why be surprised? They are critics. That’s what they do. Peace.
And a new generation of pyramid scammers with their heads up their collective asses are born.
Being an entrepreneur != joining a pyramid scheme and ripping people off.
Why they don’t teach pyramid scamming at school should be obvious.
OZ is asleep as I write this. He may or may not choose to post my earlier message.
Matt Lloyd and his colleagues will fight and win their case. Maybe pay a fine for a misdemeanor offense. But the damage is done.
The FTC does good work, sometimes. Mostly, in the USA, they just grind you you down until you have no fight or money left.
Lawsuits fly by the thousands every day. I have many American friends and I am sad to see a great people being screwed over so badly.
F the FTC. F the FBI. F the CIA. Livin’ in the MF’n USA – Steve Earle.
He won’t post this..or will he?
The fact that Matt “Lloyd” doesn’t use his real name and has entities all over the place ought to tell you how legitimate the business is.
The coaches on the phone are highly paid snakes scripting their way to the bottoms of their suckers bank accounts. Hardly a real business.
@Steve
While your BS is cute, it is a departure from reality.
Based on what? Certainly not the facts pertaining to MOBE’s business operations.
Perhaps you’d find better company with the Sovereign citizen nutters you sound an awful lot like.
MOBE was a pyramid scheme and that makes Matt Lloyd a scammer. There are laws against that in the US (and Malaysia and Australia too).
Holding scammers accountable isn’t a conspiracy, it’s the mandate of regulatory agencies such as the FTC.
Don’t let the facts get in the way of your “ebil gubmint” fiction though. As you were.
Misdemeanor? I doubt it will be merely that, Steve.
Are you trying to provoke an angry response? Not from me.
The “charge” is deceptive trade practices. It’s a BIG umbrella and yes, maybe there were violations. However, it is not an allegation of Ponzi or Pyramid Scheming. (Ozedit: Offtopic derail attempts removed)
Negligible retail in MLM = pyramid scheme.
The Receiver has gone through MOBE’s books and concluded there’s no legal way to run the company profitably.
You can dance around whether MOBE is a pyramid scheme or not with semantics, it is what it is.
lol. stop whining and put on your big boy pants.
You wouldn’t need to be here defending it if it wasn’t a scam. It would stand on it’s own merits.
LOL! Good god what a pathetic bunch of asshats! None of you made any money on this, you still try to defend this scum bag and won’t address anything of substance.
Yea sure keep going on that one lol, if you can’t or won’t address it, the rest of us know you are full of crap.
Stop defending this, put up your web urls if you are so certain this is all above board, I notice not one of you cowards are willing to do that.
OZ has this right, if it wasn’t a scam you would not be defending it, I suspect those that do, don’t want to admit how much they lost in this, or have taken some money off others down the line but really did not make much of anything and feel pretty guilty about it.
I wish I had googled that asshat along with that other dolt john chow and I would not be out the money they got from me, luckily it was not that much, I learned my lesson and won’t be so stupid the next time.
The rest of you stop trying to convince others this is legitimate, real businesses don’t get treated this way by the ftc, nor treat others this way.
matt will be lucky if he does not go to jail, or some pissed off customers come after him personally.
Did you ever think maybe he travels so much to keep a step or two from the authorities?
Just stop it with this, you just embarassing yourselves, read what you actually write in response and learn how to form a cogent argument.
Its over when its over –not until!! Any-Any USA government agency, is S-L-O-W to act,, we have tons of documented proof of that!! Just go to any MVD near you!!
The FTC moved because ,,,Lloyd made a major ,,major mistake. He made a pyramid ,,scheme,,. did not upgrade to convention marketing when the opportunities where there ,,right in his face.!
Lloyds biggest mistake was going after the business market. These people were seasoned,,could get excellent reports about Mobe,,Lloyd,, anytime,Matt never came through through with the promises,, to these people ,,they saw right through Matt. Worse, they had money!! They got the FTC off their dead a–!!
I am one of them!! 5 weeks into MOBE and Matt is sending me a monthly business report of high quality for 300 a month!! I can get that easily from other sources for 30 to 40 a month , and –what about my Mobe model I am building????
I love Matt as do/did you,,,however denial of reality is now upon us!! Matt is a high powered con man that could have made it,, but alas,, greed,,,,now owns Matt.
The odds of Matt going to jail are good odds .,as he has to pay back to his subscribers!! Those monies are -poof-now – gone!!
Matt can be delivered to the USA as we have contracts that allow the USA to go into foreign countries ( remember Guzman of Mexico?–Now rotting in Minnasotta ?)
Matt is in huge trouble as he has to get money from other counties to pay the debt,,all countries,,combined do not equal the USA market,,, its a matter of time before this Pyramid Scam goes busto… and to all our sorrows .. Matt with it!! Even if Matt gets out of this ,,its going to be years,,, to ,rememburse , is one problem ,,fines are another,, and remember Matt stupidly sued Wealthy Affiliate, and others ,,won,, now, faces them demanding — Matt be held accountable as they were,,,,,you can be sure the FTC will have to uphold a USA corporation long before Mobe,,,its over people!! Matt is toast!!
WE can learn a lesson ..move on,,,, lets do that ,,RSVP Matt and MOBE!!